Have We Become Overly Critical?

[Queen of Hamsters]

The same crowd that was always a bunch of Negative Nancies, are still a bunch of negative Nancies.

I don't think there's been a change, really. I've seen the exact same type of "criticism" since I started playing. Aka, everything sucks, devs don't listen, GC/Ion should be fired etc.

Constructive criticism tends to find its way to them in less toxic ways.

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No, because we're paying them a subscription fee.

A subscription fee, incidentally, that is now the same cost as GamePass Ultimate. Do you think WoW provides that amount of value?

If I didn't, I wouldn't be paying it.

Simple. Adults and their money and all that. Granted, I pay using gold. Wouldn't pay a red cent for "Gamepass ultimate" or "Playstation +" or whatever though. I'll take subbing to 1 game I enjoy over 100+ where I might, MIGHT, enjoy 1. WoW + the occasional steam game = a very cheap gaming hobby indeed.

[Thelxi]

To the poor souls concerned with Blizzard's feelings, think of it this way. When the criticism stops the game will truly have died and be running on sheep-fumes. As long as there is discontent there will be a game to speak of.

[Lolites]

All criticism is constructive criticism.

thats huge pile of bullshit
and im sure you wont mind me saying that, as it is, by your own definition, constructive criticism

[Queen of Hamsters]

thats huge pile of bullshit
and im sure you wont mind me saying that, as it is, by your own definition, constructive criticism

That line reminds me of people defending sending death threats to politicians with "They signed up for critique and public scrutiny!!"...

"THIS SUCKS, FIRE ION!!!" is not constructive criticism. Nobody can actually DO anything with it. Why does it suck? What would you like to see instead? Why is Ion to be fired when there's an entire team responsible?

But alas, access to social media has turned a lot of people into 1-sentence apes with no control over their emotions.

[sam86]

like everything in life, there is every type
i hated bfa because my class (paladin) was gut horribly, but bfa has far better zones (as horde) than SL for me
I love SL because playing paladin is actually fun, also zones are worse, quests are worse, story is still horrible (last good story imo was legion), but i don't hate to login and play on my pally, and I love torghast
I love covenant system, but i know there are a lot who hates it, and i agree with them, if i was hardcore raider i'd hate how punishing covenant system is, since u are pressured all time to pick the best covenant for raiding

[intenz]

You can't be overly critical of a game that charges a monthly subscription on top of mandatory expansion purchases every two years and soft pay-2-win. If WoW was wildly successful and maintaining peak numbers year after year you would have a point but the fact that the game has jettisoned around 75% of its playerbase means some criticism is merited.

[Wangming]

Why is Ion to be fired when there's an entire team responsible?

Not to play devil's advocate to morons, but due to a lack of transparency most people just know of Ion and maybe Steve Sylvanasbodypillow Danuser.
FFXIV regularly has blog entries, forum posts or live letter appearances by members of the dev team where they talk about what they are exactly responsible for. Just saying.

Plus Ion IS the Game Director so it stands for reason that he is calling the shots.

[Daronokk]

It's no secret who supports Blizz and who crucifies them with every, single decision; however, I have to wonder...

have we become overcritical of a 15 year old MMO that continues to get updates? Ultima Online, EverQuest and World of Warcraft have been around for a long while and still have a large and dedicated fanbase, yet other MMOs like Aion, LotRO, Warhammer, Age of Conan, and even Guild Wars 2 all set out to dethrone the long standing favorites and eventually faded into nothingness. What do you suppose prevents some players from just being excited to still have new content and millions of other players?

LotRO and Guild Wars 2 are still played and aren't dead, don't know about the others. WoW has stopped releasing subscription numbers a long time ago, that says something. They're no longer comfortable with the numbers.

And are we over critical? No, I'd say the opposite. We should be even more critical. WoW still has a paid subscription, expansion every 2 years, has microtransactions, some form of pay to win. And we accept that somehow. Content has become less and less with each expansion, just look at the amount of patches / raids each expansion and you see a steady decline. And yet we pay the same.

Blizzard tries to squeeze the most money out of a dying game with minimal effort on content. Why aren't we more critical about that?

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Not to play devil's advocate to morons, but due to a lack of transparency most people just know of Ion and maybe Steve Sylvanasbodypillow Danuser.
FFXIV regularly has blog entries, forum posts or live letter appearances by members of the dev team where they talk about what they are exactly responsible for. Just saying.

Plus Ion IS the Game Director so it stands for reason that he is calling the shots.

Yeah, as the guy in charge you're responsible for the people under you. If they f*ck up it's also the guy in charge that's at fault for not acting sooner.

