Guilds dying because of Castle Nathria?

[ClassicPeon]

None of them are.

Anyway, guilds die all the time. Even old ones. Shit happens.

Because yo uare jelly or what? Sure sounds like it.

Preach has been following and commenting on wow for a long time. he has been a method raider.

If he isnt relevant literally nothing noone on this forum says ever is

Back on topic:

Loot is the problem.

Remove loot from pvp, its irrelevant anyway.
Make raids drop a bit more often, increase the droprate and i lvl a bit from regular m+. Decrease the ilvl in general from the vault, especially from m+

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Nobody. Form your own opinion and stand bny it. Name dropping a youtuber does not make your opinion fact nor does it make it more valid that if you don't. It just shows you don't have a mind of your own.

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There is no such thing as a relevant youtuber. They are no more important than any other player.

You are mixing up importance and relevance here friendo

[rrayy]

Because yo uare jelly or what? Sure sounds like it.

Preach has been following and commenting on wow for a long time. he has been a method raider.

If he isnt relevant literally nothing noone on this forum says ever is

Back on topic:

Loot is the problem.

Remove loot from pvp, its irrelevant anyway.
Make raids drop a bit more often, increase the droprate and i lvl a bit from regular m+. Decrease the ilvl in general from the vault, especially from m+

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You are mixing up importance and relevance here friendo

NO I am not because they are both. They do not matter at all.

[ClassicPeon]

NO I am not because they are both. They do not matter at all.

We are talking about a person with a lot of verifiable experience in the high end raiding scene.

He matters more then a rando dude on mmo.

That makes him relevant

[Utrrabbit]

I am playing since BC. You don't have any valid points.
Nope there was NOT a time where we haven't gotten items for MONTHS. It's flat out FALSE. Why are you coming here to lie? So many kids nowadays come here spewing false info, what are you trying to accomplish, get internet points from your troll friends?

Even in BC we had badges and all kinds of BAD LUCK PROTECTION.

And yes, the world, the gaming world has changed. You know, we are humans who like to play, and not suffer through something that could be A LOT more fun.
All gaming is faster now. The world itself is faster. There was a time when people got bored, now we have mobiles and endless contents of any kind. No time to slow down, kid.

Ive played since vanilla. Trust me you could go 2 or 3 months without gettong gear. Ive raided ever tier in this game.

[ClassicPeon]

Ive played since vanilla. Trust me you could go 2 or 3 months without gettong gear. Ive raided ever tier in this game.

You have always been able to do that depending on your gear lvl. The odds are astronomical however. Same as back then

[Gorsameth]

Because yo uare jelly or what? Sure sounds like it.

Preach has been following and commenting on wow for a long time. he has been a method raider.

If he isnt relevant literally nothing noone on this forum says ever is

Grats, you have solved the riddle.
None of us fucking matter. Youtube personality or not.

[ClassicPeon]

Grats, you have solved the riddle.
None of us fucking matter. Youtube personality or not.

Of noone matters there is no reason to mention it at all.

He was relevant for the OP's argument though. Be it wrong or not.

[Orwell7]

Ive played since vanilla. Trust me you could go 2 or 3 months without gettong gear. Ive raided ever tier in this game.

Yeah okay if you were farming 9/10 bosses for months OF COURSE you won't be getting upgrades.
But 2 months into the expansion? You must be on a holiday to not get upgrades. Not BiS, mind you - upgrades!

[Darsithis]

that's an open lie.

unless you do high rated pvp you have exactly 0 content which can provide you with anything that can make your char stronger during that week outside of GV lottery ticket.

this is not how mmorpgs should be . everything you do in mmorpg should provide you with some sort of power up or you working towards those power ups achievable while you play - not during lotter at the end of week.

its abomination of mmorpg.

however boring AP was it was a clear distinct way towards upgrades - Legion did it correctly - BfA did it incorrecly with azerite but correctly with buyable corruptions .

Artifacts/corruptions were exactly the thing that everyone could work towards to make their chars stronger.

