Shadowlands -- Castle Nathria World First [Megathread]

[Barolt]

They skipped it because Limit was too far on Denathrius I was rooting way more for Limit than Echo but I'm not blind to see how much advantage they have over EU after reset.

Echo took 2.5 hours longer on their reclear. If they had done their reclear in the same amount of time Limit did, they would've finished it an hour and a half before Limit's raid started.

[Yarathir]

Salt aside, this is the correct take. There are two titanic guilds out there right now. Look at the past few tiers:

Uldir: Very close, Limit may have lost by extending
Dazar'alor: Mecho won by a day
Eternal Palace: Mecho by 8 hours
Ny'alotha: Limit by 40 hours
Nathria: Limit by 16 hours

Jesus, I didn't realize Limit won that hard in Ny'alotha.

[Vorkreist]

Here's the overall time taken to clear the raid:

LIMIT - 8 days, 1 hour, 28 minutes
Echo - 8 days, 7 hours, 21 minutes

Echo didn't try hard enough for second place? Who would have expected that?

[gobarj]

Why is Scripe constantly quoting 16 hours as the difference in THIS tier? it was way less due to extended maintenance on NA. He's now defending shutting off the stream and what not, it just seems like poor sportsmanship on his point right now coming with a plethora of excuses.

A simple "they played out of their mind and won" is sufficient. It was close, but Limit just played a bit better this tier and took it home despite needing to face bugs and share strategies (had they not streamed Generals it may have taken Echo MUCH longer as they copied their exact strat).

[Jabakaga]

Echo took 2.5 hours longer on their reclear. If they had done their reclear in the same amount of time Limit did, they would've finished it an hour and a half before Limit's raid started.

2.5 hours is nothing compare to 16 hours. They would have finished it if they would only be 2.5 hours behind, not almost 19 hours. Not including stress knowing Limit being on the boss while reclearing will causes some major mishaps but that is ofc on them. But before anyone calls me Echo fanboi I was not cheering those white washers who left sinking ship and pretended not knowing shit that was going around about Josh.

[mmocfd1b0ab5a3]

Here's the overall time taken to clear the raid:

LIMIT - 8 days, 1 hour, 28 minutes
Echo - 8 days, 7 hours, 21 minutes

Well, Echo could have cleared it faster if they really wanted (within 4 hours after Limit). But 16h disadvantage didnt motivate them enough. So it
s technically a tie.

[Yarathir]

Well, Echo could have cleared it faster if they really wanted (within 4 hours after Limit). But 16h disadvantage didnt motivate them enough. So it
s technically a tie.

Don't do this.

I agree that Echo was probably demotivated, but any headstart excuse is gone. Limit won.

[gobarj]

Well, Echo could have cleared it faster if they really wanted (within 4 hours after Limit). But 16h disadvantage didnt motivate them enough. So it
s technically a tie.

That argument doesn't hold because Limit could've just ditched sleep too. You base things off facts in front of you, not "what if they pulled an all-nighter and killed it".

Anyhow, congrats to Echo, it was a close race and a World Second is nothing to be shy of. Still a great achievement but it definitely sucks when you spent your entire breathing moment trying to gun for the WF since the expansion launched and still fall short.

[Farora]

Why is Scripe constantly quoting 16 hours as the difference in THIS tier? it was way less due to extended maintenance on NA. He's now defending shutting off the stream and what not, it just seems like poor sportsmanship on his point right now coming with a plethora of excuses.

A simple "they played out of their mind and won" is sufficient. It was close, but Limit just played a bit better this tier and took it home despite needing to face bugs and share strategies (had they not streamed Generals it may have taken Echo MUCH longer as they copied their exact strat).

Max is better at pretending to be super mature about it all (he makes a lot of backhanded comments during streams, so it is pretend). Scripe could learn a thing or two from that.

[WhatIsLegion]

Why is Scripe constantly quoting 16 hours as the difference in THIS tier? it was way less due to extended maintenance on NA. He's now defending shutting off the stream and what not, it just seems like poor sportsmanship on his point right now coming with a plethora of excuses.

Because he is a sore loser, just like 90% of that guild. He said that NA getting extended maintenance the first week isn't a big deal at all, but doesn't realize that without that delay Limit would have seen the parts of the Sire fight that Echo turned off streams to hide. So he knows that delay mattered a lot, but he's too sore of a loser to admit it.

He is literally going full on EU Mmochamp/Twitch chat viewer with the 16 hour stuff.

[Einsz]

Why is Scripe constantly quoting 16 hours as the difference in THIS tier? it was way less due to extended maintenance on NA. He's now defending shutting off the stream and what not, it just seems like poor sportsmanship on his point right now coming with a plethora of excuses.

A simple "they played out of their mind and won" is sufficient. It was close, but Limit just played a bit better this tier and took it home despite needing to face bugs and share strategies (had they not streamed Generals it may have taken Echo MUCH longer as they copied their exact strat).

