Gearing - Whats wrong with Blizzard ???

[Niwes]

OP: Your solution is the same solution that everyone in your situation has available to them: Make your own groups. Grats, now you're getting heroic drops and higher level Mythic+ runs.

Not willing to do that? That's your problem, not ours.

oh, ofc i am willing. it seems more that the universe do not let me, without a guild or using tokens.

since so many ppl here obviously not reading the thread and steadily saying the same, regardless what i wrote (all the good „find a guild“ advices ^^) or if 20 other ppl already said the same here („greater vault“), after exp of 15 years of wow, this thread/thing just becomes boring slowly. but thx for the better, more rational and more differentiated posts. thx a lot.

so, to see what happens i tried the following the last 18 hours and here are my results (just the pure plain results, without any opinion on it):

- made my own HC raid group (nothing new here since i leaded a seminprogress guild in MoP). it took around 2 hours to get pug ppl, all with 205 or higher. i and another heal did around 4,5k hps average, tanks were mid class, we did 1st boss one shot. second (huntsman) i explained everything explicitly. tanks knew the fight. we wiped 5 times. 4 times regroup around 20-25min, even with lock. after 4,5 hours i stopped that „experiment“.

- next thing i tried was getting my +9 key to +10. looking for ~20mins for pug ppl. checked all on raider.io. hihhest i got had 1096, most were 500-700. in the end i took a 800 tank, 1 1096 dps and 2 ~700 dps. we died at second last boss once, a dps left. so i started same again at +8 (bc depleted key) 1096 guy stayed. rest was again around the same rio score as in first try. i healed like a bastard. but ppl often were dumb (necrotic week). kicks was ok‘ish with 27 kicks overall. i retried this experiment 4 times (key was 7 then again 8). after 3hours i stopped. my key is now +8 at the moment.

- so i tried 1 conquest professional grp (they didnt want me but late at night they found no heal, so iwas lucky) and 1 rated bg yolo group. healed 5,8k hps in ashran, we lost by a very small margin. all other BGs lost (we are alliance) without question. at the end the pro grp won 1 bg and i got the last points missing for 900 of trinket etc. i had 198 gear with 21% versa in pvp (luckily many of my PvE 200 items have versa). sadly my rating is at 612 now, far away from 1400, so i can not upgrade my 2 conquest items i have at the moment, with honor. i stopped the PvP experiment after 3-4 hours.

i do not wanna say anything with this results. this is just how the game was going the last day. and this felt rather „normal“ to me and my exp of the last 2 months.

i for myself slowly realize that this game is no longer for me. it seems that the most prominent and most posted solutions are:

- get a guild
- buy BoEs or boost via token/money
- wait 4-7 weeks to let the Great Vault do the job

no offense here. thats totally fine. this seems the way wow goes and after 15+ years of wow maybe this shall tell me that its enough and ok now. i am definetelly no longer the target audience for that game and thats ok. next time my sub is refreshed is in may/june. so i have time to decide if i should play all TBC stuff again (dont think so) or just call it a nice and long journey and go for good (most propably).

my biggest problem is, that i simply not have the time and not wanna invest it, in all the waiting stuff like regroup 20mins after every boss or wait 40mins to pvp. ofc a guild solves this problem (remember i play 15 years...) but since that is not an option for me, cause of fixed schedule, this means: invest HUGE time in waiting for things and sloooowly as chewing gum make progress. and this is just a bad relation between fun and investment for me.

but thx for the answers and mostly thx for the good ones that read the thread and answered differentiated and realistically/rational. behave all well.

[Relapses]

I haven't stepped foot in a single raid and I have 4 toons at ~215ish and got KSM a few weeks ago. I'm not very good at this game but the problem you're describing could easily be solved if you, y'know, just played the fucking game.

- - - Updated - - -

i for myself slowly realize that this game is no longer for me.

Nevermind my previous advice. You've solved your own problem!

[Marrilaife]

Is it such a bad thing that ppl who started earlier, have better gear?

I never stated whether it's good or bad. I'm just saying it's obviously in Blizzard's interest to tell people uninterrupted sub and playing continuously is more beneficial than jumping in - jumping out. On the other hand if someone wants to jump in randomly, season resets usually provide catch up gear to do exactly that. But since we're 5 months in the season already, who the heck wants to keep farming +7 and similar keys?

