where SL goes wrong to me (leaving out social issues)

[Swnem]

"Well designed daily hubs" so none of them? Cause no expansion had ALL of their dailies in one place. They all were based in different places in different zones.
And every expansion had atleast 1 rep which there dailies required you to travel entirely cross continent.

Oh now the example has to be "whole expansion dailies well designed". Your strawman-fu continues.

Btw that is a complete lie.
Skettis for example? Netherwing for example? Molten front for example? Heck i don't remember one that told you to go to another zone actually. You say argent tournament (is this about the ones that told you to go to the Ulduar zone that was right there next to the camp?
So, i guess you are trying to "win" on technicalities. Very dishonest.

[FelPlague]

Oh now the example has to be "whole expansion dailies well designed". Your strawman-fu continues.

Btw that is a complete lie.
Skettis for example? Netherwing for example? Molten front for example? Heck i don't remember one that told you to go to another zone actually. You say argent tournament (is this about the ones that told you to go to the Ulduar zone that was right there next to the camp?
So, i guess you are trying to "win" on technicalities. Very dishonest.

Skettis, funny you mention that... Cause some of their dailies send you all the way to blades edge mountain. Or did you not know that?
Netherwind has you moving around a fairly large area in the bottom right of shadowmoon, even going underground.
Molten front is literally across an entire zone.

Also it's hilarious you don't even know the argent tournament dailies like collecting the swords, and they you call storm peaks the "ulduar zone"

[Swnem]

Skettis, funny you mention that... Cause some of their dailies send you all the way to blades edge mountain. Or did you not know that?
Netherwind has you moving around a fairly large area in the bottom right of shadowmoon, even going underground.
Molten front is literally across an entire zone.

Also it's hilarious you don't even know the argent tournament dailies like collecting the swords, and they you call storm peaks the "ulduar zone"

You see baby, i played the game when it came out. Not 5 years ago. The quests you are talking about are rare. Probably the one time ones you get from advancing the reputation/aka the reputation campaign. But, that is what you want. You want an "exception" to prove you right. Even if there is, it doesn't change my point. Daily quests in a smaller area are better than WQ's that have you traveling all around, don't have a big satisfying turn in, are not something you can optimize every time you do it and don't tell a story, they are just the secondary quests many skip while leveling.
So, yes, i think well designed daily hubs are more satisfying. Get over it.

[Relapses]

The only dailies I actually enjoyed and looked forward to doing were ToT's. I don't know why but it just felt really satisfying to knock them out right before raid. I strongly disliked Timeless Isle and WoD's version of dailies (so much so I never even bothered to get flying in this expansion). I disliked Legion WQss even more. BfA's early WQs weren't as bad but 8.3 dailies felt like a chore. SL's WQs are the worst implementation yet and I hope to God that Blizzard backtracks on this deeply unpopular idea sometime before the expansion is over.

[sam86]

disagree with badge, agree with everything else
the problem isn't wf/tf sucks, the problem is blizz reduced loot drop to still make u go raid more like before, in old times u wish for the 0.001% (not exaggeration number, actual real one i think from Nighthold for a pally item, can't recall which) chance that best proc TF gear drop, now u wish for the 0.01% it f8cking drops in first place

- - - Updated - - -

You see baby, i played the game when it came out. Not 5 years ago. The quests you are talking about are rare. Probably the one time ones you get from advancing the reputation/aka the reputation campaign. But, that is what you want. You want an "exception" to prove you right. Even if there is, it doesn't change my point. Daily quests in a smaller area are better than WQ's that have you traveling all around, don't have a big satisfying turn in, are not something you can optimize every time you do it and don't tell a story, they are just the secondary quests many skip while leveling.
So, yes, i think well designed daily hubs are more satisfying. Get over it.

nice burn /10 char

[Jahaga]

Of course the in-game community is dead and its a massive problem and torghast is bad and the maw zone is terrible. Let's set those aside. Other issues to me.

1. World Quests got completely destroyed. People whined about them were they were perfectly fine and now they are ruined.

What about World Quests was changed that upsets you?

2. Lots of mogs but almost ALL of them are ugly which kills the desire to collect them. I think every single mog set locked behind covenant rep is ugly.

I 110% agree with you on this. The removal of class tier armor sets almost feels like they've given up on trying to create cool class-themed armor sets. Yet we're told their team continues to grow?

3. badge bookkeeping 1000% sucks compared to WF/TF. Another step backwards.

I'm not sure if this is referring to Valor? If so, it's somewhat of a step in the right direction, but it could have been done a lot better and should have been implemented from the start. WF/TF was the absolute worst change to loot ever. RNG on top of RNG on top of RNG...

4. raid settings are getting extremely repetitive with almost every single one of them in dark, dank caves or antiseptic buildings. We need more varied raid settings. On a beach, on a snow capped mountain or snowy woods, forests, etc.