SL has nothing . zero null nada.

that's why people are leaving game

I didn't say all content gives rewards that are solid upgrades. I said that there is plenty of content outside of raiding. These are, in no particular order:

- Leveling alts
- World quests for rep/gold/random items
- Campaign quests and weekly campaign events/activities
- Rare hunting/achievement hunting
- Dungeons, including heroic, mythic, and mythic+
- Alt raiding (we usually do that towards the end of an expansion/tier)
- Pet battles, pet catching
- Old raids for transmog/gold/achievements/pets
- Unrated and rated PvP

I know that not all content appeals to everyone, but disbanding a guild solely because you've completed CN is silly, and I maintain that point of view. Of course, I really doubt tons of people are leaving or disbanding guilds over finishing CN. This all smacks of the usual anecdotal evidence that "my buddy quit, so WoW has < 100k subs now and is dead!"

As you can see, that's not an "open lie". Just because not all of the remaining content appeals to you specifically does not mean there is no content, it just means you don't want to play. Good news, you don't have to! No one is forcing you. Do what you want to do in game.

[DeltrusDisc]

one irrelevant youtuber's guild died during a specific raid tier = all guilds are dying because of the raid

/spits out coffee

Irrelevant Youtuber? You do know who Preach is, riiight?

[Darsithis]

/spits out coffee

Irrelevant Youtuber? You do know who Preach is, riiight?

I get that Preach is important to many in the raiding community but I still think ONCHEhap is correct.

Guilds like that focus on one thing and one thing only, and they do it as quickly as they can, to get to the top and once that's done, nothing else seems to matter. I'd argue the vast majority of players are more like myself and my raid team, making steady progress, still occasionally getting drops, working on alts, and doing other content than just raiding.

[Gasparde]

Sorry, none of this applies to me, a Mythic raider. Sure, I don't go for a CE most likely, but very little players actually do.

You're ignorant, that's all there's to it.

Like, you didn't even consider what I was saying, your entire argument is basically I don't see it that way so what you're saying is bullshit.

What a great way to argue with people. 'I disagree on this very much subjective matter, which makes you objectively wrong'. Great point, mods come in and close this thread, we have our final verdict, nothing else needs to be said, lock it up boys.

I was quite literally talking about how the very people who want to be done with the content in less than 6 months could very possibly not be all too pleased with SL. And your sole argument is I'm not a player that cares about clearing the content in 6 months, so what you think doesn't matter.

It's hilariously silly how egotistical, ignorant and oblivious you casuals with your oh-so valuable majority are whenever there's someone who's not in your camp is stating their opinion. It's the same excuses over and over again, there's no one holding a gun to your head, it's your fault, no one's forcing you to not want to take 8 months to clear Nathria. Great, thanks, once more, lock it up mods, we've seen it all. You people and your I-am-fine-so-fuck-you attitude are so beyond infuriating, it's fucking insane.

[DeltrusDisc]

I get that Preach is important to many in the raiding community but I still think ONCHEhap is correct.

Guilds like that focus on one thing and one thing only, and they do it as quickly as they can, to get to the top and once that's done, nothing else seems to matter. I'd argue the vast majority of players are more like myself and my raid team, making steady progress, still occasionally getting drops, working on alts, and doing other content than just raiding.

Yeah, I mean, I'm in the same boat as you, but I just experienced a guild blow up.
First the guild leader bounced, then a couple people started mumbling this or that.
Then I decided to finally change flags and server transfer all at once to join a friend's guild who raid barely an hour more a week (5 hours vs 4 hours) but are already 9/10 heroic vs the first guild being at a measly 3/10 heroic.
Literally the day after I left, 11 others left, due to disagreements with raid leadership.
Now both of those teams are separated after years spent raiding together.
The guild I joined? My friend told me how there is some animosity growing... you can guess where this is going. /sighs

[Makabreska]

It's hilariously silly how egotistical, ignorant and oblivious you casuals with your oh-so valuable majority are whenever there's someone who's not in your camp is stating their opinion. It's the same excuses over and over again, there's no one holding a gun to your head, it's your fault, no one's forcing you to not want to take 8 months to clear Nathria. Great, thanks, once more, lock it up mods, we've seen it all. You people and your I-am-fine-so-fuck-you attitude are so beyond infuriating, it's fucking insane.

