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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    That is why you sap random ones that could cross your path. The teleport is so you can get to safety since it also works in combat. The quest wouldn't be much of a challenge if it you could just go back into stealth. It is annoying but it is still pretty simple and easy since it doesn't require stealth. You can just run past on a mount and if you are not unlucky with daze they mostly leash.

    It is fine for annoying ones to be skipped most of the time though as it does still line up perfectly with the other kill quest in the area or World Boss so most of the trash is leashed anyways. And once we have flying in 9.1 it will be a non-issue since you can just swoop in kill and fly out.

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    No. They get away with it because RNG is fine. Even rare RNG. Not everything needs to be earned just because you done it X amount of times. Blizzard does have those types of rewards for some stuff.
    Why can't every reward be earned by the player if they put x amount of hours doing it? What is wrong with that?

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    This is the reason Blizzard has continued to get away with this shit. Players dismiss any critique of a skinner box with "RNG is RNG bro deal with it". Meanwhile the players just give up and don't bother doing it anymore.
    Which is the best of sending the message you want to Blizzard. Don't get me wrong, I'm sick of RNG myself. There are just tons of things that are much worse than the ones mentioned by the OP.
    Last edited by ReVnX; 2021-04-09 at 09:43 PM.

  3. #43
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    Why can't every reward be earned by the player if they put x amount of hours doing it? What is wrong with that?
    Variety. There is nothing wrong with either RNG or slowly earned being the sole method.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  4. #44
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoulSoBreezy View Post
    lol /10char
    I hate you Soul.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ReVnX View Post
    If you are this sensitive to RNG bad luck, I don't think you should be collecting
    "I dont think you should be collecting"

    im not collecting, im going after a couple specific items, if i was collecting it would be FAAAAR worse. des has been having hell and a half with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TbouncerT View Post
    This is just seems to be someone getting annoyed with bad RNG/Luck. It just happens to people, it sucks. I feel like it happens to me most of the time in WoW. When DS was relevant, it took my tank 27 weeks to get the shield i wanted to drop at all. I've been trying (still) to get Ashes of Al'ar (1.70% drop rate) for YEARS and still haven't got it, while my wife got it a few years ago. She still hasn't gotten the headless horseman mount (.4%) and she does that daily on multiple toons and I've had it for over 10 years now. I've done hundreds of Stratholme runs for Deathcharger's Reins (.8%) and still don't have it, while a co-worker got it on his 5th attempt. Sorry for the frustration, but that is just how it goes.
    except these are a couple things.

    now make hundreds of them, and how is that accessible?
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    My ideas are objectively good

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    This is the reason Blizzard has continued to get away with this shit. Players dismiss any critique of a skinner box with "RNG is RNG bro deal with it". Meanwhile the players just give up and don't bother doing it anymore.
    What is Blizzard getting away with? Most of this stuff is RNG and it seems pretty RNG to me. Some people getting it in 1-20 attempts while others might get it in 50-100 and beyond. What should Blizzard do? Just kill #? If you kill X mob, X times, you'll guaranteed to get X item? It's just fine the way it is, the love/hate relationship has worked so far. People will stop playing for a number of reasons. Some people will stop farming said item, while others will keep trying. You cant please everyone and the system itself is fine.

    "My memory... since when? If everything is a dream, don't wake me." -Cloud Strife, Final Fantasy VII

  6. #46
    I agree with most of what you said. Shadowlands has certainly pushed me to a point I've never been before with this game. I've asked myself if its worth sinking more of my valuable time into something that doesn't seem to respect it whatsoever. I've honestly never been closer to punching out of this game than now. I just have to break the addiction and pull the plug, but yea, its hard.

