LFR is a superfluous, meaningless difficulty

[hulkgor]

it might have been true when they said it around cataclysm, but nowadays a good 20% of players do some form of non queued raiding so it's no longer applicable anyways.

Throwing random numbers around doesn't really mean anything and just comes across as pointless misinformation.

[munkeyinorbit]

I have told you multiple times now what I believe the data was showing. And for the last time, I said it was to show basic raid participation because someone said people didn’t do it back then. For the very last time, I’m attempting to put a logical explanation to it.

You have literally provided nothing besides “NU UH”. I do not care if you don’t agree with me. But if you’re wanting to talk objectively then you need to post something to support what you’re saying or just shut your mouth.

I’m just going to give you one word responses until you do so.

The issue that you claim your conclusion uses logic. There's no breakdown of casual vs non casual. This is core to your argument. If there is no data to back up your logical conclusion then it's not logical at all and is infact an unsubstantiated claim. This means you have expressed an opinion based on your own bias.

Thanks for your opinion but there is no basis for your claim so you are wrong

[Glazey]

No i'm using fact. You're just blinded by willful ignorance. I can't show someone something they refuse to see.

What facts are you using? All you've given me is your reasons why you like WoD. The fuck are you on about

[arkanon]

The issue that you claim your conclusion uses logic. There's no breakdown of casual vs non casual. This is core to your argument. If there is no data to back up your logical conclusion then it's not logical at all and is infact an unsubstantiated claim. This means you have expressed an opinion based on your own bias.

Thanks for your opinion but there is no basis for your claim so you are wrong

This is basically my point, im not sure why @Diabloish stopped replying, maybe they finally accepted their argument was as soft as marshmallow. Having the data is one thing - interpreting and analyzing it correctly and in an objective way is something entirely different.

[TheRevenantHero]

No content? What content we did have was severely lacking? BRF was the only positive?

What magical content does WoD have that I'm not remembering?

The raid were actually enjoyable. so far the only raid in SL is utter trash.

[Wilfire]

The raid were actually enjoyable. so far the only raid in SL is utter trash.

WoD was a labor of love. People bashed it because they didn't understand it so the core of Blizz devs got fired / moved on while Activision put corporate lackeys in charge that design the game with spreadsheets and user metrics and give us stuff like M+. The fact that MoP and WoD devs understood that the into raid is supposed to be easy (Vaults, Highmaul) while SL devs think that they need to jack up the difficulty to drag out the world first race says everything.

[MrLachyG]

WoD was a labor of love. People bashed it because they didn't understand it so the core of Blizz devs got fired / moved on while Activision put corporate lackeys in charge that design the game with spreadsheets and user metrics and give us stuff like M+. The fact that MoP and WoD devs understood that the into raid is supposed to be easy (Vaults, Highmaul) while SL devs think that they need to jack up the difficulty to drag out the world first race says everything.

WoD was great, just needed a middle raid in between BRF and HFC

[tehealadin]

WoD was great, just needed a middle raid in between BRF and HFC

Yea the absence of a middle is what really harmed it. The content was really good, some great dungeons, amazing raids, I enjoyed the world and question during leveling, the sense of nostalgia, I felt the overarching plot for the bulk of it was good (we won't let it happen again), garrisons had their pros and cons, on an individual level I liked them, not sure about how good they were for the game on a collective level, I think if WoD had a proper middle section then it wouldn't be thought of in the way that it is today by so many.

[MrLachyG]

Yea the absence of a middle is what really harmed it. The content was really good, some great dungeons, amazing raids, I enjoyed the world and question during leveling, the sense of nostalgia, I felt the overarching plot for the bulk of it was good (we won't let it happen again), garrisons had their pros and cons, on an individual level I liked them, not sure about how good they were for the game on a collective level, I think if WoD had a proper middle section then it wouldn't be thought of in the way that it is today by so many.

yep. Gul'dan and the Shadow Council attack Shattrath, we free Grommash who helps us retake the city (better redemption story) and that sets up HFC. Farahlon as a new zone (staging area for the Legion). would've made WoD top tier

[Tadkins]

WoD was a labor of love. People bashed it because they didn't understand it so the core of Blizz devs got fired / moved on while Activision put corporate lackeys in charge that design the game with spreadsheets and user metrics and give us stuff like M+. The fact that MoP and WoD devs understood that the into raid is supposed to be easy (Vaults, Highmaul) while SL devs think that they need to jack up the difficulty to drag out the world first race says everything.

