Solution for M+ leavers....

[Vitinariy]

I feel like every character should have a 'profile page' where people from his group can leave comments.
Or some sort of internal like/dislike system, so that people can rely on in-game information, rather than addon information.

Or even a simple statistic (how many instances player started vs how many finished).

[ellieg]

I feel like every character should have a 'profile page' where people from his group can leave comments.
Or some sort of internal like/dislike system, so that people can rely on in-game information, rather than addon information.

Or even a simple statistic (how many instances player started vs how many finished).

Tank announces the route he's gonna go. No one says anything. Halfway thru the run he pulls a pack thats listed in the run he linked, but dif than the one the mage usually does. "Wtf idiot, why are you going this way" leaves a bad review.

Person is flawless all run. 1 mistake happens. Review reads "doesn't know how to play class. Stands in all mechanics".

Join group. Everyone is doing 1.5k dps. Healer can't keep everyone up. Finishing key does not look likely, much less on time. Leave and get a mark against you. Bad luck like this 3x when first doing m+ on your char and now u can't get into any groups.

No one leaves reviews unless u fuck sonething up, or u do absolutely amazing. Average, good, or even really good play will almost never get a review. I just don't trust players giving an unbiased review

[chiddie]

Gearscore was from an era where everything was easier than it is now.

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The fact that you can't understand that if you remove the timer, ppl will just control every pack and single target mobs, then wait for cds on Boss is baffling to say the least.

What level of key are you usually doing ?

We have no proof of this. It may be true, it may be not true, it could happen sometimes. But we don’t know.

One thing that EVERYONE likes about M+ (or dungeons in general) is that apart from total fails every dungeon can be completed in a reasonable amount of time (30 to 40 minutes). This won’t change without a timer, because the faster I go, the more dungeons I can run, the more chances I’ll have to loot something.

There will be cases when you clearly see that Boss X will be maybe doable with cds because group wiped with boss at 10% without them, but it won’t be the standard for sure. With everyone taking everything more relaxed probably you will see dungeons completed in 40-50 minutes instead of 30-40, that imho is fine enough.

Ah, I’m currently in the 4-6 bracket, moving to 7-9 starting this week. But in BfA I healed up to +14 before the exp ended, so I’m not a permanent 2-4 bracket player who has not seen anything past 10 and “do not know things”.

[Specialka]

We have no proof of this. It may be true, it may be not true, it could happen sometimes. But we don’t know.

One thing that EVERYONE likes about M+ (or dungeons in general) is that apart from total fails every dungeon can be completed in a reasonable amount of time (30 to 40 minutes). This won’t change without a timer, because the faster I go, the more dungeons I can run, the more chances I’ll have to loot something.

There will be cases when you clearly see that Boss X will be maybe doable with cds because group wiped with boss at 10% without them, but it won’t be the standard for sure. With everyone taking everything more relaxed probably you will see dungeons completed in 40-50 minutes instead of 30-40, that imho is fine enough.

Ah, I’m currently in the 4-6 bracket, moving to 7-9 starting this week. But in BfA I healed up to +14 before the exp ended, so I’m not a permanent 2-4 bracket player who has not seen anything past 10 and “do not know things”.

If we are talking about +14 in the pre patch before SL, then it would be the equivalent of 8-9 now (maybe, but not higher). And again, as I suspected, you are in the lower brackets of key. Once you do higher key, you will see less and less leavers. Well, if you successfully get ahead of the gear curve. If not, those leavers will simply gear up and do higher key as well, and leave all the same. The issue here is people, not the system.

[chiddie]

While I agree with your ideas, now, healers would be complaining that they have nothing to do, or not enough. Granted that a healer is expected to dps when he can do so, most people want to play healer to heal, not dps.

I can assure you that I would PAY to be able to sometimes run dungeons pewpewing because the others take no damage.

Maybe it’s more frequent in 10+ bracket but in 2-6 bracket I’ve never had runs in which I could pewpew and launch a couple of heals here and there.

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If we are talking about +14 in the pre patch before SL, then it would be the equivalent of 8-9 now (maybe, but not higher). And again, as I suspected, you are in the lower brackets of key. Once you do higher key, you will see less and less leavers. Well, if you successfully get ahead of the gear curve. If not, those leavers will simply gear up and do higher key as well, and leave all the same. The issue here is people, not the system.

I got to 14 more or less a month before pre patch. And yes, I noticed that post pre-patch difficulty decreased, but it’s not the point.

The issue is people, but their behavior is “issued” by the system.

[Specialka]

I can assure you that I would PAY to be able to sometimes run dungeons pewpewing because the others take no damage.

Maybe it’s more frequent in 10+ bracket but in 2-6 bracket I’ve never had runs in which I could pewpew and launch a couple of heals here and there.

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I got to 14 more or less a month before pre patch. And yes, I noticed that post pre-patch difficulty decreased, but it’s not the point.