  7. #47
    I think worst thing is that certain rares drop a mount ONLY if you're a member of that zone's covenant. And nothing in the game tells you that. I only found out about it like 2 months ago and since then just ignore such rares, which is pretty sad. Usually if you passed by and a rare dropping a mount would spawn, you'd be happy about it and kill the rare for a chance. Now 3/4 of such rares might as well be some generic elite for you.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    If someone is such a completionist that they multibox or play over 12 hours a day then good for them. No idea why blizzard would have to design the game around those few people.
    Cause the game looks “bad” if people finish before the projected metrics. And it’s why blizzard over the years added incremental progression elements based in rng (wf/tf/corruption) all to game on the “need to complete” urge in people. And that’s just for the power aspect of the game. They threw in legacy loot with 7.3.5 when no one wanted that all to slow down the collection meta they finalized with legion. Why they withheld island “vendor” npc until 8.3 cause they wanted addicts to exhaust themselves playing their failed tentpole feature. And back to power metric why they withheld corruption vendor until after the ny’alotha hall of fame closed.

    The purposely withhold things because they don’t want the top end from finishing things too quickly. And on the flipside they prune/iron out excess details and info to avoid overwhelming the lower end of the playerbase (like why the character panel nerf with 7.0 and removal of proc chance from trinkets like we had in MoP?).

    This entire game is just a twisted arms race between blizz and players when it comes to systems and sensible progression vs equivalents in prior expansions.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    except these are a couple things.

    now make hundreds of them, and how is that accessible?
    It's accessible because the mob always spawns and you can always try again....

    Its just the matter of how much time you want to invest in to it. What you said above just re-enforced my RNG point.

    "My memory... since when? If everything is a dream, don't wake me." -Cloud Strife, Final Fantasy VII

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by TbouncerT View Post
    It's accessible because the mob always spawns and you can always try again....

    Its just the matter of how much time you want to invest in to it. What you said above just re-enforced my RNG point.
    But like Felplague said. It's NOT just kill the mob when it spawns. Some of these have multiple steps involved in being able to kill/loot the item that take a considerable amount of time when doing them over and over again day after day for just a 0.5% chance.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Rares have always been a thing in wow, but since mists of pandaria they have become less so rares, and more so "mobs with special names that are always alive and need to be killed daily for a chance at a reward" instead of "actual rarespawn, that almost always drops their unique reward" of the past.


    This is a major fucking issue, especially with shadowlands, and here I am to give you some examples.

    1. Bubbleblood- While I can solo this rare, it takes awhile, and its annoying ,it is slow and boring, takes about a minute, and I have killed this rare every day since launch of shadowlands. And yet here we are april 9th, and i still have yet to get his grungy containment pack. The reason I am hunting this item is for the pack cause it fits my mog amazingly. we are almost 6 months in, and this one reward is still missing. that is literally insane, that is in the most simple terms, a 0.5% drop rate (for me) and this is
    one item
    on one rare
    in one zone
    how is that at all respectful to the players time? that you ask of players who want to collect all the rewards just form world content itself, multiple hours of farming every single day, for MONTHS just to have a chance at the rewards, FROM WORLD CONTENT.


    2- collector kash- this highlights another issue, he has a few rewards, however one of them the jagged bonesaw could not be obtained till jan 12th when we unlocked a new renown level... after that point he now drops the jagged bonesaw, this item is a modifier you apply to a toy you get as a necrolord. And yet, I have been farming this rare every day since jan 12th. 3 months later, and yet where is that jagged bonesaw? still on the rare. Locking a garunteed item behind unlocking its drop is fine, get renown then go kill a rare and get the item! but locking a RANDOM CHANCE behind something like this? its fucking mental


    3- Tahonta- this rare had a secret method required to get the mount, which required reaching a specific level of the abomination factory, and then to go find a secret abomination neena, and then have her on you when you kill the rare, meaning all the kills before this, all the farming, was pointless, cause you never could have gotten the mount. Imagine if some rare had a secret method where you had to kill a rare the same hour your account was registered on, most players would get it acidently, as the others would all be screwed, not knowing that the time they played at and killed it, meant they never ever had the chance of getting this. it took a fair while for players to figure out it was neena that made the mount spawn, and even now we arnt 100% sure, as even with neena, people like me killing tahonta every day still have yet to get the mount.

    now i shouldnt need to do this, but fuck it lets give it a shot!
    What does my average day look like?

    Log on with neena. Go to tahonta and kill them. No mount
    Go to bubbleblood, ask in chat if anyone wants to help kill. No response. wait 10 seconds, then spend the next minute killing bubbleblood. No pack
    Then go to collector kash, kill him. no bonesaw.
    Then I take the portal back to the seat. and then i go to the abom factory and collect unity. Then go and do ALL the maldraxxus world quests. Then return to the abom factory and pick up neena again.