Personally I didn't think WoD was as bad as people say. It's not my top expansion but I did have plenty of fun during that era.

I do believe the gripes against it were legitimate though, especially knowing all of the content that was cut from it. Disappointing to say the least, it could have been a lot better.
https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...rds-of-Draenor

[kranur]

I really wish Blizzard would realize the solution isn't to let everyone into raids, but instead to conclude storylines outside of them.

How can they conclude the story if the main villains reside into raids.

[GnomeEU]

Actually my main is 220.and today I did lfr while watching TV.
1 hour after reset I already had my 1000 anima altho I was half afk half the time. I wanted the skill point from my covenant before raid.

And I like lfr for my alts.
My tank can farm the tank trinket there without requirements from pugs

[TheRevenantHero]

WoD was a labor of love. People bashed it because they didn't understand it so the core of Blizz devs got fired / moved on while Activision put corporate lackeys in charge that design the game with spreadsheets and user metrics and give us stuff like M+. The fact that MoP and WoD devs understood that the into raid is supposed to be easy (Vaults, Highmaul) while SL devs think that they need to jack up the difficulty to drag out the world first race says everything.

LMFAO NO IT WASN'T. So much shit was cut and the content we DID get felt like it was mailed in. Still better than Shadowlands but holy shit WoD was atrocious.

[Nachtigal]

I don't think I am. Hundreds of thousands use LFR. Do you think they're going to sit quietly?

As long as rejection, kicking, elitism and gatekeeping exist, LFR needs to stay.

Those things exist because people try to get into mythic content without being ready, and then refuse to accept any responsibility for their flaws, and project the blame elsewhere (gear/balance/covenants etc) to try and weasel out of improving themselves. As an example, resto shamans not utilizing spirit walkers grace don’t belong on a mythic raid team trying to get cutting edge.

[Tadkins]

Those things exist because people try to get into mythic content without being ready, and then refuse to accept any responsibility for their flaws, and project the blame elsewhere (gear/balance/covenants etc) to try and weasel out of improving themselves. As an example, resto shamans not utilizing spirit walkers grace don’t belong on a mythic raid team trying to get cutting edge.

I'm talking about normal raids there.

[Revamp Man]

Same as in LFR. I lvl. Need LFR stuff to queue to normal, etc.

- - - Updated - - -



Nope, that is not a reason. It would be harder than premade but nothing, absolutely nothing is stoping autojoin pub to cooperate. Hell, it may even be healthy to the community.

ok so you are saying that it would be better if we had something like MoP lfr pre determ stacks for thge difficulties that have things like chains on sludge fist or auto wipe mechanics like sun king

[TheRevenantHero]

Those things exist because people try to get into mythic content without being ready, and then refuse to accept any responsibility for their flaws, and project the blame elsewhere (gear/balance/covenants etc) to try and weasel out of improving themselves. As an example, resto shamans not utilizing spirit walkers grace don’t belong on a mythic raid team trying to get cutting edge.

Those things also exist because there's a lot of toxic, elitist assholes that think players don't even deserve to get into HEROIC if they don't have an insanely high ilvl and have already beaten the raid. Are you a new raider? 9 times out of 10 people will just tell you to go fuck yourself rather than invite you to their raid group.

[Depakote]

LMFAO NO IT WASN'T. So much shit was cut and the content we DID get felt like it was mailed in. Still better than Shadowlands but holy shit WoD was atrocious.

No it wasn't. IT was the last of the good non-borrowed power expansions. Soild story and gearing systems. Did it have a lot of cut content? Sure but the content it did have was great.

[crusadernero]

Those things exist because people try to get into mythic content without being ready, and then refuse to accept any responsibility for their flaws, and project the blame elsewhere (gear/balance/covenants etc) to try and weasel out of improving themselves. As an example, resto shamans not utilizing spirit walkers grace don’t belong on a mythic raid team trying to get cutting edge.

I think you misspelled "normal" with "mythic"

[MidnyteTV]

I am sick of anti-LFR posts. It's tourist mode. I also use it as a tool to learn a new spec. Stop.