Because he wants to save face and there are enough retarded people that will agree with his retarded rant.

[gobarj]

Max is better at pretending to be super mature about it all (he makes a lot of backhanded comments during streams, so it is pretend). Scripe could learn a thing or two from that.

Well, we're all competitive in nature really and no one likes losing. I know he does pretend for sure and if he lost we'd definitely see some snarky remarks, especially when the race is this close and within a few % (had it been a 2 boss difference then I'd imagine they wouldn't care about losing as much).

My opinion is it was very close, and Echo might have been right there with the same release timing, but it's impossible to know that because of all the competing factors coming into play. What we do know is that Limit absolutely crushed this tier. They killed all the big bosses first using their own strats, and they were pretty quick on every single boss. So basically, Limit gets the title, and Echo has reason to be upset that their chances were hurt by the later start time.

It's pretty much impossible to quantify these things anyhow, unfortunately it's just how it's going to be unless Blizzard intervenes or Echo moves to NA. I do genuinely believe Echo wouldn't have killed Generals with a one day lead with practice on Sire if they did not have Limit to copy their strats off or the bugs fixed that Limit faced before them. This may have have directly impacted them on Sire the reset as they likely wouldn't have as much progress in P2.

[Farora]

There's an argument that the key is not total time, but time from reset. But this is why it's absolutely impossible to come up with a true set of standings.... yes, Limit was 11 hours ahead on time the instance was available, but 16 hours from the end of the first reset. Those 5 hours of time were not completely useless for Echo, but they weren't as useful as additional hours after the reset would have been. Not to mention the obvious problem of Limit going first, and Echo adjusting their reclear plan in a desperate attempt to win on a god pull yesterday.

So anyone pretending they can come up with a valid set of standings using time is just a moron. At the end of the day that's based on opinion, and that's why the actual time is just what everyone uses.

My opinion is it was very close, and Echo might have been right there with the same release timing, but it's impossible to know that because of all the competing factors coming into play. What we do know is that Limit absolutely crushed this tier. They killed all the big bosses first using their own strats, and they were pretty quick on every single boss. So basically, Limit gets the title, and Echo has reason to be upset that their chances were hurt by the later start time.

Yeah you can't go back in time because it's extremely subjective. That's why next time they should just start at the same time, everyone is happy then.

Well, we're all competitive in nature really and no one likes losing. I know he does pretend for sure and if he lost we'd definitely see some snarky remarks, especially when the race is this close and within a few % (had it been a 2 boss difference then I'd imagine they wouldn't care about losing as much).

I prefer honesty myself, so Scripe whining, it's honest because that's how they feel. As long he tries to be an adult. The sponsors probably prefer the fake nonsense.

[kaintk]

all of this is blizzard fault, they should participate more in the mythic raid race
they should add a real timer from raid opening until the kill on their raid boardm that would remove any mistake done to know the real kill time

anyway, in the second raid the race will be better since the 2 guild will be more on the same level of farming stuff, in this one limit had better luck for the stuff they had for their character

[Woobels]

all of this is blizzard fault, they should participate more in the mythic raid race
they should add a real timer from raid opening until the kill on their raid boardm that would remove any mistake done to know the real kill time

anyway, in the second raid the race will be better since the 2 guild will be more on the same level of farming stuff, in this one limit had better luck for the stuff they had for their character

I don't really see how? Unless Echo got like absurdly unlucky with gear but that seems unlikely, and that can happen again in a new tier.

[Supakitch]

Grats to echo for world last

[gobarj]

all of this is blizzard fault, they should participate more in the mythic raid race
they should add a real timer from raid opening until the kill on their raid boardm that would remove any mistake done to know the real kill time

anyway, in the second raid the race will be better since the 2 guild will be more on the same level of farming stuff, in this one limit had better luck for the stuff they had for their character

If that was the case then you'd always be at a disadvantage starting first.

[Jayma]

Any gear level disadvantage was entirely due to Echo's Paladins.
Max mentioned Echo was a little slow in noticing the power of Holy paladins.

Looking at the Ilvl that's clearly true.

Difference in kill times was only 7 seconds. With Limit being slightly faster. Trill really performed this tier and was a clear advantage for Limit.

[Barolt]

Echo didn't try hard enough for second place? Who would have expected that?

Except that Echo literally said on stream, constantly, that they were pushing hard for a kill in the 16 hour window. So this "they didn't try after Limit's kill" is bullshit, according to Echo.

[Xath]

Not everyone has a great connexion. Luckily Blizzard will realised that the race brought the attention of more than 200k viewers, and both players and fans (that are not delusional) want global release.

So yeah Limit won the race, but is it really a race ?

Everyone wants a global release but it isn't going to happen because blizz doesn't want to deal with the headache. Yes it is a race and pretty much everyone outside the fanboys admits it's first is first.