Blademaster Class Concept Updated

[ZazuuPriest]

Out of curiosity, if Blademaster is not enough different from Warrior to be a class, what can they add that it's not already on the game?

I ask because I'm surprised that a lot of people say "they are X class" but they can't agree on wich one (some say warriors, some enh shaman, some monk). I think that maybe it's because Blademaster is it's own thing.

even by your summation blademaster isn't its own thing its a small part of 3 classes that already exist and as such there is no place in this game for them because they would take away from those 3 classes. bad ideas are bad

[username993720]

A prime candidate for the Blademaster class would be the Ankoan race (notice the dual-wielding swords):

even by your summation blademaster isn't its own thing its a small part of 3 classes that already exist and as such there is no place in this game for them because they would take away from those 3 classes. bad ideas are bad

Warrior - Bladestorm
Shaman - fire enchanted weapon
Monk - Windwalk name

Big deal -_-

[Desscent]

Like many stated, we need more ranged ;d

[Cracked]

The classes already play more or less the same, the last thing this game would need is another stealth, melee class.

[username993720]

Like many stated, we need more ranged ;d

How does a Dark Ranger, Priestess of the Moon and Sea Witch sound to you?

The classes already play more or less the same, the last thing this game would need is another stealth, melee class.

Yes, but none of them fulfill the fantasy of a Samurai.

[ZazuuPriest]

A prime candidate for the Blademaster class would be the Ankoan race (notice the dual-wielding swords):





Warrior - Bladestorm
Shaman - fire enchanted weapon
Monk - Windwalk name

Big deal -_-

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You were probably one of ones who cried when locks lost meta

But you're right no big deal...

[Triceron]

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But you're right no big deal...

It really isn't because the argument of 'taking away from other classes' doesn't really exist.

I mean, if that were true, then Necrolord and Revendreth Covenants would have taken everything away from Death Knights, but instead of actually taking away it's giving existing classes their own Necromantic Unholy and Blood abilities even though there is direct overlap with the DK's own abilities and themes.

Necrolord Covenant gives everyone Fleshcraft which is a fancier version of Bone Armor. Would you consider this taking away from a DK? I wouldn't.


Multiple classes can have the same abilities. There is no such thing as ability exclusivity to any class in WoW. Even the most iconic and unique Shaman ability Bloodlust was eventually shared by Mages and a Profession crafted item. That doesn't *take away* from the Shaman still having Blood Lust. Classes aren't brought to raids because of unique or 'gimmick' abilities, so it doesn't matter if multiple classes have Bladestorm, Windwalking/Stealth and Enhanced/Enchanted Weapons. Abilities and themes aren't exclusive to any class, even if it's core to their identity. A Druid may be a master of Shapeshifting, but this doesn't mean they're the only ones who can shapeshift. Shamans can take Ghost Wolf form, Demon Hunters take up Demon forms, and any alchemist can take up a rideable Dragon form. It's all a matter of perspective.

[username993720]

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You were probably one of ones who cried when locks lost meta

But you're right no big deal...

Nope
Nope
Nope

and nope.

[Syegfryed]

Not true.
They are lacking the following abilities as well:
Image Transmission, Advancing Strikes, Critical Strike, Illusion Master, Deflection, Burning Blade, Phantom Pain, Harsh Winds.

Honestly, it's kind of surprising coming from you. I always thought you were a big Orc fan.

are you seriously bringing up Heroes of the storm shenanigans like a big gotcha? all of those are evolving skills from the ones we already have

Lets not pretend those skills are like big defining traits from the class, the OG ones are from warcraft 3, warriors do have critical strike, deflection is a parry like ability, and again, they only rly need mirror image and wind walk as talents

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These abilities break the Warrior archetype.

they don't, they are part of the orchish warrior archetype, a type of warrior archetype.

The differences are huge when you consider how mirror image and windwalk would actually change how a Warrior is played, and is a big reason why Warriors don't have said abilities.

talents are supposed to do just change, change how a class is played, they don't need to be groundbreaking neither too powerful, just resemble the archetype.

