Does Blizzard have a reasoning behind the covenant exclusivity?

[Santti]

They have given the reasons themselves. No need to speculate on it.

[Echocho]

Did I step into a time machine? Is it a year ago?

[A Chozo]

In a parallel universe, Covenants are only cosmetic, and the community is bitching because it's all pointless fluff and it doesn't alter the gameplay in any shape or form.

Never change, MMO-C.

Did I step into a time machine? Is it a year ago?

You two know damn well that this is not how this works.
Get on with the script. Repeat after me:

Covenants bad.

[kenn9530]

If you come into a raid right now as frost mage instead of fire or even arcane you are literally trolling your raid group and they will tell you to switch. Why did they think covenants would be different? It just reads that blizzard doesn't know their playerbase. I consider myself an "Ashen Hollow Paladin" instead of "Divine Toll Paladin" right now. The Venthyr/Kyrians themselves I don't give a shit about.

What BS are you talking about with mage specs, you do know on average the difference overall in the whole current raid tier is around 5% on average between the best mage spec and worst, even the worst spec for a mage performs better than more than half the other specs, you can play any mage spec you want in mythic raiding currently.

Even sub rogue the worst overall peforms reasonably well across all mythic fights, with a skilled group it doesnt matter if some classes perform worse than others.

[Deadite]

Did I step into a time machine? Is it a year ago?

This thread is gonna pop up everytime they Buff/Nerf them.

[dope_danny]

I think part of it is simply the illusion of content. Like you do your maldraxxus covenant first for example and go "oh X was a memorable moment, i wonder what everyone else gets?" and then you do the kyrian covenant where you go to maldraxxus and do the exact same thing with a different NPC. If you are a casual player who only touched one then you might assume its all super independent, story rich content. Which gives the illusion theres four times the amount of content than if it was one linear campaign when really it feels like its 1.5x at best.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

Yes, but the reasoning is total bullshit. Blizzard crowed "player choice" while actively cutting down on player agency.

[Argorwal]

I think part of it is simply the illusion of content. Like you do your maldraxxus covenant first for example and go "oh X was a memorable moment, i wonder what everyone else gets?" and then you do the kyrian covenant where you go to maldraxxus and do the exact same thing with a different NPC. If you are a casual player who only touched one then you might assume its all super independent, story rich content. Which gives the illusion theres four times the amount of content than if it was one linear campaign when really it feels like its 1.5x at best.

I’ve only done the Kyrian campaign fully, and right now I’m about halfway through the Ardenweld campaign and they have absolutely nothing at all to do with each.

I guess I’ll see for myself the overlap once I get 2 more alts to 60 for maldraxxux and revendreth

[Soon-TM]

In a parallel universe, Covenants are only cosmetic, and the community is bitching because it's all pointless fluff and it doesn't alter the gameplay in any shape or form.

Your transdimensional, large scale mind reading skills are awesome. You must certainly have made a lot of money playing poker or games alike /s

Covenants bad.

Not really bad, just unnecessary on one hand and OP (for select specs) in the other.

[GreenJesus]

What BS are you talking about with mage specs, you do know on average the difference overall in the whole current raid tier is around 5% on average between the best mage spec and worst, even the worst spec for a mage performs better than more than half the other specs, you can play any mage spec you want in mythic raiding currently.

Even sub rogue the worst overall peforms reasonably well across all mythic fights, with a skilled group it doesnt matter if some classes perform worse than others.

It was just an example of a pure dps class that could just switch to another spec and do more damage.. Maybe a better example would be demo lock that is far below affliction in terms of damage.

[Zyky]

Reasoning? So they can say in later in the expansion or next expansion "we're listening to you" and then they'll make them account wide regardless of covenant choice. It's a cycle, they do something like this, then they tell the playerbase they're listening to the feedback, then they make a halfassed fix much too late for it, then they say they'll do better next time, and they don't and the cycle continues.

[Goat7]

They aren't but rather the boon of being able to permanently use their power is contingent on you pledging your allegiance to them. For instance, in the storyline quest, you're not able to use the Bastion abilities in Maldraxxus or Revendreth until after you reach 60 and then pledge your allegiance to Bastion which then allows you to use bastion abilities everywhere else.




Full stop. You can switch to another covenant very easily. Just go talk to the covenant rep in Oribos. You want to go try NF for resto or Maldraxxus for Ele? Not a problem. Now switching back to your original covenant, that's a different story.

Also with the way renown works, the catch up is amazingly fast. Had a guild mate switch and restarted renown from 1 to 30 in 3 days. And if he did want to switch back, it's just a 2 weekly quest turn in (could be as short as 1 week if he timed it around reset).

This is not amazingly fast.

- - - Updated - - -

Hi guys, I'm sorry if this discussion has already been talked to death, but the more I play Shadowlands, the less sense the covenant system makes. I'll try to describe my experiences and thoughts, and look forward to hearing yours.

Before release: When I first heard about the covenant system , and the fact that there will be four different "factions" in the Shadowlands, of which we, the players had the "RPG" role of picking for our characters, I thought two things;
- Blizzard, this won't work, the game and the player base is far too dependent on performance that any choice regarding player power isn't actually a choice. The best performance will be king.
- On the other hand, it's kinda cool. Rivalling factions with different aesthetics recruiting us in order to assert their dominance in their respective realms.

However, they aren't really rivalling, and throughout levelling and the campaign, we are a huge asset to all four covenants. It kinda makes the point of us choosing a covenant pretty redundant. All four factions see us as a valuable ally, all four factions allow us to use their powers while levelling. Why would they be against it when we are max level?

