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  1. #781
    Quote Originally Posted by MechanoDruid View Post
    Yep, pretty much.

    But you don't want that, you want to get boosted by players with higher score who have completed KSM, so you are using RIO. Which is why RIO is cancer and new system is shit.
    I can tell you arent aware how bad the wow community is at playing the game if you say this lmao, is raider.io perfect? no, will mythic+ score be perfect? no, is it better to have nothing? ofc not, players are absolutely awful at the game and people will take w/e tool there is to avoid these players even if the tool is flawed, sometimes i think people dont even play this game.

  2. #782
    Quote Originally Posted by MechanoDruid View Post
    Yep, pretty much.

    But you don't want that, you want to get boosted by players with higher score who have completed KSM, so you are using RIO. Which is why RIO is cancer and new system is shit.

    Without stupid system you'd have to find other players who want to get KSM, push keys together. Might get some players who'd be doing that for fun. But because RIO exists, even if you are not using RIO, large enough part of player base near KSM level are using it, so players with high score see that you don't have KSM and avoid your group, thus making your task harder than it would have been if KSM didn't exist at all.

    Systems that are designed to divide player base are always bad in what supposed to be MMO. Blizzard should have never exposed runs data, which made RIO possible.
    Seems more like you want to luck into good groups you dont have the experience for vs using it as a way to judge player ability. RIO is a godsend for having the best chance to complete a key. I dont want to RNG my way through it.

  3. #783
    Quote Originally Posted by MechanoDruid View Post
    Systems that are designed to divide player base are always bad in what supposed to be MMO. Blizzard should have never exposed runs data, which made RIO possible.
    M+ is best experienced with a premade group of people who are likeminded. Remove rio and all you will do will be a "come to Oribos bank for inspection" and kill most of the pugging. Cool looking powerful raid gear is dividing community into raiders and scrubs too... Also..
    Guilds are bad then. Guilds are designed to gather up like minded and similarly skilled players and essentially removing them from whole game community as they are in a guild bubble and not available. You don't see top guild players doing some casual mythic raids in pugs. Also to join good guild they have insane requirements - good parses and past raiding experience at required level and time commitment.

  4. #784
    Quote Originally Posted by MechanoDruid View Post
    Systems that are designed to divide player base are always bad in what supposed to be MMO. Blizzard should have never exposed runs data, which made RIO possible.
    Then dont play wow, cause these "systems" existed since vanilla, unless you are delusional enough to believe that there was a gold time when everyone invited anyone, which is ofc false, as a player you were always judged, you are always judged and you will always be judged, the only thing that changes is the tools used for this.

  5. #785
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post

    I have 1187 rio with all 14 in time and there’s no way to get invited in a single 15 because party makers think that with me they won’t be able to bruteforce the key (that can be true to an extent, of course).
    But you always can do your key. You have 0 15s timed, so it does not matter what 15 you get - it's an upgrade. Getting into a group is not a problem if you are the one whos choosing.
    I am a tank. I literally can get into any group I want in +2 to +20 levels but I very rarely do, because creating your own group is way better than joining someone's key. I know it's not very relatable as I don't have to wait for tanks, but I would do same if I mained DPS, I do that on my alt mage, I play frost, no pug ever wants a frost mage (I always let ppl know when I que up) unless they need venthyr which is not meta for frost in m+.

  6. #786
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    But you always can do your key. You have 0 15s timed, so it does not matter what 15 you get - it's an upgrade. Getting into a group is not a problem if you are the one whos choosing.
    I am a tank. I literally can get into any group I want in +2 to +20 levels but I very rarely do, because creating your own group is way better than joining someone's key. I know it's not very relatable as I don't have to wait for tanks, but I would do same if I mained DPS, I do that on my alt mage, I play frost, no pug ever wants a frost mage (I always let ppl know when I que up) unless they need venthyr which is not meta for frost in m+.
    On my healer I much prefer running my own key. I can guarantee I get a tank that I actually want to heal lol

  7. #787
    Dreadlord Molvonos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    But you always can do your key.
    Therein lies the problem for a lot of the people bitching.