Windwalk could just last for a few seconds

Blademaster is as much an Arms Warrior as they are a Subtlety Rogue if you really think about it. They're like a Subtlety Rogue that can use 2H blades and Bladestorm.

blademaster use two handed weapons and plate armor-ish abilities, they are warriors, trough and trough.

[Shadowferal]

Hmm...applied to an arakkoa wingblade;

[username993720]

are you seriously bringing up Heroes of the storm shenanigans like a big gotcha? all of those are evolving skills from the ones we already have

Lets not pretend those skills are like big defining traits from the class, the OG ones are from warcraft 3, warriors do have critical strike, deflection is a parry like ability, and again, they only rly need mirror image and wind walk as talents

Yes. What's wrong with that?
The HotS character expands upon the class abilities from WC3. It's a great source of inspiration.

Image Transmission
Activate to switch places with a target Mirror Image, removing most negative effects from you and the Mirror Image.

Advancing Strikes
Attacks against enemies increase your Movement Speed by 25% for 2 seconds.

Critical Strike
Your next Attack within 8 seconds will be a Critical Strike, dealing 50% increased damage. This also applies to Images, and does not break Wind Walk.
Passive: You and your Images deal a Critical Strike on every 4th Attack.

Illusion Master
Mirror Images can be controlled individually or as a group and their damage is increased by 100%.
Passive: Image Transmission's cooldown is reduced to 8 seconds.

Deflection
When activated, increases parry chance by 100%, reduces the chance ranged attacks will hit you by 100% and grants a 100% chance to deflect spells. Lasts 10 sec.

Burning Blade
Inflicts X Fire damage to enemies within 2 yards and creates a Blaze at the location.

Phantom Pain
Instant 3 min cooldown
Falling below 25% health instantly restores health. You then take damage over 10 sec. This effect can only occur once every 3 min.

Harsh Winds
Instant
Harsh winds buffet the enemy, dealing Physical damage, preventing spellcasting, and slowing movement speed by 85%.

Plus, as a Samurai archetype, they can draw additional inspiration from Genji (Overwatch):

Agility
Activate to jump to target area.
Passive: you are able to double-jump.

Shuriken
Sprays shurikens at up to 8 targets within 10 yards, dealing Physical damage.

Swift Strike
dart forward, slashing with your blade. If you eliminate a target, you can instantly use this ability again.

Dragonblade
You brandish your blade. for a brief period of time you can try to 'excute' any targets within your reach (meaning, you don't need to wait for 20% health). Doesn't mean it guarantee kills.

X-Strike
Perform two slashes dealing X damage. The slashes detonate after Y seconds causing an additional Z damage to enemies in their area.

Swift as the Wind
Instant
When you use Swift Strike, you have a chance to be infused with the powers of wind, increasing your movement speed by 30% and attack speed by 70% for 8 sec.

Dragon Claw
2 sec cast
Attacks with a whirlwind of sharpened claws, inflicting Physical damage to all enemies within 12 yards.

Dodge
Instant 1.5 sec cooldown
Dart out of the way of an incoming attack.

Reflect
Reflect direct abilities.

they don't, they are part of the orchish warrior archetype, a type of warrior archetype

An Orcish Warrior is most likely to be a Grunt or a Raider. Less so a Blademaster.

blademaster use two handed weapons and plate armor-ish abilities, they are warriors, trough and trough.

"Demon Hunters use Glaives and wear Leather. They are Rogues through and through" - That's what people thought before the addition of the Demon Hunter class.

Hmm...applied to an arakkoa wingblade;

Wikia images do not work here for some reason

[Alanar]

As much as I like it and I see you realy put some time in it.

The thing is tho.. I feel like blademaster is just using aspect of excisting classes. Which doesnt persee excite me.
Wind, shuriken toss, quick strike.. mostly just rogue, monk stuff, but then with a samurai sword, which is also kibda rogue like if you ask me. Even that mirror image spell is looking realy similar to the * wind* walker spec.

