Aegwynn (as Guardian) vs. Queen Azshara - Who would most likely win in a real battle?

[Shaqthefat]

from sargeras wowpedia page:





Yes it was a avatar. But azshara bent the knee without even fighting. And nowhere is it found that he feared azshara.

And she fought him ( even if it was his avatar). they titan who rips whole old gods from planets and kills them. Who commands a endless army. And he feared her!


Azshara worked for/minion of the old gods.


So:

Sargeras beats > old gods
Sargeras fears > Aegwynn

Azshara > works as minion for old gods.

So real simple.....if your boss can be killed by a big bad, and that big bad fears someone......enough said.

Sargeras didn't fear Aegwynn in the sense that she could kill him, he was worried about her potential to prevent an invasion by the Legion. If Aegwynn fought the real sargeras she wouldn't stand a single chance.

[TheFirstOnes]

Its certainly an interesting conversation, I mean we kicked Azshara's butt in a single patch and raid.

We haven't had a chance to fight Aegwynn but she did beat the avatar of Sargeras... Who we also beat pretty easily.

We beat the husk of the Avatar. We DID however defeat the Avatar of Aggramar, however.

[baskev]

That's cool and all. Sargeras and Aman'thul can slay Old Gods. You're right.

Now maybe answer the actual question on why an Avatar would?

Not. But if a titan like that fears or thinks higher off someone like aegwynn. but he can with ease kill old gods. Should there not be a reason for him to fear her? or think of her as a treath?

But we are getting just stuck on Sargeras.

Azshara was feared. But also was able to be killed by 1 of sargeras top luitenants.

But i say again...because you guys are blind. we can not really know the answer. I can not find 1 instance of them facing the same enemy. Or facing a enemy that we can compare to a other person to find our their strenght.

Also azshara was afraid of the wild gods. But they have to been shown to be weak. Yet she is 1 of the greatest mages. So we can not be sure.


But we have seen aegwynn fight a avatar of sargeras and resist his sould for quite some time while he was inside her. that is also nothing.

[TheFirstOnes]

He never feared her. He just found her power admirable when battling his Avatar. That was it.

[baskev]

Sargeras didn't fear Aegwynn in the sense that she could kill him, he was worried about her potential to prevent an invasion by the Legion. If Aegwynn fought the real sargeras she wouldn't stand a single chance.

So he did fear her? because she could stop his plans? that is fear. fear of killing him...nope. Last time i checked titans can not be killed. ( argus weirdly was ?).

Yup if she fought the real one.

But again, azshara has nothing to proof her strenght fight wise. Only some parol tricks. Not big boss fights.
And aegwynn did keep the soul of sargeras under check for a while.

But like i said to other people. we can not know. we have yet to find a person who they bought fought. Or any connections in battle's.

For instance.

Archimond could kill azshara
But that other demon lord could not.
But she feared the wild gods.

Aegwynn found the legion after they hunted ( and almost wiped out) 1 of the last dragonflights.

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I repeat again for a special person who does not know what an avatar is. The Avatar is not a real Titan. In Avatar, only a tiny fraction of the power of a true Titan. And Sargeras was never afraid of Aegwynn. I do not understand why you are citing the exploits of Sargeras as an example, if his Avatar was never capable of such a thing. Or, according to your logic, Aegwynn is stronger than the Old Gods? Never write such nonsense again.

Realy? Don't you know the person who met with both ladies? Have you ever heard of Jaina Proudmoore? Who was Aegwynn's main fan, knew her biography and all of her exploits by heart, and communicated closely with her while Aegwynn was her advisor in Theramore? And this same Jaina said in Nazjatar that Azshara is the most powerful mage in the history of Azeroth.

Lol, Azshara could have caused the Legion demons to attack each other simply by spending time with them.

That is rude. I know what a avatar is. A body/form that holds the spirit or is controled by a person from a remote location.

I even said it was a tiny part of the power. Read what i write the nex time.

