Thorgast balance

[Bloodyleech]

I rarely let end bosses even damage me... have you tried that?

No no no no, this isn't how it works, how dare you! You have to tank enemies, he made it quite obvious!

On a more serious note: yeah, using the class abilities to negate as much damage is very basic knowledge.

[Odinfrost]

Sad fact: you can get the same type at least TWICE in a TC run. Had fire 1-6 and 13-18.

Even sadder fact: You can get the same wing all 3 times. My recent TC (layer 5) was 18 floors of Soulforges.

[Bigbazz]

Even sadder fact: You can get the same wing all 3 times. My recent TC (layer 5) was 18 floors of Soulforges.

Tip if you didn't know already, if you throw the anima (250 cost thing sold at vendor) at a fire type mob it drops an anima power that massively reduces the fire damage you take, including from the soulforges health drain.

[Strawberry]

first death i DCed, second death my cat made me fall off a bridge. third and fourth death was due to afk cause wife wanted me to buy groceries.

the only requirement to progress floors is to kill bosses, if u can oneshot them then gg ez mount

I have zero interest in creeping through the dungeon just to one shot a boss.
As arms I can pull 3 1.8mil HP elites and 5-10 500k hp trash mobs at the same time and just cleave them all in 10-15 seconds without taking any damage. With regular 1mil cleaving crits.
In the end, when the final boss dies in 1 or 15 hits is irrelevant. The point is, for arms, it's trivial.

[Odinfrost]

Tip if you didn't know already, if you throw the anima (250 cost thing sold at vendor) at a fire type mob it drops an anima power that massively reduces the fire damage you take, including from the soulforges health drain.

I know. Found out a few days before that run. I was chatting with a friend while going through that run, just took the fire resist at the first chance I had, and joked that I would get a 3/3 soulforge. Lo and behold.

[Amaterasu65]

Arcane mage is impossible to do ... even Layer 1 ... I just don't have enough health to tank the bosses or packs when they don't split.

I can dps even the biggest guys down in under 30 seconds, but they can dps me down in under 10.

That's the point - the balance is off kilter.

I remember in Torghast layer 8 (non-Twisting Corridors) pre nerf, I was around or a little lower than 200ilvl. I still didn't have the torghast upgrades from Ven'ari, so most useful epic powers were non existent, especially if you consider that 6 floors are not enough to get what you want. I had to kite endlessly and be on the edge at all times otherwise the mobs would reach me and two shot me. I think fire has some extra help with scorch speed, while also dealing damage and can do the normal rotation under 30% on the move. Arcane needs hard casts so you either spam barrage for speed and slow and hope you'll eventually kill it, or tank it in the face.

I haven't tried it as arcane yet, don't remember most of the powers but I think it will feel as a handicap compared to fire.

[Bloodyleech]

I remember in Torghast layer 8 (non-Twisting Corridors) pre nerf, I was around or a little lower than 200ilvl. I still didn't have the torghast upgrades from Ven'ari, so most useful epic powers were non existent, especially if you consider that 6 floors are not enough to get what you want. I had to kite endlessly and be on the edge at all times otherwise the mobs would reach me and two shot me. I think fire has some extra help with scorch speed, while also dealing damage and can do the normal rotation under 30% on the move. Arcane needs hard casts so you either spam barrage for speed and slow and hope you'll eventually kill it, or tank it in the face.

I haven't tried it as arcane yet, don't remember most of the powers but I think it will feel as a handicap compared to fire.

Barrage should slow enemies if talented, too. (which is the best go-to talent on this row)

The real problem here is just that some people do not want to learn/get better/accept that they are not the pinacle and just say that it's the games fault - this is the real thing why some people are not able to solo this place. Gear is thrown at one for almost free (full 197 armor, 187 weap), so this is a non-issue in the nerfed regular Torghast - TC is not even gear dependend at all, just all about using powers that interact with each other.

[HansOlo]

You are talking about corridors? Because with 200k dps you basically two/three shots every regular Torghast boss even in layer 8.

Things get really wierd on a demo lock. My pets autoattacks/white hits scales up to like 20K per hit sometimes and reaching more than 500K HP(basicly unkillable). The spec is not bursty and there is a 15-20sec ramp up time. But ive killed bosses less than 30sec on my 215 lock and having more than 100K end fight DPS and peaking towards 200K.

[Raugnaut]

Arcane mage is impossible to do ... even Layer 1 ... I just don't have enough health to tank the bosses or packs when they don't split.

I can dps even the biggest guys down in under 30 seconds, but they can dps me down in under 10.

That's the point - the balance is off kilter.

You are doing something incredibly wrong then. Layer 1 starts out easier then outdoor SL content. Unless you have 0 Ve'nari buffs (Keep in mind that Ve'nari Torghast buffs are completely account wide) you should have enough anima powers to down layer 1 with ease. Having trouble with layer 1 isn't a Blizzard problem or a balancing problem - It is 100% a player problem.

But then there are players out there who insisted that spamming Ice Lance as Arcane mage back in Cata was maximum DPS because "ITS INSTANT CAST LOL", I can completely see that there are hopeless players in the game who should honestly just be perma-banned from all group-based content.

