The Machismo discussion from the Biden/Haris thread so he can stop derailing it.

[Elegiac]

I'm willing to take inflation into account

Why, though. What is the purpose of taking inflation into account.

[Machismo]

Why, though. What is the purpose of taking inflation into account.

Great, let's get rid of it all!!!

Glad you're on board.

[Shadowferal]

It's like a child stamping his feet...

[Elegiac]

Great, let's get rid of it all!!!

Answer the question. What is the purpose of taking inflation into account.

[Shadowferal]

Answer the question. What is the purpose of taking inflation into account.

Good luck with that.

[PhaelixWW]

So, it's entirely arbitrary...

Wow, looks like we finally made it.

You thinking rounding numbers is the same as arbitrary?

If this is the limit of your reading comprehension, then you should start over back in grade school.

Either that, or you're just incredibly, massively disingenuous.

[Machismo]

Third and final time. The first link you never bothered to read. That I then quoted from.

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Inflation is part of cost of living, so you have to take it into account.

That doesn't show how they got to that number. That's the problem.

$900+ a month for transportation, seems very, very high to be the absolute minimum.

The same goes for food costs. if a person doesn't eat out, eating for under $2 a meal isn't difficult.

Limiting those would also lower tax burden, which is a good thing.

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Nobody is onboard with your plans to reintroduce slavery but you.

You really should stop lying about me.

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Answer the question. What is the purpose of taking inflation into account.

I said I'd be fine with it.

Enjoy!!!

[Machismo]

You thinking rounding numbers is the same as arbitrary?

If this is the limit of your reading comprehension, then you should start over back in grade school.

Either that, or you're just incredibly, massively disingenuous.

Not at all, that's the point. People have been touting the $15 an hour number for about 7-8 years now, and it's largely being pulled out their asses.

[Machismo]

It has sources for everything on how they got the numbers, your inability to grasp what’s on the page isn’t on them.

The issue is that I disagree with some of those numbers. One can gain transportation for far less than $900 a month. That seems more like an average, than a minimum.

My concern is the "modest but adequate" aspect of it.

And yes, if you are earning minimum wage, then working more than 40 hours a week may be warranted for you to be as comfortable as this.

[Santti]

No, it’s being calculated based on cost of living and that seems to fly over your head. It’s like talking to a flat earther...

I'm glad I'm not the only one noticing the parallels between flat earthers and... whatever the hell this is.

[Machismo]

No, it’s being calculated based on cost of living and that seems to fly over your head. It’s like talking to a flat earther...

I still cook meals for less than $2 per meal... and that's for dinners. I make way, way more than the supposed minimum cost of living, and my grocery bill is considerably less than that per person.

Mind you, I eat out more, but that is a luxury, and something I didn't always do.

[PhaelixWW]

Not at all, that's the point. People have been touting the $15 an hour number for about 7-8 years now, and it's largely being pulled out their asses.

Incidentally, the living wage in 2015 was $15.12.

So no, it's not arbitrary, nobody pulled it out of their ass, it's just that some shortsighted, comprehensionally-challenged people have been pushing back on it for long enough to see the living wage rise another ~10% while those who fight for it have not demanded the same increase.

Your entire argument is flat-out, absolutely, embarrassingly wrong.

[Shadowferal]

So..."if I can do it, so can everyone else?" Wtf?

[PhaelixWW]

So..."if I can do it, so can everyone else?" Wtf?

I'm getting a definite "let them eat cake" vibe...

[Zan15]

So, what exact metric are we going to use to get it to exactly $15 an hour?

I'm still waiting on that.

If it's cost of living, great... let's see the exact numbers on that.

If you are going to force things onto people, you sure as shit better be able to explain exactly why. As of now, nobody can point to why it's exactly $15 an hour.

I agree, I have no desire to use it based on GDP... that was what other people wanted to do.

I'm fine with basing it on inflation... if there had to be one.

Which I don't want.

Now, your turn... why should it be exactly $15 an hour?

wait you still have not told us why 15 dollars is wrong? You have no data to support it being wrong except its not specific enough for YOU.

If you are fine with basing it on inflation then you are fine with people being paid $10,100 a year?

You realize basing it on inflation does nothing to support your desire to peg it down to the local level right?

The data on inflation + production + COL already was the proof you were looking for to support AT LEAST 15 dollars an hour and many dollars higher.
But you refuse to accept production in any way.