    Oh wait unity? oh yeah. There is an ENTIRE ARMOR SET locked behind doing world quests in maldraxxus with unity as your active abom, unity an abom not obtainable till rank 5 of the abom factory. And has no weekly quest, same with neena, so you cant carry their summon items in your bag, you have to go actually pick them up from the abom factory. And completing a world quest with unity, has about a 1 in 20 chance of giving you a peice of gear for your mog set.


    Now repeat this for 6 months straight, and im sure you start to see why this is so fucking draining, depressing, and tiring.
    Because of this I have been playing less and less of shadowlands day by day, to the point most days my log in is just to go, kill these 3 rares, then log off, because its just exhausting. and im playing more classic then live, even playing more of other games that i used to only play when wow's servers were down.

    People love to talk about how "locking flying is just blizzard trying to force people to stay subbed for longer" i love to point out that is hilariously wrong.
    Simply because this, this right here is that. its gambling, not with money but with time. "If i kill them today i might just get it!" its disgusting and disrespectful to players time. Blizzard needs to increase the drop rate of rares, or simply return them to what they used to be.

    I can garuntee you right now, I far prefered the time lost protodrake to this shit. When I farmed that mount it took me a long time, but that i could sit there and play something else, it was "once it spawns i am 100% going to get it" instead of this, were the mob is always there, but every single day you have a chance to get the item, and this chance means you are never actually garunteed to get it, even if you farm for 6 fucking months like I have.



    Many people call me a shill saying I never say anything bad about the game, usually because I keep to myself the problems, simply because my problems with the game are ones plenty of people already talk about, or ones not big enough to make a thread or big deal about, so I never really voice them, but for yall that keep calling me shill and such, here is one of my problems I feel is big enough to talk about, and is a major problem.


    Blizzard makes a lot of stupid fucking decisions, but stuff like this, these "small things" they add up, especially as this is THREE RARES there is atleast 100 in shadowlands. and yet 3 of them have me here 6 months later still missing rewards. I can only fucking imagine how bad it is for other people who actually want to "complete" shadowlands. I know for example desmephisto who is going for full plate, he has been doing hardcore wow every day all day for 6 months now on multiple warriors to try and get all the plate gear in shadowlands. here we are 6 months later, hes got multiple warriors of each covenent. and yet hes only about 50% done completion... that is fucking insane.


    I did so many dailies, killed so many rares, I was world first 20k, 30k, and 35k anima. And yet here we are, there is still countless rewards i have to unlock, after months of farming, and yet ive maybe only unlocked 20-30% of necorlord cloth rewards. like and there is fucking 3 more necrolord armor types, then ontop of that 3 more covenants, like you gotta be fucking kidding me.

    Rant over, im gunna go drink for abit and see how this turns out, tell me what item youve been farming for or something idk. what rare has been fucking abyssmal to you?
    Yup its silly.

    But lets break down the problems you have.

    rare's:
    - they should be like before. Gold unit frame really rare, long timer. Silver unit frame what most "rares" are in the last few expansions. ( just a elite that hits harder , and has a loot table that is bigger).
    - More rewards, anima, proffesion mats etc. daily reset for anima bonus. So first kill of day you get anima + chance on loot.
    - yes TLP was better as this shit. dozens of things, that a super small chance to drop, that are behind x,y,z gated stuff. and you need stuff for.

    Armor set:
    - yeah, putting a lot of things behind several gated things is insane. If they do it for 1 thing i would get it. Or behind 1 thing.

    Anima:
    - again agree. 1 of the biggest problems for me is all the different currency we have. and those different vendors etc also have rep to gather. So its insane. First get to exalted and get rep for this faction...that is only used for this faction.
    - anima drop rates are also so low or the cost for things are so high. AP in legion or Azerite in BFA where better things then this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Phayde View Post
    Shit, I think FelPlague got hacked.
    lol

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    But like Felplague said. It's NOT just kill the mob when it spawns. Some of these have multiple steps involved in being able to kill/loot the item.
    An excellent example of this are the rares/events on mechagon.