[Boricha]

I finally got around to dedicating some time to an alt, and I have to say I was taken aback by how big the difference was. Balance druid anima powers seem significantly stronger than mage. Even layer 8 felt similar in difficulty to my mage despite a 35 ilvl difference.

[Kalisandra]

Even sadder fact: You can get the same wing all 3 times. My recent TC (layer 5) was 18 floors of Soulforges.

Ugh. How boring.

[FelPlague]

So what's up with the Thorgast balance?

I've been main-ing a ret paladin since the beginning of vanilla now and am by no means bad at it, but when I play Thorgast on my Paladin and my Destro Lock (which I think I play 'okay'), I notice so much difference in terms of difficulty.

On my Paladin, I do have to pay attention on the later levels and pop some cooldown-gymnastics to survive.
On my Warlock, it doesn't matter at all. My voidwalker tanks everything and takes virtually no damage. I can burn down everything with basic attacks and only have to worry about fears/heals.

Have other people noticed that some classes have it easier/harder?

Or is it because on my first character, things are supposed to be harder?

Powers, i know if i play my warlock most mobs will one shot my pet in the higher levels unless i have got specific powers, and on lower levels my pet is fine, but for the entire run if i am EVER hit, i basically instantly die, so i need to make sure my pet tanks, and i get powers to make my pet more powerful.

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Even sadder fact: You can get the same wing all 3 times. My recent TC (layer 5) was 18 floors of Soulforges.

i mean yes? thats how RNG works... if you roll a dice there is a chance you will get the same number all 3 times...

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Tip if you didn't know already, if you throw the anima (250 cost thing sold at vendor) at a fire type mob it drops an anima power that massively reduces the fire damage you take, including from the soulforges health drain.

You can also throw it at the spellcasters who are on fire i think called soulforge masters or something.

also if you throw it at the spellcasters that are followed by skeletons, you get a power that gives you 10x phantasma from skeletons, meaning yeah, you just win, you get 50 phantasma from every skeleton pack.

[Skorpionss]

Yup. Funny you should mention it tho, with warlock and paladin being basically the top 2 torghast classes that have it the easiest. Followed by warriors and hunters.

Night Fae Druids would like a word too. In fact I'm struggling more on my hunter which I've played since TBC than on the Druid I just started playing this expansion...

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I'm just really wondering what would happen if I try it on other classes. See how unbalanced those are..

Try Druid if you go night fae, it's a blast (I had 500k dps on the last boss on TC layer 3, he died in a single cast because of the OP covenant ability)

[Lora]

i personally love thorgast and think its completely balanced. being able to do silly numbers and pull entire floors at a time as a balance druid just feels right. now if i could only find Mjölnir in there...

[Benitora]

Arcane mage is impossible to do ... even Layer 1 ... I just don't have enough health to tank the bosses or packs when they don't split.

I can dps even the biggest guys down in under 30 seconds, but they can dps me down in under 10.

That's the point - the balance is off kilter.

Not true at all.
Finished Torghast on my newly dinged Arcane mage no problem whatsover.
You have Slow, you have Arcane barrage slow and speed increase. You have the exact tools you need to kite if need be.

Thankfully during soulforges this week, we had the beast, which made it nearly trivial by building him as a suicide bomber. He dies, explodes, AOE stuns, heals me for the HP he is recovering to start back up, rinse and repeat.

Every single mob in there can be stunned, slowed and rooted. Use that. Even the bosses.

[Nellise]

Ugh. How boring.

When I did my layer 8 Twisting Corridors I had all 3 sections be the one that spawns the mobs that attack if you're out of combat too long. I think I had 3 of them show up the whole run. Made it way easier than my layer 7 run. Felt kind of cheap, but since the only reason to do it was the mount, I'll take it.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Not true at all.
Finished Torghast on my newly dinged Arcane mage no problem whatsover.
You have Slow, you have Arcane barrage slow and speed increase. You have the exact tools you need to kite if need be.

Thankfully during soulforges this week, we had the beast, which made it nearly trivial by building him as a suicide bomber. He dies, explodes, AOE stuns, heals me for the HP he is recovering to start back up, rinse and repeat.

Every single mob in there can be stunned, slowed and rooted. Use that. Even the bosses.

You can also use mirror immages. That alone usually is enough to tank any elite (especially with shields and more mirror image upgrades). If you get the rather common runecloth wrappins power you can also use an almost sure kill AP+RoP+TotM+Invis combi to obliterate most elites and bosses in under 10 seconds. You are also practically guaranteed to get the fireblast talent, which provides you with another interrupt in most cases and especially in TC you will hardly if ever have a run where you can't buff the shit out of mirror immages. While there is a meme about arcane mages being a 1 button spec, you'd have to actually ignore everything in it's toolkit to have that much difficulty with it - or one has to be just plain bad at it.

[Unzd]

Balance is off, but honestly if you take a group in there, the classes who has a hard time solo Will be nice as well.

[cateran100]

Thanks but we talking about TC..Normal Torghast is a walk in the park