In-game Raider.io score

[Tenebrius]

Remember how you could have a low-ish rio score but still get in groups because the leader was not using raiderio? Yeah...now he will.

[chiddie]

Remember how you could have a low-ish rio score but still get in groups because the leader was not using raiderio? Yeah...now he will.

I think that once it becomes official, for almost everyone the only way to push will be doing own keys.

[Specialka]

I think that once it becomes official, for almost everyone the only way to push will be doing own keys.

Because you think that those who push do not already use rio ?

[GreatAlex]

One addon less to use. I welcome it, although I don't like the system in itself. This being said, whoever tried to play without it or has tried to build own groups simply knows that it's borderline impossible.

Good thing I mostly run guild internal anyway.

[chiddie]

Because you think that those who push do not already use rio ?

No, but I see quite a lot of people, specially in lower brackets, without rio. Tomorrow of course you won’t be forced to use it, but you’ll see it like it or not. And honestly once you see it and understand how it works and what it does you won’t look back.

Today I fell again for the usual bait “+14 group creator with 1200 rio and other 3 members with 900 rio I couldn’t see before joining the group” and for the first time I had the “force” to say to myself “no I’m not gonna waste one hour again only to fail the key and carry others” and I left the group before entering the dungeon.

45 minutes later I got my first DoS 14 in time with a proper group. Go figure why we need rio.

[kamuimac]

No, but I see quite a lot of people, specially in lower brackets, without rio. Tomorrow of course you won’t be forced to use it, but you’ll see it like it or not. And honestly once you see it and understand how it works and what it does you won’t look back.

Today I fell again for the usual bait “+14 group creator with 1200 rio and other 3 members with 900 rio I couldn’t see before joining the group” and for the first time I had the “force” to say to myself “no I’m not gonna waste one hour again only to fail the key and carry others” and I left the group before entering the dungeon.

45 minutes later I got my first DoS 14 in time with a proper group. Go figure why we need rio.

and what exacly stopped you from inspecting people after joining groups ?

want super overpowered groups ? its pretty simple - only join groups with all dps/healer over 40k health and then checking if all of them have 1500+ .io

but hey - you wont find those in +14 won you ? because they wont want to carry "undergeared underscored " people like you only they will be doing like 16-20 for their GV. - ups .... guesss in their eyes your are the same kind of baddie that you hate to have in your groups.

the irony .

over last few weeks when doing +14 i noticed that there are really no rules to how group will perform - i have seen 1300 people doing catastrophic mistakes and 900 itlv people who perform amazing . your problem is youwant to be carried - and this not always happen

[Cuppy]

lol... 1500 rio people are still bad at the game...

I feel this is a major part of the toxicity we have in wow. This claim is just so weird, like what do you mean ”bad”? What is even considered bad these days? You miss an interrupt and you’re just plain bad? Nothing between ”good” and ”bad”? You are one of these two and unless you play absolutely like a robot with 100% effiency you will fall to the foremost?

What about those people who don’t run mythic+ but prefer pvp? 0 io score but high rank, are they bad?
What about carried people? They have high io because they paid to get in the run, are they good because of high io score?

[Relapses]

Jesus christ, Blizzard is speedrunning killing the game.

Yes Alex, I'll take "Shit People On Forums Have Said Since Vanilla" for $1,000.

[baksheesh]

they lack basic game knowledge...

tanks turning 180 degrees when they're going to kite... they can't block, parry or dodge mobs that are behind them...

people that walk through mobs with shroud...

pet classes that don't dismiss their pets with skips and then their pet pulls...

people that don't press their bloodlust button...

getting hit by volcanic left and right...

And people who have timed +17 in all dungeons do this? That's what 1500 io corresponds to this tier bro, sure every once in a while you'll get an outlier but groups I join with people all that score tend to go pretty well

[Dakara]

1. People tell you to make your own group because making your own group works. It's almost like there are thousands of KSM players who pugged their own keys in addition to getting invited to other people's keys. It's almost like there are new people getting KSM every single day pugging keys. If other people can do it, so can you.

