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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    No - again, the times from Suburb stations (in my example those would be the three stations between San Diego and San Francisco) would be dramatically changed. The whole point of the Hyperloop is to allow people in the far suburbs get to metropolis' in dramatically reduced time.
    You know that Demolition Man where San Diego and Los Angeles merge to San Angeles is fiction?

    San Diego And Los Angeles are the metropolises; and there will realistically not be stops between them.

    I don't think that it will be fruitful to continue this discussion as it will likely drag on forever; as hyperloop goes from promise to promise.
    Last edited by Forogil; 2021-03-05 at 10:50 PM.

  2. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forogil View Post
    You know that Demolition Man where San Diego and Los Angeles merge to San Angeles is fiction?

    San Diego And Los Angeles are the metropolises; and there will realistically not be stops between them.

    I don't think that it will be fruitful to continue this discussion as it will likely drag on forever; as hyperloop goes from promise to promise.
    Los Angeles and San Diego are 120 miles apart - you could make a case for having a substation in each city. However, you could also put one right in the middle, say in San Angeles (), and that would solve a number of other problems.

    San Angeles
    Bakersfield/Fresno area
    San Jose
    San Francisco

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    No - again, the times from Suburb stations (in my example those would be the three stations between San Diego and San Francisco) would be dramatically changed. The whole point of the Hyperloop is to allow people in the far suburbs get to metropolis' in dramatically reduced time. Hence #2 is not what you're saying.
    500 miles is "suburbs distance" to you? that's never going to work with only 3 stops for that distance. even if the hyperloop does what it's suppose to do, the travel time to the station would push it out of acceptable commute time.

  4. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    500 miles is "suburbs distance" to you? that's never going to work with only 3 stops for that distance. even if the hyperloop does what it's suppose to do, the travel time to the station would push it out of acceptable commute time.
    No, but 120 miles is. You'd be amazed at what people were doing pre-covid to have both the big city job and the suburban home. 2+ hours commute each way, every day. Those three stops would be right at the heart of a major portion of people who already commute. The big losers would be those people in Sacramento and surrounding areas going into the Bay Area.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    No, but 120 miles is. You'd be amazed at what people were doing pre-covid to have both the big city job and the suburban home. 2+ hours commute each way, every day. Those three stops would be right at the heart of a major portion of people who already commute. The big losers would be those people in Sacramento and surrounding areas going into the Bay Area.
    yeah but your 2 hour drive turns into something like 30 minutes drive to station + 10mins parking/transfer time + 30 mins hyperloop + 5 mins transfer + 20 mins public transit to destination.

    sure you might gain some time but the gain has to be pretty darn big before people start using public transit instead of the convenience/reliability of their own car.

    better to have more less efficient hyperloop stations then.

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    yeah but your 2 hour drive turns into something like 30 minutes drive to station + 10mins parking/transfer time + 30 mins hyperloop + 5 mins transfer + 20 mins public transit to destination.

    sure you might gain some time but the gain has to be pretty darn big before people start using public transit instead of the convenience/reliability of their own car.

    better to have more less efficient hyperloop stations then.
    Or basically traditional public transport...

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    yeah but your 2 hour drive turns into something like 30 minutes drive to station + 10mins parking/transfer time + 30 mins hyperloop + 5 mins transfer + 20 mins public transit to destination.

    sure you might gain some time but the gain has to be pretty darn big before people start using public transit instead of the convenience/reliability of their own car.

    better to have more less efficient hyperloop stations then.
    These people with the 2+ hour commute each way are already using public transportation. So the increased speed would have a dramatic impact on commute times.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    These people with the 2+ hour commute each way are already using public transportation. So the increased speed would have a dramatic impact on commute times.
    Some may be. I'm still not remotely sold on the speeds, even if they were practical and not theoretical, having that meaningful of an impact. As he pointed out, yeah it cuts the travel time from where you are to where you're going (generally) down, but you may have to add on additional travel time at both ends depending on where you are/transit hub is and where the city hub is/where you work.

    All the pros for Hyperloop continue to largely seem to rest on "optimal/theoretical situations".

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    These people with the 2+ hour commute each way are already using public transportation. So the increased speed would have a dramatic impact on commute times.
    you would lose time, not gain time if you had to use public transit instead of a car to get to the hyperloop hub. so that makes it even worse.

  10. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    you would lose time, not gain time if you had to use public transit instead of a car to get to the hyperloop hub. so that makes it even worse.
    You're still misunderstanding me.

    The people I'm talking about currently drive to public transportation to get to work. Home-->Train Station-->City-->Office. Hyperloop replaces the Train Station, dramatically cutting down the time for that portion of the commute, which is typically the longest. (@Edge assuming the speeds Hyperloop claim comes to fruition, of course).

    It would also open up more options for some/many people.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    You're still misunderstanding me.

    The people I'm talking about currently drive to public transportation to get to work. Home-->Train Station-->City-->Office. Hyperloop replaces the Train Station, dramatically cutting down the time for that portion of the commute, which is typically the longest. (@Edge assuming the speeds Hyperloop claim comes to fruition, of course).

    It would also open up more options for some/many people.
    oh you mean they spend 2+ hours in JUST the train? and that would be reduced to 30-45mins in hyperloop?

    yeah sure. but that's not a fair comparison. i always travel door to door, not train station to train station.

    the train ride is only the longest part of the journey if you live within short travel time of the train station. buf if there is only one train station every 120 miles you suddenly might find yourself traveling over an hour just to get there, at which point the exercise becomes counterproductive.