Besides that we realy need a new range class I feel like blademaster is just to hollow for me.. I rather see a spellbreaker or dark ranger pop up in the future.

[pacotaco]

My two cents: I would lean heavily on the Mirror Image schtick and make it the primary mechanic for the class. While it exists in game, I would amp it up as it's the only melee mechanic that isn't really represented in WoW from the Blademaster's kit from WC 3.

To that end, I'd suggest looking at the Mesmer from GW2. Lots of illusion based abilities with duplicates of the player doing damage and creating effects. It might make the class a little more magical than originally intended, but it would be a cool and unique angle for the class.

The only thing I don't quite agree with is the Mail armor. Considering they are depicted as basically being armorless, it seems like an odd choice based solely on the desire to add another mail class to the game. rather than offering a good representation of what the Blademaster is in lore.

I'll give it a look on the MI. My initial concept was based on creating a different spec based around each distinctive ability portrayed on the other media and tied together by the common link of elemental magic.

The mail armor server 2 purposes: mechanically, adding another mail user to the loot list, and thematically, it was based on samurai, whose armor was closer to mail armor to anything else.

[Syegfryed]

Yes. What's wrong with that?

because most of it, if not all of it, is not canon

its not the original blademaster is changed to fit into a moba, in wow Blademaster are just warriors, you can find tons fo then as warrior trainers in wow.

An Orcish Warrior is most likely to be a Grunt or a Raider. Less so a Blademaster.

wrong, again,t ons fo blademasters as warrior trainners, blademaster is like being an arch mage, and not a regular wizard

"Demon Hunters use Glaives and wear Leather. They are Rogues through and through" - That's what people thought before the addition of the Demon Hunter class.

no, thats a false equivalence, demon hunters use fel magic and do not fight with stealth, the only difference from a blademaster to warrior arms is the lack of mirror image and wind walk, period.

[pacotaco]

- At least one piece of the Initial Blademaster concept art included Fist Weapons, so they should probably be included as weapons able to be wielded. Expanding on this, Warchief Kargath Bladefist notably used Fist Weapons, and used a lot of common Blademaster imagery in his abilities such as his really fast illusionary dash-striking, as well as quite literally Blade Dance.

While this is true, it doen'st fit very well the modern concept. Maybe the wind spec could use them, but Fists use to be too unrefined, an that would class withthe concept of swift, weaponmaster concept.

- Polearms are also large bladed weapons, they could be put into Burning Blade spec as well. This would also make it easier to swap between a 2h dps and 2h tank spec, there being at least one weapon shared between the two.

I initially contemplated to add polearms to BB and 2Hs to PP, but I wasn't sure. I wanted to really show the protective nature of the tank spec, and the bladed 2H felt too agressive.

- Especially lacking in races like Humans, Forsaken, and Blood Elves who are noted with either racials or weapon masters as masters of the blade, so it seems like Blademasters would be a given for these races given the weapon proficiency. For other weapons, Dwarfs and Trolls also had similar mastery over axes with their weapon masters, and Tauren with staves, if the blade mastery concept is extending beyond just swords this would be good justification to including it to more races and even a good way to tie certain specs more closely to certain races.

I did this for several reasons:
- Lorewise, we've only see Orcs and one Draenei.
- It gives those races a more special class, like DH did to BElves and NElves.
- I added pandaren because the theme was close to their Asian theme.
- I also juggled with adding NElves (the race has some Japanese undertones) and Vulpera, but I didn't to dilute too much the original concept and lore.
- I'm also working on other class concepts that fill those other races races.

- Way of Phantom Pain describes a mastery over water specifically, but only a couple abilities listed for them seem to have much visual thematic theming to water. I'd double down on the water, and even incorporate the water into more of the tank specs' core abilities and passives.

True. I acknowledge that I had a harded time with tanks, and being blademaster a class mostly protrayed as a damage archetype did not help.

- Wind with dual weapons and fire for two-handed weapons for the burning blade spec I think were a great choices. The closer I just think the synergy with weapon choices and element concept the better they can be more unique and stand as their own specs, so wanted to say good job on that.

