get rid of valor points and just bring back TF and WF

[Argorwal]

Didn't Frodo find the one ring randomly while doing some other crap? And he was solo at the time, not even in a group.

You'll have to try harder if you want to convince me there isn't a clear history in RPG lore of exceptional items *very* occasionally getting into the hands of poorly geared individuals performing trivial tasks.

It was a known drop in a known location. Gollum had it and it stayed the same when Bilbo got it.

Not a generic ring that randomly became the one ring.

[Kaver]

The people whining about TF and WF just completely ruined this game. It has to be said.

And for the record, please for the love of god stop talking about how "everyone" wanted WF and TF gone. I never did. That was one of the few good ideas they had and whiners wrecked it.

The game is so much better without Titanforging. It was horrible for the game. People like you only wants it back because you cannot complete content without overgearing it. Learn to play.

[kranur]

hows does TF and WF fix bad drop rates?

If anything it only makes it worse lol. Not only you have a low chance at an item, adding wf/tf chance on top of that ... lol

[Subrias]

That's good that you concede and need to resort to ad hominem, you can use it as a reminder to see how toxic of a person you are lol.

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The fact that you feel bad even if you progress in raid and M+ is telling. Feeling bad because your gear isn't perfect is like a new level of OCD, it's just mind boggling.

Every min/max player is this way. That is why people create "BIS" lists and sites like icy veins, wowhead, Maintankadin (rip), EJ (also rip), raidbots, and ask mr robot exist. If you are going to argue about people getting 226 gear from pvp the you also have to concede to the fact that the people in PVE and PVP who reach these heights do so because they want to have the best gear and the best chance at maxing out their characters. If you are not one of these people, then this whole thread is invalid because TF doesnt matter at all unless you care about the gear.

[Kaver]

I agree.

There were many compromises that could have been done rather than caving to the whiny elitists and removing WF/TF completely as they did.

As a "casual" player (ie. not doing M+ or beyond LFR level raiding) I found the WF/TF system gave me more options to remain occupied in game.

The only ones whining here are people like you. TF was horrible for the game. The game shouldn't be made worse because of people like you who refuse to do anything else but world quests and lfr.

[Spazzix]

If you can't do content that rewards a certain tier of gear, you don't get that gear.
The end.

MMORPGs necessarily create interactions of relative power and ability between players, if you don't want that, go play single player RPGs. Doing high level content and getting RNG shafted then seeing a random person with a bunch of WQ gear and some max TF pieces does, in fact, diminish my gameplay experience.

[Traveler Voltin]

If anything it only makes it worse lol. Not only you have a low chance at an item, adding wf/tf chance on top of that ... lol

one of the things i do miss from WoD(shocking) is that you always got a drop from the final boss.

[Philomene]

The people whining about TF and WF just completely ruined this game. It has to be said.

And for the record, please for the love of god stop talking about how "everyone" wanted WF and TF gone. I never did. That was one of the few good ideas they had and whiners wrecked it.

Random player realize his voice isn’t the voice of the whole community and that blizzard decided based on actual indicators instead of forum threads, in the next episode will realize he can unsub to appear in the unsubscription metric, more news at 11.

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The game is so much better without Titanforging. It was horrible for the game. People like you only wants it back because you cannot complete content without overgearing it. Learn to play.

Exactly. No reason to get heroic item level gear when running normal. To each tier its reward.

[Glorious Leader]

If you can't do content that rewards a certain tier of gear, you don't get that gear.
The end.

MMORPGs necessarily create interactions of relative power and ability between players, if you don't want that, go play single player RPGs. Doing high level content and getting RNG shafted then seeing a random person with a bunch of WQ gear and some max TF pieces does, in fact, diminish my gameplay experience.

Hey turns out people leave when you rub it in their faces.

[Yorimar]

so I have no desire to run 50x plaguefall just so that a trinket for me "maybe" drops as a TF. i absolutely do not understand how people voluntarily get involved in something like this and then still ask for it. I just can't get my head around it

instead you now run plaguefall 50x hoping that trinket drops at all. so what changed besides not getting vendor epics?

[Kaver]

all those people were complaining that they're hardcore

You guys are waaaay to liberal with the words "Hardcore" and "Elitist". Most of the people who wanted Titanforging gone are simply players who don't like heavy RNG. It has nothing to do with being hardcore. They just want guy to be more reliable and fitting of the content challenge.

I love how people who are only doing World Quests have highjacked the word "casual" and everyone who just set a foot inside a raid or dungeons is an "elitist jerk".

[glowpipe]

Valor in its current form is litteraly a gods gift to boosters. Pay money to get boosted through 15's and get higher gear for it. This is pay to win. Nothing more and it needs to be changed

[Yuli]

How are you targeting those things exactly? You could always do all that, I'm not sure what you're talking about. I don't care about any of the loot in this game, it's all bad, boring, trivial, nothing is unique about it, etc.

Talk for yourself then, or to quote you:

Your anecdote about people you played with isn't evidence of anything, if anything, all those people were complaining that they're hardcore addicts who can't help themselves.

Your opinion about stuff isn't evidence of anything, if anything, you are just complaining about other people's opinions because you're indifferent. If you don't care about loot, what are you even argueing about then?

[Kaver]

it's fine that we're not continuously doing progression for the entire 6 months of a patch, let us finish after a couple months and then just relax and play.

And most people like to have alts. It's completely fine to finish your gear progression on your main a bit early so you can focus more on alts. Blizzard should design the game based on people who wants to play only one character 8 hours every day.

[Lochton]

As a person who relies mostly on world content with all but one character, I do miss warforged where I had a chance to get better gear than the basic 184-197 item level. The last character, of course, is a raiding character, so I experience upgrades on him of course. Valor points sadly don't serve world players but luckily do serve Mythic+ players to upgrade gear when they don't get anything from their runs.

[Argorwal]

Valor in its current form is litteraly a gods gift to boosters. Pay money to get boosted through 15's and get higher gear for it. This is pay to win. Nothing more and it needs to be changed

Yeah, I feel like the valor change to be a 1 time achievement for the upgrades, along with PvP requiring rating once and can be sat, both are spiking token sales and boosts.

IMO you should have to win games at the higher rating and time keys of the appropriate level each week to use the upgrade.

[shise]

Are you on crack?

That was pure RNG. What we need is mythics keys to stop giving equal or higher equipment than raids. Raids > all.

Valor points or badges are fine for catch up gear. Not the upgrading system they pulled out of their ass.

[Zka]

Blizzard's shitty game design ruined this game, but the removal of WF/TF was not a smart move for sure.

[Lamnent]

Your anecdote about people you played with isn't evidence of anything, if anything, all those people were complaining that they're hardcore addicts who can't help themselves.

No, they're pissed because people can get lucky and get more than you can get with putting much time in, and into harder content.

You just calling people addicts makes you look like you have no idea what you're talking about, which from your linked armory it seems like that's the case. God forbid people put time into a hobby they enjoy. jfc.

[Lochton]

Are you on crack?

That was pure RNG. What we need is mythics keys to stop giving equal or higher equipment than raids. Raids > all.

Valor points or badges are fine for catch up gear. Not the upgrading system they pulled out of their ass.

Sort of wish they had made mythic+ into challenge modes.