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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Highlord Hanibuhl View Post
    For years now, people have been complaining about 3 similair issues:

    - The fact that they burn out of the world being the same, doing the same stuff over and over again
    - The fact they either want flying or don't want it, to get as fast as possible from point A to B
    - The game feels like it's stuck in a time-capsule, with months going by feeling the same

    People long for the days of Vanilla, where we felt like the world was MASSIVE and everything was new. That feeling cannot return, but I feel like the game can improve on this.

    Right now, for expansions upon expansions, the game has turned into a theme-park where every 2 meters there would be a mob, always in the same spot. Doing dailies, hunting rares or just traveling feels like chore pretty darn fast, whereas games like the Witcher 3, Grand Theft Auto V or Red Dead Redemption do not suffer from such problems.


    Adding behaviours to mobs
    We know we can find a mob by checking WoWhead and finding its spawn-location at the exact marker. But what if nocturnal animals only come out in the morning, evening and night, or animals can go out to eat or hunt themselves, NPC's actually have varying patterns in which they go about the world?

    What if running past a herd of stag mounted, will cause them to spook... or what if certain predators can spot and track you from afar.

    Then, hunting rares, traveling the world or doing quests will make the world and its inhabitants feel more alive, instead of them being mindless drones just waiting for you to aggro them.

    We sometimes see this in certain area's where wolves hunt sheep, but this seems like a mechanised process where another sheep spawns right at it's place.

    Knowing that a river will cause animals to go for a drink, will create oportunity for players to stalk them there.

    Making the world bigger
    Right now, no matter where you are in the world, you can always see something of danger/interaction near you. That isn't neccesarily a good thing as it makes the world feel small. Back in Vanilla, certain area's had a lower density of mobs, creating the need to travel more across empty stretches of land.

    This can still be done again, making the world feel larger again.

    Random encounters
    With different behaviours for NPC's, random encounters/events could occur where players are asked by NPC's to assist them for a brief moment, help them fend off creatures, loot/rob certain NPC's or kill rares.

    By adding these sorts of events to the game, every time you travel, something different happens.



    I feel that by adding these things, all afor mentioned problems would be fixed;
    - The world does no longer feel the same as NPC-behaviours will make the world play out different every time
    - The world feels bigger and grander and also more alive, negating the need for getting as fast as possible from point A to B - you now want to cherish your travel
    - Because the world feels so alive, every interaction with it can/will feel different.


    I'd love to hear your thoughts!
    Il get flamed for this but hear me out:

    they could make the content harder so its more engaging and takes longer to complete and stop nerfing everything unless it really needs it due to actually being impossible.

    Before you shoot me down ask yourself, have you ever been bored when something is still hard? the boredom comes from the content becoming so easy you dont even have to think, it becomes grind, when its still hard and your working towards it you are engaged and thinking how to improve how to do better, then the game is fun, engaging. nerf it to accommadate the social community whats the result? the entire community INCLUDING the social community is bored because now its just a grind for everyone.

  2. #42
    Jesus that last one would make me quit this game faster than you could type Uninstall. I get irritated enough when a mob dismounts me while I'm trying to go somewhere -- this game needs less annoyances, not more. Yikes.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by schwank05 View Post
    If the game would have stayed the same with new bosses, zones, gear and abilities since BC I would still love the game. I could still be running Kara weekly to this day. If they had not gotten rid of 10 man my raid team would still be together and progressing Mythinc content as we did through CATA. If everything had remained the same before WOD I would still love the game I did however unsub for the first time since 05 towards the end of MOP because I got sick of the theme. The class designs were great, but the theme sucked ass. I just want 10/25 Man raiding back with no more mythic or activated Mythic or Hard Modes Ulduar was the perfect raid. I want Skill trees back where you could mix and match from more than one tree, I want Blood DPS DK back, I want Real Disc Priest from MOP back where you just did damage and healed the raid, I want Fast OH 1H weapons back and with it Combat Rogue so I can dual Wield Axes again, I want Real Resto Druid back where you just Hotted all the things and could single handedly keep 23-24 people alive, I dont play a Resto druid to cast heals. Basically bring back Pre WOD WOW and Ill be happy. I made it 2 months in WOD before unsubbing, 1 Month in Legion, and 2 weeks in BFA the game has just been lame and cannot compete with Modern Survival games for me.
    Not gonna lie, but non-flex raidsizes are horrible. They always were, people who had to be benched and raidleaders who had to bench were never happy.