Yeah, the idea behind it was: slow charge -> big burst, hard hitting strikes (Fire) and "dead by thousand cuts" + manage speed (Wind)

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even by your summation blademaster isn't its own thing its a small part of 3 classes that already exist and as such there is no place in this game for them because they would take away from those 3 classes. bad ideas are bad

We have a lot of classes that they also pick from other archetypes. For example:
- Paladin: Warrior + Priest
- Druid: Warrior + Rogue + Mage + Priest
- Warlock: Mage + Hunter
- Shaman: Mage + Priest
- Death Knight: reverse Paladin

Yet, nothing stopped Blizzard from adding them.

People always appeal to the DH/Warlock meta debacle, but the thing is that Meta was a flagship ability for DH in the 1st place, and they just added it to WLs as a nod. I feel the same with Bladestorm: it's not a warrior thing. I don't feel like becoming a cutting hurricane fits the concept of the full-plate-armor juggernaut expert on all type of weapons.

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A prime candidate for the Blademaster class would be the Ankoan race (notice the dual-wielding swords):

Yeah, some of them even have the blademaster title.
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Blademaster_Okani

Warrior - Bladestorm
Shaman - fire enchanted weapon
Monk - Windwalk name

Big deal -_-

Actually, I'd just remove Bladestorm from warriors. The shaman weapon enchants work different, and the WW monk can keep the name without problem of confusing people.

[Recovery]

Id prefer a new ranged class at this point. Maybe a new caster that focuses on earth magic. You can argue that Elemental does that, but not really. They have very few earth elemental abilities.

Think taliyah from LoL.

[jellmoo]

I'll give it a look on the MI. My initial concept was based on creating a different spec based around each distinctive ability portrayed on the other media and tied together by the common link of elemental magic.

I worry that basing the concept around elemental magic is going to cause overlap with Enhancement Shaman. Imbuing a weapon with elemental power is kind of their schtick.

The mail armor server 2 purposes: mechanically, adding another mail user to the loot list, and thematically, it was based on samurai, whose armor was closer to mail armor to anything else.

While there is definitely samurai influence in the Blademaster, I'd argue that their aesthetic is more based on the wandering swordmaster or masterless ronin rather than that of a more organized member of the military. In game, they always seem to go without armor, rather than wearing a traditional style of samurai armor.

[username993720]

As much as I like it and I see you realy put some time in it.

The thing is tho.. I feel like blademaster is just using aspect of excisting classes. Which doesnt persee excite me.
Wind, shuriken toss, quick strike.. mostly just rogue, monk stuff, but then with a samurai sword, which is also kibda rogue like if you ask me. Even that mirror image spell is looking realy similar to the * wind* walker spec.

Besides that we realy need a new range class I feel like blademaster is just to hollow for me.. I rather see a spellbreaker or dark ranger pop up in the future.

Then, how about taking those aspects from the Rogue and Monk and giving it to the Blademaster?

Many claim that the Dark Ranger cannot constitute a class on its own, as it overlaps with the Hunter and Death Knight classes. as a specialization, though, it could definitely be viable.

As for a Spellbreaker, it is very unlikely, as it is a simple silvermoon guard unit, like a Grunt or a Footman.

because most of it, if not all of it, is not canon

It uses the same abilities as its Warcraft 3 counterpart: Mirror Image, Critical Strike, Bladestorm, Wind Walk - and expands upon it. I view it as a completely viable source.

its not the original blademaster is changed to fit into a moba, in wow Blademaster are just warriors, you can find tons fo then as warrior trainers in wow.

