[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Slant]

While Guy Verhofstadt seems to assume that better contracts would result in problems solved, while the total number of vaccines produced wouldn't have increased, mistakes have been made.

But that's fine. The EU isn't an institution free of scrutiny or criticism. Things could have been handled better, and next time, we probably will.

How? You can't force a company to be able to make more vaccines. I'm sure they would if they could, but what people seem to ignore is that there's a limit to production capacities and I think we're very much testing it with the demand of about 10 billion people globally.

[dribbles]

So radio silence from you as bad news stories pour out about Brexit, then suddenly you come back with this which is literally nothing to do with Brexit.

Are you going to talk about the NI situation? The 68% fall in goods movements? The utter failure to hire enough customs staff? The fishing deal and how terrible it is? This was what you wanted, remember, are you going to talk about how shit the thing you demanded is turning out to be?

Of course you aren't. Because like all Brexiteers you're a fucking hypocrite.

In the midst of a global pandemic claiming the lives of millions you want to talk about a few little fishes? Or the NI protocol teething problems that will easily be resolved in a democratic vote by the people of NI 3 years from now, as mandated by the Northern Ireland protocol?

If it wasn't for Brexit we would absolutely be fully compliant participants in the EMA collective EU vaccine procurement fiasco that Guy Verhofstadt talks about and be suffering the tragic repercussions of that folly. The fact we are not, have no production problems, and are swimming in more than enough vaccine for everyone is all to do with the success of brexit. There is even talk of the UK coming to the EU's aid with our vaccine excess and liberating them once again this time from Coronavirus.

As Boris said in parliament just yesterday and I quote, the Government would not have been able to have a successful vaccine rollout if it had still been a part of the European Union and its bodies.

You and others have asked for brexit benefits for weeks, I just gave you two in that original post. Here's another couple announced in the last 48hrs... London is named top city in the world to invest in.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/...Schroders.html

Know who said that first in 1804 about the UK? The Schroders, a German family from Hamburg who knew it back then and their company still say it today more than 200 years later.

Wise people the Germans. (for the most part) From the BBC today...

1,000 EU finance firms 'set to open UK offices'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56155531

And so on and so on, please do keep up, we are not back in 2016 re-fighting the referendum.

[Specialka]

In the midst of a global pandemic claiming the lives of millions you want to talk about a few little fishes? Or the NI protocol teething problems that will easily be resolved in a democratic vote by the people of NI 3 years from now, as mandated by the Northern Ireland protocol?

If it wasn't for Brexit we would absolutely be fully compliant participants in the EMA collective EU vaccine procurement fiasco that Guy Verhofstadt talks about and be suffering the tragic repercussions of that folly. The fact we are not, have no production problems, and are swimming in more than enough vaccine for everyone is all to do with the success of brexit. There is even talk of the UK coming to the EU's aid with our vaccine excess and liberating them once again this time from Coronavirus.

As Boris said in parliament just yesterday and I quote, the Government would not have been able to have a successful vaccine rollout if it had still been a part of the European Union and its bodies.

You and others have asked for brexit benefits for weeks, I just gave you two in that original post. Here's another couple announced in the last 48hrs... London is named top city in the world to invest in.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/...Schroders.html

Know who said that first in 1804 about the UK? The Schroders, a German family from Hamburg who knew it back then and their company still say it today more than 200 years later.

Wise people the Germans. (for the most part) From the BBC today...

1,000 EU finance firms 'set to open UK offices'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56155531

And so on and so on, please do keep up, we are not back in 2016 re-fighting the referendum.

But how all that will benefit the common brexiteers ? As it seems there far more brexiteers in rural areas, how will they benefit from a financial place ? They did not benefit before the Brexit from the City, they won't as well tomorrow.

[Slant]

Before anyone gets their pants in a twist, regarding Dribbles 1000 EU finance firms set to open offices in the UK, let's put this in context:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...trading-hub-ft

Amsterdam is now the #1 European trading hub. And those 1k offices? They're opened to milk the UK market for what it's worth, sell OUR services to THEM. The irony being that it used to be the other way around, of course. Those Brexit dividends paying off big time.

