If they made a new class in the future, what would it be?

[username993720]

Yeah i imagined that and makes sense.



But its not something that always happen as most prominent Trolls necromancer did not became undead.

Though if i remember correctly, the whole "becoming undead because of the magic they wield" is more of a RPG Book info, so not really canon or at least not something that should be taken as a "general rule"

I guess you're right. It is an RPG info.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Pri...(Warcraft_III)

They are not priests. Priestess of the Moon can't heal either. As I said, they are literally just hunters who could cast Starfall.

Also, necromancers don't all become undead. They only become liches because it gives them more power. Plenty of races other than humans used necromancy and never became undead.

I know what a Priestess of the Moon is. Why do you think they are called Priestess? They are part of a religious sect, called Sisters of Elune:
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Sisterhood_of_Elune

"The Sisterhood of Elune (aka Sisters of Elune or simply the Sisters) could be the oldest night elf religious and magical order, predating the quel'dorei by some 2,000 years. As the name implies, they are an order of priestesses dedicated to the worship and servitude of the moon goddess, Elune. The Sisterhood is led by the High Priestess of Elune while the priestesses of Elune are the elite of the organization."

"The Sisterhood of Elune is the highest echelon of the priesthood that serves the goddess of the moon, Elune."

"All priests who served Elune were night elf women."

Tyrande's healing abilities:
Light of Elune, Everlasting Light, Mark of Mending, Elune's Chosen, Shadowstalk, Eyes of the Huntress.

You can say what you want til tomorrow. Doesn't make you right or versed in the lore.

As for Necromancers, i know now that was an RPG info.

[Ielenia]

The fact that Vanilla classes embody all sorts of types, while the expansion ones were taken from Warcraft 3 Hero units.

This is all sorts of wrong.

The paladin, for example, takes from hero units only, and the priest takes from a single non-hero unit only. Whereas the death knight takes from "all sorts of types": all four Scourge hero units (death knight, dreadlord, lich, crypt lord) and several non-hero units (banshee, necromancer, frost wyrm, gargoyle, ghoul).

[username993720]

This is all sorts of wrong.

The paladin, for example, takes from hero units only, and the priest takes from a single non-hero unit only. Whereas the death knight takes from "all sorts of types": all four Scourge hero units (death knight, dreadlord, lich, crypt lord) and several non-hero units (banshee, necromancer, frost wyrm, gargoyle, ghoul).

Assuming they are based on Warcraft 3.
You know, the Paladin was a unit in Warcraft 2, as well. The Priest even featured in Warcraft 1.

[TheRevenantHero]

I guess you're right. It is an RPG info.



I know what a Priestess of the Moon is. Why do you think they are called Priestess? They are part of a religious sect, called Sisters of Elune:
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Sisterhood_of_Elune

"The Sisterhood of Elune (aka Sisters of Elune or simply the Sisters) could be the oldest night elf religious and magical order, predating the quel'dorei by some 2,000 years. As the name implies, they are an order of priestesses dedicated to the worship and servitude of the moon goddess, Elune. The Sisterhood is led by the High Priestess of Elune while the priestesses of Elune are the elite of the organization."

"The Sisterhood of Elune is the highest echelon of the priesthood that serves the goddess of the moon, Elune."

"All priests who served Elune were night elf women."

Tyrande's healing abilities:
Light of Elune, Everlasting Light, Mark of Mending, Elune's Chosen, Shadowstalk, Eyes of the Huntress.

You can say what you want til tomorrow. Doesn't make you right or versed in the lore.

As for Necromancers, i know now that was an RPG info.

Priestess is also a TITLE. Priestess of the Moon =/= playable priests. They are religious servants of Elune, making their title priestess. As for their abilities, they are hunters who can cast Starfall. They have absolutely no healing abilities whatsoever. As for Tyrande, she is a priest/hunter/druid. So using her as an example is asinine since lore characters don't play by the same rules. Another prime example is Anduin using mass resurrection, wielding swords, and wearing plate as a priest.

The only person who has absolutely no idea what they're talking about when it comes to lore is you.

[Ielenia]

Assuming they are based on Warcraft 3.
You know, the Paladin was a unit in Warcraft 2, as well. The Priest even featured in Warcraft 1.

And you know what? You're still wrong, because they're not "all sorts of types". It's just one single "type": paladin units. Priest units. Mage units. They are not "all sorts of types" like the death knight, who takes after ghouls, gargoyles, nerubians, etc.

The paladin? Single "type": takes only after paladins. Priest? Single "type": only after priests. Mage? Again, single "type": only after mages.

[username993720]

Priestess is also a TITLE. Priestess of the Moon =/= playable priests. They are religious servants of Elune, making their title priestess. As for their abilities, they are hunters who can cast Starfall. They have absolutely no healing abilities whatsoever. As for Tyrande, she is a priest/hunter/druid. So using her as an example is asinine since lore characters don't play by the same rules. Another prime example is Anduin using mass resurrection, wielding swords, and wearing plate as a priest.

The only person who has absolutely no idea what they're talking about when it comes to lore is you.

Because they are not represented in the Priest class, through its abilities. You know, like Voodoo religion, for example. They've only focused on Light and Void aspects.

Tyrande is the absolute representative for the class. So, you can't just scuff her off because she doesn't fit your narrative.

Again with the Anduin lie... They guy is a Priest through and through. His weapon and Armor are cosmetic in HotS. He does not have any melee abilities and he is not a Paladin. Armor is not a classification when it comes to classes. Tauren Chieftains wear wood and leather, yet they are Warriors.

[TheRevenantHero]

Because they are not represented in the Priest class, through its abilities. You know, like Voodoo religion, for example. They've only focused on Light and Void aspects.