The issue is people, but their behavior is “issued” by the system.

For me, the system is working. I see very few leavers. Why would you want to change that ?

[Lynkeus]

A reputation/commendation system like the one on Overwatch could be helpful. It doesn't necessarily prevent anything but courage players to behave. A mount or pet or some cosmetic things also can be given at certain thresholds.

[Ragnarohk]

Nah, most ppl want to do damage (even in group of pen and paper players, you tend to see more people playing a warrior with a two hand weapon than a bard that will buff you), not because tank role is more complicated (hint, it is not).

I mean, tanks do everything DPS does and more. So if tanking isn't complicated... then i don't know how low to rate DPS.

Most people shy away from the role because of the responsibility it implies.

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I can assure you that I would PAY to be able to sometimes run dungeons pewpewing because the others take no damage.

Maybe it’s more frequent in 10+ bracket but in 2-6 bracket I’ve never had runs in which I could pewpew and launch a couple of heals here and there.

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I got to 14 more or less a month before pre patch. And yes, I noticed that post pre-patch difficulty decreased, but it’s not the point.

The issue is people, but their behavior is “issued” by the system.

Instead of having healers DPS it would be nice if they added more healing mechanics. I wouldn't complain if they bring the Overflowing affix back

[Specialka]

I mean, tanks do everything DPS does and more. So if tanking isn't complicated... then i don't know how low to rate DPS.

Most people shy away from the role because of the responsibility it implies.

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Instead of having healers DPS it would be nice if they added more healing mechanics. I wouldn't complain if they bring the Overflowing affix back

Dps rotations are more complicated than tank rotation and doing it perfectly while watching for CC, root, interrupt, positionning yourself, etc is more demanding than anything you can have as tank. Your only responsability as tank is to know the route and do the pull.

[erifwodahs]

Nah, most ppl want to do damage (even in group of pen and paper players, you tend to see more people playing a warrior with a two hand weapon than a bard that will buff you), not because tank role is more complicated (hint, it is not).

It is in m+ if you do pushing.
I have never had any friends even attempting to make a route and few of them said if they were willing to take on that crap they would be tanking themselves.
How often does a dps shares a route with a tank depending on the covenants and comp? 1 in 20 runs?

[Loveliest]

Get a dedicated team and you wont have this to worry about.

While this is true, doesnt mean that things should be left as is. Pugs are still a thing for several reasons.

[Specialka]

It is in m+ if you do pushing.
I have never had any friends even attempting to make a route and few of them said if they were willing to take on that crap they would be tanking themselves.
How often does a dps shares a route with a tank depending on the covenants and comp? 1 in 20 runs?

You are mixing complexity and responsability.

[erifwodahs]

Dps rotations are more complicated than tank rotation and doing it perfectly while watching for CC, root, interrupt, positionning yourself, etc is more demanding than anything you can have as tank. Your only responsability as tank is to know the route and do the pull.

you must be joking.
While some dps has more complex rotations most of them are very basic "AoE" and "ST" build and spend rotations or priority actions. While melee has hard time because they get a lot of the same shit which tanks are getting ranged are literally glass cannoning with some sidesteps and some CC here and there.

[Loveliest]

Nah, most ppl want to do damage (even in group of pen and paper players, you tend to see more people playing a warrior with a two hand weapon than a bard that will buff you), not because tank role is more complicated (hint, it is not).

Only ppl who don't tank or get carried by awesome dps and healer say tank is easier. There is nothing a dps does in a dungeon that a tank does not do. Nothing.

[Specialka]

Only ppl who don't tank or get carried by awesome dps and healer say tank is easier. There is nothing a dps does in a dungeon that a tank does not do. Nothing.

Many mecanics do not target tank.

[ellieg]

Many mecanics do not target tank.

They also have the hp pool to ignore certain mechanics and shift the stress onto the healer lol

[erifwodahs]

You mix complexity and responsability.

I said, that tank specs are not complex, tho probably more complex than BM, Frost Mage or Havoc. Role is more complex tho. DPS is just one thing - do dps. Tanks are supposed to tank, know the pulls and know the exact order and monitor not only his CDs but dps CDs too, look at healers CDs and mana while knowing exactly when the pride will proc.

I had this monk last HoA run, skip was marked on the map but he wasted his pot CD. You have to stop and tell everybody what's going one and then come of with a plan on the go and not ruin pride time on tyra setting. DPS? DPS is "Me smash" and throw occasional interrupt/stun

[Glorious Leader]

They also have the hp pool to ignore certain mechanics and shift the stress onto the healer lol

And tend to also have multiple defensive cooldowns they can cheese mechanics with

[erifwodahs]

Many mecanics do not target tank.

Same as there are many mechanics which DPS don't get?

[ellieg]

Same as there are many mechanics which DPS don't get?

Obviously but the poster was implying tank does literally the same stuff dps does, and more. Tanks do a lot and no one denies that but the statement was false.