    And I thought by now that Classic has been out, that skill-tree's have been off peoples mind again, now that they got into peoples mind again how dull and restrictive they actually were.

    And sorry, no can do. Disc was despised for it's insane power, and mandatory presence in most raids. Disc are even the main reason why most healers now got struck with an overall balance, because every heal should be somewhat be able to do every content. With some healers ofc being better in certain situations than others.

    Imagine PvP with a druid healer that you can't interrupt, lol. Make shamans mandatory?

    But alas, it's all fine and dandy, until one actually remembers the problems these things people "want back" had. Cause most of the time, they just liked being the favoured class, and didn't understood how bad off the alternatives were.

    And fast 1-h weapons, well. Want to get finally a weapon in the raid, and realise its worse than your current? Cause thats what you're asking for.

    There's many, many changes for simple and easy to understand reasons. No one wants to play the equivalent of a classic feral druid, but they also want to play the specc that's most fun to them without being horribly bad.

    By getting one thing, you'll remove three things for others. Atm, shadowlands isn't perfect, but unless we talk about MoP (excluding warlocks), it's by far better than most expansions gameplay & performance wise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dadoodoo View Post
    Il get flamed for this but hear me out:

    they could make the content harder so its more engaging and takes longer to complete and stop nerfing everything unless it really needs it due to actually being impossible.

    Before you shoot me down ask yourself, have you ever been bored when something is still hard? the boredom comes from the content becoming so easy you dont even have to think, it becomes grind, when its still hard and your working towards it you are engaged and thinking how to improve how to do better, then the game is fun, engaging. nerf it to accommadate the social community whats the result? the entire community INCLUDING the social community is bored because now its just a grind for everyone.
    I fully getcha, but as someone with a complete noob thaz started this expansion as a friend, some content is still hard for them.

    Even tho they can do Thorgast Layer 8 by themselves, which speaks volumes about how easy this has been made due to several nerfs.

    And I agree with the poster above me. There's some real hot takes in there, where I think "No thank you, I actually enjoy not having to grind 8 hours on a weekend that is supposed to be fun content instead."
    "No thank you, I don't want to quit work just because I need more time to complete my stuff."
    Last edited by LordTakeo; 2021-01-20 at 07:10 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Wu View Post
    "Real" MMORPG means not having the lionshare of your content be singleplayer. Pretty objective, no?

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by LordTakeo View Post
    "No thank you, I don't want to quit work just because I need more time to complete my stuff."
    There you have it. by making the content hard you need more time. thus the content lasts longer. wondering why there is nothing to do 6 weeks into the expansion? no hard content that keeps you engaged.

    Also you forget someone that doesnt have the time could still work towards completing that top level and collecting soul ash by doing lower layers as they progress with knowledge/gear, you can see the whole system blizzard tried to set up with higher reward in the lower levels but its like they bottled it as soon as people started complaining they couldnt do layer 8 instantly so nerfed it.

    You cannot balance the game so its fun for a long time without an element of difficulty because as soon as it becomes easy that is when it turns into the boring grind.

    Blizzard are screwing there own game by making the whole community bored by making the game too easy.

    the problem is the person that you mention wants to collect the top achievements / gear too alongside everyone else with a quarter of the effort so everything has to be nerfed to accommadate them screwing legitimately everyone in the community out of a fun game.

    The entitled casual is being catered too which is resulting in EVERYONE being bored INCLUDING the entitled casual.

    "i want to be able to do that content too, just because i work should effect MY game"
    "here you go we will lower the skill level requirement just to suit you"
    "thanks i did it, now what? theres nothing to do"
    Last edited by dadoodoo; 2021-01-20 at 07:37 AM.