  12. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    oh you mean they spend 2+ hours in JUST the train? and that would be reduced to 30-45mins in hyperloop?

    yeah sure. but that's not a fair comparison. i always travel door to door, not train station to train station.

    the train ride is only the longest part of the journey if you live within short travel time of the train station. buf if there is only one train station every 120 miles you suddenly might find yourself traveling over an hour just to get there, at which point the exercise becomes counterproductive.
    Yeah, just the train.

    I have to agree that door-to-door should be the way to do it, but if you compare pieces of it, it's at least reasonable.

    And the train stations will be farther apart with the Hyperloop, so that distance would be increased, even if the train ride is decreased (I'm arguing against myself here, lol).

  13. #153
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    HyperloopTT the group behind the Cleveland project unveiling the full scale valve that will be able to isolate given sections of the tube for easy re-pressurization either for maintenance or in the event of an emergency.
    Interesting milestone.
    It's 16.5 feet tall, weighing 77,000 pounds and can fully open or close within 30 seconds, the company behind the valve said in a video release.
    Add Cleveland to the list of cities/state/countries currently working on various stages of Hyperloops projects.

  14. #154
    The monorail from Simpsons... yeah, that's what many are thinking right now.
    Technically doable, for certain, it's not that huge deal after all. Commercially viable, that's a whole different topic I wouldn't bet any of my money on. When all relevant safety precautions are in place, the capacity can be (is?) a concern as well, you can't just queue up those pods with few meters of clearance. Add on top that conventional high-speed rails are at the 300kph/200mph range already, and the maglev designs have recently(ish) hit the 600kph/370mph mark, I don't see a very bright future for this hyperloop concept, except for the conmen behind public projects reaping government money.
    Concorde cut travel time quite a bit as well but was commercially a god-awful disaster after the oil crisis had landed. Noise concerns added fuel to the fire (no pun intended), but anyhow, that was a technical marvel and a commercial disaster.

  15. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by ifrah View Post
    The monorail from Simpsons... yeah, that's what many are thinking right now.
    Technically doable, for certain, it's not that huge deal after all. Commercially viable, that's a whole different topic I wouldn't bet any of my money on. When all relevant safety precautions are in place, the capacity can be (is?) a concern as well, you can't just queue up those pods with few meters of clearance. Add on top that conventional high-speed rails are at the 300kph/200mph range already, and the maglev designs have recently(ish) hit the 600kph/370mph mark, I don't see a very bright future for this hyperloop concept, except for the conmen behind public projects reaping government money.
    Concorde cut travel time quite a bit as well but was commercially a god-awful disaster after the oil crisis had landed. Noise concerns added fuel to the fire (no pun intended), but anyhow, that was a technical marvel and a commercial disaster.
    Good episode. Interesting parody's to the Music Man as well.

    The commercial viability of Hyperloop will be the biggest issue. I'm betting that the Government pays for most of the development cost, which won't be recouped.

    Interesting that you mentioned Concorde - it was a development nightmare, with both France and the U.K. losing money - but it was commercially profitable.

    I would imagine that the project, as it comes to fruiting, will also have ancilary benefits - perhaps down the road, from the tech developed in designing and producing an under/above-ground vacuum passenger and cargo transport.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Good episode. Interesting parody's to the Music Man as well.

    The commercial viability of Hyperloop will be the biggest issue. I'm betting that the Government pays for most of the development cost, which won't be recouped.

    Interesting that you mentioned Concorde - it was a development nightmare, with both France and the U.K. losing money - but it was commercially profitable.

    I would imagine that the project, as it comes to fruiting, will also have ancilary benefits - perhaps down the road, from the tech developed in designing and producing an under/above-ground vacuum passenger and cargo transport.
    Thanks for the clarification, rushed the last paragraph. Profitable for those two airlines at the end of the day after the British & French governments poured in the billion(s). This funding resulting that the actual sales price of the aircraft did not have to absorb the project cost, so on a broader scope it was a major scale commercial failure.
    Anyway, at the end of the day, would see the similarities there with this Hyperloop plan that unless government(s) absorb some massive hits, it won't happen in the first place, let alone in any (pseudo)-profitable way for some rail operator. And there also lies another weakness of a private company investing any of their precious pennies in this. An aircraft is still an aircraft, you're not building and constructing the airports and aerospace as the carrier, but these Hyperloop operators would either need to do that too, or go for the government pouch again to get the maintenance which probably will be a tiny wee bit more than your normal railroad takes.

  17. #157
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    Bringing this back because of tech and project updates.

    Another company/country is bringing hyperloop to life. A Zurich company announces plans to have a hyperloop up and running from Geneva to Zurich in the next five years. They cite an existing test site that is already up and running and scaling the tech from those successes.

  18. #158
    Guess we'll reconvene in a decade when they're still "planning to bring its hyperloop to the market in four to five years."

  19. #159
    Am I the only one who is a bit skeptical about a company that only present a 3-member board and an advisory board as their team, that doesn't have a page on wikipedia, and one of the top-hits when searching for their name says: "Log in. I’ve forgotten my password." (to get to some dashboard).

  20. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Bringing this back because of tech and project updates.

    Another company/country is bringing hyperloop to life. A Zurich company announces plans to have a hyperloop up and running from Geneva to Zurich in the next five years. They cite an existing test site that is already up and running and scaling the tech from those successes.
    Nice I like your stubborn optimism. Somebody has to push us towards better transportation. I had to drive on the highway going 70mph for 5.5 hours(one way) a couple days ago... It was stupid, I'd rather be going 700mph in a vacuum tube and arrive in a half hour.

    I don't know if Hyperloops will ever be the future but the people saying it could never be cost effective in the future don't actually know that. They're just basing it on our current lack of knowledge and the current expense projections, which will change over the years and decades.
    Last edited by PC2; 2021-08-06 at 06:12 PM.

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