Biden / Harris Focused Discussion

[Jettisawn]

While the Hardcore trumper is trying to derail, manchin is being a little bitch.

Oh please, I don't need to hear from a Neo-liberal Biden support. I figured Manchin would be your boy, right along with Biden.

Meanwhile this why it is important to "Force a Vote", but you many on here were against it when it came to universal care in the middle of a pandemic. Good Job

[Edge-]

While the Hardcore trumper is trying to derail, manchin is being a little bitch.

You see Manchin's brilliant plan for Appalachia that NOBODY HAS EVER THOUGHT OF BEFORE?!

Spoilers: It's green energy jobs. The same shit folks have been talking about for well over a decade.

[Elegiac]

You see Manchin's brilliant plan for Appalachia that NOBODY HAS EVER THOUGHT OF BEFORE?!

Spoilers: It's green energy jobs. The same shit folks have been talking about for well over a decade.

I'm just gonna take the W in that if even idiots like Joe Manchin are on the green energy jobs bandwagon then clearly the discussion on climate has shifted in a positive direction.

[beanman12345]

Manchin and Sinema are truly disgusting people on a personal level, quite frankly.

Manchin because it's clear he lets his conflicts of interests dictate his positions, and Sinema because she's cut from the same cloth as Jill Stein and other Grifter Green Party members in that it's a form of champagne libertarianism.

Can't disagree, really shitty people. Just a different shade of shitty brown as trump and his ilk.

[SirBeef]

Yeah but how many times did the Dems do it for emergency relief funding?

Irrelevant. Regardless of what's in the bill, political stunts like this are shit moves to stall.

[NED funded]

So a bunch of Democratic Senators decided that they didn't want to embrace such a sweeping change such as doubling the minimum wage in the US, at least not like this.

What a surprise, no really how shocking could it be. I mean you only have many of those same Senators going on record multiple times expressing their concern, though not opposition, about doing so, especially after what the CBO said.

Apparently I looked it up and even with 50 votes it would not have passed so its not like it would have mattered

[shimerra]

Oh no, I get it completely. My English is terrible, but doesn't mean I won't hit back. Sorry if I hurt your feelings. (Not really tho)

Man you sure love to whine about whining. I hope that everything is okay over there. I mean you bitch about policy, and then do nothing but bring something up from Months ago that didn't even have anything to do with you personally. Talk about thing skin.

No you really don't get it. And you continue to demonstrate that with this post. Because if you did get it you wouldn't have missed the very obvious point that grammar nazi-ing is the literal definition of not constructive. In a post where you whine about a lack of constructive posting. If you think my feelings were hurt that's just another nail in the you're still not getting it coffin.

Jesus Christ man do I have to get the crayon and paper out to draw you a map for everything? Your public tantrum up about @'s stood out because it was my responses to your public tantrum that you PM'd me to cry some more. And considering to date you and Pro-violoence, the arm-chair insurrectionist, are pretty much the only ones to do that it stood out. Good company to keep there I guess in your eyes.

If you're going to soil your nappy in the walmart and go kicking and screaming on the floor it stands out. Sorry my memory's better than yours?

[Elegiac]

Apparently I looked it up and even with 50 votes it would not have passed so its not like it would have mattered

Indeed, essentially making it a free vote where Senators were able to cast their votes on the merits - Manchin, Sinema, and six other senators failed that test.

Sinema especially because she not only contradicted her previous campaign promises but also gave CSPAN a fun little thumbs down moment that her primary opponent is going to put on every television screen they can afford. All it's really doing is demonstrating that centrism and the Third Way continue to be political farces designed to help conservatives.

[Jettisawn]

No you really don't get it. And you continue to demonstrate that with this post. Because if you did get it you wouldn't have missed the very obvious point that grammar nazi-ing is the literal definition of not constructive. In a post where you whine about a lack of constructive posting. If you think my feelings were hurt that's just another nail in the you're still not getting it coffin.

Jesus Christ man do I have to get the crayon and paper out to draw you a map for everything? Your public tantrum up about @'s stood out because it was my responses to your public tantrum that you PM'd me to cry some more. And considering to date you and Pro-violoence, the arm-chair insurrectionist, are pretty much the only ones to do that it stood out. Good company to keep there I guess in your eyes.

If you're going to soil your nappy in the walmart and go kicking and screaming on the floor it stands out. Sorry my memory's better than yours?

The fact you need to put me into such light shows you to be nothing but a bold face lair. You don't have any idea WTF you are talking about and thus have to stoop down the character attacks that aren't even true on the merits. Also (Walmart) should be capitalized.

Let me know how many more months you plan on throwing a tantrum about a single forum post from months ago. It'll be okay no reason to be so upset over a post months ago. Calm down please.

[arandomuser]

i hate joe manchin
he thinks hes making a play to keep his seat in west virginia like they have some principled stances on economics
they were fine being thrown free money under trump they only have conservative views on policing/abortion/guns and immigration they dont give a shit about the deficit just tell them you want to bring back the 1940s immigration bill and youll win them in a landslide, but jesus manchin is screwing over dems in 2022 by voting against measures that poll above 60%+ with his phony concerns over the deficit
also its rich that the "populist" trump republicans re all voting against the stimulus and then later are going to say " see dems didnt deliver for you" and joe manchin is helping them

[Themius]

i hate joe manchin
he thinks hes making a play to keep his seat in west virginia like they have some principled stances on economics
they were fine being thrown free money under trump they only have conservative views on policing/abortion/guns and immigration they dont give a shit about the deficit just tell them you want to bring back the 1940s immigration bill and youll win them in a landslide, but jesus manchin is screwing over dems in 2022 by voting against measures that poll above 60%+ with his phony concerns over the deficit
also its rich that the "populist" trump republicans re all voting against the stimulus and then later are going to say " see dems didnt deliver for you" and joe manchin is helping them

me thinks the people he employs that he pays minimum wage are his conflict of interests.

