Forsaken players: Would you accept Arthas as your king? (Speculation)

[Omedon]

This has been simmering in the back of my head since Bastion's introductory cinematic, and I think it's time for a fun speculation thread.

I perceive a big part of the forsaken player identity as enjoying that "controversial" aura that comes with their "death to the living" creed: the idea that they are the one race left in the game that is still, by default, somewhat villainous. When I was on my "BFA HAS TO END THE FACTION DIVIDE" craze, I saw Calia as the bridge to addressing one of the major pillars of the faction conflict, that being the tang of objective evil that swirled around the forsaken.

But, as we all know now, faction mechanical change driven by Calia face-turning the forsaken didn't happen, and a goodly number of the forsaken playerbase seem still rather cross with the very idea of Calia, waiting for her to sit on the throne so they can grab their torches and pitchforks and march to Blizz HQ.

But what if Calia isn't the one that her own arc is meant to put at the head of the forsaken? What if it isn't even Lillian Voss?

What if the final picture is Arthas on the Throne, with Uther, Calia and potentially Lillian to guide him?

I'm not going to get into the specifics of how he gets there, partially because it dips into Kyrian spoilers, but I think we can all see a path to where this happens. He's in play again, and there is that void of forsaken leadership still in place... with an entire kingdom to potentially be resurrected.

So, I put it to you, both forsaken players and people observing that culture from outside. I mean with alts being what they are now, the "forsaken player" could be all of us! If the story ended up bringing back Lordaeron (because the nightelves aren't the only ones still owed a happier beat after losing their home) and putting the "Rightful King" on the throne, would that be an acceptable outcome to you? If they're going to villain-bat Sylvanas into the dirt (and again, that's an assumption for the sake of this discussion), would Arthas be a good consolation prize? He has that tang of danger around him, he's canonically appropriate and popular among the playerbase. Bear in mind, "loyalty to sylvanas" isn't canon any more, the player has been soundly cast as against her with even the "loyalist" betrayed by her, so if Arthas were to be put in charge of the forsaken in an arc that makes him palatable, and perhaps even a little redeemed...

Is he the one?

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Why would he come to Azeroth and not go through the Arbiter if he ever gets saved from the Maw?

[Hollycakes]

I would so lol at this but also quite enjoy it. Played undead at launch until WoD when all my friends went alliance. I'm in. Like this arc better than bluthers.
#Undead4lyfe.

Question is, what do we call him?!

[ipoststuff]

The King the doesn't need acceptance of a few zombie peasants.

[valax]

I'm sure players would want that , the actual forsaken wouldn't want any of that , he's the reason they are dead and risen again to be his mindless servants and only because of Sylvanas they regained some kind of free will so bringing him back and putting him at the forsaken's command would annoy more people than it would please IMO.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

The King the doesn't need acceptance of a few zombie peasants.

What is a king without subjects?

[Angrie]

This has been simmering in the back of my head since Bastion's introductory cinematic, and I think it's time for a fun speculation thread.

I perceive a big part of the forsaken player identity as enjoying that "controversial" aura that comes with their "death to the living" creed: the idea that they are the one race left in the game that is still, by default, somewhat villainous. When I was on my "BFA HAS TO END THE FACTION DIVIDE" craze, I saw Calia as the bridge to addressing one of the major pillars of the faction conflict, that being the tang of objective evil that swirled around the forsaken.

But, as we all know now, faction mechanical change driven by Calia face-turning the forsaken didn't happen, and a goodly number of the forsaken playerbase seem still rather cross with the very idea of Calia, waiting for her to sit on the throne so they can grab their torches and pitchforks and march to Blizz HQ.

But what if Calia isn't the one that her own arc is meant to put at the head of the forsaken? What if it isn't even Lillian Voss?

What if the final picture is Arthas on the Throne, with Uther, Calia and potentially Lillian to guide him?

I'm not going to get into the specifics of how he gets there, partially because it dips into Kyrian spoilers, but I think we can all see a path to where this happens. He's in play again, and there is that void of forsaken leadership still in place... with an entire kingdom to potentially be resurrected.