2. If you really need a specific item drop, now with Valor it's way better to just go into lower keys and carry those runs with your high ilvl. If you're 210+ and apply for a +2, you'll get an invite in no time. You spam those dungeons and then upgrade the item with Valor. Nobody in their right mind would spam 35-40 minute DoS+15 runs for the tiny chance of a trinket drop, just to save some Valor points.

Of course making your own group works... everyone should do it, then there'd be a list of groups with 1 player LFM and no applicants. The whole LFG system relies on some players forming groups and others joining at a ratio of 4:1.

But the main point of my post you Quoted is specifically related to your 2nd point. People who want to target specific items have to rely on Pugs because chances are they don't have a Key for that Dungeon to form their own group.

If my main needs a specific item (he doesn't) then I wouldn't bother farming it on anything less than a +12, but preferably a +15 because I really CBF farming the Valor for the upgrades.

However, as per original post my gripe with M+ is more to do with Alts. My main does just fine in M+, but when it comes to Alts I just CBF these days. Too much time spent playing the UI just to find a group. Hence why my original post was suggesting making Heroic dungeons relevant again and have a bit more longevity before moving into Keys.

You said you got DECLINED that means, based on English language, that you were not able to join any group. Or can you show a dictionary that supports your claim of being invited and then kicked and still being able to describe said action as "declination". Thank you. I think you are lying and trying to wiggle yourself out of this. Thank god you said declined, very descriptive of what happened with little room of misinterpretation.

No, I specifically referenced a +5 I was declined from. To be Declined from a single group does automatically mean you were Declined from ALL Groups.

As I said, I was invited to the group then immediately removed. That is being Declined from the group... the fact that the leader noticed their "mistake" after inviting me instead of before does not change the outcome.

Now you want to argue over Word Play and accuse me of lying because you were to quick to jump in a tell someone on the Internet they were wrong.

[Temp name]

I feel this is a major part of the toxicity we have in wow. This claim is just so weird, like what do you mean ”bad”? What is even considered bad these days? You miss an interrupt and you’re just plain bad? Nothing between ”good” and ”bad”? You are one of these two and unless you play absolutely like a robot with 100% effiency you will fall to the foremost?

What about those people who don’t run mythic+ but prefer pvp? 0 io score but high rank, are they bad?
What about carried people? They have high io because they paid to get in the run, are they good because of high io score?

Not him, but..
Yesterday I was doing a dungeon on my holy paladin. Mists+16. I'm ~206 ilvl, so "undergeared" by most metrics, but I've done most dungeons on 16 with 2 chests just fine, so I'm not worried about it.
In the group we have:
Me
Tank (my friend, ~1800)
Boomy (~1200, 1700 on main)
Warlock (~1500)
Hunter (~1300, 1500 on main)

At the end of the dungeon the tank has 37 interrupts, boomy and hunter have 6 and 5 respectively, warlock has 0. Neither boomy or hunter CC'd fox on 2nd boss, they even both got stunned and killed by dodgeball because of it.
People were dying left and right due to no interrupts going out, or just not moving away from spitefuls and getting clapped
We failed to time the dungeon by about a minute.

I can't remember how many deaths we had, but I can tell you it was too many. And the highest dps we had was 5.2k overall, and it wasn't the warlock.

The warlock had the fucking stones to tell me I was getting boosted, despite him just barely beating the tank in dps, not interrupting ANYTHING, taking the most damage except for the tank, and dying every other pull because casts went off and him not moving from spitefuls. (Also I checked out his logs afterwards, he averages 5.6 percentile on mythic bosses)

Score means fuck all in the grand scheme of things. You can have people with all the gear and score in the world, but they'll still suck. Conversely you can have people who're undergeared, with low score, who do well, simply because they haven't had a chance to earn gear and score yet for whatever reason.

