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  1. #61
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    sure it is.
    You can just say you haven't had to search for new employment in the past ten years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    my answer would be - visit your local library - every library have computers with access points to internet - exacly for people who cannot afford internet at home.
    Again, someone who doesn't live in the real world. Public libraries are often some of the first institutions to be the victims of budget cuts with the reasoning that people don't need them because "everyone has internet at home".

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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    lso you are mistaken about paper applications - our HR department recives those all the time - same like people who come to ask for job direcly - if they know about possible openings they always ask to leave the CV with phone number there .
    Cool, your company is clearly run by incompetent people that rely on outdated recruitment strategies. Gonna need to see some evidence your anecdote is applicable to anyone but yourself, though, since small businesses these days actually tend to rely on third party staffing solutions thanks to the internet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  2. #62
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lothal View Post
    It's so funny reading this thread, how incredibly crazy Americans are when it comes to anything sounding remotely of "socialism" and how hard they are willing to fight to make sure they voice is not being heard and their rights not being upheld.

    Keep it up guys!
    Americans will literally act like wage slavery is aspirational than go to therapy. /s
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    You can just say you haven't had to search for new employment in the past ten years.

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    Again, someone who doesn't live in the real world. Public libraries are often some of the first institutions to be the victims of budget cuts with the reasoning that people don't need them because "everyone has internet at home".

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    Cool, your company is clearly run by incompetent people that rely on outdated recruitment strategies. Gonna need to see some evidence your anecdote is applicable to anyone but yourself, though, since small businesses these days actually tend to rely on third party staffing solutions thanks to the internet.
    a) i did - without much effort due to my experience and knowledge

    b) i visit our local library regularly because even though i have no problem to buy even 10 books a week i rather rent some of them because i already have to much books in my apartment so i see those computers in corner - nobody ever usses them but they are there for people who need them

    c) i work for one of major fashion companies in my country so ye aparently those recruitment strategies do work as supplementary to online recrutation ill give you example - how would you check the qualifications of industrial seamstress or precise machine operator online easiest way is to take them for 5 days and see how they deal with work - and if they are not good just let them go after this week . ofc recruitment for office positions would be completly different but not everyone works in office.
    Last edited by kamuimac; 2021-01-21 at 12:19 PM.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Lothal View Post
    I know of countless cases among my peers who had to apply for a job in paper, including myself. Oftentimes the company in question even wants you to hand-write the motivation letter. This happened to myself (a mountain guide job) and to my lawyer friend (public institution) which are both on completely opposite ends of the job spectrum, so your claim is completely invalid.
    “Because I know of 2/100 times this happens cases your majority common case is invalid” isn’t too great of an argument.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Americans will literally act like wage slavery is aspirational than go to therapy. /s
    Don’t lie. You know they can’t afford therapy. Either the copays are too high or the services are not included.

    So they’ll wage slave themselves and then sadly watch tv. Thinking about seeing a therapist but not able to afford it

  5. #65
    America built itself on the backs of low paid labor, i.e. - Capitalism, mainland and abroad.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Lothal View Post
    I know of countless cases among my peers who had to apply for a job in paper, including myself. Oftentimes the company in question even wants you to hand-write the motivation letter. This happened to myself (a mountain guide job) and to my lawyer friend (public institution) which are both on completely opposite ends of the job spectrum, so your claim is completely invalid.
    There are people using typewriters therefore you don't need them fancy computers that is the sum of your argument.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Because keeping workers and the poor distracted with fighting with each other has been a tactic of the ruling class for ages.
    It's more people are uncomfortable realizing that they need to offer something to the work force beyond basic labor...

    The weirdest part for me us watching the same people who constantly support mass immigration complaining that unskilled labor doesn't pay enough... just what is it you think you support?

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Lothal View Post
    That's not a good comparison at all. If you want to use typewriters as an analogy, then I would tell you that they might be useless for 99% of people but they are still useful to many writers who just wanna go in their cabin in the mountains for two weeks and type on a typewriter oldschool style to boost their creativity.