[bmjclark]

So glad democrats hold the majority in the senate so it can be them that shuts down a minimum wage increase instead of republicans

[Themius]

Honestly seems democrats love republican majority. At least then they have a reasonable excuse

[Theodarzna]

You've taken one particular idea about economic supply and demand, applied that, then threw out the inconvenient parts. Immigration is not completely 100% positive, but there is a net positive effect overall. You've simply taken the negative aspects, throw out the positives, and magnified the negatives into a much bigger problem than they actually are. This is made even worse by the fact that you apply all these positives of population growth to justify your own views about why people should be having more babies. So it's not that you don't know about these positives of population growth, it's just that you seem to think they don't apply to immigration? Not sure exactly how you justify it within your own head, but it's a really weird juxtaposition to gaze at from the perspective of an outsider.

The positives are largely to a specific class. So yes, if you lump the benefits to say Jeff Bezos, along with the losses to say the population of say Ohio, sure, its a marginal win, and I am sure Jeff Bezos appreciates your interest in his profit line. I've stated the negatives are negative for certain people. Yes, for Maids, this sucks, for people who hire Maids, Immigration is great. This is in the end a massive wealth transfer from the poor, to the well off and college educated. The "overall" is a strange detail to overlook as I am not actually persuaded by that. Much like the growth in GDP could be said to be a sign that the last thirty years have been good "overall" but ignore that vast income inequality entirely misses the point. You basically lump in the wins for big business and shrug off the losses for the poor already here and say "Well its a net good and I like it! So its good!"

I have, quite handily.

Saying "On the whole its good!" and "Ummm Democrat party is good guy team so they will solve everything!" isn't really a response. Saying "Ummm Immigrants will create jobs!" doesn't really work when we don't yet have that massive job boom from demand that create full employment anyway.

But since you are just going to dodge what I say over and over and try and create extensive walls of text to just play that game over and over again, not responding to any of my points except to say "But overall its good! And 'OTHER FACTORS' without explaining your point in any detail, something which I do, I let someone else answer the questions:



If you wish to continue cheerleading for the Democratic Party, and making sure your loyalty and dedication is recited here, i won't stop you, but please, stop with the worthless sermon and just talk about the issues.

[Elegiac]

The positives are largely to a specific class.

That's nice, Jan. Citation needed for the claim that immigrants don't spend money at small businesses, maintain employment at small businesses, or aren't able to be college educated/acquire skills, tho.

[Felya]

The positives are largely to a specific class.

Agriculture?

- - - Updated - - -

That's nice, Jan. Citation needed for the claim that immigrants don't spend money at small businesses, maintain employment at small businesses, or aren't able to be college educated/acquire skills, tho.

... or own small businesses... you ever heard of a bodega?

Have you guys heard of google? Does Sergey Mikhaylovich Brin sound American born? How about Steve Chen?

[Kaleredar]

Honestly seems democrats love republican majority. At least then they have a reasonable excuse

Are you still riding the notion that the democrats should have just "wanted it more" and then the math would have magically worked out for them?

[Orange Joe]

Just want to reiterate, too, that federal law supersedes State law, where federal law goes further. So States can't undercut this stuff by writing their own laws permitting such; those laws just get overruled by the federal standards. State law can be more protective than federal, but it can't be less; if it tries to do so, federal law takes over.

I mean they "can" otherwise we wouldn't have any legal marijuana states.

[Endus]

I mean they "can" otherwise we wouldn't have any legal marijuana states.

Those states can't overrule federal enforcement. If the FBI wanted to roll in and make arrests, they could.

They've just decided they have better battles to fight. But if you get arrested by the FBI for some cross-state crime, and they find pot on you, you'll have drug charges added to whatever else it was, even if the States involved are all marijuana-legal jurisdictions and you were entirely within their legal limits there.

Same with sanctuary cities; ICE can still function, but the local police don't cooperate and feed them information. Because there's no legal obligation to do so.

[Bodakane]

Are you still riding the notion that the democrats should have just "wanted it more" and then the math would have magically worked out for them?

I think the Dems helping get shit heels like Manchin elected is why their numbers don't work out.

The party needs to stop fearing going more progressive in election cycles. People want progressive policies. The reason progressive candidates struggle is for no other reason then the Dem power structure, saying they will struggle and acting as such. Dems still think we are in the midst of a 10 year ago, less polarized political climate and they steadfastly refuse to change their strategy. Centrists are not the answer, because the Repubs are going further and further right because there is no equal force pulling them back.

In tug of war, if both sides are equally strong, but the right side pulls with a 100% power towards the right and the left side decides to not commit fully to pulling to the left they will lose ground as the center marker on the rope will move more towards the right. This is not different politically.

The issue isn't if they go low you go high, the issue is if they go super right, you go super left....that's how create a centrist government.