[Machismo]

How? Insurance, gas, vehicle upkeep, payments on said vehicle... it’s not comfortable. It’s basic life.

Let's look at my car:

2012, paid a total of $34,572 over the last 9 years (and I will not be replacing it for several more).

Insurance: about $700 a year, had to guess a bit, because my wife and I are on the same plan.

Upkeep: 24 oil changes, small issues, brakes and tires. All told... about $3600 over 9 years.

Gas: 118k miles, averaging 21.7 miles per gallon... multiple by the cost of gas over the past 9 years... we'll say 3.00 a gallon. $16,313. I actually got the gas a lot cheaper with my grocery store club card, but I ignored that.

All told, that's $563 a month over the span of 9 years, for a brand new car.

So, I have no idea how they got it up to $900 a month. That's why I question some of these numbers.

[Zan15]

I still cook meals for less than $2 per meal... and that's for dinners. I make way, way more than the supposed minimum cost of living, and my grocery bill is considerably less than that per person.

Mind you, I eat out more, but that is a luxury, and something I didn't always do.

oh can you please share how?

Gimee an example of how you get to 2 dollars a meal i am now intrigued

[Machismo]

Only if you’re either not eating meat or buying it in bulk. Something someone making minimum wage can’t do. You gonna keep moving goalposts or link something that disproves statistics based on the current world we live in?

Not really, planning meals and preparing basic things is rather inexpensive. breakfast is actually very cheap, and can easily be done for less than $1 a meal.

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oh can you please share how?

Gimee an example of how you get to 2 dollars a meal i am now intrigued

Easy, we'll go with something simple like spaghetti, garlic bread, and green beans.

This feeds our family of 5.

Spaghetti: $1 a 16-ounce package

Sauce: $2-$2.49 per jar

Garlic bread: $2 a loaf

Green beans: $.70 a can, I use 2 for the 5 of us.

Now, I don't use close to all the pasta, it ends up being about 2/2 of a package. So, combine that, and you have about $6.40 before utility and water costs. Now, divide that by 5 people, and you have $1.28 per person.

Shall we discuss the wonders of boneless skinless chicken breast and rice?

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Incidentally, the living wage in 2015 was $15.12.

So no, it's not arbitrary, nobody pulled it out of their ass, it's just that some shortsighted, comprehensionally-challenged people have been pushing back on it for long enough to see the living wage rise another ~10% while those who fight for it have not demanded the same increase.

Your entire argument is flat-out, absolutely, embarrassingly wrong.

For where?

Let's see it.

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So..."if I can do it, so can everyone else?" Wtf?

I can do it, and it's not that fucking difficult...

Millions have been doing it for decades.

[Zan15]

Let's look at my car:

2012, paid a total of $34,572 over the last 9 years (and I will not be replacing it for several more).

Insurance: about $700 a year, had to guess a bit, because my wife and I are on the same plan.

Upkeep: 24 oil changes, small issues, brakes and tires. All told... about $3600 over 9 years.

Gas: 118k miles, averaging 21.7 miles per gallon... multiple by the cost of gas over the past 9 years... we'll say 3.00 a gallon. $16,313. I actually got the gas a lot cheaper with my grocery store club card, but I ignored that.

All told, that's $563 a month over the span of 9 years, for a brand new car.

So, I have no idea how they got it up to $900 a month. That's why I question some of these numbers.

Whelp min wage based on inflation would be about 10,500 so that's 875 a month before taxes or about 9k after.

So they would have 300 dollars left for everything else.



Guess they could sleep in the car.

[Machismo]

wait you still have not told us why 15 dollars is wrong? You have no data to support it being wrong except its not specific enough for YOU.

If you are fine with basing it on inflation then you are fine with people being paid $10,100 a year?

You realize basing it on inflation does nothing to support your desire to peg it down to the local level right?

The data on inflation + production + COL already was the proof you were looking for to support AT LEAST 15 dollars an hour and many dollars higher.
But you refuse to accept production in any way.

It's wrong, because it's not based on any hard data that people are providing.

It's not my number it's yours... so the burden is on you.

I don't want one at all. But, if there is one, it should be localized.

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Whelp min wage based on inflation would be about 10,500 so that's 875 a month before taxes or about 9k after.

So they would have 300 dollars left for everything else.



Guess they could sleep in the car.

Or, you know... not own a brand-new fucking car.