[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Forogil]

Gross figures are commonplace and the accepted easily understood normal used in these and many other cases in the UK.

It is not commonplace to use a gross including an already negotiated rebate.

It's like selling an item and claiming you bought it for the "list price"; when you paid less.

The net part is debatable, but including the rebate in the gross means that it was a

lie on the Brexit side to run that add on that bus.

Because the uk simply didn't send that money (the debatable part is that large parts of it was returned); as only the money after the rebate was actually sent to the EU (and then partially returned).

Same as when you lied about the uk having more paid vacation than in the EU, when the uk has the EU-minimum of 28 days; it's just that the uk employers tried to cheat by counting 5-day weeks - that's why the uk has more "weeks", but the minimum amount of days.

When the UK builds a new aircraft carrier at a published gross cost of £4bn

I doubt that number is true as well.

[dribbles]

It is not commonplace to use a gross including an already negotiated rebate.

It's like selling an item and claiming you bought it for the "list price"; when you paid less.

The net part is debatable, but including the rebate in the gross means that it was a


Because the uk simply didn't send that money (the debatable part is that large parts of it was returned); as only the money after the rebate was actually sent to the EU (and then partially returned).

Same as when you lied about the uk having more paid vacation than in the EU, when the uk has the EU-minimum of 28 days; it's just that the uk employers tried to cheat by counting 5-day weeks - that's why the uk has more "weeks", but the minimum amount of days.


I doubt that number is true as well.

Now it is you who are not telling the whole truth.

The rebate was up for renegotiation and would not have survived continued long term UK membership, many EU members were unhappy about it. So in effect it was quite fair for brexiteers to discount it/or add it back to/from the calculated sum on the big red bus that the UK sent, or would send if the UK remained inside the EU after the referendum.

The referendum was about the future, not about the past where should there have been a positive vote to remain the rebate would have clearly been consigned to.

See, do you accept now there were no lies told?

[Huehuecoyotl]

Now it is you who are not telling the whole truth.

The rebate was up for renegotiation and would not have survived continued long term UK membership, many EU members were unhappy about it. So in effect it was quite fair for brexiteers to discount it/or add it back to/from the calculated sum on the big red bus that the UK sent, or would send if the UK remained inside the EU after the referendum.

The referendum was about the future, not about the past where should there have been a positive vote to remain the rebate would have clearly been consigned to.

See, do you accept now there were no lies told?

"If you squint really hard, then it kind of looks like that red paint is actually blue. Especially if you hold your breath until your eyesight gets close to blacking out. So technically I'm not telling lies."

Utter and complete bollocks as always dribbles. Faced with careful and detailed analysis of why you are wrong, you double down on the bullshit and stand your ground. "Steadfast against reality" should be the Brexiteer motto.

How are you enjoying the border in the Irish sea, trade red tape and rules so complex that nobody understands them? How's that "freedom" working out for you?

[Veggie50]

Now it is you who are not telling the whole truth.

Implying the concession that before it was you, not telling the whole truth

[Forogil]

Now it is you who are not telling the whole truth.

The rebate was up for renegotiation and would not have survived continued long term UK membership, many EU members were unhappy about it. So in effect it was quite fair for brexiteers to discount it/or add it back to/from the calculated sum on the big red bus that the UK sent, or would send if the UK remained inside the EU after the referendum.

Based on bojo's negotiating skills shown recently it is clearly possible that he could have lost the entire rebate.

However, the bus clearly said "send", which sort of is verb in the present tense, and not in the future tense ("would send"; although technically it's not a real future tense in English).

[LeGin Tufnel]

However, the bus clearly said "send", which sort of is verb in the present tense, and not in the future tense ("would send"; although technically it's not a real future tense in English).

I know... it's ridiculous isn't it.

The Brexit bus said, and I quote, ""We send the EU £350 million a week".

It really is quite straight forward: this was a lie. The UK did not "send the EU £350 million a week".

Here are five more Tory promises broken:

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/ent...b6acb534565d3f

The Tories did not negotiate a comprehensive free trade and customs agreement "that will deliver the exact same benefits as we have" (David Davis, January 2017).

What niggles me here is that at least the more virulent Brexiteers have the decency to own up and say something along the lines of: "well, collateral damage". Muh sovereignty.

The likes of BJ and co. simply carry on lying.

[Demolitia]

It's pretty silly to think that your taste or lack thereof, in music, should be the deciding factor in what your countrymen can listen to and vice versa.

What's wth the communist approach to letting govt. decide for the people?

Also bands can still play overseas, it's just that a visa is needed. And no they wont get rejected because the old fart issuing the visa, shares your taste in music.

I'm afraid there is another issue for touring musicians. Under the new deal british hauling trucks of 3.5 tons and more are only allowed 2 drops in the EU before they have to go back home.
https://musiceducation.global/cabota...y-brexit-deal/

[jonnysensible]

Give me your ham sandwiches brexit

[Demolitia]

Don't forget cheese.

[Crispin]

Yeah it's like arriving in Australia with foods in your luggage now, no can do.

[Mormolyce]

Very sensible.

People are so desperate to get into the UK from the EU they would suddenly all become karaoke artistes to bypass UK control of their borders.

Meanwhile on the £350 million a week calculation, and now 10 days in, the UK has saved half a billion pounds already. Enough to build a new hospital as an example...