[Ragnarohk]

I believe that it is up to the criticized to make criticism constructive, not the criticizer. Even something as unintelligible as "you fucking suck" can improve someone if they allow it.

O god no.

Constructive criticism makes an observation, understands the context, notes why XYZ isn't optimal, and offers 1 or more solutions that respect the context.

[SirBeef]

All criticism is constructive criticism. There is nothing wrong with providing feedback.

Wrong. Tell me how Covenants are trash is constructive criticism?

[Aphrel]

It's no secret who supports Blizz and who crucifies them with every, single decision; however, I have to wonder...

have we become overcritical of a 15 year old MMO that continues to get updates? Ultima Online, EverQuest and World of Warcraft have been around for a long while and still have a large and dedicated fanbase, yet other MMOs like Aion, LotRO, Warhammer, Age of Conan, and even Guild Wars 2 all set out to dethrone the long standing favorites and eventually faded into nothingness. What do you suppose prevents some players from just being excited to still have new content and millions of other players?

Well, one pretty effective way to prevent players from playing the game is to release the last classic raid within a week of shadowlands.

I don't even think its incompetence anymore, idiotic things like this has happend too many times. I think they are intentionally trying to kill off one of the games, and im not even sure wich one.

[Kelduril]

It's no secret who supports Blizz and who crucifies them with every, single decision; however, I have to wonder...

have we become overcritical of a 15 year old MMO that continues to get updates? Ultima Online, EverQuest and World of Warcraft have been around for a long while and still have a large and dedicated fanbase, yet other MMOs like Aion, LotRO, Warhammer, Age of Conan, and even Guild Wars 2 all set out to dethrone the long standing favorites and eventually faded into nothingness. What do you suppose prevents some players from just being excited to still have new content and millions of other players?

Yes lol. Compare WoW to MMOs like GW2, ESO, RIFT, BDO. It's night and day. WoW offers so much more content for your buck.

That being said it's inexcusable that they aren't offering us better customisation. Fans have showed that a one man team can do it. So why won't Blizzard?

[SirBeef]

I believe that it is up to the criticized to make criticism constructive, not the criticizer. Even something as unintelligible as "you fucking suck" can improve someone if they allow it.

I also bet you think it's up to the other people to provide evidence when someone else makes a factual claim? IF you make a claim you, you are obligated to provide the supporting evidence. If you want change, or to be taken seriously, you need to be constructive in your feedback, such as not being a dick or hostile, explaining why you do not like said feature, and why it could be improved.

Calling devs stupid or lazy isn't constructive. Saying something sucks or is stupid isn't constructive. 90% of feedback I see is just garbage shitposting.

[Lolites]

90% of feedback I see is just garbage shitposting.

dont call it feedback, its not, its pointless whining without any base whatsoever

[Kumorii]

No, because we're paying them a subscription fee.

A subscription fee, incidentally, that is now the same cost as GamePass Ultimate. Do you think WoW provides that amount of value?

Yes, or I wouldn't pay.

[Magneto]

critisism is the primary weapon to combat the salami-slice strategy of "you think you do, but you dont"-idgaf-emperors. Resist the beginnings.

[mbit]

Wrong. Tell me how Covenants are trash is constructive criticism?

"people hate this system" is valid infomration. Did you forget whose job it is to design the game? Not the player.

[Kallisto]

I have to agree with this. Specific symptoms, problems, and resolutions lead to results. It's kinda why we have a PTR, for actual constructive feedback. Pretty sure "you fucking suck" isn't a clickable option for a feedback piece

That would mean people use the ptr for something other than getting raid mechanics learned or finding ways to get spoilers.

[Tradu]

No. Remaining critical is how you get improvements made.

Also the longer the game exists, the more previous versions are available to compare to. So if they do something that was already done better in a previous expansion/patch, we can tell them that.

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That line reminds me of people defending sending death threats to politicians with "They signed up for critique and public scrutiny!!"...

"THIS SUCKS, FIRE ION!!!" is not constructive criticism. Nobody can actually DO anything with it. Why does it suck? What would you like to see instead? Why is Ion to be fired when there's an entire team responsible?

But alas, access to social media has turned a lot of people into 1-sentence apes with no control over their emotions.

The thing is, people love to label any criticism of the game as unconstructive. And Blizzard has actually repeatedly said they'd rather not be given solutions/suggestions, but just be told what you dislike instead.

[Tiradon]

Honestly after seeing a bunch of photoshop with 3d models on it showing the new zone alongside 1 screenshot.. How can we not be critical? Especially when a few days ago they released a 6-month subscription mount plan......... Now we sitting here talking about a patch release in July/August.