Shadowlands PTR Patch 9.0.5 - Build 37503

[Chickat]

Sooooo... Is it worth thinking that maybe, this is a prelude to the main patch, and we can expect March/April for that one?

Doubt it. They said this patch will drop in March. Probably May for 9.1.

[FossilFree]

Give raiding some love too, I could care less about M+.

[La]

ITT: "I don't understand, why don't they just make Mythic Raiding irrelevant?"

[TheRevenantHero]

So ONLY m+ gets valor points? This expansion just gets worse and worse.

[VanishO2]

Valor would come from where though? Dungeons? So what's the issue?

From raids, just like it used to be back in the day. Dungeons had justice points and raids valor points.

[GhostShaman]

I just want to fly already....so bored with this expac....

[Mojo03]

90% next raid is the Maw.

Expect Maw and Torghast improvements next patch.

New Zone for next 2 raids in 9.2

[Jastall]

IMO the cap should have been 223- not as much as Mythic raiding, but by the time you're doing +15s 220 gear is likely close to obsolete except for a couple slots.

This, this will be a godsend for getting that one item you need upgraded, like dungeon trinkets. 220 Quantum Device ahoy.

[Aggressive]

The Valor system is trash. So run Mythic +'s to even get a good use out of it. And higher mythics at that. Yep Trash system.

[Varitok]

Yay, they brought back Valor points to force me into unfun bog that is M+...

[Kiivar86]

Curious what the promotion will be for those two flying mounts. They sound neat at least.

[Darknessvamp]

With a patch like this I'm half expecting them to announce 9.1 is it and you have to wait till next year for the next expansion to drop. Why not go all out and add this into 9.1 and aim for a late April/May release? That way people can get more relevant gear and upgrades rather than get this patch in a month and be mad that they get little to no use out of a system they will perceive should've been in from the start. Of course this doesn't fix the loot shortage issue either.

[zachie]

This sounds good on paper, however...

A person who has a keystone conqueror (every dungeon +10 timed) usually no longer needs any 213s, and a person who has keystone master (+15) usually no longer needs any 220s. Maybe 1-2 unlucky slots but that's that. This is more of a system to more easily upgrade your final unlucky gear slots rather than a system for general gear progression.

That's if you assume raiders/pvp'ers should get a benefit out of this system, but it's not designed for them.
This is a change for the people who purely play dungeons, whitch a few of my friends do, they don't raid because it doesn't fit their work shcedule and they don't pvp because they're not into pvp. so their only real upgrades come from the vault.

With this change they will be able to progress their gear beyond the measly 207's that drop from their +12 mythics, or with the once a week upgrade that comes from the vault.

[Ludek]

Tbh the upgrade system sounds good on paper but there is one caveat.

Tiers 213 and 220 should not be locked behind Keystone Conqueror / Master as this is basically the RNG element.

Indeed they should be locked by the max difficulty of a key you can progress - but it should either be do X M+ 10+/15+ in time (like tier 207), or get some "general M+ score" (here Blizz would need to implement their own RIO clone) - or of course could be one or another, either you get keystone master, or you go for 20+ M15+ done (best solution)

Unless they give us an actual option to do any dungeon with any key, there is a chance you will never get those upgrades unlocked, unless you pug for certain keys. Which PVP upgrades still way better, because in the arena for example you only need to get the rating, you do not need to get the rating while killing 10+ people of every spec and then pray for the RNG to que you up against those specific classes you are missing.

[Tojara]

It's not as good as the PvP system (which uses two currencies), but it's a really good start.

Unsure if 220 is a good stopping place or not, but it's certainly not bad. Arguments can be made either way as to whether or not there should be another tier higher, but I think everybody can agree that there should be something (even if it's cosmetic) to chase beyond the 15 achievement.

The big reason PvP is still a bit superior (you can do both forms of content BTW), is because it uses two currencies. One buys you the gear (and is capped, much like valor will be), and the other is essentially infinite, which upgrades all of your gear depending on rating thresholds. As such, you have to be a bit careful in what you choose to upgrade with your valor points because there's an upper cap (220, as it stands). In PvP the only thing stopping you is the rating that you're stuck out, and waiting to buy or upgrade other pieces of conquest gear you get from your vault, or from the vendor.

It sort of has to work this way with the PvE gear because unlike PvP, you actually get physical drops in dungeons and getting higher base items is going to be beneficial. If you keep up with the conquest system, the most items you can get in any one week is two (one from the vault, and one from the vendor). That entirely depends on the cost of the item though, and sometimes you have to wait a second week to have enough conquest to buy a new base item. The beneficial thing about the PvP system is that any of the loot you acquire from the vendor or the vault is never wasted, and the only thing that's stopping you from higher iLvLs is the rating threshold, nothing else.

As it's proposed it's still a good system because people looking to get gear can immediately start upgrading gear, and for the most part, it's not going to be 'wasted'. It's still beneficial (as I understand it) to get as high of a base item as possible so that you save valor points in the long run.