And no i am not saying she is stronger as a fully powered sargeras OR a old god.

Just trying to gauge her level of power ( like i also did with azshara).

1% of a goblins power or 1% of sargeras power are 2 different things. I am just saying she fought him ( avatar form) and yes it was just a fraction of the power. But we do not know how much or little it was.

And he did fear that she could stop his invasion of azoroth. While azshara was just a tool for him to into azoroth.

Azshara exploits are only show and tell. You can not find a boss she has defeated.

btw :

Jaina Proudmoore and Lor'themar Theron would later refer to her as perhaps the greatest sorceress the world of Azeroth had ever known

look up what that word means. Other terms that are used for her...one of the greatest etc etc.

And azshara like you said was strong in manipulation, and parlor tricks like holding back water. But some of this also came from outside sources.

and she used things like this:

she infused a drop of its living waters into her bejeweled scepter. Queen Azshara's enchanted scepter afforded her great power. I

but again. we can not be sure blizzard writing can be all over .
and btw dark...welcome to ignore.

[TheFirstOnes]

“Last time i checked titans can not be killed. ( argus weirdly was ?).”

Titans can die. Read Chronicle.

[Shaqthefat]

So he did fear her? because she could stop his plans? that is fear. fear of killing him...nope. Last time i checked titans can not be killed. ( argus weirdly was ?).

Yup if she fought the real one.

But again, azshara has nothing to proof her strenght fight wise. Only some parol tricks. Not big boss fights.
And aegwynn did keep the soul of sargeras under check for a while.

But like i said to other people. we can not know. we have yet to find a person who they bought fought. Or any connections in battle's.

For instance.

Archimond could kill azshara
But that other demon lord could not.
But she feared the wild gods.

Aegwynn found the legion after they hunted ( and almost wiped out) 1 of the last dragonflights.

Titan's can be killed it's just very difficult. The only reason the Titans didn't die during their battle against Sargeras was a last minute spell from Norgannon.

And no, Aegwynn didn't keep the soul of Sargeras under check, she wasn't even aware of the piece of his soul inside of her. Which was used to a manipulate her into isolation away from the Council of Tirisfal and to have a child that would prove to be a sufficient host. Which was Sargeras's exact plan.

Aegwynn was a pawn to Sargeras that worked perfectly. The entire third war are a result of the Sargeras manipulating Aegwynn.

Sargeras saw her a threat to the legion's invasion, but also saw that she was going to be easily to manipulate.

[baskev]

Titan's can be killed it's just very difficult. The only reason the Titans didn't die during their battle against Sargeras was a last minute spell from Norgannon.

And no, Aegwynn didn't keep the soul of Sargeras under check, she wasn't even aware of the piece of his soul inside of her. Which was used to a manipulate her into isolation away from the Council of Tirisfal and to have a child that would prove to be a sufficient host. Which was Sargeras's exact plan.

Aegwynn was a pawn to Sargeras that worked perfectly. The entire third war are a result of the Sargeras manipulating Aegwynn.

Sargeras saw her a threat to the legion's invasion, but also saw that she was going to be easily to manipulate.

It has been hinted that when titans die, their souls would return to their own Order plane

Think of it like ardenweild they can be reborn. So yes they can die , but there spirits are a bit stronger then we think.

Could be, i thought she was aware later on. But lets not argue about that. its about the power between the ladys.

And yes he saw her are a threat to the legion invansion. And azshara not.

Funny that all of you are going after the fact that i have a opinion that Aegwynn is a bit stronger.

Yet non of you have said anything about azshara. Or even tried to compare the powers. Something i have been trying to do for a while now.
And maybe i am wrong and azshara is stronger.

But instead of trying to discuss and find it out. all of you are just going on and on about stuff.

So lets put all the discussions about the other things aside.


Thread question was: who of the 2 ladies is stronger.
Until we find someone they both fought.
Or someone who fought people they both fought. we can not gauge their full power.

