1. #38981
    Quote Originally Posted by PhaelixWW View Post
    he might support it but he will do everything possible to delay it till it doesn't really matter anymore.
    Buh Byeeeeeeeeeeee !!

  2. #38982
    The Undying
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    the Quiet Room
    Posts
    34,524
    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post
    he might support it but he will do everything possible to delay it till it doesn't really matter anymore.
    He can't now - he isn't the Majority Leader now. And if the GOP has any rational thoughts about the future, impeaching Trump is their best option. Bar him from future office and his entire power base is pulled out from under him.

  3. #38983
    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post
    he might support it but he will do everything possible to delay it till it doesn't really matter anymore.
    Can it be voted by the Democratic-controlled Senate?

    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    He can't now - he isn't the Majority Leader now. And if the GOP has any rational thoughts about the future, impeaching Trump is their best option. Bar him from future office and his entire power base is pulled out from under him.
    Thank you, you just answered my question.

  4. #38984
    Quote Originally Posted by PhaelixWW View Post
    Pardons can't apply to future crimes.
    Unfortunately he does have the power to grant blanket pre-emptive pardon for anybody who was at the Capitol on January 6. Yeah. The Presidential pardon power is that powerful. The more reason to kick him out as soon as possible.

  5. #38985
    Over 9000! PhaelixWW's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Washington (né California)
    Posts
    9,029
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Unfortunately he does have the power to grant blanket pre-emptive pardon for anybody who was at the Capitol on January 6. Yeah. The Presidential pardon power is that powerful. The more reason to kick him out as soon as possible.
    Those are past crimes. You're confusing "future charges on past crimes" with "future crimes", which is what my statement was about.


    "The difference between stupidity
    and genius is that genius has its limits."

    --Alexandre Dumas-fils

  6. #38986
    Quote Originally Posted by Timester View Post
    Can it be voted by the Democratic-controlled Senate?



    Thank you, you just answered my question.
    Yah it can, but they have to wait till the state finishes counting overseas ballots and certify results. they might finish it before trump's term is over.....but it won't matter because they need the VP to break any tie anyway which puts you back till trump is out of office.
    Buh Byeeeeeeeeeeee !!

  7. #38987
    Over 9000! zealo's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    9,509
    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post
    he might support it but he will do everything possible to delay it till it doesn't really matter anymore.
    He and the GOP has now lost control of both congress and the presidency by now. If they have any long term prospects in mind, it isn't a horrible idea for them to support something that takes Trump out of the equation for 2024.

  8. #38988
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    He can't now - he isn't the Majority Leader now. And if the GOP has any rational thoughts about the future, impeaching Trump is their best option. Bar him from future office and his entire power base is pulled out from under him.
    umm the two senators from GA have not been seated yet because the results are not certified yet in GA.

    Moscow Mitch is still technically in charge.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by zealo View Post
    He and the GOP has now lost control of both congress and the presidency by now. If they have any long term prospects in mind, it isn't a horrible idea for them to support something that takes Trump out of the equation for 2024.
    Lost control as of the 20th. maybe 22nd if certification takes that long in GA
    Buh Byeeeeeeeeeeee !!

  9. #38989
    Legendary! Thekri's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    A highly disgruntled constituent of Lindsey Graham.
    Posts
    6,167
    Quote Originally Posted by Timester View Post
    Can it be voted by the Democratic-controlled Senate?



    Thank you, you just answered my question.
    Ossoff and Warnock probably won't be seated until near the end of the month. So for the time being, there will be 50 GOP senators, 46 Democrats, and 2 Independents who always vote Democratic. Georgia has until the 22nd to certify its elections, assuming no recounts are triggered (Which should be safe, since both GOP contenders conceded, and both are out of recount margins). So the Senate can seat them after that. Technically I think McConnell remains majority leader until the Senate holds another election of its leadership, which won't happen until after the Democrats have the votes to actually replace him (It is a mostly ceremonial process, but they do need the votes for it).

    Anyway, I don't see trial in the Senate happening before the 22nd, so it is safe to say both Ossoff and Warnock will cast votes. Harris is irrelevant here, because they need a 2/3s majority, not a 50/50, so she can't vote.

    I actually don't know if Roberts will preside. I think he won't, assuming the trial starts after the 20th, since the Chief Justice only presides over an impeachment of a sitting president. I am pretty sure Schumer will run the show, although McConnell might actually get it started on the 22nd or 25th.

  10. #38990

  11. #38991
    I see this as McTurtle purging Trump from the Republican Party. Not Trumpism, just Trump.

  12. #38992
    The Undying
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    the Quiet Room
    Posts
    34,524
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Unfortunately he does have the power to grant blanket pre-emptive pardon for anybody who was at the Capitol on January 6. Yeah. The Presidential pardon power is that powerful. The more reason to kick him out as soon as possible.
    Technically he could do it, but he would have to get the names of all the people. He couldn't just Pardon "anyone who was there" or something generic like that. That kind of work is tough for a lazy fat-assed felon aka Individual-1.

  13. #38993
    Over 9000! zealo's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    9,509
    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post
    umm the two senators from GA have not been seated yet because the results are not certified yet in GA.

    Moscow Mitch is still technically in charge.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Lost control as of the 20th. maybe 22nd if certification takes that long in GA
    Minor semantics that may not matter all that much to Mitch.