  5. #45
    Immortal Zka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    there is a reason why shadowlands is so succesful, we can see its a good mix of Vanilla ideas and current wow ideas.
    I haven't seen a bit of classic in SL, except that travel takes way too much time.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Highlord Hanibuhl View Post
    ...
    No, instead of pushing compromise, that doesn't suit anybody, they should provide options instead. For example if somebody likes small claustrophobic location without flying mounts, ground mount, ability to run and jump - they should have their Maw, but it shouldn't be forced, i.e. no mandatory content, such as Covenant Campaign, should send me to there. That's it. And I want my Tanaan-like location with flying and simple tasks, that aren't random, because I actually hate RNG.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zka View Post
    I haven't seen a bit of classic in SL, except that travel takes way too much time.
    Lol, whole Maw is "Pre-40lvl-Vanilla". That exact moment, when instead of keeping Classic and Retail as two different games for 2 different types of players, they start to drag that crap from Vanilla to Retail instead, because Vanilla is "true" MMO, is more "successful" or just to try to drag players from there to Retail, when it will die due to it's age and simple fact, that no one will get fun from repeating the same content for ages, no matter how "good" it is.

    I don't care about Wow 11.0, if it's not solo-MMO. No half-measures - just perfect xpack.

  7. #47
    Take a break is an idea. Then start playing when you are motivated.

    When I get bored I just go and play other games then back to WoW when I feel refreshed. I get bored of other games, I can feel that I really want to play WoW then I do that.
    Last edited by Doffen; 2021-01-20 at 07:44 AM.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by dadoodoo View Post
    There you have it. by making the content hard you need more time. thus the content lasts longer. wondering why there is nothing to do 6 weeks into the expansion? no hard content that keeps you engaged.
    So I guess you have 10/10 mythic cleared, have 2000 rio score and/or are gladiator?
    You've unlocked all transmogs, mounts and other collectibles? Done all covenant campaigns, loremaster, and build all covenant sanctum buildings?
    You have all dungeon, raid and PvP achievements?

    I could go on, but hopefully you see the point. Anyone who complains about not having something to do right now just chooses not to do content. Making it "harder" is not necessary, since there already is hard content. Now, what you want is hard solo content. But I have a better idea: play something that isn't an MMORPG; there are tons of hard single player games.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zka View Post
    I haven't seen a bit of classic in SL, except that travel takes way too much time.
    You haven't seen the hundreds of threads complaining about not getting enough loot? If that's not classic I don't know what is.
    Also SL needs you to keep yourself busy, similar to classic.

  9. #49
    I also read out the question I think its a proper solution is this Burn-out and boredom problem is easy to fix. Take a break from playing games for 6 to 12 months and do something completely different. When you eventually return, you'll find the game enjoyable again. thank you!

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by LordVargK View Post
    Now, what you want is hard solo content.
    that would be amazing!

    Glad in 2s - 50% is down to you
    Glad in 3s - 33% is down to you
    Mythic raid clear - 5% is down to you
    2k m+ - 20% is down to you.

    i mean imagine wanting a part of the game where 100% is down to you so you can accurately display how good you are, the shame!
    Imagine if raiding was solo, what you have to do in a raid the result of the kill was entirely 100% on you, your telling me that would be hard? the difficulty in raiding comes from the team co-ordinating together or is dependant on your team as wholes strength, not the actual content itself which undoubtedly every single one of you reading this has experience the hindrance that raiding is repeatidly, you play perfect, wipe, you play perfect, wipe.

    I have done all of the above btw at a time in previous expansions where 60% of your toon wasnt played/self explanatory/chosen/funneled into one direction for you.
    Last edited by dadoodoo; 2021-01-20 at 08:24 AM.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by msdos View Post
    I log in once a week, if that, but it's still boring. What gives? I still raid 4 days a week on classic though. Something is wrong with people's logic on this one, I can't accept it due to the reality of my situation, which is: retail is boring, classic somehow isn't and I wasn't expecting it tbh.
    Even if you log in once a year Torghast will be boring. Or are you referring to something else? I'm not sure we're on the same page atm.
    success comes in the form of technical solutions to problems, not appeals to our emotional side

  12. #52
    All I need is to be able to farm in a more sandbox world, and I would play all the time. More like vanilla/TBC in that sense. The modern game is so soulless, the only content we are supposed to do is the timegated and curated content blizzard intend, and once that runs out there's nothing. Farming is meaningless because blizzard would rather nerf it than ban bots.