Tyrande is the absolute representative for the class. So, you can't just scuff her off because she doesn't fit your narrative.

Again with the Anduin lie... They guy is a Priest through and through. His weapon and Armor are cosmetic in HotS. He does not have any melee abilities and he is not a Paladin. Armor is not a classification when it comes to classes. Tauren Chieftains wear wood and leather, yet they are Warriors.

I can scuff her because she has abilities from hunter, druid, and priest. She's literally three fucking classes based on her abilities. And once again, priestess is a TITLE. I'll say it again since you refuse to read: Priestesses of the Moon are just hunters who can cast Starfall. Nothing else unique about them.

You are mentioning HotS and that's 100% irrelevant. He wears plate and uses a sword, two things priests can't do, IN WORLD OF WARCRAFT. He was actively cutting down Horde in the announcement cinematic for BfA. So stop bringing up HotS because it has nothing to do with this. Lore characters have never and will never play by player rules. Anduin is priest/paladin/warrior judging by his abilities he's used in game and in cinematics for WoW.

[username993720]

And you know what? You're still wrong, because they're not "all sorts of types". It's just one single "type": paladin units. Priest units. Mage units. They are not "all sorts of types" like the death knight, who takes after ghouls, gargoyles, nerubians, etc.

The paladin? Single "type": takes only after paladins. Priest? Single "type": only after priests. Mage? Again, single "type": only after mages.

Types, meaning different sources.
The Paladin, indeed, draws from Paladin units, only.
The Priest draws from Blood/High elven Priest unit, Human Cleric and Orc Necrolyte.
The Mage draws from the Archmage, Blood Mage, Sorceress, Mage and Conjurer.

So, while you could attribute Death Knight to its Warcraft 2 incarnation, the Demon Hunter and Monk did not have any incarnations in WC2, nor WC1.

I can scuff her because she has abilities from hunter, druid, and priest. She's literally three fucking classes based on her abilities. And once again, priestess is a TITLE. I'll say it again since you refuse to read: Priestesses of the Moon are just hunters who can cast Starfall. Nothing else unique about them.

You are mentioning HotS and that's 100% irrelevant. He wears plate and uses a sword, two things priests can't do, IN WORLD OF WARCRAFT. He was actively cutting down Horde in the announcement cinematic for BfA. So stop bringing up HotS because it has nothing to do with this. Lore characters have never and will never play by player rules. Anduin is priest/paladin/warrior judging by his abilities he's used in game and in cinematics for WoW.

That's because she's a Priestess of the Moon. It is composed of a Ranger (Hunter), Priestess (Healing) and Lunar spells.

"Brewmaster is a title, for those who take up the cooking profession. It is not a Monk" - that is your logic.

Repeating a lie does not make it true.

Anduin is not a Paladin nor a Warrior. He has never used any of their abilities. He is even categorized in the WoWpedia page as a Priest and confirmed to be one by Alex afriasabi and Blizzcon Q&A.

[TheRevenantHero]

Types, meaning different sources.
The Paladin, indeed, draws from Paladin units, only.
The Priest draws from Blood/High elven Priest unit, Human Cleric and Orc Necrolyte.
The Mage draws from the Archmage, Blood Mage, Sorceress, Mage and Conjurer.

So, while you could attribute Death Knight to its Warcraft 2 incarnation, the Demon Hunter and Monk did not have any incarnations in WC2, nor WC1.



That's because she's a Priestess of the Moon. It is composed of a Ranger (Hunter), Priestess (Healing) and Lunar spells.

"Brewmaster is a title, for those who take up the cooking profession. It is not a Monk" - that is your logic.

Repeating a lie does not make it true.

Anduin is not a Paladin nor a Warrior. He has never used any of their abilities. He is even categorized in the WoWpedia page as a Priest and confirmed to be one by Alex afriasabi and Blizzcon Q&A.

No it fucking isn't. Tyrande is the ONLY example of it. All other examples of Priestesses of the Moon are simply hunters. Nothing more.

And it doesn't fucking matter what they call him because he doesn't play by player rules. He's a priest yet he uses a sword and wears plate armor. Sure he is considered a priest but he does things player priests simply can't do. That's what you're incapable of grasping. Using NPCs for examples of why something should be a class is exceptionally asinine.

[Triceron]

Jesus christ, you write a lot. You know that?

You only noticed now? Lolwut?

I thought you're not into looking for patterns. Now, it is viable to consider 'evidence the devs have outlined'?

By patterns I mean observed correlations to events which aren't actually talked about by the Devs.

By evidence I mean actual things the Devs have spoken oit about having done or considering, whether it be post mortems or interviews.

As I said, I am not arguing against the possibility of any class in general, but if you ask me how and why I rank things in tiers, it is based on dev information like having a class that fits a story and setting of an expansion, and also considering what potential future content is likely or unlikely.

There isn't. Never claimed it was the next class.
They need an expansion like Pandaria, which no one thought would come.

Right. And as I said, I think the chance of that happening is extremely low. My opinion here, since you asked me why I consider these B tier. This isn't evidence or proof, this is me explaining my position for Blademaster.

I personally think there are classes more relevant to upcoming content than a Blademaster. It doesn't make much sense to me to suddenly bridge in a Japanese styled hidden nation on Azeroth where Blademasters might happen to come from, even though they're all culturally derived from the Burning Blade.

Elven story, perhaps. Like ancient Zin-Azshari and Dire Maul, as depicted in the Chronicles.

Sure, but overall there isn't really much high demand for Sea Witch in general. I personally view that Blizzard will do a safe pick on something that is well established in the minds of the community.

As I said, they passed on Dark Rangers and Necromancers which are way more well established, only to make Sea Witch? I don't think it is appealing enough on its own. I can be wrong about this opinion, but I am basing my judgement on the lack of interest overall given by both Blizzard and the community in regards to an actual Sea Witch class.

Azshara is, pretty much, still relevant, as she "intend to claim the real throne of power" for herself at the end of the encounter in Ny'alotha.
Blizzard wanted to add Nagas for a long time. Once in classic WoW, and once mentioned by Chris Metzen.
I could see the Elven story kinda fitting there.
Besides, me not coming with great ideas doesn't mean Blizzard can't or that it is off the table. They could surprise us, out of nowhere, with expansions like MoP.

We just had Azshara front and center last expansion. I doubt she will be back any time soon after this.

I agree Naga are something people still want, so there is merit in the idea. As much merit as Tinkers and Dragonsworn though? No, not in my mind.

If you can see the Tinker, then you can see the Alchemist as well. It was translated into Engineering, as well, after all. A Technology-based expansion, like Undermine or whatever, revolving around the rivalry of Gnome and Goblins would be one example.
The hero associated with it would be Noggenfogger, as in Reforged he is used to represent that unit.

Tech has a broader scope than Alchemy. Undermine is tech-based, we know this. Alchemy isn't a Gnome theme, so you don't actually get that same rivalry.

On top of this, I consider K'aresh as a potential expansion in the near future, and the Ethereals also have toes to technology which is applicable to Tinkers. Alchemy not so much.

Tinker just fits a much broader range, and the reason I regard it high is the mech suit. Literally the mech suit is what makes this stand out from the rest. Guns and explosives? We have that already with hunters and engineering. What actually makes Tinkers unique and distinct is going to be the mech. Alchemy has nothing as flashy that is comparable, honestly speaking.

And I'm not talking down Alchemy here, I am giving my honest opinion of why I value Tinker as having more merit as a class. I prefer Alchemy profession over Engineering, I have a Sandstone Drake from Cata, I have multiple Alchemist characters from my Druid with the drake or my Troll Priest which I roleplay as a Witchdoctor woth Alchemy themes. I am not against the Alchemist concept, but I openly realize it simply does not reach the potential of a Tinker class.

If we are talking about Alchemist after a Tinker is already in game, maybe, sure. But any time before and many would be left to question 'why Alchemist over a Tinker?' amd if after then it'd be 'Tinker already jas a chemical healing spec, why did we need another science-based class?'. It doesn't make sense to me unless we're talking about something like class skins where any class can get shoehorned in without considering logistics of marketting or story themes or thematic overlap with existing classes etc.

Not necessarily. Hero classes, maybe. Not basic ones. Look at the Monk class. How epic was that? associating it with a Blizzard's April Fools joke race.

Personal opinion - Pandaren and Monks were a failed experiment. Monks are arguably one of the least played classes in the game, and Pandaren in general are one of the least played races. Pandaren have taken a complete backseat to the lore, and Monks haven't really been very relevant lately; but again, personal opinion. I feel like it is something they would want to avoid repeating in the future, banking on the April Fools stuff that was so successful back in WC3. I would feel they would want to model new classes on the more successful Death Knight or Demon Hunter.

Tinker falls into this trap, which is why I do not support the idea of Gnome and Goblin only Tinkers. If they can disassociate some of that April Fools comic relief from the Tinker and give some epic options, I will be mich more on board. As I said, I give Tinker merit because the Mech has a lot of potential appeal, and they have strong thematic relevance to the story, amd they are fairly well recognized through Mekkatorque and the Goblins. That doesn't mean I think Tinker is flawless or without drawbacks compared to other class concepts, it is in high position because it has stronger potential and greater merit.

We can't say for sure why. They told us that nothing fitted, but we know that Dark Danger and Necromancer would. I'm guessing they couldn't categorize it as a basic class, like the Monk. Since we had a Hero class last time, a basic one is due. Or, they just didn't have time and resources to include one alongside the features of the expansion. I don't, really, know...

This is the first indication of 'no more classes' to me. I hope its not the case, but as I said, best not to grasp on to observed patterns.

The problem with you and Te riz is you both assume Blizzard will add these 2 classes and be done with it. Even though we know it's one of their main money-making features. I don't say they are due next expansion, but i'm talking in general about the future and what it might hold. Even in 20 years from now.

And that is your problem.

You took my words and argument and formulated a bogus conclusion. Add 2 classes and be done with it? Just because I said classes are B-tier?

Did you not consider that my rankings relate to a 20-yr period too?

Think hard about this. Did I say Blademaster, Warden and all those concepts *would not be added* to the game? No, I never did. So why did you come to this conclusion? I said they are B-tier and in lower regard than Tinker and Dragonsworn at the moment (in my opinion), and that means those two take a higher priority because of multiple factors. Popularity and familiarity to the public, which leads to demand and satisfying the Marketting department as well as the internal sales pitches. Thematic relevance to future content, which we know has Undermine, K'aresh and Dragon Isles all in consideration. I've ranked based on what is most relevant in the upcoming storyline towards the fight against the Void Lords, which we know is coming.

If Blizzard wants to make a Naga expansion with Sea Witches, then they absolutely could, but it'd be something that is not openly predictable or something that is in very high demand right now. It'd be as out-of-left field not-expected as adding an Ogre Necromancer race and class combo just because they added a boss of that in Exiles Reach and we still have Cult of the Damned and the Ogre Empire still at large in the lore. It doesn't really have any real relevance to the bigger picture story to me, so it's less predictable, and thus lower on my personal list. Again, I'm talking about merits and potential, and the problem with an idea like Sea Witch is that no one seems to really care right now about that particular class. So if Blizzard wants to add the class, they could, but they have a more difficult time marketting it too since no one seems to be asking for one right now. That's how I see things and that's my opinion right now. B-tier concepts are what I consider having less relevance to the current state of WoW. Blizzard could add them any time, but nothing stands out to picking them over a more potentially relevant class.

I don't see reddit posts for the Sea Witch that garnered 8k upvotes like the Dragonsworn, I don't see it ranked very high in the upcoming class polls, I don't even see it being discussed or posted with ideas like we often do with other classes like Blademaster, Necromancer and Bard. So where exactly do you think I should put the Sea Witch in rankings? As an A-tier possibility? You're free to do so if you wish, but since you asked for my opinion, I have responded that it's a B-tier pick, after the Tinker, Dragonsworn and *even unlikely* the Bard. The Bard has more demand right now than the Sea Witch, and that is something important to consider. Perhaps Blizzard could do something and merge the two concepts together, who knows.

Actually, i am kind of a fan of the Tinker. If Te riz wouldn't have shoved it down our throats, i wouldn't seem so against it in this thread. Other than the Tinker (and Alchemist), i only think Shadow Hunters are exotic and interesting enough. Shaman, clearly, do not do them justice.

I agree with your sentiment. Had not I gone through years of DH vs Tinker, I might have a better opinion of Tinkers, maybe. And yes, I am very open to the idea of a Voodoo related class. There was a fake leak pre-Legion for the Dark Prophet, and a Shadow Stalker class that was a mix of Dark Ranger and Shadow Hunter. While I hated the idea at first, I grew to really like it, because it opened up the Voodoo theme that we could really explore through a class. I think there is potential there still.

Again, basing it on popularity would have given us Dark Rangers because of Sylvanas fans. This site's polls are not, really, a tool for measurement.

Which is why when they weren't added, everything on my list shifted.

I think Blizzard is taking more consideration into what becomes a class. If a Dark Ranger isn't even picked, then what are the chances of a niche Blademaster or a niche Alchemist? Dark Ranger has far more potential than both IMO, and if Blizzard didn't pick this up, then I imagine they are waiting on a stronger concept with more potential overall. But let me be clear - I am not making this as an argument for-or-against any class concept, I am framing this part as my personal opinion and interpretation of events. I'm not using this as evidence of my rankings list; this simply happens to be what I observed and I'm explaining a personal view which I don't expect anyone else to agree with or share my sentiments on.

We have little evidence to conclude what other classes would fit right now. If we know about hints of a Japanese styled nation in the future, sure my ranks would change to value Blademaster higher. If Blizzard starts throwing more hints towards Naga wanting to join the Alliance/Horde, then sure I'd put Sea Witch in higher consideration. I simply don't see much of that happening in the near-future, so those concepts will likely come after what I feel is more relevant right now. As I said, I don't discount any class concept, and even your bogus Slavemaster example is completely viable given that Blizzard hints strongly enough for it and people are openly accepting of a Slavemaster class.

No, if you don't consider the Dark Ranger alone. You gotta see the bigger picture. Sylvanas has been hyped up since Legion, with her featuring in the expansion cinematic trailers 3 times, already, (and in Reckoning) showcasing her abilities in action. Her character, pretty much, drove the story forward these last few expansion. She's gonna have boss abilities in Chains of Domination which Blizzard could draw on. Tyrande has been relevant in these couple of expansions. She was given the Night Warrior lore, out of nowhere, to expand the Priestess of the Moon role. Now, it's either they are gonna combine that with Sea Witch, because of the whole archery/magic thing, or Wardens because of Dark Wardens. I'm not quite sure. But, an Elven expansion featuring all 3 could totally come, as i said, with Zin-Azshari and Dire Maul as depicted in Chronicles, and Azshara being the antagonist. Much like how Night Elves, Blood elves and High elves combined forces to take down Elisande.

Well, we're running into 'oooh I want that' territory if we're talking about combined classes and whatnot.

Where is the indication that this would happen? There's no connection between any of these classes.

And I am not disagreeing with you, since I see merit and potential in a combo class, but the reality is that it's not very likely to happen since we're not seeing Blizzard move towards connecting these concepts. It's wish fulfillment we're talking about. I could talk about a Ranger Class that is based on the 3 Windrunner sisters; Arcane for Vereesa, Void for Alleria and Dark for Sylvanas; but even as a concept there's nothing indicating a union of the sisters. There's merit and potential in the idea, but it's not relevant to the story or to Blizzard's plans at all. They aren't moving towards bridging those concepts. I don't think people are expecting it either, which plays into the whole concept of choosing a familiar and popular class to market a new expansion around.

It's better to capitalize on one understood Class concept that is easy to understand than it is to mix a bunch of loosely-related concepts together and pass it off as something new.

A Dragon Isles expansion is due, correct. But, it might bring along with it a covenant style of feature, based on the 5 aspects. Or, it could bring a Draconic race.

And that's a fair possibility.

It's just not one that would exclude the addition of a class. As I said before, we can't use any evidence to *deny* any class from existing.

The rankings I use are based on what evidence we know, and certain concepts will be lower due to the *lack of evidence* that they would be relevant in the near future.

My rankings aren't set in stone. They shift with each new piece of information we get, and I hope I explained that clearly. As I said, Dragonsworn was not even on the list until BFA mentioned Dragon Isles, and only after Shadowlands was announced without a Dark Ranger or Necromancer class did it jump even higher on the rankings taking their spot. If we learn more about Azshara real soon, then maybe Sea Witch could be higher too.

Exactly. Blizzard's own actions. Which, have shown a direction towards WC3 heroes. I didn't make this up, out of nowhere.

Except we know from the devs themselves that they didn't set out to translate WC3 heroes. They didn't make a MK hero, they made a Warrior hero that represents MK's and Chieftains and Orc Berserkers.

Even the Monk class is a considerable RPG archetype which simply has the Brewmaster as an aspect of it. The fact that it is not a 'Brewmaster Class' with Mistweaving and Windwalking as specs shows that there is more to this class than just sourcing the WC3 Hero.

As I said, there's more to their actions than just translating WC3 heroes.

[Ielenia]

Types, meaning different sources.

"Type" is not the same thing as "source".

The Priest draws from Blood/High elven Priest unit, Human Cleric and Orc Necrolyte.

"No" to the necrolyte, since it's a necromancer unit, not a cleric unit, but other than that, I stand by what I said: they're all priest units.

The Mage draws from the Archmage, Blood Mage, Sorceress, Mage and Conjurer.

Like above, they're all mage units.

So, while you could attribute Death Knight to its Warcraft 2 incarnation, the Demon Hunter and Monk did not have any incarnations in WC2, nor WC1.

The demon hunter still disproves you (along with priests, paladins and mages) because they all draw from the same type.

[LemonDemonGirl]

I agree with your sentiment. Had not I gone through years of DH vs Tinker, I might have a better opinion of Tinkers, maybe. And yes, I am very open to the idea of a Voodoo related class. There was a fake leak pre-Legion for the Dark Prophet, and a Shadow Stalker class that was a mix of Dark Ranger and Shadow Hunter. While I hated the idea at first, I grew to really like it, because it opened up the Voodoo theme that we could really explore through a class. I think there is potential there still.

Ok, that sounds amazing! Do you know if there's still any pictures or threads for it? I'd love to see it!

[Imperator4321]

"No" to the necrolyte, since it's a necromancer unit, not a cleric unit, but other than that, I stand by what I said: they're all priest units.

Just wanted to add the Priest class having contrasting Holy and Shadow powers is probably inspired by the cleric class from D&D historically having access to "positive energy" spells (like "cure light wounds") and "negative energy" spells (like "inflict light wounds") or having class abilities like "channel positive or negative energy" similar to how the WC3 Death Knight lorewise and gameplay wise is heavily inspired by the fallen-paladin/anti-paladin concept popularized by D&D

Basically holy/priest/cleric classes having access to unholy/evil abilities in addition to their holy/good ones isn't anything new, there is a slight variation in that the "evil/unholy" powers are mind/psychic themed though.

When discussing WoW classes some consideration should be granted to the genre tropes and conventions surrounding WoW, in addition to prior games like WC3.

[Triceron]

Ok, that sounds amazing! Do you know if there's still any pictures or threads for it? I'd love to see it!

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...han-and-reddit

This is what's left of it that I could find. Just google up the Dark Prophet or Shadowstalker class.

[username993720]

No it fucking isn't. Tyrande is the ONLY example of it. All other examples of Priestesses of the Moon are simply hunters. Nothing more.

And it doesn't fucking matter what they call him because he doesn't play by player rules. He's a priest yet he uses a sword and wears plate armor. Sure he is considered a priest but he does things player priests simply can't do. That's what you're incapable of grasping. Using NPCs for examples of why something should be a class is exceptionally asinine.

She is the representative of the class. Who cares about other, unknown and negligible NPCs?

And, by the way:

Moon Priestess Maestra:
Heal — Calls upon Holy magic to heal an ally.
Holy Fire — Consumes an enemy in flames, burning it and inflicting additional Fire damage every 2 sec. over 8 sec.
Holy Smite — Smites an enemy, inflicting Holy damage.

Priestesses of the Moon (Ahn'qiraj):
Mass Healing — Healing between 4163 and 4837 every 2 seconds.

Armor and Weapons do not matter if they're not embodied in the abilities. Thrall wears the Doomplate armor. He's still a Shaman. Baine doesn't wear plate. He's still a Warrior.

By patterns I mean observed correlations to events which aren't actually talked about by the Devs.

By evidence I mean actual things the Devs have spoken oit about having done or considering, whether it be post mortems or interviews.

As I said, I am not arguing against the possibility of any class in general, but if you ask me how and why I rank things in tiers, it is based on dev information like having a class that fits a story and setting of an expansion, and also considering what potential future content is likely or unlikely.

They, also, said Tinker feels too whimsical. Do you believe them?
You have to learn and take their words as a grain of salt. Because, as i said, PR require you to provide an answer that would satisfy the crowd without revealing their true intentions.

Right. And as I said, I think the chance of that happening is extremely low, making this class extremely low chance. My opinion here, since you asked me why I consider these B tier. This isn't evidence or proof, this is me explaining my position for Blademaster.

I also personally think there are other classes more fitting for future content than a singular Blademaster class. My personal views are that this is a better class to unveil along other class concepts, since it doesn't make much sense to me to suddenly bridge in a Japanese styled hidden nation on Azeroth where Blademasters happen to come from even though they're all culturally derived from the Burning Blade.

We, also, didn't expect a second Burning Legion expansion, a second Death expansion, or to visit Outland again, as Draenor. So, another MoP is possible.

Not necessarily as a whole class. Maybe a spec inside a class.
That's where you're wrong. Because it doesn't have to be Orc Blademasters from the Burning Blade clan. It could be Ankoan and their Waveblade clan.

Sure, but overall there isn't really much high demand for Sea Witch in general. I personally view that Blizzard will do a safe pick on something that is well established in the minds of the community.

As I said, they passed on Dark Rangers and Necromancers which are way more well established, only to make Sea Witch? I don't think it is appealing enough on its own. I can be wrong about this opinion, but I am basing my judgement on the lack of interest overall given by both Blizzard and the community in regards to an actual Sea Witch class.

I don't see a reason to discard it, when it fits, quite well, with a Dark Ranger and Priestess of the Moon.

And no, they didn't discard it for a Sea Witch. Not alone, per se. The Priestess of the Moon, also, wouldn't fit Shadowlands. Unless Elune is a Death entity. I Wanna say Wardens, too. But, there are undead ones called Dark Wardens.

We just had Azshara front and center last expansion. I doubt she will be back any time soon after this.

I agree Naga are something people still want, so there is merit in the idea. As much merit as Tinkers and Dragonsworn though? No, not in my mind.

They left her character arc open, though.

Not in my mind, either. But, i'm not talking here about personal rankings.

Tech has a broader scope than Alchemy. Undermine is tech-based, we know this. Alchemy isn't a Gnome theme, so you don't actually get that same rivalry.

On top of this, I consider K'aresh as a potential expansion in the near future, and the Ethereals also have toes to technology which is applicable to Tinkers. Alchemy not so much.

Tinker just fits a much broader range, and the reason I regard it high is the mech suit. Literally the mech suit is what makes this stand out from the rest. Guns and explosives? We have that already with hunters and engineering. What actually makes Tinkers unique and distinct is going to be the mech. Alchemy has nothing as flashy that is comparable, honestly speaking.

And I'm not talking down Alchemy here, I am giving my honest opinion of why I value Tinker as having more merit as a class. I prefer Alchemy profession over Engineering, I have a Sandstone Drake from Cata, I have multiple Alchemist characters from my Druid with the drake or my Troll Priest which I roleplay as a Witchdoctor woth Alchemy themes. I am not against the Alchemist concept, but I openly realize it simply does not reach the potential of a Tinker class.

If we are talking about Alchemist after a Tinker is already in game, maybe, sure. But any time before and many would be left to question 'why Alchemist over a Tinker?' amd if after then it'd be 'Tinker already jas a chemical healing spec, why did we need another science-based class?'. It doesn't make sense to me unless we're talking about something like class skins where any class can get shoehorned in without considering logistics of marketting or story themes or thematic overlap with existing classes etc.

I didn't say it wouldn't come together with the Tinker, as part of a scientist class, or something. You just assumed i did.
And Alchemy is part of the Gnome theme. Ever heard of Potion Doc?
I agree on Ka'resh. It is long overdue. Probably, as part of the Light/Void expansion.

Personal opinion - Pandaren and Monks were a failed experiment. Monks are arguably one of the least played classes in the game, and Pandaren in general are one of the least played races. I feel like it is something they would want to avoid repeating in the future, banking on the April Fools stuff that was ao successful back in WC3.

Tinker falls into this category which contributes to why I personally do not support the idea of Gnome and Goblin only Tinkers. If they can disassociate some of that April Fools comic relief from the Tinker and give some epic options, I will be mich more on board. As I said, I give Tinker merit because the Mech has a lot of potential appeal, and they have strong thematic relevance to the story, amd they are fairly well recognized through Mekkatorque and the Goblins. That doesn't mean I think Tinker is flawless or without drawbacks compared to other class concepts, it is in high position because it has stronger potential and greater merit.

I don't know why you all think everything needs to be epic, all the time?
What's wrong with some fun and quirky classes? That is the uniqueness of Gnomes and Goblins. If everyone was the same, this game would be hella boring.

This is the first indication of 'no more classes' to me. I hope its not the case, but as I said, best not to grasp on to observed patterns.

Yeah.... no. They, probably, just couldn't afford themselves to add a new class every other expansion.

And that is your problem.

You took my words and argument and formulated a bogus conclusion. Add 2 classes and be done with it? Just because I said classes are B-tier?

Did you not consider that my rankings relate to a 20-yr period too?

Think hard about this. Did I say Blademaster, Warden and all those concepts *would not be added* to the game? No, I never did. So why did you come to this conclusion? I said they are B-tier and in lower regard than Tinker and Dragonsworn at the moment (in my opinion), and that means those two take a higher priority because of multiple factors. Popularity and familiarity to the public, which leads to demand and satisfying the Marketting department as well as the internal sales pitches. Thematic relevance to future content, which we know has Undermine, K'aresh and Dragon Isles all in consideration. I've ranked based on what is most relevant in the upcoming storyline towards the fight against the Void Lords, which we know is coming.

If Blizzard wants to make a Naga expansion with Sea Witches, then they absolutely could, but it'd be something that is not openly predictable or something that is in very high demand right now. It'd be as out-of-left field not-expected as adding an Ogre Necromancer race and class combo just because they added a boss of that in Exiles Reach and we still have Cult of the Damned and the Ogre Empire still at large in the lore. It doesn't really have any real relevance to the bigger picture story to me, so it's less predictable, and thus lower on my personal list. Again, I'm talking about merits and potential, and the problem with an idea like Sea Witch is that no one seems to really care right now about that particular class. So if Blizzard wants to add the class, they could, but they have a more difficult time marketting it too since no one seems to be asking for one right now. That's how I see things and that's my opinion right now. B-tier concepts are what I consider having less relevance to the current state of WoW. Blizzard could add them any time, but nothing stands out to picking them over a more potentially relevant class.

I don't see reddit posts for the Sea Witch that garnered 8k upvotes like the Dragonsworn, I don't see it ranked very high in the upcoming class polls, I don't even see it being discussed or posted with ideas like we often do with other classes like Blademaster, Necromancer and Bard. So where exactly do you think I should put the Sea Witch in rankings? As an A-tier possibility? You're free to do so if you wish, but since you asked for my opinion, I have responded that it's a B-tier pick, after the Tinker, Dragonsworn and *even unlikely* the Bard. The Bard has more demand right now than the Sea Witch, and that is something important to consider. Perhaps Blizzard could do something and merge the two concepts together, who knows.