So, I put it to you, both forsaken players and people observing that culture from outside. I mean with alts being what they are now, the "forsaken player" could be all of us! If the story ended up bringing back Lordaeron (because the nightelves aren't the only ones still owed a happier beat after losing their home) and putting the "Rightful King" on the throne, would that be an acceptable outcome to you? If they're going to villain-bat Sylvanas into the dirt (and again, that's an assumption for the sake of this discussion), would Arthas be a good consolation prize? He has that tang of danger around him, he's canonically appropriate and popular among the playerbase. Bear in mind, "loyalty to sylvanas" isn't canon any more, the player has been soundly cast as against her with even the "loyalist" betrayed by her, so if Arthas were to be put in charge of the forsaken in an arc that makes him palatable, and perhaps even a little redeemed...

Is he the one?

I mean it would take it full circle with the people of lordereon, as Arthas is the prince of lordereon. I have no issue with him and uther becoming leaders of the forsaken. I think that also puts calia in a better place as well.

I think the only issue would be Arthas' redemption speech being mega cringey.

I think Bolvar is another good option

[Razion]

The Forsaken have ever wanted to start a new world order, to extinguish anyone who would get in their way - Human, Scourge, or otherwise. To the Forsaken the Lich King, Arthas, is the ultimate embodiment of enslavement and the oppression of their new world order. Even the more gentle Forsaken who don't subscribe to the new world order angle still resent and despise Arthas for what he did to them. When Arthas was a prince and uncorrupted he was beloved by his people. Assuming Arthas could even go back to a point where he wasn't corrupted and didn't fall to madness, I doubt the people of Lordaeron after campaigning against the Lich King for as long as they did would hold anything but hatred for him. The Forsaken live lives of bitterness and hatred, a life of endless suffering and the only person responsible for it is Arthas ultimately. Even if they could find it in themselves to forgive him, I don't think they would ever accept him as ruler again - they'd sooner kill him or kill themselves. Arthas is their most hated enemy, forever and always. Plus, he would just be another Human vying for the throne at this point. The Forsaken need a Forsaken leader. Someone who will take their own interests to heart. Not someone who is just going to control them and be driven to corruption at the drop of a hat again.

[McNeil]

He'd have a hard time being accepted by the forsaken who got into their situation because of him in the first place. The again we forgave AU Grom despite causing a worldwide genocide, and unlike Arthas he was not being corrupted nearly as much. I don't buy that any dead character from the Shadowlands should be able to return to Azeroth though, it kinda defeats the whole meaning of.... you know, being dead.

I do expect to see something from Arthas but I doubt that its going to be more than some form of redemption.

[Selah]

Would never fly with the forsaken in my opinion. Arthas would be the living embodiment of all of their suffering. Even if he was under the control of the Jailer, it doesn't change the history of what he represents.

A different way to think about this, take your favorite historical monster. Someone who committed heinous acts all throughout history. Even if it comes out that said person was under the direct control of another outside force, it's extremely likely that even if that force was removed most people would outright (rightfully) reject the idea of that person ever holding power again.

[intenz]

Wow lore has degenerated into such a clown world that I honestly wouldn't be shocked or even care if Arthas was the new forsaken leader.

[AngerFork]

It's an interesting question. Arthas does have a legitimate claim to Lordaeron's throne, moreso even than Calia. Plus the Forsaken currently exist largely due to Arthas' actions...without him taking up Frostmourne, they likely wouldn't be there at all. And you are correct that the Forsaken currently have a leadership vacuum without a great fit to take over in place.

But that in itself is what makes this tricky. Many Forsaken feel their condition is a curse rather than a second chance at life, and there are still some loyal to the Dark Lady. It would be a very hard sell for those Forsaken to go back to the very man who cursed them this way. After all he's done, can he really be trusted as a leader? Also, would Arthas even want that role? There's a lot he never learned about Forsaken culture and he really wouldn't know the first thing about them today, aside from how they came to exist.

I definitely think there's a spot in the World of Warcraft for Arthas if he returns, but I don't see it as being at the head of the Forsaken. Personally, I suspect he'll wind up within the ranks of the Kyrian when all is said and done, but he might have a spot within the Ebon Blade or Argent Crusade if he does return to Azeroth.

[mizeri]

What is a king without subjects?

he would still be a king