Aegwynn was stronger when sargeras was in her, but azshara used the well as power source. So its very hard to tell who is stronger.

What i do think is that Aegwynn has show to have some power fighting the legion etc.
While azshara has mostly used her power to show off. and we have yet to see her original form fight a real big bad/good person.

[Shaqthefat]

Think of it like ardenweild they can be reborn. So yes they can die , but there spirits are a bit stronger then we think.

Could be, i thought she was aware later on. But lets not argue about that. its about the power between the ladys.

And yes he saw her are a threat to the legion invansion. And azshara not.

Funny that all of you are going after the fact that i have a opinion that Aegwynn is a bit stronger.

Yet non of you have said anything about azshara. Or even tried to compare the powers. Something i have been trying to do for a while now.
And maybe i am wrong and azshara is stronger.

But instead of trying to discuss and find it out. all of you are just going on and on about stuff.

So lets put all the discussions about the other things aside.


Thread question was: who of the 2 ladies is stronger.
Until we find someone they both fought.
Or someone who fought people they both fought. we can not gauge their full power.

Aegwynn was stronger when sargeras was in her, but azshara used the well as power source. So its very hard to tell who is stronger.

What i do think is that Aegwynn has show to have some power fighting the legion etc.
While azshara has mostly used her power to show off. and we have yet to see her original form fight a real big bad/good person.

It was flat-out said in Chronicle that Norgannon saved the Pantheon from death. Their spirits are strong, but not that strong.

I think Aegwynn, and Medivh for that matter, are stronger than Azshara. My problem is that you're involving Sargeras as the reason why and that does nothing to prove why Aegwynn is stronger.

Aegynn was never empowered by Sargeras, Medivh was. Azshara wasn't seen as a threat to the Legion, because Azshara wasn't actively trying to combat the Legion. I have no doubt that if she was against the Legion, she would've been seen as a serious threat since Mannoroth was unable to overpower her.

Azshara's most impressive feat is blocking teleportation in Nazjatar, while Aegwynns is overpowering an Avatar of Sargeras. Still an impressive feat despite winning being part of Sargeras's plan.

Aegwynn is likely stronger than Azshara, but your Sargeras reasonings are very flawed.

[Magical Mudcrab]

“Last time i checked titans can not be killed. ( argus weirdly was ?).”

Titans can die. Read Chronicle.

How can we believe that Titans can die? Just because we killed the world soul of one and Chronicle explicitly says they can die? I am unconvinced. Until I see some written material saying they can die and have killed one myself I refuse to believe it. /s

[baskev]

It was flat-out said in Chronicle that Norgannon saved the Pantheon from death. Their spirits are strong, but not that strong.

I think Aegwynn, and Medivh for that matter, are stronger than Azshara. My problem is that you're involving Sargeras as the reason why and that does nothing to prove why Aegwynn is stronger.

Aegynn was never empowered by Sargeras, Medivh was. Azshara wasn't seen as a threat to the Legion, because Azshara wasn't actively trying to combat the Legion. I have no doubt that if she was against the Legion, she would've been seen as a serious threat since Mannoroth was unable to overpower her.

Azshara's most impressive feat is blocking teleportation in Nazjatar, while Aegwynns is overpowering an Avatar of Sargeras. Still an impressive feat despite winning being part of Sargeras's plan.

Aegwynn is likely stronger than Azshara, but your Sargeras reasonings are very flawed.

Again, i can have things wrong. So i am going to asume that not 100% of what i say is 100% correct all the time.

And your problem was that i used Sargeras. He was the only one who might have face other beings of power. So we could compare the power levels.
Yes it might be flawed. But atleast i tried to make reason and tried to use facts instead of getting pitchforks and calling me stupid ( what some people did). I can make mistakes, so can you and others. So stop falling back on it.