[Swnem]

You complain, but you are unwilling to raid with a guild or get a stable mythic+ group. That is how you advance.
Otherwise, yes, the weekly vault.

[kaminaris]

Is it such a bad thing that ppl who started earlier, have better gear? My main is 221. I started the week m+ was released. Didn't get up to 226 in vault until 1.5 to 2 months in. No raids. My first alt, druid, got 60 about 2 months after m+ released. He's only 211, will be 213 when I finish this lego. Most recent alt is ele sham. It 60 maybe a month ago. Ilvl 203 I think.

I could grind out conquest, or grind out VP and add 5-15 ilvls on the alts.

It sucks knowing you peob won't hit 226+ this season but neither will most ppl. Nothing wrong with progressing at your own rate. Work your way up, get familiar with the dungeons now. In 2 months you'll be equal footing to everyone

Have you ever gave a single thought about implication of this? Yes it is bad, its really really bad.
Being permanently behind a curve means having hard time to find any group at this point. For M+ there are already "better geared" people. For raiding guilds/pugs it's the same.

Especially with this scaling where 10 ilvls is massive difference. It's not "progressing at your own pace", its essentially being excluded from content as there are better geared people out there.

[cparle87]

The best part is that WF/TF was quite controversial in Legion/BfA, because it awarded gear far above the content you were doing. But the SL iteration of the weekly chest is effectively a guaranteed crazy TF item /facepalm

The difference was that WF/TF could happen anywhere. You could get mythic raiding gear from a catch 10 squirrels WQ, theoretically. Which incentivized doing all content, even the lowest, in the hopes of winning the lotto. The chest is one guaranteed TF per week. See the difference?

[kaminaris]

The difference was that WF/TF could happen anywhere. You could get mythic raiding gear from a catch 10 squirrels WQ, theoretically. Which incentivized doing all content, even the lowest, in the hopes of winning the lotto. The chest is one guaranteed TF per week. See the difference?

Yeah except that guaranteed item isn't guaranteed upgrade, pure RNG out of massive loot pool. With TF you knew what item you could get from WQ and you knew loot pools on raid/dung bosses. So one system can give you occasional bonus while doing all content and the other is weekly bingo lottery you have to gather tickets for that may screw you up anyways.

[erifwodahs]

yes, ofc. i totally believe this. but its the same argument as „join a guild“. i never met this xpac any pug m+ group that ever would be able with avg 191 doing 10+....

We did 10-12s in that gear with low conduits/renown, but we actually are pushing "okay" key and had experience from BfA. Problem is that at that time all the players who had that 190+ were good players, because casuals were stuck in lower ilvl. Any good player now migrated up the ilvl bracket and 200-210 is now alts where they don't stay for long because it's a hellhole. (did a dungeon where warlock legit forgot he can do BRs and mage didn't lust/TW) OR very casual players/noobs. Also arrogant bitches on their alts who have 1.6k main score and think they can shit on people for mistakes in +10, so yeah... have to be quick and persistent to get out.

[tikcol]

first part: when looking at the game design the last few years and some of blizz stances or design descission to me this seems EXACTLY how it really goes.

- - - Updated - - -



without guild ?
without using any gold for BoEs ?
without using any gold for Boosts ?
without being carried ?

ok. tell me how. (meant serious)

As a mage that I only played during mop...

I boost the character to max level, do some heroics, do all the mythics, start m+, spam m+, dont behave like a withered flower when I get declined.

Do world bosses, lucky me, best legendary power drops from first week boss.

Torghast ofc, I didn't even have time to get 235 helm before I quit. Layer 8 first day, twisting corridors? That's for losers.

I did buy a cloak, a ring and a trinket from the AH but that's it and it was the heroic version. Trinket was that 200 ilevel bullshit trinket I replaced with last bosses trinket next day

Clear normal, start spamming request inv to heroic, eventually clear it. Good loot on vault, easy life.

PvP, get 2k rating. Easy game, boring game. Quit.


That's my darklands experience, time I'll never get back.