    Yes, it's a niche use. But it's still a valid one. Also this comparison is not valid at all because the amount of people using typewriters is percentually much much lower than the amount of companies doing "oldschool" hiring.
    That's your assumption but considering how prominent online applications are you are just as likely to be wrong, also saying it's niche pretty much proves the point that those people don't matter. If you want to apply for a job and you want to apply to as many as possible you need access to the internet and a computer.

  9. #69
    Legendary! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    Both Republicans n democrats are right-wing parties, that is why...

  10. #70
    Scarab Lord downnola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    b) i visit our local library regularly because even though i have no problem to buy even 10 books a week i rather rent some of them because i already have to much books in my apartment so i see those computers in corner - nobody ever usses them but they are there for people who need them
    That is not my experience whatsoever. Every time I hit the library there's never a free PC. Then again, I work and live in a city that's underserved in a state where jobs bleed annually.
    Populists (and "national socialists") look at the supposedly secret deals that run the world "behind the scenes". Child's play. Except that childishness is sinister in adults.
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  11. #71
    Merely a Setback breadisfunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    unlike you i remember perfecly times when internet at home was not so common .

    my answer would be - visit your local library - every library have computers with access points to internet - exacly for people who cannot afford internet at home.

    poor people should stop pretending that they can live on level they cannot .

    this is how debts are created - people buy stuff which they dont need, for money they dont have, to impress people who dont care about them .

    also you are mistaken about paper applications - our HR department recives those all the time - same like people who come to ask for job direcly - if they know about possible openings they always ask to leave the CV with phone number there .

    just because people are ultra lazy naowadays and rather apply via e mail doesnt mean that companies ignore "paper applications" - especially when they recruit "blue collars" fr physical labour who lets not kid ourselves are statisticaly not brightest bunch of people .

    unless by companies you understand only megacorporations - and ignore milions of small businesses
    so basically your answer is to go lalalala i can't hear you. this isn't 1995. EVERY COMPANY AROUND HERE EVEN SMALL BUSINESS require a electronic application. i'm glad you live in the middle of nowhere where you can walk in and get a job but that's not the case here.
    also HOW THE FUCK do you use a library computer in covid-19 or other pandemic when they are ALL FUCKING CLOSED? did you even think before you typed that out? or how about in poor communities that probably don't have one? of course you don't care about them. nah you would rather sit there and rant and rave about lazy blue collar welfare queens bs that you have been fed by the fox and friends. i am done taking you seriously when your only answers are to ignore the problem and provide horseshit answers that don't solve anything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lothal View Post
    It is an argument because the person I was quoting claimed paper applications are "outdated recruitment strategies". They're clearly not - my examples are a top-3-company-in-the-industry-in-my-country and the other is a public institution which is part of the judicial system.

    There are many upsides to paper applications, especially related to the personal qualities of the staff that is being looked for. The poster I was quoting is being extremely generalistic and only looking at various corporate jobs, specialized jobs with routine work, unqualified jobs with routine work, etc. Not for "specialty" jobs which are a huge part of the job market as well.

    So yes, even 2/100 cases makes the majority invalid, because the poster claims ALL PAPER APPLICATIONS ARE OUTDATED. No, they're not.
    don't be surprised if in 5-10 year paper applications disappear entirely. they are a giant waste of paper and money and companies are increasingly ditching them.
    Last edited by breadisfunny; 2021-01-22 at 05:29 AM.
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  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    That's your assumption but considering how prominent online applications are you are just as likely to be wrong, also saying it's niche pretty much proves the point that those people don't matter. If you want to apply for a job and you want to apply to as many as possible you need access to the internet and a computer.
    but why would you need to apply to as many as possible jobs ?

    unless you have 0 skills , 0 knowledge and 0 experience in said field.