Meh...

5. almost all of the characters in SL are constipated and wooden. I don't care about the first ones. I don't care about Zovaal. They spew out these bland, boring slow-witted diatribes that put me to sleep. Its a complete disaster. They are as horribly written and acted like characters from the Star Wars prequels. Characters like Baine, Anduin, the Winter Queen, Zovaal, the Primus all fit right in with Qui-Gon, Anakin, Padme, etc. Even Sire Denathrius is more about just spewing boring diatribes out his mouth than anything (I don't know why they praise him).

Bad writing and voice acting is nothing new from Blizzard. Believe me, I'm still butt hurt about how Diablo III turned out.

6. Looks like they will throw away KelThuzad as a minor miniboss instead of actually doing something with the buildup he's had over the years. Another waste. That's a billboard advertisement to not get invested into the new characters in SL.

I agree, they had an opportunity to bring back some old characters only to further screw up their story.

With all the being said, I'm enjoying this expansion more than the last. I stepped away from raiding and decided to focus entirely on Mythic+ Dungeons and I've been enjoying it a lot since launch.

[FelPlague]

You see baby, i played the game when it came out. Not 5 years ago. The quests you are talking about are rare. Probably the one time ones you get from advancing the reputation/aka the reputation campaign. But, that is what you want. You want an "exception" to prove you right. Even if there is, it doesn't change my point. Daily quests in a smaller area are better than WQ's that have you traveling all around, don't have a big satisfying turn in, are not something you can optimize every time you do it and don't tell a story, they are just the secondary quests many skip while leveling.
So, yes, i think well designed daily hubs are more satisfying. Get over it.

except they appeared every single day and were in the orgrilla area...
they were literally there every single day, they were not "rare"
also funny cause literally most of the daily quests of the past are literally the exact same thing, quests you did while leveling but again and again and again and again for weeks EVERY SINGLE DAY, atleast world quests rotate more often, daily quests yes they had randomness in some places, for example the argent tournoment, one day it was this, one day it was that, but 99% of the time it was exact same old same old.

[Swnem]

except they appeared every single day and were in the orgrilla area...
they were literally there every single day, they were not "rare"
also funny cause literally most of the daily quests of the past are literally the exact same thing, quests you did while leveling but again and again and again and again for weeks EVERY SINGLE DAY, atleast world quests rotate more often, daily quests yes they had randomness in some places, for example the argent tournoment, one day it was this, one day it was that, but 99% of the time it was exact same old same old.

Ogri'la was a different reputation and set of dailies. xD
They had an ending though. You got to exalted and done. You got to know that faction, you had a little story with them and experienced their culture more closely. I am pretty sure that the dailies weren't always the same, even because you would unlock more as you went up in reputation. Even if they are always the same, i don't find it a problem cause i can design the best way to quickly compete them, and once i am exalted, i am rewarded and i am done.

WQ's don't have a story, there is no feeling of accomplishment. They just are and you just do them as a hamster on a wheel. You just travel between them and complete for a small reward, but there is no journey there just a constant churn. In terms of variety it really isn't very different though. WQ's repeat a lot too. The difference is they are up at different times, so you can't even develop your own awesome and quick route.

[Piesor]

I just don't like the stupid timesink. Everything feels so stretched that it bores me to death. Gearing up by upgrading the same generic item again and again and again, stupid long traveltimes, WQs with multiple steps and freaking anima as reward, the maw without mount, mission tables 3.0 with crap rewards and zero impact on the metagame.... everything annoys me.
For me modern WoW does not work anymore, I feel completely disconnected to my characters and there is zero incentive for me to continue playing the game. It's like the game hast lost its soul for me.

[kodemonkee]

Shadowlands goes wrong for me when 100% of messages in trade chat is about boosting and 45 out of 62 Groups in raid finder (for HC) is boosting advertising.

I remember the good old days when groups looked for people in trade chat for the raid and you had to go up to the flight master at the top for gear check.

[FelPlague]

Ogri'la was a different reputation and set of dailies. xD
They had an ending though. You got to exalted and done. You got to know that faction, you had a little story with them and experienced their culture more closely. I am pretty sure that the dailies weren't always the same, even because you would unlock more as you went up in reputation. Even if they are always the same, i don't find it a problem cause i can design the best way to quickly compete them, and once i am exalted, i am rewarded and i am done.

WQ's don't have a story, there is no feeling of accomplishment. They just are and you just do them as a hamster on a wheel. You just travel between them and complete for a small reward, but there is no journey there just a constant churn. In terms of variety it really isn't very different though. WQ's repeat a lot too. The difference is they are up at different times, so you can't even develop your own awesome and quick route.