Best tip I can give you? The request invite is your best friend. We're needy losers and our best friend has it all. Abuse it and don't feel bad about it.

Oh and be smart about your m+ spamming, try to spam keys that increase your score.

[cparle87]

Yeah except that guaranteed item isn't guaranteed upgrade, pure RNG out of massive loot pool. With TF you knew what item you could get from WQ and you knew loot pools on raid/dung bosses. So one system can give you occasional bonus while doing all content and the other is weekly bingo lottery you have to gather tickets for that may screw you up anyways.

Depends on which one you do. I'd only call the M+ pool massive, since you can get anything that drops from any of the 5-mans. The pvp one is pretty small and the CN one is quite a bit smaller. And you can even control the loot table yourself by picking your loot specialization. It's not as big as you think.

- - - Updated - - -

As a mage that I only played during mop...

I boost the character to max level, do some heroics, do all the mythics, start m+, spam m+, dont behave like a withered flower when I get declined.

Do world bosses, lucky me, best legendary power drops from first week boss.

Torghast ofc, I didn't even have time to get 235 helm before I quit. Layer 8 first day, twisting corridors? That's for losers.

I did buy a cloak, a ring and a trinket from the AH but that's it and it was the heroic version. Trinket was that 200 ilevel bullshit trinket I replaced with last bosses trinket next day

Clear normal, start spamming request inv to heroic, eventually clear it. Good loot on vault, easy life.

PvP, get 2k rating. Easy game, boring game. Quit.


That's my darklands experience, time I'll never get back.


Best tip I can give you? The request invite is your best friend. We're needy losers and our best friend has it all. Abuse it and don't feel bad about it.

Oh and be smart about your m+ spamming, try to spam keys that increase your score.

If you're really worried about "time you'll never get back" why don't you try quitting these forums too?

As for your post, I can see a couple lies in here to begin with. For instance layer 8s weren't available until a week or two into the expansion. As for the rest I love how nonchalantly you talk about pugging heroic and getting 2k rating. Either you had some super lucky pugging, or it's more lying for the sake of your agenda, which seems to be nothing more than to spread hate for a game, which for the third xpac in a row, you seem to glorify telling people you've already quit.

[Mardux]

oh, ofc i am willing. it seems more that the universe do not let me, without a guild or using tokens.

since so many ppl here obviously not reading the thread and steadily saying the same, regardless what i wrote (all the good „find a guild“ advices ^^) or if 20 other ppl already said the same here („greater vault“), after exp of 15 years of wow, this thread/thing just becomes boring slowly. but thx for the better, more rational and more differentiated posts. thx a lot.

so, to see what happens i tried the following the last 18 hours and here are my results (just the pure plain results, without any opinion on it):

- made my own HC raid group (nothing new here since i leaded a seminprogress guild in MoP). it took around 2 hours to get pug ppl, all with 205 or higher. i and another heal did around 4,5k hps average, tanks were mid class, we did 1st boss one shot. second (huntsman) i explained everything explicitly. tanks knew the fight. we wiped 5 times. 4 times regroup around 20-25min, even with lock. after 4,5 hours i stopped that „experiment“.

- next thing i tried was getting my +9 key to +10. looking for ~20mins for pug ppl. checked all on raider.io. hihhest i got had 1096, most were 500-700. in the end i took a 800 tank, 1 1096 dps and 2 ~700 dps. we died at second last boss once, a dps left. so i started same again at +8 (bc depleted key) 1096 guy stayed. rest was again around the same rio score as in first try. i healed like a bastard. but ppl often were dumb (necrotic week). kicks was ok‘ish with 27 kicks overall. i retried this experiment 4 times (key was 7 then again 8). after 3hours i stopped. my key is now +8 at the moment.

- so i tried 1 conquest professional grp (they didnt want me but late at night they found no heal, so iwas lucky) and 1 rated bg yolo group. healed 5,8k hps in ashran, we lost by a very small margin. all other BGs lost (we are alliance) without question. at the end the pro grp won 1 bg and i got the last points missing for 900 of trinket etc. i had 198 gear with 21% versa in pvp (luckily many of my PvE 200 items have versa). sadly my rating is at 612 now, far away from 1400, so i can not upgrade my 2 conquest items i have at the moment, with honor. i stopped the PvP experiment after 3-4 hours.

i do not wanna say anything with this results. this is just how the game was going the last day. and this felt rather „normal“ to me and my exp of the last 2 months.

i for myself slowly realize that this game is no longer for me. it seems that the most prominent and most posted solutions are:

- get a guild
- buy BoEs or boost via token/money
- wait 4-7 weeks to let the Great Vault do the job

no offense here. thats totally fine. this seems the way wow goes and after 15+ years of wow maybe this shall tell me that its enough and ok now. i am definetelly no longer the target audience for that game and thats ok. next time my sub is refreshed is in may/june. so i have time to decide if i should play all TBC stuff again (dont think so) or just call it a nice and long journey and go for good (most propably).

my biggest problem is, that i simply not have the time and not wanna invest it, in all the waiting stuff like regroup 20mins after every boss or wait 40mins to pvp. ofc a guild solves this problem (remember i play 15 years...) but since that is not an option for me, cause of fixed schedule, this means: invest HUGE time in waiting for things and sloooowly as chewing gum make progress. and this is just a bad relation between fun and investment for me.

but thx for the answers and mostly thx for the good ones that read the thread and answered differentiated and realistically/rational. behave all well.

They've given you a solution to your issue, you just don't like it. Your problem is not not blizzard's fault or anyone else's fault. You're making the choice to not use gear avenues available to you, then turning around and whining about how bad gear progression it.

[tikcol]

Depends on which one you do. I'd only call the M+ pool massive, since you can get anything that drops from any of the 5-mans. The pvp one is pretty small and the CN one is quite a bit smaller. And you can even control the loot table yourself by picking your loot specialization. It's not as big as you think.

- - - Updated - - -



If you're really worried about "time you'll never get back" why don't you try quitting these forums too?

As for your post, I can see a couple lies in here to begin with. For instance layer 8s weren't available until a week or two into the expansion. As for the rest I love how nonchalantly you talk about pugging heroic and getting 2k rating. Either you had some super lucky pugging, or it's more lying for the sake of your agenda, which seems to be nothing more than to spread hate for a game, which for the third xpac in a row, you seem to glorify telling people you've already quit.

I started playing in January.. I'm sure you can do it too. Does it bother you that much that people quit? Isn't that what people like you tell others to do when they complain about the game?

[Bagrod]

it took me two months from 204 to 214.

Which I do not really see a a big issue.

2 Months to gear up on HC Raid level seems quite reasonable for me to be honest.

Of course its not BFA Speed where you could do that all within a week (except for Azerite Items maybe).

But I do like the slower overall pace. Especially if you play rather casually and just know that 1-4 m+ is enough for the week if you dont find the time to do more.

[pfbe]

yeah, good idea. but running a m+10 in 202 item level seems not intended. so whats the intended way to improve when between 7 and 10 only drops 200 ???

use your valor points to upgrade your gear to ilvl 207. Then do all the +10's, and upgrade your gear to 213. Then do all the +15's, and upgrade your gear to 220. Then realize 9.1 is about to come out and all your effort is about to go down the drain, and do it all again. That's the game.

[Ausr]

I haven't stepped foot in a single raid and I have 4 toons at ~215ish and got KSM a few weeks ago. I'm not very good at this game but the problem you're describing could easily be solved if you, y'know, just played the fucking game.

- - - Updated - - -



Nevermind my previous advice. You've solved your own problem!

That seems to be the problem with a lot of people complaining how they can't get gear. They don't want to put any effort into the game to obtain the gear. Find a stable group, find a guild that fits you, learn to play the game and gain some skill.

Nope. It's the game's problem and they should be just handed the best gear.

[Echocho]

That seems to be the problem with a lot of people complaining how they can't get gear. They don't want to put any effort into the game to obtain the gear. Find a stable group, find a guild that fits you, learn to play the game and gain some skill.

Nope. It's the game's problem and they should be just handed the best gear.

That easier said than done if you have social anxiety or can't play on a schedule. You could also already have reached your skill ceiling. If you can't get any better how are you supposed to "git gud"?