Ah, so this is what it's all about. We, filthy casuals ruining the game for you, pro l33t haxxor real player? Well shit. You are still plain wrong. Majority of the grind is gone, you don't have to earn "100 billions" of gold from boosting to afford full raid consumables etc.

[Gasparde]

If this was BFA and Legion i would get this post, but, you are wrong

I mean, that's settled then, right?

Me giving literal and undeniable time frames of how you could just raidlog and get to world#100 during WoD in the same amount of time it took a guild like Preach's/Fatboss' to get to world#70 this time around, na, that's just me being wrong.

It only took those guys so long because they were bad. They didn't have to do all their splits, and PvP, and Maw pushing, and multiple alt leveling and their BoE buying and their 12 months of Nyalotha selling to clear Nathria in 2 months - it only took them this long because they were just not good enough.

But let's just ignore these hard numbers and let's instead focus on subjectively disagreeing with someone's opinion and then acting like that's an objective justification to call them wrong and bring this to the good old 'the problem was you all along!' level.

No one forces you to do multiple characters, no one forces you to do 2400+ arena of RGB for the quick 233s, thats problem of the guild and the community.

AND YET ONLY THE GUILDS THAT DO THIS STUPID SHIT HAVE MANAGED TO CLEAR THIS PLACE WITHIN 2 MONTHS. WHEREAS 5 YEARS AGO ALL YOU NEEDED TO DO WAS LEVEL A CHARACTER TO 100, GET GEAR FROM 1 WEEK OF HFC AND YOU'D HAVE CLEARED THE PLACE WITHIN THE SAME TIME FRAME.

How fucking dense and thick does one have to be to not understand the undeniable difference that is going on here, Jesus Christ. It is not a question about whether or not this is a good thing, it is a simple factual statement about people who used to be done with raiding after 2 months 5 years ago will now probably not be done with raiding after like 4 months despite putting in the same amount of time, effort and skill - can you fucking take yourself and your ego out of the equation and look at this topic objectively instead of being a dismissive prick to everyone who simply doesn't enjoy your way of playing? Rhetorical question of course, because I know you can't - for some reason you people are stupidly opinionated about how I would like to spend my time playing this game (despite me not giving any fucks about what you do with your time, I just want to do my thing), and while silly old me here is advocating for a game that allows for both of us to be happy you people just always have to descend down from your thrown of condescension to tell me how people like me are wrong, how we are bad and how everything is our fault and how we're ruining the game and how we should all just quit.

You fucking people are so obnoxiously toxic... and you even have the audacity to feel justified about it because you just can't help but to always play victim and make every discussion revolve around yourself. Nope, can't have someone point out how Preach's guild went through insane amounts of prep while having insanely good players and how it still took them 2 months to clear the raid.... and how that is very much not how things used to be, nope, have to be offended, have to feel attacked, have to somehow turn this into a partisan elitist vs casual, majority vs minority, us vs them, right vs wrong, whatever childish nonsense argument.

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Ah, so this is what it's all about. We, filthy casuals ruining the game for you, pro l33t haxxor real player? Well shit. You are still plain wrong. Majority of the grind is gone, you don't have to earn "100 billions" of gold from boosting to afford full raid consumables etc.

Jesus Christ, grow up.
Infracted

[erifwodahs]

Nobody. Form your own opinion and stand bny it. Name dropping a youtuber does not make your opinion fact nor does it make it more valid that if you don't. It just shows you don't have a mind of your own.

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There is no such thing as a relevant youtuber. They are no more important than any other player.

Some of them get their own NPCs, organize tournaments, help changes to happen. Look at Rextroy, if he is not relevant in removing the scaling and bug fixes then nothing is relevant. Some of people have a hardon on hating shit. Ignorance is stupid, not bad ass.

[Makabreska]

Jesus Christ, grow up.

It's you who have a clear problem with the game and reality perception, not me.

It is you who keeps ranting, calling others toxic because they don't agree with you etc.

[Kallisto]

I mean, that's settled then, right?

Me giving literal and undeniable time frames of how you could just raidlog and get to world#100 during WoD in the same amount of time it took a guild like Preach's/Fatboss' to get to world#70 this time around, na, that's just me being wrong.

It only took those guys so long because they were bad. They didn't have to do all their splits, and PvP, and Maw pushing, and multiple alt leveling and their BoE buying and their 12 months of Nyalotha selling to clear Nathria in 2 months - it only took them this long because they were just not good enough.