Someone didnt play tbc hilariously enough if they didnt know about the shatari skyguard dailies in orgrila.
go play TBC/wotlk/cata/mop/wod for abit, do some dailies, then we can discuss, for now your talking complete garbage.

[Swnem]

Someone didnt play tbc hilariously enough if they didnt know about the shatari skyguard dailies in orgrila.
go play TBC/wotlk/cata/mop/wod for abit, do some dailies, then we can discuss, for now your talking complete garbage.

What are you on about?! I said Skettis and Netherwing were examples of contained hubs that were well designed and you are talking about shatari and ogrila.

You seem to be feeling somewhat desperate to get out of this one. Maybe you should just move on. Don't butt into a convo you didn't follow and then go on tangents. It is clear the only point you have is "na-uh". Don't make me add you to ignore. Let's just move on.

[FelPlague]

What are you on about?! I said Skettis and Netherwing were examples of contained hubs that were well designed and you are talking about shatari and ogrila.

You seem to be feeling somewhat desperate to get out of this one. Maybe you should just move on. Don't butt into a convo you didn't follow and then go on tangents. It is clear the only point you have is "na-uh". Don't make me add you to ignore. Let's just move on.

"I said Skettis"
"you are talking about shatari"

Hey gunna be more simple here, please dont fill your ego when you dont even know what reps exist in wow.

cause i hate to inform you but the "skettis" rep you are talking about, is ACTUALLY called the shatari skyguard, and they had quests both in skettis, and over at the orgrila location in blades edge mountain.

again please spend some time PLAYING wow before discussing it.

[Swnem]

"I said Skettis"
"you are talking about shatari"

Hey gunna be more simple here, please dont fill your ego when you dont even know what reps exist in wow.

cause i hate to inform you but the "skettis" rep you are talking about, is ACTUALLY called the shatari skyguard, and they had quests both in skettis, and over at the orgrila location in blades edge mountain.

again please spend some time PLAYING wow before discussing it.

What does it matter what it's called?! I specifically talked about the dailies in Skettis as examples of dailies in a contained area. I did NOT say Shatari.
It does not matter what the reputation is called. I guess this is another syndrom of the "all dailies in an expansion have to be good". We already know they weren't, thus my point for well designed ones.
You don't get to bring your arbitrary redrawn goals to this.

You don't have a point and you are still talking about tangencial things because since the beginning you don't understand what was being talked about cause you just butted into the conversation. Just stop your tantrum. It's getting boring.
Not once have you actually debated the topic, just chasing gatcha moments. Sorry, not gonna work cause my point does not depend on anything WoW did. WoW did it alright sometimes, but often not.
What now? What are you gonna gatcha about now? Are you gonna be able to tell me why well designed dailies contained in a small area are worse than WQ's? Or is it gonna be more nonsense?

[FelPlague]

What does it matter what it's called?! I specifically talked about the dailies in Skettis as examples of dailies in a contained area. I did NOT say Shatari.
It does not matter what the reputation is called. I guess this is another syndrom of the "all dailies in an expansion have to be good". We already know they weren't, thus my point for well designed ones.
You don't get to bring your arbitrary redrawn goals to this.

You don't have a point and you are still talking about tangencial things because since the beginning you don't understand what was being talked about cause you just butted into the conversation. Just stop your tantrum. It's getting boring.
Not once have you actually debated the topic, just chasing gatcha moments. Sorry, not gonna work cause my point does not depend on anything WoW did. WoW did it alright sometimes, but often not.
What now? What are you gonna gatcha about now? Are you gonna be able to tell me why well designed dailies contained in a small area are worse than WQ's? Or is it gonna be more nonsense?

Wow, I am speechless. I just can't even wrap my head around it. Nah, I ain't even gunna try, goodluck.

[Doffen]

As long I got covenants, great tmogs to farm and fun characters to play I am happy even if I dont do Torghast, dont do the Maw except for Souls and very few WQs.

Looking forward to the new mega dungeon to spam!

[rowaasr13]

Shadowlands goes wrong for me when 100% of messages in trade chat is about boosting and 45 out of 62 Groups in raid finder (for HC) is boosting advertising.

At least you can fix trade chat with https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/sr13-antispam (yeah, shameless plug). Works best for English and strong for German as well. Less effective on other Latin-alphabet languages but somewhat cleans up those too.

[ashblond]

I have no idea who design the world quests in SL. but it is absolutely lol.

[Mightytasty]

I wish they would have scrapped the Maw entirely and spent those last 2 months of development making Torghast actually fun instead. Instead of one really awesome new feature, we get two half-baked ones.

Also, unpopular opinion but I don’t like the vault. Feels very mobile game-y to me. Would prefer if bosses just dropped more loot.

[Zka]

I have no idea who design the world quests in SL. but it is absolutely lol.

Pretty much everything seems to be done by trainees who have never seen or played the game before.