    Mid terms in 2022 and the next general election in 2024 will be a central point of his strategy now, and supporting this ensures Trump is outright ineligible to run even if he wanted to as an independent.

  14. #38994
    Legendary! Thekri's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    A highly disgruntled constituent of Lindsey Graham.
    Posts
    6,167
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Technically he could do it, but he would have to get the names of all the people. He couldn't just Pardon "anyone who was there" or something generic like that. That kind of work is tough for a lazy fat-assed felon aka Individual-1.
    Nope, he could totally do it without names. Plenty of precedent for that. Andrew Johnson pardoned all Confederate Army officers after the civil war. James Buchanan pardoned all Mormons who may have committed Sedition or Treason during the Utah War.

    That second one is probably the most relevant one. Brigham Young, an American Citizen, led a large armed insurrection of other Americans against the US Army, attacking supply trains and conducting a guerrilla war. James Buchanan blanket pardoned everyone involved. In fact, the very first Presidential Pardons were under similar circumstances, where George Washington pardoned the leaders of the Whiskey Rebellion (Although those were named individuals).

    So broad pardons for insurrections are VERY precedented in America, and certainly legally permissible.

  15. #38995
    Herald of the Titans TigTone's Avatar
    3+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Westfall
    Posts
    2,747
    Quote Originally Posted by Thekri View Post
    Nope, he could totally do it without names. Plenty of precedent for that. Andrew Johnson pardoned all Confederate Army officers after the civil war. James Buchanan pardoned all Mormons who may have committed Sedition or Treason during the Utah War.

    That second one is probably the most relevant one. Brigham Young, an American Citizen, led a large armed insurrection of other Americans against the US Army, attacking supply trains and conducting a guerrilla war. James Buchanan blanket pardoned everyone involved. In fact, the very first Presidential Pardons were under similar circumstances, where George Washington pardoned the leaders of the Whiskey Rebellion (Although those were named individuals).

    So broad pardons for insurrections are VERY precedented in America, and certainly legally permissible.
    Let’s hope this history lesson doesn’t show up on fox news and trumps cultists are not made aware of it.

  16. #38996
    Legendary! Thekri's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    A highly disgruntled constituent of Lindsey Graham.
    Posts
    6,167
    Quote Originally Posted by TigTone View Post
    Let’s hope this history lesson doesn’t show up on fox news and trumps cultists are not made aware of it.
    I wouldn't count Trump's lawyers being aware of it. They seem pretty damn clueless. But yeah, American history has a lot of wierd messy chapters, and quite a few insurrections. Most of them actually have had a wide blanket pardon at the ending, and historically it was a pretty bad idea.

    Without making any comment on the current Mormon Church, I will say Buchanan's pardon was an absolutely terrible idea. Brigham Young and his group were not remotely sorry, and both that group, and ESPECIALLY the fundamentalist offshoots teach the insurrection as a glorious victory. It is pretty directly responsible for the bizarre little cult compounds all over the west, which pop up on the news every once in a while when some 10 year old girl escapes or something. And of course we all know what Johnson's pardon of Confederates did.

  17. #38997
    The Undying
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    the Quiet Room
    Posts
    34,524
    Ok, this is wonderful. She throws out insane one-liners, and then (as indicated) loses her shit when accused of living in a different reality. And her location is pinned as Jupiter, FL - which really ought to be considered for the Trump LiEbrary. And the look on the interviewers face is just priceless.

    Thank you for posting this.

  18. #38998
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Ok, this is wonderful. She throws out insane one-liners, and then (as indicated) loses her shit when accused of living in a different reality. And her location is pinned as Jupiter, FL - which really ought to be considered for the Trump LiEbrary. And the look on the interviewers face is just priceless.

    Thank you for posting this.
    OTHER PEOPLE DIED AND PAID FOR THIS COUNTRY SO LISTEN TO MEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

    Pathetic.

  19. #38999
    The Undying
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    the Quiet Room
    Posts
    34,524
    Quote Originally Posted by Thekri View Post
    Nope, he could totally do it without names. Plenty of precedent for that. Andrew Johnson pardoned all Confederate Army officers after the civil war. James Buchanan pardoned all Mormons who may have committed Sedition or Treason during the Utah War.

    That second one is probably the most relevant one. Brigham Young, an American Citizen, led a large armed insurrection of other Americans against the US Army, attacking supply trains and conducting a guerrilla war. James Buchanan blanket pardoned everyone involved. In fact, the very first Presidential Pardons were under similar circumstances, where George Washington pardoned the leaders of the Whiskey Rebellion (Although those were named individuals).

    So broad pardons for insurrections are VERY precedented in America, and certainly legally permissible.
    Were those Pardons ever tested in court?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    OTHER PEOPLE DIED AND PAID FOR THIS COUNTRY SO LISTEN TO MEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

    Pathetic.
    But so categorically Trump - just the perfect representation of the entitled idiocy that embodies his followers.

  20. #39000
    Legendary! Thekri's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    A highly disgruntled constituent of Lindsey Graham.
    Posts
    6,167
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Were those Pardons ever tested in court?
    Doesn't really matter, because if they were they were upheld, and if they weren't they are still valid precedent that would uphold this one. I mean we have like 5 good examples of these pardons, and all of them stood, several for a few centuries now.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •