Mega-Thread: Coronavirus Pandemic

[Granyala]

Well my wallet went into a coma does that count? Independent contractor at a warehouse for half my income = No sick time = Having to pay people to cover my shift.

After 40+ years of asthma you just know when something is wrong.

Haha, yeah I can imagine that.
I'm very lucky to live in Germany, where medical costs & sick time are basically a non issue (unless you are sick for > 6 weeks at a time).

I know the feeling, having Asthma myself. I hope it's nothing permanent. Good news on your dad getting the vaccine though.

- - - Updated - - -

How are vaccine roll outs going?

According to RKI, 1.048.160 people got it as of Friday (I assume it's the first dose).
So far I haven't heard anything problematic.

[PACOX]

Moderna said that you might want another booster after one year.

I do think it will be seasonal thing like flu, probably taken alongside, at least next 2-3 years.

As of now, it does not appear to mutate like influenza. If it does then it is just one more annual shot. Even in the US under our current system it would mostly be subsidized and available on every corner if it's annual. The problem, like the flu shot, is people bothering to get it.

We can only speculate how long the current shots last assuming the virus doesn't mutate. The science just isn't there. Minimum is 5 months, I haven't come across an article that wants to bet on a year. I believe the vaccines will get better with time, especially the mRNA ones. What we have now is a tarp over a leaky roof. It will last quite a while but what you really need is to do is repair the roof. Later iterations of vaccines will plug the hole.

- - - Updated - - -

According to RKI, 1.048.160 people got it as of Friday (I assume it's the first dose).
So far I haven't heard anything problematic.

I hope those numbers are good for your area. In mine we are looking at 1% of the county having received a dose - that's among healthcare workers, first responders, caregivers, and the elderly. Supposedly more doses are due to arrive but we're looking at a very slow rollout if the rate stays the same. I personally believe service workers (fast food, restaurant, grocery, home repair, you know the 'essentials') should be in the initial groups as well.

[Forogil]

They're not saying that 23 people died from the vaccine. They said that 23 elderly, frail people have died at some point after taking the vaccine, and they're investigating to find out if the deaths are related to the vaccine, or if they're just incidental.

I generally agree that there's a lot of alarmism and this deaths don't seem that concerning, but technically they wrote "a few days after"; not "at some point after".

Since the vaccination started recently it's almost the same, but I would say that number seems too low for "at some point after":

Norway (the country - not the care provider in some states in the US) has about 30k persons in long-time care and had vaccinated about 20k (primarily within that population) January 11 (a few days before that study). If about 200 persons die each week in long-time care in Norway (there have been a bit conflicting statements; I believe the 400 include other care homes as well) that means about 30 persons die each day, and if 20k of 30k had been vaccinated it means that among the vaccinated 20 persons would on average die each and every day - compared with the 23 that died a few specific days after they had gotten the vaccine.

However:
It might be that they skipped some very frail persons, if the person is on death's door and stopped eating it doesn't seem meaningful to vaccinate.
It's still possible that the vaccine pushed some over the edge; as even a mild fever could be fatal. In the general population few persons are that ill; and you can wait a few days for those specific cases.
And even if they all died due to it would mean that grouphave 0.1% fatality to the vaccine compared to perhaps 20% for the virus. (Clearly those numbers are lower in the general population.)

[Granyala]

I hope those numbers are good for your area. In mine we are looking at 1% of the county having received a dose - that's among healthcare workers, first responders, caregivers, and the elderly. Supposedly more doses are due to arrive but we're looking at a very slow rollout if the rate stays the same. I personally believe service workers (fast food, restaurant, grocery, home repair, you know the 'essentials') should be in the initial groups as well.

Same here, It's just the beginning.
It will be late summer /fall at least before it is available to my age group.

Bright side: loots of guinea pigs before I have to make the decisions.

[Katie N]

Looking back now, I don't understand how some countries dealt with it so badly and continue dealing with it so badly.

[Gaidax]

Looking back now, I don't understand how some countries dealt with it so badly and continue dealing with it so badly.

Some have excessive bureaucracy issues, like in many cases in EU. Some are just management/decision making. Some don't have the means or reach. Some just don't give a damn. Some are combination of two or more of the cases before.

It's really down to each and every government and their own demons.

[Felya]

Some have excessive bureaucracy issues, like in many cases in EU

Those bureaucracy issues didn’t stop Trump from defunding the pandemic response team, cutting the CDC budget by 19% and only kicking a few million people off healthcare, because Trump is obsessed with Obama. When US president tells a reporter one on one, the virus will be a big deal, but tells the public it’s a hoax that will go away by Easter... then goes on to encourage rioters attacking nurses and medical professionals, during their ‘I need a hair cut’ riots.

Last I checked... those are not the definition of bureaucracy... more like a hospitality mogul didn’t want to take action, that would impede his business. Even if it meant 400k dead... Trump got to make money...

- - - Updated - - -

Looking back now, I don't understand how some countries dealt with it so badly and continue dealing with it so badly.

Some countries have presidents, who are also billionaires that own a lot of hotels and golf courses around the world, where lock down and preventative measures, have a direct impact on Trump corporation finances.

[Easo]

Here in Poland people calculated that if you are in 18-30 bracket and don't have access to vaccine because your job you will be vaccinated as soon as....2025. Nice one. Its going so insanely slow that they will probably end up in vicious circle of re-vaccinating medical staff/oldies all over.

No, it will be much faster. Though Pfizer's decision about manufacturing revamp was interesting, to say the least, they are pumping out what, hundreds of thousands of doses per day? Moderna is gonna be doing the same, plus there are other manufacturers incoming as well. It is ramping up very fast. Question is about logistics and peoples willingness to get it.

I think there was one another, but seems unrelated.

We're 2 million people in already, there is an odd case of allergic reaction here and there and couple cases of deaths, but there is no clear link for the latter ones.
I'm hoping I'll get my vaccine in February. They are now starting to offer it to 45 yo+, so I imagine somewhere in February my age group will start getting it too.

Basically statistical error at most, bad luck, etc. There are millions of vaccinations across Europe too, nothing spectacular is coming out about sideeffects.

[Arrashi]

No, it will be much faster. Though Pfizer's decision about manufacturing revamp was interesting, to say the least, they are pumping out what, hundreds of thousands of doses per day? Moderna is gonna be doing the same, plus there are other manufacturers incoming as well. It is ramping up very fast. Question is about logistics and peoples willingness to get it.

Arguably it will be much slower. They vaccine betwen 20-25k people a day in 6k "vaccination points" which gives 4-5 vaccinations per day per station. And it will go much faster in big cities where it started than in smaller towns/countryside.

[breadisfunny]

Looking back now, I don't understand how some countries dealt with it so badly and continue dealing with it so badly.

because our country is full of conspiracy nuts who abhor vaccines and worship trump's footsteps.

[Zan15]

Some countries have presidents, who are also billionaires that own a lot of hotels and golf courses around the world, where lock down and preventative measures, have a direct impact on Trump corporation finances.

Not to mention that country has very lax "donation" rules/laws when it comes to presidential elections. Had to keep those corporate/billionaire donors happy. Can't be happy with a closed country....

- - - Updated - - -

No, it will be much faster. Though Pfizer's decision about manufacturing revamp was interesting, to say the least, they are pumping out what, hundreds of thousands of doses per day? Moderna is gonna be doing the same, plus there are other manufacturers incoming as well. It is ramping up very fast. Question is about logistics and peoples willingness to get it.


.

Strange, I heard in the US we have a couple million strong logistics entity that basically has been preparing for things like this for decades.
Guess when you are not going to save the oil for our corporate entities, you don't get them involved..... sigh

Well at least it looks like an actual adult on the 20th will be making some changes to start to get them involved, bigly.

[Logwyn]

mAbs aren’t the same thing as the vaccines.

"Interestingly, N234Q was markedly resistant to neutralizing antibodies, whereas N165Q became more sensitive. These findings could be of value in the development of
vaccine and therapeutic antibodies."

Didn't bother did ya.

[PACOX]

Basically statistical error at most, bad luck, etc. There are millions of vaccinations across Europe too, nothing spectacular is coming out about sideeffects.

Side effects are unfortunate but the rate they occur seem to lower than say going to the hospital and having to deal with some complication - even if you hospital stay doesn't involve surgery. People often don't avoid hospitals because they fear complications (there's other reasons they do though) and the vaccines appear to be safer.

[Krakan]

Looking back now, I don't understand how some countries dealt with it so badly and continue dealing with it so badly.

I think it's a combination of the organizations responsible for raising the alarm turned into cheer leaders for how amazing china was at handling it. W.H.O. acted disgracefully for example along with a healthy dose of not wanting it to be as bad as it was and protecting the markets.

[Gaidax]

Here's a fun bit, MoH released joint project agreement with Phizer that allowed to get priority on vaccines.

https://govextra.gov.il/media/30806/...t-redacted.pdf

[PhaelixWW]

I think it's a combination of the organizations responsible for raising the alarm turned into cheer leaders for how amazing china was at handling it. W.H.O. acted disgracefully for example along with a healthy dose of not wanting it to be as bad as it was and protecting the markets.

Nah, lol

I know you very desperately want to blame everything on China, but you can't just reimagine reality to fit your narrative.

[Krakan]

Nah, lol

I know you very desperately want to blame everything on China, but you can't just reimagine reality to fit your narrative.

I mean.. you can go back and read how for months the w.h.o. said it wasn't a big deal and it wasn't a pandemic...

It's still there written down I don't have to imagine it... is this what happens to your mind on cnn?

[Zan15]

I mean.. you can go back and read how for months the w.h.o. said it wasn't a big deal and it wasn't a pandemic...

It's still there written down I don't have to imagine it... is this what happens to your mind on cnn?

i know proof won't follow from you, but didn't the WHO declare its going to become a pandemic mid feb, which would have only been about a month and a half after it was first discoverd?
Also hard to declare a pandemic before it becomes one, huh?

[Krakan]

i know proof won't follow from you, but didn't the WHO declare its going to become a pandemic mid feb, which would have only been about a month and a half after it was first discoverd?
Also hard to declare a pandemic before it becomes one, huh?

Yeah why would we want to be alerted to something a month and a half before it snowballed out of control... who would want to isolate one country rather then infect the world.

[PhaelixWW]

I mean.. you can go back and read how for months the w.h.o. said it wasn't a big deal and it wasn't a pandemic...

It's still there written down I don't have to imagine it... is this what happens to your mind on cnn?

It's absolutely written down. Everywhere. The WHO never "said it wasn't a big deal".

But the WHO was busy, and alerts were going out early on.

Your attempted narrative is garbage and you know it.