[dribbles]

Before anyone gets their pants in a twist, regarding Dribbles 1000 EU finance firms set to open offices in the UK, let's put this in context:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...trading-hub-ft

Amsterdam is now the #1 European trading hub. And those 1k offices? They're opened to milk the UK market for what it's worth, sell OUR services to THEM. The irony being that it used to be the other way around, of course. Those Brexit dividends paying off big time.

Small beans Slanty.

That bloomberg link reports on equities trading only, a tiny part of London's financial services markets which are larger than Amsterdam by 75 times, and bigger than the whole of the EU combined by 5 times.



Some context indeed.

[Crispin]

In the midst of a global pandemic claiming the lives of millions you want to talk about a few little fishes? Or the NI protocol teething problems that will easily be resolved in a democratic vote by the people of NI 3 years from now, as mandated by the Northern Ireland protocol?

If it wasn't for Brexit we would absolutely be fully compliant participants in the EMA collective EU vaccine procurement fiasco that Guy Verhofstadt talks about and be suffering the tragic repercussions of that folly. The fact we are not, have no production problems, and are swimming in more than enough vaccine for everyone is all to do with the success of brexit. There is even talk of the UK coming to the EU's aid with our vaccine excess and liberating them once again this time from Coronavirus.

As Boris said in parliament just yesterday and I quote, the Government would not have been able to have a successful vaccine rollout if it had still been a part of the European Union and its bodies.

You and others have asked for brexit benefits for weeks, I just gave you two in that original post. Here's another couple announced in the last 48hrs... London is named top city in the world to invest in.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/...Schroders.html

Know who said that first in 1804 about the UK? The Schroders, a German family from Hamburg who knew it back then and their company still say it today more than 200 years later.

Wise people the Germans. (for the most part) From the BBC today...

1,000 EU finance firms 'set to open UK offices'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56155531

And so on and so on, please do keep up, we are not back in 2016 re-fighting the referendum.

God you're a good laugh mate, glad you get of the ban now and then, to provide some comedy.

Just fyi, you were in the EU when you prepared for the vaccine, and there are EU countries not giving a shit about the EU plan, and doing their own thing. Now this have been said before, yet you somehow manage to ignore it, cus that would mean brexit did fuck all to that plan right?

Your post from thisismoney does not mention that brexit is a cause of it. Ergo not a brexit positive. (Also no one expected London to turn into Baghdad, it's your fucked up "WE MUST WIN" mindset that is going strawman crazy)

Also you're taking things wildly out of context. Guy Verhofstadt did not say the EU is a fiasco, but the vaccine situation is, not surprised tho.


But your fucked up world view is definately shown, when a vaccine roll-out to save lives, becomes some odd talking point for "go brexit" regardless if it had nothing to do with it. Next you'll blame the UK's poor Covid response in 2020 on the EU right?

[Temp name]

Small beans Slanty.

That bloomberg link reports on equities trading only, a tiny part of London's financial services markets which are larger than Amsterdam by 75 times, and bigger than the whole of the EU combined by 5 times.



Some context indeed.

Check the date on your data. 2019 and 2020. If you look at the article Slant linked, Amsterdam only overtook London in January 2021 after being behind in December 2020

[Crispin]

Check the date on your data. 2019 and 2020. If you look at the article Slant linked, Amsterdam only overtook London in January 2021 after being behind in December 2020

pft, dates are an EU construction.

[zealo]

UK vaccinations are proceeding at a brisk enough pace that the UK government expects to be able to safely reopen infection hotspot environments like indoor gyms etc by April already.

It's laughably transparent that Dribbles here is trying to push people away from talking about Brexit impacts because of the pandemic, it was about as predictable as sunrise that he would do that.

[Veggie50]

How? You can't force a company to be able to make more vaccines. I'm sure they would if they could, but what people seem to ignore is that there's a limit to production capacities and I think we're very much testing it with the demand of about 10 billion people globally.

clearing up conditions about WHEN said dosages would be delivered would have likely resulted in astra zenica indicating much sooner they would not be able to comply. The EU could then have perhaps invested in AZ to increase production capabilities, or have prepared for alternative suppliers to fill gaps. Stuff like that. That’s ALL 20/20 hindsight though.

Thing is, it was an under pressure situation requiring rapid decision making, in a complex and unchartered domain. We made mistakes, we learned from those mistakes.