Why do I bring that up? Well one of Blizzards main arguments was that its an RPG aspect of the game, but from an RP perspective, they could just as well not have done so. Perhaps made the Covenant Ability (Fleshcraft, Night Fae form, Blood Mirror and Call Ally) as well as the in-dungeon benefits permanent and covenant based, and the actual "power" things be easier (maybe not free) to change.

So, to summarize;
- Late into this patch, I feel like trying out different specs for fun in RBGs and farm content. Specifically I play a Venthyr Enhancement Shaman and would love to play around with resto and ele every now and then, but I can't, and I don't understand the reasoning behind blizzards decision to not allow them to be open. Similarly I really enjoy the concept of Night Fae Paladin, a paladin to me is a character that buffs others, that's just how I see the class when I play it, and the Night Fae ability is perfect for that... It's just not good enough, so I went Kyrian

- The RPG element could just as well allow for free "empowering" from each covenant, as we're all friends anyway. Perhaps a short quest chain -after- reaching renown 40 with your main faction, with each other faction in place to gate-keep it a little would've been good.
- The idea of creating different permanent factions with different permanent power levels will never work in WoW (or modern online gaming) - Most power = King for 99% of the playerbase. (As far as I see at least)

What do you guys think? Is this system good, or does it have it's merits? Do you feel there's a strong argument for it being as it is? RPG/MMO wise? Could they have done anything better? Will they change the system going forward?

Thanks for your time <3

I think covenants suck ass. Making it so you can just change whenever you want and not have to re farm renown or do weeklys, would be great and a step forward.

[Alroxas]

This is not amazingly fast.

What then would be your time frame that doesn't make it trivial? Because any shorter and it would be trivial. Might as well advocate for #pullripcord then.

[Lolites]

This thread is gonna pop up everytime they Buff/Nerf them.

nah its gonna pop up every time a troll is bored, doesnt matter if there any change

- - - Updated - - -

I’ve only done the Kyrian campaign fully, and right now I’m about halfway through the Ardenweld campaign and they have absolutely nothing at all to do with each.

I guess I’ll see for myself the overlap once I get 2 more alts to 60 for maldraxxux and revendreth

there are like 2q where kyrian and necro overlap and 2 where venthyr and necro overlap, and thats pretty much it, night fae dont overlap with anyone and kyrian/venthyr dont overlap at all if i remember correctly

[Soon-TM]

its all super independent, story rich content. Which gives the illusion theres four times the amount of content than if it was one linear campaign when really it feels like its 1.5x at best.

Idk, the individual covenant stories actually mingle neatly with each other, while at the same time being diverse enough (except NF, which feels like writers are trying to cancel the several IOU's they signed during Legion/BfA rather than a coherent thing). The only problem for me is... That I can't give a flying #$&@ about the story and the entire cast of characters - except maybe Bwonsamdi.

[OldPerson]

And thats imbalance is the biggest issue. I would love to play my bm as a necrolord. But my damage will be simply rip then. So i HAVE to play nightfae to have at least a little fun and aceptance in m+ and raid. Cuz the Specc balance is worse aswell.
So my Horde Hunter feels like a nightelf -.-

And to make thing even wirse, they create 4 new "factions" but hey i cant talk to dudes with the same covenant, if he is an alliance player...

covenants should have been for cosmetic only, they are a lot of other ways to implement the next unbalanced borrowed power thingy into wow.

What do you mean by "my damage will be simple rip then" ?
To me that would suggest greater than 10% loss (closer to 20% or more). What is the real loss in DPS if you go elsewhere?

[Soon-TM]

What do you mean by "my damage will be simple rip then" ?
To me that would suggest greater than 10% loss (closer to 20% or more). What is the real loss in DPS if you go elsewhere?

Maybe you are an extremely gifted player, and can parse purple or orange using suboptimal choices. But there are many other players who aren't that gifted, so they need to rely on whatever advantages they can put their hands on.

Or on the other hand, maybe you just don't give a flying sh1t about your performance, and are content with sticking to LFD/LFR, or rely on your guild/paid boosts to carry your underperforming ass through non-trivial content. Guess what, not everyone features such a nonchalant attitude, even if they aren't mythic progression raiders.

[Electric Lighter]

What do you mean by "my damage will be simple rip then" ?
To me that would suggest greater than 10% loss (closer to 20% or more). What is the real loss in DPS if you go elsewhere?

It is tricky to map out with how conduits factor into it but overall it would be rather substantial. The necro lord ability is worthless compared to nightfae that more or less makes or breaks the class. It would be like comparing the dps loss between having arcane power or having presence of mind along with talents that would improve each.

[Argorwal]

Maybe you are an extremely gifted player, and can parse purple or orange using suboptimal choices. But there are many other players who aren't that gifted, so they need to rely on whatever advantages they can put their hands on.

Or on the other hand, maybe you just don't give a flying sh1t about your performance, and are content with sticking to LFD/LFR, or rely on your guild/paid boosts to carry your underperforming ass through non-trivial content. Guess what, not everyone features such a nonchalant attitude, even if they aren't mythic progression raiders.

If someone cares this much about their performance I assume they are swapping classes every patch to make sure they have the top dps spec?

Anything less is...suboptimal.

[Electric Lighter]

If someone cares this much about their performance I assume they are swapping classes every patch to make sure they have the top dps spec?

Anything less is...suboptimal.

I mean they used to just respec talents and that is what covenants are after all a talent row with 4 choices instead of three.