A few questions I hope they address though. Currently conquest has a rolling cap that gets updated every week, is valor going to function the same? For those that don't interact with the PvP system, you can only acquire 550 conquest a week (used to buy base items, then upgraded with honor). The cap however goes up by 550 every single week so if you decide on week 4 to actually get into the PvP system, you will have a cap of 2200 conquest to earn. It's a lot to get all at once, but you're never punished for not playing. Hopefully valor points are structured the same, and in a system where you can acquire 1000 valor points a week, entering the system on a fresh alt character four weeks in will have the overall cap at 4000. Again, a lot of work but you're never punished for starting late.

The upgrade system is based of achievements at 5/10/15. Currently these are account wide. Does this mean that any character (even a new one) will have access to 220 upgrades if your account achieves it, or is it going to be character locked for the purpose of upgrades? They could go either way on this.

Really good changes overall though. Sure it happens in the middle of the patch where a lot of the player base might not need it but it's obviously going to be a system that benefits us in 9.1, 9.2, and 9.3. Better in the first quarter of an expansion than figuring this shit out half way through the final raid tier of expansion.

[mmocfd1b0ab5a3]

IMO the cap should have been 223- not as much as Mythic raiding, but by the time you're doing +15s 220 gear is likely close to obsolete except for a couple slots.

This, this will be a godsend for getting that one item you need upgraded, like dungeon trinkets. 220 Quantum Device ahoy.

Thats only if you overgear it. First +15 all timed were done under 195ilvl low renown and pre nerf.

In the next season youll want to do timed +15s again with your 226 ilvl gear, will rewards close to 250ilvl still be obsolete?

[Ellia]

Should be able to upgrade items to 233 ilvl if you time +15. It would be on par with raiding and PvP rewards.

If you time ONE 20 you should be able to upgrade to 226, if you time all 20s you should be able to upgrade to 233. Timing a +15 is WAAAAY easier than hiting glad. I'm about 1900 RIO right now, and my PvP CR is like 2050. If blizzard starts throwing 226 and 233 valor gear at people who can time all 15s. . .

Honestly I'd feel bad for the raiders and the pvpers.

- - - Updated - - -

It's not as good as the PvP system (which uses two currencies), but it's a really good start.

Unsure if 220 is a good stopping place or not, but it's certainly not bad. Arguments can be made either way as to whether or not there should be another tier higher, but I think everybody can agree that there should be something (even if it's cosmetic) to chase beyond the 15 achievement.

The big reason PvP is still a bit superior (you can do both forms of content BTW), is because it uses two currencies. One buys you the gear (and is capped, much like valor will be), and the other is essentially infinite, which upgrades all of your gear depending on rating thresholds. As such, you have to be a bit careful in what you choose to upgrade with your valor points because there's an upper cap (220, as it stands). In PvP the only thing stopping you is the rating that you're stuck out, and waiting to buy or upgrade other pieces of conquest gear you get from your vault, or from the vendor.

It sort of has to work this way with the PvE gear because unlike PvP, you actually get physical drops in dungeons and getting higher base items is going to be beneficial. If you keep up with the conquest system, the most items you can get in any one week is two (one from the vault, and one from the vendor). That entirely depends on the cost of the item though, and sometimes you have to wait a second week to have enough conquest to buy a new base item. The beneficial thing about the PvP system is that any of the loot you acquire from the vendor or the vault is never wasted, and the only thing that's stopping you from higher iLvLs is the rating threshold, nothing else.

As it's proposed it's still a good system because people looking to get gear can immediately start upgrading gear, and for the most part, it's not going to be 'wasted'. It's still beneficial (as I understand it) to get as high of a base item as possible so that you save valor points in the long run.

A few questions I hope they address though. Currently conquest has a rolling cap that gets updated every week, is valor going to function the same? For those that don't interact with the PvP system, you can only acquire 550 conquest a week (used to buy base items, then upgraded with honor). The cap however goes up by 550 every single week so if you decide on week 4 to actually get into the PvP system, you will have a cap of 2200 conquest to earn. It's a lot to get all at once, but you're never punished for not playing. Hopefully valor points are structured the same, and in a system where you can acquire 1000 valor points a week, entering the system on a fresh alt character four weeks in will have the overall cap at 4000. Again, a lot of work but you're never punished for starting late.

The upgrade system is based of achievements at 5/10/15. Currently these are account wide. Does this mean that any character (even a new one) will have access to 220 upgrades if your account achieves it, or is it going to be character locked for the purpose of upgrades? They could go either way on this.

Really good changes overall though. Sure it happens in the middle of the patch where a lot of the player base might not need it but it's obviously going to be a system that benefits us in 9.1, 9.2, and 9.3. Better in the first quarter of an expansion than figuring this shit out half way through the final raid tier of expansion.

The stopping point should be at 233, if you manage to time every +20

[valax]

I'm still waiting for my ancient mount blizzard , we didn't forget.

[pewpmeiser]

And there it is, the covenant flaw we all knew was coming, Blizz lets the players invest months into a covenant then will start tinkering, as they always do.

Changing covenants is extremely easy to do.

[majesta]

Do not want, not a fan of M+ and the toxicity I have seen in it.