Great stuff Boris.
[Infraction]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but how is this post infracted? By this standard every shitty thing he posts is trolling. Which... I'm not saying it isn't... but why start penalising it now?

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Yeah it's like arriving in Australia with foods in your luggage now, no can do.

Australia is the chillest place on Earth until someone tried to bring a mango through customs.

[Easo]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but how is this post infracted? By this standard every shitty thing he posts is trolling. Which... I'm not saying it isn't... but why start penalising it now?

It is a question I have wondered about too. Yes yes, do not discuss moderation, blah blah, but the guy literally did it for years by posting disproven fantasies and open lies again and again (plus posts like this which are really close to open trolling - "desperate EU citizens and hack/fake musicians/EU sending dogs"), yet nothing was done about it.
It is good that he finally is gone, if for a little while, but still...

[stardrist]

It is a question I have wondered about too. Yes yes, do not discuss moderation, blah blah, but the guy literally did it for years by posting disproven fantasies and open lies again and again (plus posts like this which are really close to open trolling - "desperate EU citizens and hack/fake musicians/EU sending dogs"), yet nothing was done about it.
It is good that he finally is gone, if for a little while, but still...

To be fair to Dribbles, which is admittedly difficult, this forum is mostly filled with American neo-liberals denying very obvious reality. Currently he europeans are a bit more rational, but there's been a strong undercurrent of eurofascism on this forum historically.

[Mihalik]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but how is this post infracted? By this standard every shitty thing he posts is trolling. Which... I'm not saying it isn't... but why start penalising it now?

It's probably a ban on the cumulative total of nonsense Dribbles manages to put out. I swear to god, it must be his day job or something.

Australia is the chillest place on Earth until someone tried to bring a mango through customs.

That mango might just trigger the final evolutionary form of the Australian wildlife, the Tyranids.

[Dhrizzle]

Fuck it, I say end the uk and bring back the old Anglo saxon kingdoms as well as reunited Ireland and independent Scotland and Wales

A large chunk of Scotland will become Anglo-Saxon Northumbria but they can have Strathclyde.

[Elegiac]

A large chunk of Scotland will become Anglo-Saxon Northumbria but they can have Strathclyde.

Reject modernity, return the English to Angeln and Saxony and give the island back to the Celts.

[Dhrizzle]

Gross figures are commonplace and the accepted easily understood normal used in these and many other cases in the UK. From job adverts quoting a salary of £100k Gross, no one expects to net £2k a week but the gross figure is still used and yet not stated as such. When the UK builds a new aircraft carrier at a published gross cost of £4bn you don't start saying yeah but all the shipworkers ate cheese rolls at Mavis's gaff for two years so the country got a rebate and the carrier didn't cost £4bn really.

Only remainers have a problem with the UK government reporting the EU used to cost us in excess of £350 million a week gross, or 4 or 5 aircraft carriers a year. Luckily most of the electorate, in their tens of millions, agreed with me on the clarity of those figures at the time of the referendum and voted for Brexit on that basis.

It was not incorrect, misleading or a lie on the Brexit side to run that add on that bus.

It was absolutely a lie. The bus said we sent £350m a week to the EU, we did not as the rebate was applied before any money went. It also said we could spend it on the NHS, this is a double lie as some of that money comes back to the country and will have to be covered. Finally there's the big loss of cash that the UK is suffering with Brexit that sucks up whatever is left in the kitty and then some.

Following your analogy, it's like someone saying they earn £100k and promising to spend £2000 a week on fancy restaurants despite a big chunk of it never making it to your account due to taxes, a lot of the rest being needed for rent and bills while the rest goes towards debts that are also eating through your savings.

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Now it is you who are not telling the whole truth.

The rebate was up for renegotiation and would not have survived continued long term UK membership, many EU members were unhappy about it. So in effect it was quite fair for brexiteers to discount it/or add it back to/from the calculated sum on the big red bus that the UK sent, or would send if the UK remained inside the EU after the referendum.

The referendum was about the future, not about the past where should there have been a positive vote to remain the rebate would have clearly been consigned to.

See, do you accept now there were no lies told?

No, you can't tell a lie, imagine a future where that lie becomes true then declare your imaginary future to be real and get it to retroactively make your previous lie true.

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Reject modernity, return the English to Angeln and Saxony and give the island back to the Celts.

Let's return the Scots to Ireland just to confuse everyone.

[Mayhem]

No, you can't tell a lie, imagine a future where that lie becomes true then declare your imaginary future to be real and get it to retroactively make your previous lie true.

So clairvoyance?

[Demolitia]

Now even DB Schenker temporarily halted shipping to the UK due to bureaucratic hurdles ... Another good news for international supply chains

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An anecdote perhaps, but it will not help restoring faith in the UK's custom process ...
https://mobile.twitter.com/TOrynski/...84018628259841

[Inuyaki]

Now even DB Schenker temporarily halted shipping to the UK due to bureaucratic hurdles ... Another good news for international supply chains

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An anecdote perhaps, but it will not help restoring faith in the UK's custom process ...
https://mobile.twitter.com/TOrynski/...84018628259841

That story is just sad...


And to the Schenker part: They normally are pretty good in handling stuff. If even they throw in the towel, it's really bad.