    They dont want to have to work building the group that will carry them, they just wanna be as lazy as possible.

    Like homie putting words in people's mouths.

    Back to the opinion piece, I love raider.io. do I believe it's an absolute indicator of skill? No, but I do believe it's about 85% of it.

    What people dont seem to realize is that it shows you have experience running keys. Would I wanna risk my +15 on a tank who has 300 io? Heck no, because he likely doesnt know the pulls, how to kite, how to position, etc.

    How will he learn though? They cry.

    Doing lower level keys. Gaining experience appropriate to their io and skill level rather than getting carried.

    Pretty simple.

    If you cant find a group for whatever reason (hint: join a guild/community), start your own group with your own keys.
    Personal Preference and Opinions ≠ Facts, Truth, or Logic

  8. #788
    Quote Originally Posted by Molvonos View Post
    Therein lies the problem for a lot of the people bitching.
    Deflection of problems is a big one here. There is always something preventing them doing the simplest of things. Noob tanks, bad schedule, no time to play, no friends and so on.
    Two of my group members are literally couple of randoms who asked if I am looking for DPS to do keys with last week, trialed couple of tyrannical keys to see if they aren't some ragers. One was 1.5k score and other was 1.7k nearly. Now they are both 1.9+k just because they approached me and we teamed up to knock few 20s down and before that they were mainly pugging. Have a good run with player who is in a same boat as you? Simple "Can I add you?" is all you need to do.

  9. #789
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    But you always can do your key. You have 0 15s timed, so it does not matter what 15 you get - it's an upgrade. Getting into a group is not a problem if you are the one whos choosing.
    I am a tank. I literally can get into any group I want in +2 to +20 levels but I very rarely do, because creating your own group is way better than joining someone's key. I know it's not very relatable as I don't have to wait for tanks, but I would do same if I mained DPS, I do that on my alt mage, I play frost, no pug ever wants a frost mage (I always let ppl know when I que up) unless they need venthyr which is not meta for frost in m+.
    It’s not that I can also, I can only.

    But this contributes to keep the system flawed because of course I will want to have my key timed so I will also choose overrioed ppl... that is the reason why I can’t join others’ groups.

    I don’t understand why everything works more or less as intended until 13-14 and then you suddenly have to push your keys or nothing.

  10. #790
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    On my healer I much prefer running my own key. I can guarantee I get a tank that I actually want to heal lol
    Exactly. When you join a NW and see that party leader has priest mage and druid as DPS you know that it will be tough ride. I would rather not commit to such masochistic experience.

  11. #791
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    Exactly. When you join a NW and see that party leader has priest mage and druid as DPS you know that it will be tough ride. I would rather not commit to such masochistic experience.
    Lol necrotic bolt time

  12. #792
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    But this contributes to keep the system flawed because of course I will want to have my key timed so I will also choose overrioed ppl...
    Then disable your Raider.io and take whoever floats your boat.

  13. #793
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    I don’t understand why everything works more or less as intended until 13-14 and then you suddenly have to push your keys or nothing.
    I think u do understand tho. In 10s, u get ppl qing who need 10s. These are the ppl who have timed 8-9s. In 13s, u get ppl qing who need 13s. Ppl who have timed mostly 12s. Then u hit 15. U get ppl who need 15s. The ppl that need 15s are those that timed 14s. The other group that needs 15s are the ones doing it for vault, or doing it for 210 gear to upgrade with valor. This 2nd group has timed 15s, some have timed 20s, some even have 22 /23s. Now you are competing against them too and they have every right to be in this key.

  14. #794
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    But this contributes to keep the system flawed because of course I will want to have my key timed so I will also choose overrioed ppl... that is the reason why I can’t join others’ groups.
    So you know that it is rational. But you have an option to go against these "flaws" but you have to be ready to pay the price. It is as flawed as companies not wanting to fully finance their workforce education, you can go against the system, but be ready to pay your incompetent employees the salary and full education price until they are competent enough. Easy way is just to hire competent people. Is that a society flaw? Maybe, but that is how human nature works.