[Slant]

clearing up conditions about WHEN said dosages would be delivered would have likely resulted in astra zenica indicating much sooner they would not be able to comply. The EU could then have perhaps invested in AZ to increase production capabilities, or have prepared for alternative suppliers to fill gaps. Stuff like that. That’s ALL 20/20 hindsight though.

Thing is, it was an under pressure situation requiring rapid decision making, in a complex and unchartered domain. We made mistakes, we learned from those mistakes.

Blablabla, I'm sorry... You can't just "invest into X" and fix the problem by throwing money at this. The time to realise that resources are not enough would have been 3 years ago. Some people need to get a reality check here, manufacturing is limited, end of story. We can't poof 20 billion doses out of thin air. Amazing...

The type of whining that's happening here right now? It would have happened under any other condition. If it's not "fast enough in 6 months" it would have been not "fast enough in 3 months" or heck, not "fast enough in 2 weeks" for that matter.

No mistakes were made as far as I am aware. Just life happening. This obsession with being able to blame someone or something is obscene.

[Mayhem]

clearing up conditions about WHEN said dosages would be delivered would have likely resulted in astra zenica indicating much sooner they would not be able to comply. The EU could then have perhaps invested in AZ to increase production capabilities, or have prepared for alternative suppliers to fill gaps. Stuff like that. That’s ALL 20/20 hindsight though.

Thing is, it was an under pressure situation requiring rapid decision making, in a complex and unchartered domain. We made mistakes, we learned from those mistakes.

Uhm, how would the EU invest in alternative suppliers for a vaccine that is produced by astrazeneca help with anything?

[Veggie50]

Uhm, how would the EU invest in alternative suppliers for a vaccine that is produced by astrazeneca help with anything?

Do you believe the EU had 0 choices in anything in this process? Do you believe the EU has performed its role perfectly? Because that’s what slants arguing here. I call that naive.

The EU is a human construct, and therefore has flaws. It’s not a bad thing to criticize those flaws. We definitely should have tighter positions in those contracts. Would that have solved everything? No, but to argue there were no alternative actions we could have taken, is small minded at best. There ARE other vaccines. AZ just seemed to have the best, and most supply.

[Acidbaron]

The EU has pressure mechanics when it comes to the vaccines, these exist mainly out of these two:

- They pay for the vaccine on delivery.
- They delay promised investments because deliveries are also delayed and such contractual agreements aren't met.

Both of these are economic pressure mechanics and should be enough.


Also take note that the UK strategy is to get everyone vaccinated with a first dose, this is yet another high risk gamble as they also took a gamble on their vaccine bet being the right one. If for whatever reason there are hiccups in production and the time between the first and second shot is delayed it could completely make the first wave of vaccinations go to waste.

There is no perfect solution or perfect way to go about this, both choices have negatives and positives. It's just the media likes to create outrage porn and so highlights these things without telling the full story as it wouldn't sell nearly as well or gather nearly as much clicks.

[Ds123macd]

But how all that will benefit the common brexiteers ? As it seems there far more brexiteers in rural areas, how will they benefit from a financial place ? They did not benefit before the Brexit from the City, they won't as well tomorrow.

Rural communities in Britain suffered because a huge % of produce was bought by the city from EU imports.

With imports likely to be more expensive moving forwards than homegrown produce, produce demand from rural communities will increase.

Indeed, Aldi, here in the UK started a few months ago specific marketing campaigns to say they have invested £12 billion in UK farming produce.

With thousands of new companies setting up in the city, there will be 10's of thousands more employed people, all of which need to be fed.

Rural UK communities are going to flourish in Brexit Britain as the city grows to meet demand of city dwellers who have more disposable income.

So, there is that.

I work in the dental industry supplying dental products to thousands of dentists, and i can tell you with the pound to euro devalued, UK manufacturing demand to supply cheaper products has gone through the roof.

Brexit Britain is becoming a huge success as a whole.

It's nothing like the fear mongering left wing stories of doom and gloom.

My house has increased in value by £60,000 in 5 short years as an example and it just keeps growing.

Brexit is nothing but one big wealth story for the UK and most of its civilians.

[Specialka]

Rural communities in Britain suffered because a huge % of produce was bought by the city from EU imports.

With imports likely to be more expensive moving forwards than homegrown produce, produce demand from rural communities will increase.

Indeed, Aldi, here in the UK started a few months ago specific marketing campaigns to say they have invested £12 billion in UK farming produce.