It's not that people are bad because they're 1500 score, it's that people have 1500 score when they're bad. 1500 is a fair bit above KSM, and you can apparently get there just fine by getting boosted out your ass in random pugs and think you're hot shit

[Specialka]

Not him, but..
Yesterday I was doing a dungeon on my holy paladin. Mists+16. I'm ~206 ilvl, so "undergeared" by most metrics, but I've done most dungeons on 16 with 2 chests just fine, so I'm not worried about it.
In the group we have:
Me
Tank (my friend, ~1800)
Boomy (~1200, 1700 on main)
Warlock (~1500)
Hunter (~1300, 1500 on main)

At the end of the dungeon the tank has 37 interrupts, boomy and hunter have 6 and 5 respectively, warlock has 0. Neither boomy or hunter CC'd fox on 2nd boss, they even both got stunned and killed by dodgeball because of it.
People were dying left and right due to no interrupts going out, or just not moving away from spitefuls and getting clapped
We failed to time the dungeon by about a minute.

I can't remember how many deaths we had, but I can tell you it was too many. And the highest dps we had was 5.2k overall, and it wasn't the warlock.

The warlock had the fucking stones to tell me I was getting boosted, despite him just barely beating the tank in dps, not interrupting ANYTHING, taking the most damage except for the tank, and dying every other pull because casts went off and him not moving from spitefuls. (Also I checked out his logs afterwards, he averages 5.6 percentile on mythic bosses)

Score means fuck all in the grand scheme of things. You can have people with all the gear and score in the world, but they'll still suck. Conversely you can have people who're undergeared, with low score, who do well, simply because they haven't had a chance to earn gear and score yet for whatever reason.

It's not that people are bad because they're 1500 score, it's that people have 1500 score when they're bad. 1500 is a fair bit above KSM, and you can apparently get there just fine by getting boosted out your ass in random pugs and think you're hot shit

Having 1500 rio 3 weeks after a season starts is not the same than having it 2 or 3 months later. Stuff gets nerf over time and people increases their ilvl over time as well.

[chiddie]

and what exacly stopped you from inspecting people after joining groups ?

want super overpowered groups ? its pretty simple - only join groups with all dps/healer over 40k health and then checking if all of them have 1500+ .io

but hey - you wont find those in +14 won you ? because they wont want to carry "undergeared underscored " people like you only they will be doing like 16-20 for their GV. - ups .... guesss in their eyes your are the same kind of baddie that you hate to have in your groups.

the irony .

over last few weeks when doing +14 i noticed that there are really no rules to how group will perform - i have seen 1300 people doing catastrophic mistakes and 900 itlv people who perform amazing . your problem is youwant to be carried - and this not always happen

I always look at rio party members but I’m kind hearted and I feel sorry to leave even if I know that 9 on 10 the rune will be a disaster.

The rest of your post is just a nonsense rant: every M+ level grants roughly 10 points, math is quite easy, how is searching for ppl around 1100 to 1200 rio for a 14 searching for “overgeared ppl to be carried”?

Also, the assumption on the 14 is wrong because as I stated before the issue with 14 is the exact opposite: they are the lowest M+ level to count for Max level item in vault and thus they are literally flooded with high rio ppl going for an easy run to fill the vault (and of course searching similar ppl in order for the run to be easy).

[crusadernero]

No idea how this is supposed to make dungeons(M+) a better experience for the overall playerbase. Oh well, im getting used to dungeons being ignored content at max level.

[crusadernero]

yes, they do... even at 1800 i am surprised by how bad people are... like i was going to do +19 hoa... the mage or boomkin doesn't dispel the curses on trash... then yells at me for not dispelling it... i'm a fucking priest, i can't dispel curses... then we wiped 2 times to echelon and they left... calls the rest of us shit players before leaving... lol... they didn't outrange the shards aoe damage either...

i also could have done more damage on my paladin as retri than that boomkin did... and i don't even play retri regularly...

You sum up pretty much my experience with m+ and the reason I dont bother with it at all. I do them while leveling and its over. if I join groups or if I form them myself, its often enough a shitshow for whatever reason.

[khazlol]

find a m+ team and stop puggin

ever since the dawn of WoW puggin was always the meh experience.