Because in WoW, the class has not been implemented yet. Do you think Death Knights had a different toolkit than other classes before Wrath of the Lich King? no, they didn't. They used a mix of Warrior and Warlock abilities. Did Demon Hunters have the plethora of abilities they have now? no, they mainly used Metamorphosis, which had been a Warlock ability.

wrong, again,t ons fo blademasters as warrior trainners, blademaster is like being an arch mage, and not a regular wizard

"Warriors are common among orcs. Orcs have a long history of warfare; their race has been battling various creatures for generations. In the past, many orcs embraced their demon-born bloodlust and became barbarians. In recent years, the orcs' discovery of their spiritual and shamanistic path traditions has allowed orcs to focus and refine their savagery. Many orcs still become barbarians, but the way of the trained warrior - becomes more and more common. The iconic orc warrior is garbed in chain mail or leather and plate. He carries a mighty battleaxe and wears a horned helmet. He crouches in a battle stance, axe at the ready, as he evaluates his opponent...then, with a fearsome yowl, he strikes in a blur. Such warriors can be found among the common Grunt or the venerated worg riding raiders."

"Orcs are born warriors; as Eitrigg in Of Blood and Honor says, all orcs are warriors (this is a hyperbole as many orcs are peons). Subgroups of orc warriors are grunts and raiders. Famous orc warriors include Grom Hellscream, Durotan, and Orgrim Doomhammer."

no, thats a false equivalence, demon hunters use fel magic and do not fight with stealth, the only difference from a blademaster to warrior arms is the lack of mirror image and wind walk, period.

The only similarity between a Blademaster and an Arms Warrior is a mastery over two-handed weapon and the Bladestorm ability.
Back in the day, Warlocks were the Demon Hunters due to Metamorphosis. It isn't the case today.

- I also juggled with adding NElves (the race has some Japanese undertones).

I agree with that assessment.
I did a thread about races' origins and the Night elves are definitely Japanese influenced.

People always appeal to the DH/Warlock meta debacle, but the thing is that Meta was a flagship ability for DH in the 1st place, and they just added it to WLs as a nod. I feel the same with Bladestorm: it's not a warrior thing. I don't feel like becoming a cutting hurricane fits the concept of the full-plate-armor juggernaut expert on all type of weapons.

Exactly.
The Warrior class isn't a Samurai.
From my analysis, it's more of a Tauren Chieftain/Mountain King archetype.

Yeah, some of them even have the blademaster title.
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Blademaster_Okani

Not only that. But the double-sword use could imply on a specialization that is separate from the two-handed archetype.

Actually, I'd just remove Bladestorm from warriors. The shaman weapon enchants work different, and the WW monk can keep the name without problem of confusing people.

Much like how Metamorphosis was removed from the Warlocks and given to the Demon Hunter.

[pacotaco]

I worry that basing the concept around elemental magic is going to cause overlap with Enhancement Shaman. Imbuing a weapon with elemental power is kind of their schtick.

True. But to me, shaman specs focus more on the role (melee dps, ranged dps, healer), and mix all of the elements more or less the same.
I tried to make each BM spec focus on one element, and only have 2 or 3 shared abilities, like mages do.
About the imbue weapon, it doesn't work like the shaman. It's a short-lived buff that the played needs to manage to keep up, like the old Paladin's Inquisition: you had to spend holy power to buff yourself for a few seconds, but you also need that resource to use some abilities, so you had to manage when to buff and when to hit. I thought it would be ok to recreate that type of gameplay, since it was removed from the game and would not step on anything already existing.

[jellmoo]

True. But to me, shaman specs focus more on the role (melee dps, ranged dps, healer), and mix all of the elements more or less the same.
I tried to make each BM spec focus on one element, and only have 2 or 3 shared abilities, like mages do.
About the imbue weapon, it doesn't work like the shaman. It's a short-lived buff that the played needs to manage to keep up, like the old Paladin's Inquisition: you had to spend holy power to buff yourself for a few seconds, but you also need that resource to use some abilities, so you had to manage when to buff and when to hit. I thought it would be ok to recreate that type of gameplay, since it was removed from the game and would not step on anything already existing.

I think the issue you run into is the visual. Imbuing a weapon with fire, for example, and then using other melee attacks might have some mechanical differentiation from what the enhancement shaman does, but visually it's going to look more than a little similar. The game obviously has cases of overlap in it already, but in each case there is also a "hook" for the class that makes it different.

I'm not sure what the hook is with this one.