With thousands of new companies setting up in the city, there will be 10's of thousands more employed people, all of which need to be fed.

Rural UK communities are going to flourish in Brexit Britain as the city grows to meet demand of city dwellers who have more disposable income.

So, there is that.

I work in the dental industry supplying dental products to thousands of dentists, and i can tell you with the pound to euro devalued, UK manufacturing demand to supply cheaper products has gone through the roof.

Brexit Britain is becoming a huge success as a whole.

It's nothing like the fear mongering left wing stories of doom and gloom.

My house has increased in value by £60,000 in 5 short years as an example and it just keeps growing.

Brexit is nothing but one big wealth story for the UK and most of its civilians.

We will really realize that big success that is Brexit in a year or two. You should stop daydreaming though.

[Ds123macd]

We will really realize that big success that is Brexit in a year or two. You should stop daydreaming though.

I'm a Business Analyst in the dental industry.

I only deal with quantifiable statements.

The numbers speak for themselves.

[Machismo]

Rural communities in Britain suffered because a huge % of produce was bought by the city from EU imports.

With imports likely to be more expensive moving forwards than homegrown produce, produce demand from rural communities will increase.

Indeed, Aldi, here in the UK started a few months ago specific marketing campaigns to say they have invested £12 billion in UK farming produce.

With thousands of new companies setting up in the city, there will be 10's of thousands more employed people, all of which need to be fed.

Rural UK communities are going to flourish in Brexit Britain as the city grows to meet demand of city dwellers who have more disposable income.

So, there is that.

I work in the dental industry supplying dental products to thousands of dentists, and i can tell you with the pound to euro devalued, UK manufacturing demand to supply cheaper products has gone through the roof.

Brexit Britain is becoming a huge success as a whole.

It's nothing like the fear mongering left wing stories of doom and gloom.

My house has increased in value by £60,000 in 5 short years as an example and it just keeps growing.

Brexit is nothing but one big wealth story for the UK and most of its civilians.

Evidence, please.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm a Business Analyst in the dental industry.

I only deal with quantifiable statements.

The numbers speak for themselves.

Let's see all those numbers.

[Gorsameth]

Rural communities in Britain suffered because a huge % of produce was bought by the city from EU imports.

With imports likely to be more expensive moving forwards than homegrown produce, produce demand from rural communities will increase.

Indeed, Aldi, here in the UK started a few months ago specific marketing campaigns to say they have invested £12 billion in UK farming produce.

With thousands of new companies setting up in the city, there will be 10's of thousands more employed people, all of which need to be fed.

Rural UK communities are going to flourish in Brexit Britain as the city grows to meet demand of city dwellers who have more disposable income.

So, there is that.

I work in the dental industry supplying dental products to thousands of dentists, and i can tell you with the pound to euro devalued, UK manufacturing demand to supply cheaper products has gone through the roof.

Brexit Britain is becoming a huge success as a whole.

It's nothing like the fear mongering left wing stories of doom and gloom.

My house has increased in value by £60,000 in 5 short years as an example and it just keeps growing.

Brexit is nothing but one big wealth story for the UK and most of its civilians.

yes, Brexit is great for potato growers. But there is a lot of stuff that doesn't comfortably grow in the UK, so those being more expensive is not a boon to farmers.

And where are the thousands of new companies with 10's of thousands of more employees coming from? Their not coming from the EU because that is harder then ever before.
Are they all only now coming in from the country side?

I also fail to see how your house price from 5 years ago has anything to do with Brexit.
For a so called 'dental industry' guy you sure talked a lot about farming.

[Crispin]

I'm a Business Analyst in the dental industry.

I only deal with quantifiable statements.

The numbers speak for themselves.

This is quite cute. You'll quickly realise that your house price rising has nothing to do with brexit, and if you're as smart as you think you are, you'll know that prices will drop again at some point.

But I'm sure it's every brits wet dream, to be an overpaid potato gatherer.

Would love some source of the thousands of new companies adding 10's of thousands new jobs, now that you only deal with quantifiable statements, and whether these jobs are a net gain compared to jobs lost/going overseas due to brexit.

Prove your worth mr business analyst. (Here's some help tho https://smallbusinessprices.co.uk/brexit-index/)

So far you've lost more than 400.000 jobs to brexit. Even if your 10's of thousands claim was true, it would still be a net loss.