[kamuimac]

oh, ofc i am willing. it seems more that the universe do not let me, without a guild or using tokens.

since so many ppl here obviously not reading the thread and steadily saying the same, regardless what i wrote (all the good „find a guild“ advices ^^) or if 20 other ppl already said the same here („greater vault“), after exp of 15 years of wow, this thread/thing just becomes boring slowly. but thx for the better, more rational and more differentiated posts. thx a lot.

so, to see what happens i tried the following the last 18 hours and here are my results (just the pure plain results, without any opinion on it):

- made my own HC raid group (nothing new here since i leaded a seminprogress guild in MoP). it took around 2 hours to get pug ppl, all with 205 or higher. i and another heal did around 4,5k hps average, tanks were mid class, we did 1st boss one shot. second (huntsman) i explained everything explicitly. tanks knew the fight. we wiped 5 times. 4 times regroup around 20-25min, even with lock. after 4,5 hours i stopped that „experiment“.

- next thing i tried was getting my +9 key to +10. looking for ~20mins for pug ppl. checked all on raider.io. hihhest i got had 1096, most were 500-700. in the end i took a 800 tank, 1 1096 dps and 2 ~700 dps. we died at second last boss once, a dps left. so i started same again at +8 (bc depleted key) 1096 guy stayed. rest was again around the same rio score as in first try. i healed like a bastard. but ppl often were dumb (necrotic week). kicks was ok‘ish with 27 kicks overall. i retried this experiment 4 times (key was 7 then again 8). after 3hours i stopped. my key is now +8 at the moment.

- so i tried 1 conquest professional grp (they didnt want me but late at night they found no heal, so iwas lucky) and 1 rated bg yolo group. healed 5,8k hps in ashran, we lost by a very small margin. all other BGs lost (we are alliance) without question. at the end the pro grp won 1 bg and i got the last points missing for 900 of trinket etc. i had 198 gear with 21% versa in pvp (luckily many of my PvE 200 items have versa). sadly my rating is at 612 now, far away from 1400, so i can not upgrade my 2 conquest items i have at the moment, with honor. i stopped the PvP experiment after 3-4 hours.

i do not wanna say anything with this results. this is just how the game was going the last day. and this felt rather „normal“ to me and my exp of the last 2 months.

i for myself slowly realize that this game is no longer for me. it seems that the most prominent and most posted solutions are:

- get a guild
- buy BoEs or boost via token/money
- wait 4-7 weeks to let the Great Vault do the job

no offense here. thats totally fine. this seems the way wow goes and after 15+ years of wow maybe this shall tell me that its enough and ok now. i am definetelly no longer the target audience for that game and thats ok. next time my sub is refreshed is in may/june. so i have time to decide if i should play all TBC stuff again (dont think so) or just call it a nice and long journey and go for good (most propably).

my biggest problem is, that i simply not have the time and not wanna invest it, in all the waiting stuff like regroup 20mins after every boss or wait 40mins to pvp. ofc a guild solves this problem (remember i play 15 years...) but since that is not an option for me, cause of fixed schedule, this means: invest HUGE time in waiting for things and sloooowly as chewing gum make progress. and this is just a bad relation between fun and investment for me.

but thx for the answers and mostly thx for the good ones that read the thread and answered differentiated and realistically/rational. behave all well.

SL is just pure garbage unless you are in top 5% of playerbase

you experience is exackly what 95% of playerbase is experienceing thats why already 60 % of playerbase left

i get it - mythic raiders will defend SL to death because their idea of game is just to log in and do raid but everyone else ? they qre having horrible time playing SL .

[Mouri Kogorou]

god forbid doing group content in an MMORPG to acquire better gear.

[huth]

That easier said than done if you have social anxiety or can't play on a schedule. You could also already have reached your skill ceiling. If you can't get any better how are you supposed to "git gud"?

In either of those cases you've simply reached the cap of what you can achieve, though.

[Echocho]

In either of those cases you've simply reached the cap of what you can achieve, though.

Right. And that cap didn't exist in BfA, Legion or even Wrath. It's a cap put into place exclusively for this expansion to screw over the casual playerbase.