Dutch Academic Research Concludes: Immigration Costs 400 billion over past 25 years

[Thereturn]

Dutch academics have researched the economic effects of immigration.
Report: http://www.demo-demo.nl/files/Grenze...gingsstaat.pdf

(you can download and translate it here: https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&op=docs)

Long story short:
They conclude the net costs have been over 400 billion in the past 25 years. The upcoming years this will increase to 600 billion. Which is huge for a country as small as holland (The current dutch national BNP is 900 billion). And do note; this is net cost, AFTER the benefits of immigration.
Is this to continue, the dutch wellfare state (social securities, cheap healthcare) will come under serious pressure. Which leads us to the following discussion:

At which point should a country say: "Ok, halt the immigration, otherwise we cant maintain the current social systems in place and the whole country will suffer the consequences?". Or in other words; should a country give up its wealth and social securities in order to facilitate (economic) immigration?

[s_bushido]

Yes, yes, THOSE people are bad. We get it.

Good job linking a 230 page in Dutch on an English forum, though. Spectacular effort, there.

[Thereturn]

Yes, yes, THOSE people are bad. We get it.

Good job linking a 230 page in Dutch on an English forum, though. Spectacular effort, there.

Next thing you know people will ask for 'proof'. Well here you are. Feel free to translate and read it using any PDF translator available (like this one https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&op=docs). If your actually interested in the facts that is, feel free not to if you just want to rush the racist card.

And its not about 'those' people. Dont try to frame it like that on the getgo. Its about the concept of allowing immigration if, while doing so, your destroying the countries economy and wellfare.

[XDurionX]

There's really nothing to discuss here since noone can read the study. Pointless thread.

[Thereturn]

There's really nothing to discuss here since noone can read the study. Pointless thread.

https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&op=docs

Here you are.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Next thing you know people will ask for 'proof'. Well here you are. Feel free to translate and read it using any PDF translator available. If your actually interested in the facts that is, feel free not to if you just want to rush the racist card.
And its not about 'those' people.

Its about the concept of allowing immigration if, while doing so, your destroying the countries economy and wellfare.

Doesn’t look like the economy was destroyed.

The economy of the Netherlands is the 17th largest in the world in 2019 (in terms of Gross domestic product; GDP) according to the World Bank and International Monetary Fund. Its GDP per capita was estimated at roughly $57,101 in the fiscal year 2019/20 which makes it one of highest-earning nations in the world (see list of countries by GDP (PPP) per capita). Between 1996 and 2000, annual economic growth (GDP) averaged over 4%, well above the European average of 2.5% at the time. Growth slowed considerably in 2001–05 as part of the global economic slowdown. 2006 and 2007 however showed economic growth of 3-4% per annum. The Dutch economy was hit considerably by the financial crisis of 2007–2008 and the ensuing European sovereign-debt crisis.

[Freighter]

At which point should a country say: "Ok, halt the immigration, otherwise we cant maintain the current social systems in place and the whole country will suffer the consequences?". Or in other words; should a country give up its wealth and social securities in order to facilitate (economic) immigration?

It will never happen unless you vote for the parties that will stop it. Companies would destroy your country just to get cheap labor if they could. They love immigrants because they're cheap labor. They will just keep lobbying for parties to allow it.

[omeomorfismo]

pfff, so the point of the study is to say "immigrant children study, so they cost us!"
and the old good "we should make moooooooooooooore children because reason11!1!!1 i dont want immigrant replace me1!111" without giving any solution to increas the children xDxDxDxD

[PosPosPos]

https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&op=docs

Here you are.

[Fencers]

There really ought to be a stricter policy on emphasizing the forum here as an English language forum.

[s_bushido]

There really ought to be a stricter policy on emphasizing the forum here as an English language forum.

It wouldn't even be a big deal if I didn't have a sneaking suspicion that he linked that directly (instead of the site he originally found it on) because we'd have to take his word for it...

[PC2]

This is 100% wrong. Immigration isn't costing any money nor is it the problem, a higher population is an economic boon and not a drawback. The real issue is that some European governments hand out copious amounts of money/resources through social programs.

[PosPosPos]

This is 100% wrong. Immigration isn't costing any money nor is it the problem, a higher population is an economic boon and not a drawback. The real issue is that European governments hand out copious amounts of money/resources through social programs.

Uh yeah, because making sure people don't fall through the cracks of poverty is such a bad thing.

[s_bushido]

The real issue is that European governments hand out copious amounts of money/resources through social programs.

This is only an "issue" in that money isn't unlimited. A government ensuring that its citizens (regardless of where they come from) are taken care of...that's not a bad thing...

[PC2]

This is only an "issue" in that money isn't unlimited.

That is trivially true, money/resources is always limited in the present but it's not in the future since we can gradually create more without limit.

A government ensuring that its citizens (regardless of where they come from) are taken care of...that's not a bad thing...

Sure, as long as you have consent from the people who are actually paying for it. If not then you're eventually going to run into problems. Europe seems pretty happy at the moment so I don't believe there is anything wrong.

[woopytywoop]

Doesn’t look like the economy was destroyed.

That's because Holland is a tax haven for big corporations inside the EU.
People cry why billionaires don't pay taxes, but it are countries like the Netherlands who enable them.

They costs the rest of the EU billions every year and then lecture other countries they shouldn't spend their money on schnaps and women.

fuck Dijsselbloem so badly

I also find it ironic it's a dutch study crying about how much immigrants cost the EU. Maybe they should make a study about how much they parasite on the EU? It really brings extra justice to their stereotype of being hypocrites.

[Rasulis]

Every time somebody posted a stupid study like that, I like to post this list.

Steve Jobs (Apple) - 2nd gen Syria
Jeff Bezos (Amazon) 2nd gen Cuba
Satya Nadella (Microsoft) 1st gen India
Sundar Pichai (Google) 1st gen India
Lary Ellison (Oracle) - 2nd gen Russia
Bob Miner (Oracle) - 2nd gen Iran
Jensen Huang (Nvidia) - 1st gen Taiwan
Herman Hollerith (IBM) - 2nd gen German

The list of large companies founded by 1st and 2nd gen immigrants is freaking endless - Adobe, Texas Instrument, PayPal, Salesforce, Qualcomm, ADP, VMware, Docusign, Cognizant, Ebay.

The list of large companies founded by 1st gen immigrants is also prettly long - Uber, SpaceX, Palantir, WeWork, Stripe, the much beloved Robinhood, Slack, Bloom Energy, Avant, Compass, ZoDoc, Zenefits, InstaCart, etc.

Combined, these companies easily employed tens of millions of US work force.

[PosPosPos]

Sure, as long as you have consent from the people who are actually paying for it.

In the sense that people "consent" to paying taxes, their dues to society. >_>

[Milchshake]

Found the original study here:
https://www.cpb.nl/sites/default/fil...ch-economy.pdf

From 2003 .... Looks like this trhead is just an attempt to clickbait and troll the forum. By bashing immigrants.


I wish that MMOC would reign in immigrant bashing, it's mostly a proxy for racisms.

[Edge-]

Found the original study here:
https://www.cpb.nl/sites/default/fil...ch-economy.pdf

From 2003 .... Looks like this trhead is just an attempt to clickbait and troll the forum. By bashing immigrants.


I wish that MMOC would reign in immigrant bashing, it's mostly a proxy for racisms.

Is that the same one? I haven't been able to look at the one this thread but keywords were turning that up over and over. I thought it was different since it's like, super old and doesn't seem to come to the same conclusions OP did?