I thought you ranked them by their possibility, not by their position on the waiting list.

I agree with your sentiment. Had not I gone through years of DH vs Tinker, I might have a better opinion of Tinkers, maybe. And yes, I am very open to the idea of a Voodoo related class. There was a fake leak pre-Legion for the Dark Prophet, and a Shadow Stalker class that was a mix of Dark Ranger and Shadow Hunter. While I hated the idea at first, I grew to really like it, because it opened up the Voodoo theme that we could really explore through a class. I think there is potential there still.

I, personally, don't see the Shadow Hunter being mixed with the Dark Ranger. Only with the Witch Doctor.

Which is why when they weren't added, everything on my list shifted.

I think Blizzard is taking more consideration into what becomes a class. If a Dark Ranger isn't even picked, then what are the chances of a niche Blademaster or a niche Alchemist? Dark Ranger has far more potential than both IMO, and if Blizzard didn't pick this up, then I imagine they are waiting on a stronger concept with more potential overall. But let me be clear - I am not making this as an argument for-or-against any class concept, I am framing this part as my personal opinion and interpretation of events. I'm not using this as evidence of my rankings list; this simply happens to be what I observed and I'm explaining a personal view which I don't expect anyone else to agree with or share my sentiments on.

We have little evidence to conclude what other classes would fit right now. If we know about hints of a Japanese styled nation in the future, sure my ranks would change to value Blademaster higher. If Blizzard starts throwing more hints towards Naga wanting to join the Alliance/Horde, then sure I'd put Sea Witch in higher consideration. I simply don't see much of that happening in the near-future, so those concepts will likely come after what I feel is more relevant right now. As I said, I don't discount any class concept, and even your bogus Slavemaster example is completely viable given that Blizzard hints strongly enough for it and people are openly accepting of a Slavemaster class.

If everything on your list shifted, then it's kind of an affirmation that you shouldn't predict those based on popularity.

Well, we're running into 'oooh I want that' territory if we're talking about combined classes and whatnot.

Where is the indication that this would happen? There's no connection between any of these classes.

And I am not disagreeing with you, since I see merit and potential in a combo class, but the reality is that it's not very likely to happen since we're not seeing Blizzard move towards connecting these concepts. It's wish fulfillment we're talking about. I could talk about a Ranger Class that is based on the 3 Windrunner sisters; Arcane for Vereesa, Void for Alleria and Dark for Sylvanas; but even as a concept there's nothing indicating a union of the sisters. There's merit and potential in the idea, but it's not relevant to the story or to Blizzard's plans at all. They aren't moving towards bridging those concepts. I don't think people are expecting it either, which plays into the whole concept of choosing a familiar and popular class to market a new expansion around.

It's better to capitalize on one understood Class concept that is easy to understand than it is to mix a bunch of loosely-related concepts together and pass it off as something new.

It's not because i want it.
When i analysed the Warcraft 3 Hero pool for potential new classes, there were 3 wielding a bow and using magical attacks. I thought to myself, aside from the fact that they lack in game, that it would be a waste to add them separately. They are all, after all, based on the Ranger archetype and are all from Elven ancestry. So, it made sense for me to combine the three.

And that's a fair possibility.

It's just not one that would exclude the addition of a class. As I said before, we can't use any evidence to *deny* any class from existing.

The rankings I use are based on what evidence we know, and certain concepts will be lower due to the *lack of evidence* that they would be relevant in the near future.

My rankings aren't set in stone. They shift with each new piece of information we get, and I hope I explained that clearly. As I said, Dragonsworn was not even on the list until BFA mentioned Dragon Isles, and only after Shadowlands was announced without a Dark Ranger or Necromancer class did it jump even higher on the rankings taking their spot. If we learn more about Azshara real soon, then maybe Sea Witch could be higher too.

Was it there before people came up with a class concept for it, here on the forums? Because no one, as far as i know, considered that class before.
See, if we consider every shiny and appealing class concept made by users here, we would end up with Bards up on our list. I don't think that's how it works. Blizzard does not look for people to come up with class concepts on their forums to make a new class.

You didn't make it up but you're still ignoring the devs and history of class conception, which isn't solely focused on WC3 heroes. Again, you're basing this on a narrow set of facts, rather than consider the bigger picture; that they have a big list of potential concepts and they haven't singled out WC3 concepts solely. The fact that Runemaster was ever in consideration shows that they aren't valuing WC3 heroes alone. Why Runemaster at all, and why not Shadow Hunter which relates to the Drakkari, or Demon Hunters which were already known and planned, or even Dark Rangers which we know have a direct relation to fighting against Arthas? It was Runemaster who was on that shortlist. We know that they aren't favouring WC3 Heroes over non-WC3 Hero concepts.

Multiple people have responded to you addressing this point. Even the Devs themselves have spoken out on this; they didn't make a MK class they made a Warrior class. WoW was designed to be an MMORPG from the start, adhering to the typical RPG class archetypes from Everquest and D&D. You can't just frame WC3 Heroes as an end-all be-all without considering the full picture. You're just correlating what you are personally defining as WC3 heroes.

Even the Monk class is a considerable RPG archetype which simply has the Brewmaster as an aspect of it, but here you are claiming that it's the WC3 hero in full and pretending it has nothing to do with, you know, the Monk class of D&D and other RPGs.

Just because you didn't lie doesn't mean you aren't being ignorant.