But let's just ignore these hard numbers and let's instead focus on subjectively disagreeing with someone's opinion and then acting like that's an objective justification to call them wrong and bring this to the good old 'the problem was you all along!' level.



AND YET ONLY THE GUILDS THAT DO THIS STUPID SHIT HAVE MANAGED TO CLEAR THIS PLACE WITHIN 2 MONTHS. WHEREAS 5 YEARS AGO ALL YOU NEEDED TO DO WAS LEVEL A CHARACTER TO 100, GET GEAR FROM 1 WEEK OF HFC AND YOU'D HAVE CLEARED THE PLACE WITHIN THE SAME TIME FRAME.

How fucking dense and thick does one have to be to not understand the undeniable difference that is going on here, Jesus Christ. It is not a question about whether or not this is a good thing, it is a simple factual statement about people who used to be done with raiding after 2 months 5 years ago will now probably not be done with raiding after like 4 months despite putting in the same amount of time, effort and skill - can you fucking take yourself and your ego out of the equation and look at this topic objectively instead of being a dismissive prick to everyone who simply doesn't enjoy your way of playing? Rhetorical question of course, because I know you can't - for some reason you people are stupidly opinionated about how I would like to spend my time playing this game (despite me not giving any fucks about what you do with your time, I just want to do my thing), and while silly old me here is advocating for a game that allows for both of us to be happy you people just always have to descend down from your thrown of condescension to tell me how people like me are wrong, how we are bad and how everything is our fault and how we're ruining the game and how we should all just quit.

You fucking people are so obnoxiously toxic... and you even have the audacity to feel justified about it because you just can't help but to always play victim and make every discussion revolve around yourself. Nope, can't have someone point out how Preach's guild went through insane amounts of prep while having insanely good players and how it still took them 2 months to clear the raid.... and how that is very much not how things used to be, nope, have to be offended, have to feel attacked, have to somehow turn this into a partisan elitist vs casual, majority vs minority, us vs them, right vs wrong, whatever childish nonsense argument.

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Jesus Christ, grow up.

Just admit it. You want WoD back where it was raid or die and have nothing else to do.

[Okacz]

Raid encounters are fine so far. Many my guildmates complain about the loot, they don't like you only get 3 per boss

Everybody does, which might be the largest contributor to the issue. As for now, in order to raid effectively you have to do literally everything else - M+ spam, PvP for missing slots etc. While the raid is good, lack of rewards (especially coming after BfA/Legion) in it is really annoying. Being forced to do activities you don't like to do the activity you like is terrible for motivation as well.

[Grax]

You're ignorant, that's all there's to it.

Like, you didn't even consider what I was saying, your entire argument is basically I don't see it that way so what you're saying is bullshit.

What a great way to argue with people. 'I disagree on this very much subjective matter, which makes you objectively wrong'. Great point, mods come in and close this thread, we have our final verdict, nothing else needs to be said, lock it up boys.

I was quite literally talking about how the very people who want to be done with the content in less than 6 months could very possibly not be all too pleased with SL. And your sole argument is I'm not a player that cares about clearing the content in 6 months, so what you think doesn't matter.

It's hilariously silly how egotistical, ignorant and oblivious you casuals with your oh-so valuable majority are whenever there's someone who's not in your camp is stating their opinion. It's the same excuses over and over again, there's no one holding a gun to your head, it's your fault, no one's forcing you to not want to take 8 months to clear Nathria. Great, thanks, once more, lock it up mods, we've seen it all. You people and your I-am-fine-so-fuck-you attitude are so beyond infuriating, it's fucking insane.

If Blizzard wasn't so obsessed with wasting the majority of their resources trying to cater to every niche imaginable, neither you nor casuals would have such pathetic attitudes. Blizzard needs to make a unified game​, not a fragmented mess of patchwork "solutions".

The other side of that argument is that your I-am-not-fine-so-fuck-you attitude is beyond infuriating, it's also fucking insane. The point is Blizzard created the problem when they made the baffling decision to have multiple difficulty levels of PvE content across nearly every part of the game. This is an MMO, not a single-player game.