    1. Is it up for the day?
    2. Is it currently spawned?
    3. Is this your first kill of the day?
    4. Did you do the song and dance to summon it?
    5. Did you tag/kill it?
    6. Did the item drop?

  13. #53
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TbouncerT View Post
    It's accessible because the mob always spawns and you can always try again....

    Its just the matter of how much time you want to invest in to it. What you said above just re-enforced my RNG point.
    except you can only try, and kill the mob, once a day...
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    My ideas are objectively good

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    But like Felplague said. It's NOT just kill the mob when it spawns. Some of these have multiple steps involved in being able to kill/loot the item that take a considerable amount of time when doing them over and over again day after day for just a 0.5% chance.
    But that's their choice, Blizzard isn't forcing them to do it. They want that xmog so they're grinding for it. The past few years I've noticed an increase in people not want to work for their "Reward". People want least amount of effort for the reward. I get it, times change for people. But with such a big player base, there is actually a wide range of play time. If Blizzard would focus on one sector of that, it'll actually do them more harm then good. If you want something that bad, then keep at it, it'll be rewarding once you get it. If it's bothering you that bad, then that's a sign that you need to take a break and shift your focus somewhere else and then come back to it.

    "My memory... since when? If everything is a dream, don't wake me." -Cloud Strife, Final Fantasy VII

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by zaxlor View Post
    This has been the first exspansion that I feel really, really does not respect player time.
    It has absolutely nothing to do with respecting time, or the players at all. It's an intentional choice by the developers, not just a miserable accident.

    It's an evolution of the equally insipid game design theory that in order to have "fun" there has to be a lot of "frustration" as well, and you have to find the "balance" between the two. Because, you know, games like poker, chess, checkers, and so on haven't persevered for centuries without relying on that. But hey, some mathematician made the claim once, so apparently it's true. It's impossible to have fun without being frustrated the vast majority of the time.

    And don't get me started on The Burning Crusade when they first introduced daily quests and began making the game an outright chore to play.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    except you can only try, and kill the mob, once a day...
    What's wrong with that? Gives you a chance to do other things in the game rather than camping 1 mob for hours for 1 item. If that's the only thing you want to do, then it's a bigger problem than RNG.

    "My memory... since when? If everything is a dream, don't wake me." -Cloud Strife, Final Fantasy VII

  17. #57
    Elemental Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    6 months of killing the same mob every day, that is a 0.5% drop rate, for a green dagger item.
    how is that rare, that is literally crazy.
    .
    I mean you literally defined rare. The NPC’s aren’t rare anymore but the drops are

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Something Wicked View Post
    poker,
    also relies on RNG too. Some people get dealt crap while others get a nice hand.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrLachyG View Post
    I mean you literally defined rare. The NPC’s aren’t rare anymore but the drops are
    Exactly this. it just shifted to loot more rather than the mob itself.

    "My memory... since when? If everything is a dream, don't wake me." -Cloud Strife, Final Fantasy VII

  19. #59
    Grungy Containment Pack is actually the less annoying containment pack to get.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  20. #60
    Looking at SL from the outside, that meme from HTTYD just keeps repeating in my mind.

    Me: - You need to stop all... this.
    SL: You just gestured to all of me...

    Well, I can specify the shit that keeps me from playing. The major one is that I can't presently raid, but the design of SL with its zones and the Covenants and the Jailer and the Maw and Torghast and the "rares" just puts me off even doing the things I've always been able to enjoy whenever I couldn't raid.

    I came to that realization as I was on my 8th attempt for that f-ing stag rare in the Night Fae area... Not only does it need to be spawned from an item which can pop up here or there, but it can spawn around the map and then wander, only to then not be a 100% drop on the shit it offers.


    No thanks. I'll take rares that are actually rares but give a 100% chance at a drop, any day. I could overlook that if I could raid, but when I can't raid, completion of collections is my main go-to content. SL just does them wrong, where Legion did them right.


    Luckily, Banished exists!
    Last edited by Queen of Hamsters; 2021-04-09 at 10:39 PM.

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