    I'm not even particularly hardcore but I'm almost fully hc geared or equivalent and other than raid mythic there's nothing to do. Please give us a WORLD back and not just a bunch of systems and instance-based content.

  13. #53
    My issue is that if i miss one of the weekly events i end up far behind and end up not playing because its no point.

  14. #54
    I am Murloc! Chonar's Avatar
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    This is why I visit MMO-champion. To read about problems I didn't know existed, and being told I should be upset about stuff that I hadn't noticed.
    Looking marvelous in velvet.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by dadoodoo View Post
    that would be amazing!

    Glad in 2s - 50% is down to you
    Glad in 3s - 33% is down to you
    Mythic raid clear - 5% is down to you
    2k m+ - 20% is down to you.

    i mean imagine wanting a part of the game where 100% is down to you so you can accurately display how good you are, the shame!
    Imagine if raiding was solo, what you have to do in a raid the result of the kill was entirely 100% on you, your telling me that would be hard? the difficulty in raiding comes from the team co-ordinating together or is dependant on your team as wholes strength, not the actual content itself which undoubtedly every single one of you reading this has experience the hindrance that raiding is repeatidly, you play perfect, wipe, you play perfect, wipe.

    I have done all of the above btw at a time in previous expansions where 60% of your toon wasnt played/self explanatory/chosen/funneled into one direction for you.
    Now, tell me again why you don't play a single player game for single player stuff and an MMO for multiplayer stuff? Is it because you want to "display your skills"? Sorry, but WoW isn't made to stroke your ego. Go play dark souls or something an then insult everyone who wants a storymode. Or something like that.

    Also you should learn that teamplay is probably the most important skill a human can have.

  16. #56
    How can you say people long for vanilla when they already crying for tbc ..

  17. #57
    The Lightbringer Highlord Hanibuhl's Avatar
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    It's almost like people love to cry about the game at this point...

  18. #58
    Why can't they just make it the size of an actual planet? I've played procedural worlds where the planet is the same size as Earth.

  19. #59
    Old God Mirishka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Highlord Hanibuhl View Post
    For years now, people have been complaining about 3 similair issues:

    *snip for sake of scrolling*

    I'd love to hear your thoughts!
    Some of these are decent, and some are not.

    For all of the rose-tinted fangirling I've seen people do about vanilla, never once have I seen someone say "man I miss the old days where the world was empty and devoid of interesting things! You had to walk a mile to find something to fight! That shit was immersive!" Literally never saw that.

    So the idea that the current game would be improved by adding huge stretches of dead/meaningless space for the sake of some artificial sense of immersion is straight-up nonsense. The solution to making zones feel huge and vast is for Blizz to design zones that are actually huge and vast instead of the same-y sized zones they've been cranking out for a long while now.

    Regarding mobs that only come out at night, during the day, whatever... designing the game in a way that basically says 'screw anyone who can't play during these hours lol' is a terrible idea. If I'm pulling 60 hour weeks during the night at the hospital, I should still be able to log on and get shit done. The idea that the game punishes me for that is just about the least 'immersive' thing I can think of.

    AI behaviors is something we've already seen glimpses of with predatory animals attacking prey, chasing critters, etc. Going further than that (animals drinking from rivers, for example) would be immersive, absolutely - but stuff a zone full of NPCs, creatures and critters full of complex AI routines and you're going to see a performance hit. That's a fact, as that stuff runs on CPU and WoW is already CPU-intensive.

    Random events with NPCs would be a lot of fun so long as these are available regardless of time/zone etc. It would really, really suck if stuff was gated behind events that only happen in X zone during X hours.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sole-Warrior View Post
    Why can't they just make it the size of an actual planet? I've played procedural worlds where the planet is the same size as Earth.
    The game would literally die if they tried this.
    Appreciate your time with friends and family while they're here. Don't wait until they're gone to tell them what they mean to you.

  20. #60
    Do you know why zones are so mob dense compared to vannila? Becouse game have 300% faster combat and single mob isnt threat at all. Vannila would be unplayable with so many mobs everywhere you would be perma dead. It just compensantion for faster gameplay nothing els.

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