[kamuimac]

Not him, but..
Yesterday I was doing a dungeon on my holy paladin. Mists+16. I'm ~206 ilvl, so "undergeared" by most metrics, but I've done most dungeons on 16 with 2 chests just fine, so I'm not worried about it.
In the group we have:
Me
Tank (my friend, ~1800)
Boomy (~1200, 1700 on main)
Warlock (~1500)
Hunter (~1300, 1500 on main)

At the end of the dungeon the tank has 37 interrupts, boomy and hunter have 6 and 5 respectively, warlock has 0. Neither boomy or hunter CC'd fox on 2nd boss, they even both got stunned and killed by dodgeball because of it.
People were dying left and right due to no interrupts going out, or just not moving away from spitefuls and getting clapped
We failed to time the dungeon by about a minute.

I can't remember how many deaths we had, but I can tell you it was too many. And the highest dps we had was 5.2k overall, and it wasn't the warlock.

The warlock had the fucking stones to tell me I was getting boosted, despite him just barely beating the tank in dps, not interrupting ANYTHING, taking the most damage except for the tank, and dying every other pull because casts went off and him not moving from spitefuls. (Also I checked out his logs afterwards, he averages 5.6 percentile on mythic bosses)

Score means fuck all in the grand scheme of things. You can have people with all the gear and score in the world, but they'll still suck. Conversely you can have people who're undergeared, with low score, who do well, simply because they haven't had a chance to earn gear and score yet for whatever reason.

It's not that people are bad because they're 1500 score, it's that people have 1500 score when they're bad. 1500 is a fair bit above KSM, and you can apparently get there just fine by getting boosted out your ass in random pugs and think you're hot shit

he was not wrong there. if they taken 220 pala heal instead you they would time it - because he would be able to carry their mistakes.

i see it all time - groups colapsing in 12-14 because they take undergeared heal/tank due to not wanting to wait those few minutes and then failing.

its ok to want to be carried . everyone who makes group in lfg want that. it just not always work .

in this case 2 people were being boosted - you on undergeared toon and warlock who did bad dps. and it resoulted in untimed key .

[arandomuser]

What could possibly go wrong?

nothing really already for almost any key you wont get invited unless you have a sufficient rio score, making it in game would only remove the complexity of returning players not understanding why there not getting invited keys because they dont have an outside addon, think gearscore in wotlk to ilvl in game, as long as they dont do something super troll like a queu system its fiiiine

[kamuimac]

I always look at rio party members but I’m kind hearted and I feel sorry to leave even if I know that 9 on 10 the rune will be a disaster.

The rest of your post is just a nonsense rant: every M+ level grants roughly 10 points, math is quite easy, how is searching for ppl around 1100 to 1200 rio for a 14 searching for “overgeared ppl to be carried”?

Also, the assumption on the 14 is wrong because as I stated before the issue with 14 is the exact opposite: they are the lowest M+ level to count for Max level item in vault and thus they are literally flooded with high rio ppl going for an easy run to fill the vault (and of course searching similar ppl in order for the run to be easy).

early in tier ? sure that woudl be correct

now ? lol people who care about gear are 226+ for months now and they have nothign to gain in +14. unelss its their 5th very undergear alt on which they barely play and thus perform very badly .

- - - Updated - - -

not overgearing an instance doesn't mean you will fail lol... if you know how to play you can do 12-14 in 190 gear just fine... yet people are sporting 210+ gear and fail at them...

if people expect me to be pushing 6k hps when doing my weeklies for my druid... they can forget that... i'm there for an easy vault, not to boost people who can't avoid anything... i'll find another group in seconds if they take too much damage...

this claim is theoreticaly correct

in reality i have yet to find such group .

[chiddie]

early in tier ? sure that woudl be correct

now ? lol people who care about gear are 226+ for months now and they have nothign to gain in +14. unelss its their 5th very undergear alt on which they barely play and thus perform very badly .

- - - Updated - - -



this claim is theoreticaly correct

in reality i have yet to find such group .

There are quite a ton of people in the 210-220 ilvl bracket, me included.

I can assure you that the vault is still a thing nowadays, even for people with KSM.

If you don’t believe me try to have a look in your LFD and see how many 1300+ ppl are applying for 14, you’ll be surprised.