  15. #795
    Quote Originally Posted by Guilford View Post
    We should just bring some of these anti-R.IO people to some keys. Let 'em show us their skill.
    But I want to time my +8 keys...

  16. #796
    Quote Originally Posted by guru-gamer View Post
    Then disable your Raider.io and take whoever floats your boat.
    Taking a 1200 dude for a 15 is not “taking whoever” it’s taking people that on paper are capable to do that content.

    People just want to bruteforce keys and that’s all. I can somehow understand that, but at least let’s not suppose it isn’t true. Rio is not used to find proper people, it’s used to find overqualified people.

  17. #797
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Taking a 1200 dude for a 15 is not “taking whoever” it’s taking people that on paper are capable to do that content.

    People just want to bruteforce keys and that’s all. I can somehow understand that, but at least let’s not suppose it isn’t true. Rio is not used to find proper people, it’s used to find overqualified people.
    Did u use Rios in your +12s? Did u invite ppl with 800ish score. I know i did

  18. #798
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Taking a 1200 dude for a 15 is not “taking whoever” it’s taking people that on paper are capable to do that content.

    People just want to bruteforce keys and that’s all. I can somehow understand that, but at least let’s not suppose it isn’t true. Rio is not used to find proper people, it’s used to find overqualified people.
    You are still holding onto this argument 2 weeks after, drop it already.

    Things are simple, the way the game is designed everyone can scale their gear to similar levels after a certain period of time.

    Now combine that with every Volcanic and Quaking week, hell even Grevious and Sanguine weeks, and you have freebie weeks that gear can easily carry literally no matter what.

    If you havent understood yet where i am going with this.

    Someone that has 1100-1300 raider.io since lets say, February 2021, lets not say the actual timetables which are more accurate, isnt the same with someone that has 1300 raider.io in May 2021, generally.

    This cant be seen in game, but it can be seen on the site, no one will bother to check also because they will get better applications either way so there is no reason to delve that deep.

    I dont bother with keys higher than 15, never cared unless people just pester me to tank them, i have been at 1200-1300 for weeks before i got my KSM because i couldnt care, then they announced the Valor stuff and obviously had to unlock it and got it the same week, where i passed the 1300 mark and got it, etc etc.

    I am still at the same raider.io for the last 3 months, if i try to apply at a +20, of course i am gonna get denied, and i know why, i aint fucking stupid, it doesnt matter if i can do it or not, there is nothing that can show the other player that i wont destroy the run.

    The 1200 player is the same, its May 2021, if you were any decent or remotely dedicated to the game even 5%, you would have done KSM, 2-3 months ago minimum, and farming alts or just playing for fun by now.

    People really need to accept the segregation this game has and their actual skill level, but they refuse to do so.

    If you are behind the curve for any particular reason (IRL life matters/lack of skill) whatever it might be, its no ones obligation to deal with you, you should know your level and adapt to it, aka find similar people to play with.
    Last edited by potis; 2021-05-04 at 02:31 PM.

  19. #799
    Quote Originally Posted by Guilford View Post
    We should just bring some of these anti-R.IO people to some keys. Let 'em show us their skill and knowledge of the dungeons. No comms, either. They KNOW what to do.
    That's a bit mean. I am not concerned about "skill" as such, because while a lot of rio haters make is sound that we imply that rio=skill, which is not, but it has strong correlation in higher keys, rio actually is experience rating. Some somewhere mentioned about 2.2k tank doing some "stupid" pulls, while actually chances are tank just overestimated experience of his group - either with dealing with mobs or hesitating to use CDs. You see that a lot in HPalas, Ashen Hallow has 4min cd, so they are very hesitant to use it on big dick pulls, but if he had experience he would know that boss either won't need his AH or that it will be back by the time you pull the boss. Not having AH on forty week boss might loose you 30sec, but having to do 2 pulls instead of one pull looses you a minute.

  20. #800
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Rio is not used to find proper people, it’s used to find overqualified people.
    I'm not aware of any strict guidelines or definition for how to properly use Raider.io scores.

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