    most people dont apply this way - only apply to couple of companies that they are interested in working for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by breadisfunny View Post
    so basically your answer is to go lalalala i can't hear you. this isn't 1995. EVERY COMPANY AROUND HERE EVEN SMALL BUSINESS require a electronic application.
    if you hear things like " send CV only via e mail " its most of time nice way of saying "we are not interested in hiring you but due to social pressure and laws we cannot tell you real reason - for example - we dont hire women/men for position X "

    want example - lets say a chain of boutiques is hiring cashiers - ofc the employees they want are young ,fit, pretty ,sexy women (maybe nice sexy man - but rarely)

    they cannot write this openly in advertisment

    they cannot say it during recrutation process

    they cannot give it as a reason why they rejected you .

    now if those idiotic laws didnt exist then maybe you would hear real rejection very fast - instead this all you here is generic "send us application via e-mail"

    thats why companies do that.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    but why would you need to apply to as many as possible jobs ?

    unless you have 0 skills , 0 knowledge and 0 experience in said field.

    most people dont apply this way - only apply to couple of companies that they are interested in working for.
    You are just flatly wrong...

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Themius View Post
    You are just flatly wrong...
    what am i wrong about ?

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    but why would you need to apply to as many as possible jobs ?

    unless you have 0 skills , 0 knowledge and 0 experience in said field.

    most people dont apply this way - only apply to couple of companies that they are interested in working for.
    On what planet do you live in ? have never looked for a job in your life? that has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever seen.

  16. #76
    Brewmaster Sorensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    On what planet do you live in ? have never looked for a job in your life? that has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever seen.
    Yeah especially once you get into qualified jobs you aren't mass applying you apply and get something or a few similar positions in a few companies.
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  17. #77
    Old God Vash The Stampede's Avatar
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    For workers to have rights then workers need stability in order to fight back. It's very hard to fight your employer when at a mere whim they can have you homeless and hungry. Any ideas put forward will need government intervention but realistically any laws or rules put into place will need to be enforced, which is harder to do. What people need is stability so they don't have to worry about being fired, and can use it as a tool to fight back.

    The best solution is always Universal Basic Income. It's not a popular idea but it's one that solves a lot of problems. You won't have to worry about losing your job when you know you can at least survive for a while on UBI. Other ideas I have is free fruit and vegetables given to people to eat so they don't stave. Whatever is grown in your country and subsidized by the government should be yours to eat for free, with a limit of course. Would also be good for peoples waistlines as well. Then there's rent and property taxes which are out of control. Governments should focus on building free apartments for people to live in and reduce property taxes down by at least 95%, and redirecting that tax burden elsewhere. Doing all this means that workers don't have to worry about being homeless and hungry which therefore gives them more negotiating power against their employers. Hard to run a business when employee's decide not to show up for work because of terrible work related issues. When employee's can afford not to show up for work then you have more power over your employer.

  18. #78
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    Minimum wage and other related worker topics were big campaign issues during the election. So the "why is no one mad" is totally wrong, and stating it that way comes across entitled as if, why isn't MY topic #1 or if MY topic is not #1 "no one" cares. There are and have been more significant issues in the past year such as the worst pandemic in 100 years, police racial bias/reform, etc. So those are issues further down the list and not a daily headline, but it definitely does not mean "no one" cares.

    In fact one of Biden's first acts literally the day after getting in office was to increase minimum wage for federal workers to $15. So the timing of the complaint is also kind of silly.

    PS unions were the big vehicle for workers rights in the 20th century up until ~the 1970's. They are still effective for skilled labor professions like plumbers and electricians, but hardcore strikes by unions and hardcore union busting by companies in the 70's, along with certain southern states being willing to make very anti-union agreements to entice companies to relocate factories and jobs to their state (without unions) killed most of the unions off. It helped the south but seriously destroyed economies in the rust belt where a lot of the union manufacturing was moved from. So in the short term it helped southern states, but without unions, manufacturing jobs that aren't really skilled (textiles for example) leave workers without much power if they don't like how they are treated.

  19. #79
    Workers rights have sadly been forgotten in a more and more.

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