[Arikara]

Most of Azshara's supposed power was bound up in having the Well of Eternity at her fingertips. Without that, she is significantly less impressive

Without direct access to the Well, Aegwynn comes out as both more skilled in terms of practical combat (if not in spellcraft and manipulation), and as more powerful

[OwenBurton]

Velen's not even that weak, tbh. Hell, KJ accepted Sargeras' gift mainly DUE to his jealousy over Velen's gift of being the one with the greatest vision, faith, and magical prowess. Also, really? That imo makes more sense. I thought you meant combined however. She's maybe as strong as one of the Triumvirate members, but idk about all 3 of em prior to their corruption.

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Ok...but like...

You're NOT wrong. Well, in regards to Jailer Anduin, that is.

Velen was able to stalemate Kil'jaeden at least briefly (and he seems potent enough to purify naaru, he was the one who rekindled the Sunwell). And as the cosmic forces are equal - the Light should be as formidable as the Legion, especially as its Army ended the Burning Crusade.

I'm not sure who would win. But I'm kind of surprised most people overwhelmingly think Azshara would lose; Nazjatar implied she was far more powerful than the likes of Jaina and Thalyssra at least. I thought everyone felt she was the strongest mage ever alive.

[TheFirstOnes]

Velen was able to stalemate Kil'jaeden at least briefly (and he seems potent enough to purify naaru, he was the one who rekindled the Sunwell). And as the cosmic forces are equal - the Light should be as formidable as the Legion, especially as its Army ended the Burning Crusade.

I'm not sure who would win. But I'm kind of surprised most people overwhelmingly think Azshara would lose; Nazjatar implied she was far more powerful than the likes of Jaina and Thalyssra at least. I thought everyone felt she was the strongest mage ever alive.

Jaina and Thalyssra aren't even that impressive. Hell, I'd argue Khadgar is about as impressive, if not more impressive than Jaina.

[Aleksej89]

Frankly the guardian always felt like bull* cause there is no way even a bunch of human magi could put enough power into a single person to rival any greater being.

I dont recall was there more lore to where they get that power from but i remember it always being such "superman overpowered" levels of boring.

[TheFirstOnes]

Frankly the guardian always felt like bull* cause there is no way even a bunch of human magi could put enough power into a single person to rival any greater being.

I dont recall was there more lore to where they get that power from but i remember it always being such "superman overpowered" levels of boring.

We're literally so much more powerful than any Guardian + Me'dan, that shit doesn't matter anymore.

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Maybe not singularly (Tho...lol?), but when the Players team, Guardians are like Scenario bosses. Not even Dungeon bosses LUL

[Alanar]

Azshara would win.

But her arrogance would be her undoing.

[Shaqthefat]

Again, i can have things wrong. So i am going to asume that not 100% of what i say is 100% correct all the time.

And your problem was that i used Sargeras. He was the only one who might have face other beings of power. So we could compare the power levels.
Yes it might be flawed. But atleast i tried to make reason and tried to use facts instead of getting pitchforks and calling me stupid ( what some people did). I can make mistakes, so can you and others. So stop falling back on it.

I'm not saying you can't make mistakes. I'm not falling back on anything, I was simply pointing out why Sargeras was a bad example to use for why Aegywnn was more powerful than Azshara.

[baskev]

I'm not saying you can't make mistakes. I'm not falling back on anything, I was simply pointing out why Sargeras was a bad example to use for why Aegywnn was more powerful than Azshara.

you where, several post you keep brining it up.

And yes i also agreed he was a bad example. But like i said, i atleast tried to.

Better example would have been: archimond could beat azshara ( most likely). So could aegwynn beat him, or do we know someone who can beat him that inturn aegwynn has fought?

[Shaqthefat]

you where, several post you keep brining it up.

And yes i also agreed he was a bad example. But like i said, i atleast tried to.

Better example would have been: archimond could beat azshara ( most likely). So could aegwynn beat him, or do we know someone who can beat him that inturn aegwynn has fought?

I don't think Aegwynn could beat Archimonde honestly. Archimonde has more experience than Azshara and Aegwynn combined and was the best of the Eredar Mage (Pre-Corruption).