Fair enough.
But, in the end, all that were added were from there. So, i do see a point.

As for the Monk. the class name might be from the RPG, but the concept itself is, strictly, chinese, which doesn't coincide with the overall, general Monk of D&D and other RPGs.

And lastly - you, really, have to tone down the amount of your writing and the number of times you edit your post. It is exhausting.

"Type" is not the same thing as "source".


"No" to the necrolyte, since it's a necromancer unit, not a cleric unit, but other than that, I stand by what I said: they're all priest units.


Like above, they're all mage units.


The demon hunter still disproves you (along with priests, paladins and mages) because they all draw from the same type.

What i meant was Vanilla classes could have been from several games, like WC1, 2 & 3 and even the Warcraft & WoW RPGs. I, simply, don't know.

Expansion classes are more defined, as in they, clearly, draw from the WC3 Hero units pool.

Natalie Seline drew from Orcs Necrolytes to delve into the Void. Their knowledge was the foundation for the Cult of the Forgotten Shadow.

It's not the types. But, the sources being used. I can't tell what they used for Vanilla ones. But, i can see that they used WC3 Heroes for expansion ones.

[Imperator4321]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...han-and-reddit

This is what's left of it that I could find. Just google up the Dark Prophet or Shadowstalker class.

Kind of funny that Zul being aligned with Azshara ended up happening.

As for the "Voodoo class" while i'm a fan of troll lore & characters, i feel there are a number of issues it runs into

A: it's very troll specific concept so number of playable races, related expansions goes down similar to gnome/goblin centric Tinkers (even more when you consider there are no "Voodoo" using alliance races)
B: what is the gameplay and themes inherent to this kind of class concept? what does "Voodoo" do? you can draw lines with other classes, priests mix holy and shadow magic to heal or harm, shamans are elementalists who use spells, empowered weapons and totems, druids are versatile shapeshifters, "Voodoo" in the lore is mostly used vaguely and can seemingly just do whatever the plot demands from curses, hexes, raising the dead, empower others, illusions, mind control, many of which has heavy overlap with other classes conceptually (like priests, shamans and warlocks).

Even that "Shadowstalker" only uses vague descriptors like "uses ranged weapons" or "focus on magical attacks" which can mean anything from magical arrows/bolts/bullets to casting spells alongside conventional attacks.

[username993720]

Kind of funny that Zul being aligned with Azshara ended up happening.

As for the "Voodoo class" while i'm a fan of troll lore & characters, i feel there are a number of issues it runs into

A: it's very troll specific concept so number of playable races, related expansions goes down similar to gnome/goblin centric Tinkers (even more when you consider there are no "Voodoo" using alliance races)
B: what is the gameplay and themes inherent to this kind of class concept? what does "Voodoo" do? you can draw lines with other classes, priests mix holy and shadow magic to heal or harm, shamans are elementalists who use spells, empowered weapons and totems, druids are versatile shapeshifters, "Voodoo" in the lore is mostly used vaguely and can seemingly just do whatever the plot demands from curses, hexes, raising the dead, empower others, illusions, mind control, many of which has heavy overlap with other classes conceptually (like priests, shamans and warlocks).

Even that "Shadowstalker" only uses vague descriptors like "uses ranged weapons" or "focus on magical attacks" which can mean anything from magical arrows/bolts/bullets to casting spells alongside conventional attacks.

There are more races for Witch Doctor, for example. Except the trolls, orcs, ogres, vrykul, gorloc, saberon, pygmy and Lost Ones can be witch doctors. There are also human witch doctors that are under the command of Colonel Kurzen in Stranglethorn Vale.

And, its pretty obvious how they'd play.
Take the Shadow Hunter abilities, Witch Doctor abilities, and Diablo 3 Witch Doctor abilities and you a have a notion of what it would be like.

[LemonDemonGirl]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...han-and-reddit

This is what's left of it that I could find. Just google up the Dark Prophet or Shadowstalker class.

"Zul kills Rastakhan"
Sigh. I think that's probably the second Pre-BfA Zandalar concept that has had Rastakhan die.

Still sounds like a pretty cool class concept though. And would the races be only Trolls? Or could Orcs and Elves join in the fun too?

[Ielenia]

What i meant was Vanilla classes could have been from several games, like WC1, 2 & 3 and even the Warcraft & WoW RPGs. I, simply, don't know.

You keep flip-flopping between definitions of what you meant.

Expansion classes are more defined, as in they, clearly, draw from the WC3 Hero units pool.

Not really. Again, the monk's creation draws way more from the WC3 game than from inside it. The whole 'tea' and 'mistweaving' and 'unarmed fighting' and 'drunken fighting'... all of those come from popular media.

It's not the types. But, the sources being used. I can't tell what they used for Vanilla ones. But, i can see that they used WC3 Heroes for expansion ones.

Read above about the monk.

[username993720]

Still sounds like a pretty cool class concept though. And would the races be only Trolls? Or could Orcs and Elves join in the fun too?

Kul Tirans, actually.
The Drust, who taught them Druidism, and Drustvar, have a lot of wicca-styled witchcraft.

I guess Orcs of the Bleeding Hollow clan could be considered, as well.

You keep flip-flopping between definitions of what you meant.


Not really. Again, the monk's creation draws way more from the WC3 game than from inside it. The whole 'tea' and 'mistweaving' and 'unarmed fighting' and 'drunken fighting'... all of those come from popular media.


Read above about the monk.

Because you never, really, got it. I guess i should have been more precise.

I agree about Mistweaving and Windwalker, which wasn't based on anything in Warcraft lore. But, the Pandaren Brewmaster was, clearly, the inspiration for the class (and the spec, of course). Chen had been its representative, after all.