In-game Raider.io score

[kaminaris]

It was a rat race to have the "fictional badge of honor" that you finished X raid prior to Y date because that proved you didn't need Z nerf to help you.

That is literal opposite of rat race. I know you are trying very hard to bend it to fit your own narrative but that is not how it works. Rat race doesn't give boosts to late runners just to help them clear content.

[erifwodahs]

That is literal opposite of rat race. I know you are trying very hard to bend it to fit your own narrative but that is not how it works. Rat race doesn't give boosts to late runners just to help them clear content.

Well, it's not a rat race now either then as we had a soft nerf by more/higher lvl conduits plus a ton of blizzard nerfs. There is no single reason to be "rat racing" on normal level as you can wait few months for way easier game.

[chiddie]

Rudeness and abusive isn't the same.
You can get infracted/banned in WoW if you call someone a "cunt", a "fucking idiot" etc. Also racist whispers etc. So if you use very specific language you can get in trouble. The same goes for you character name. And threats is also a no-go.
You can also get infracted/banned if you try to circumvent ignores.

Blizzard will never tell you if your report resulted in an infraction against a named player. That doesn't mean that that person didn't get an infraction.

So if someone talks to you in a way you don't like, but doesn't use banned words or threatens you, then you should ignore said person. And if said person circumvents your ignore then you can report him.

So if someone would write to me "You are the worst hunter I have ever played with. You suck and should uninstall the game." then I don't think that would lead to an infraction.

But if that person would continue to whisper me, whilst not using banned words, even after I had told him to stop and if I then put him on ignore and he would make another character to keep whispering me then an infraction would most likely happen.

Added:
Although people say that support has gotten much worse. The last time I used support was in WoD where someone kept avoiding my ignores to whisper me. Those whispers stopped after my report. Who knows what happened.

But apart from that I just put repeat whisperers on ignore. Works like a charm. No-one has tried to circumvent my ignore since WoD.

Given that if I don’t have feedback about people I reported being sanctioned somehow renders the reports near to useless, of course I won’t report “dude you’re a bad player”.

Last time I had to report someone, “retarded” was the most gentle word of the sequence.

Now I usually can’t bother to waste my time reporting because as I said with no feedback it just seems a waste of time, but when I’m insulted when it’s not my fault I just can’t pass. No one can feel entitled to insult me after he pulled the entire NW Necropolis at the same time and I couldn’t keep up with damage with my heals so “it was my fault”.

And since this happens constantly, either there are too much reports for the GM to handle or GM simply don’t care anymore, 1 person on 10000 is punished and people just continue insulting.

[Twdft]

But apart from that I just put repeat whisperers on ignore. Works like a charm. No-one has tried to circumvent my ignore since WoD.

/ignore effects the account since about WoD. If you ignore someone on your char "T-34" no char on the other account can whisper T-34, but other chars of yours if they know them. Test it with a friend.

[Niwes]

I don't get what you mean by the "normal" and "super-comfortable" path.
Either people are allowed 100% freedom to pick whom they play with, the system we have now, or people should be limited in their ability to pick whom they play with.
And WoW differs in one substantial way from the job market: You have the exact same possibilities to start up your own business (a group) as everybody else. Be your own boss and "hire" people based on your own standards. Compete and prosper!

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But we have this system now!
Raider.io specifically shows other people your experience with the content that you want to find other people to do.
Experience in single-player content, as in D3, is considerable more irrelevant compared to Raider.io as it only shows your experience in single-player content, whereas Raider.io shows your experience in doing relevant group content.

So people now can use a very useful tool, raider.io, to filter out entitled players or they can make their own group based on whatever other criteria they want: They can do it based on ilvl, name, server or whatever other criteria they want.

I don't care if someone is able to do some single-player challenge, I want to know if someone is able to interact and overcome group content with other people, because M+ tests your ability to do exact that and not your ability to do single-player "challenges". And that is exactly what raider.io helps you to know.

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It is very easy to spot if someone has bought one of each dungeon on 15+.
Furthermore such people don't run M+ after they have bought their achievement. People buy M+ boosts not to play more M+, but in order not to play M+.

The odds of you running in to someone who has bought his score is absurdly low, whereas if you don't use the tools available for you to filter out entitled players, then you could get your key busted.
The "dangerous" people for your key aren't those that buy boosts, but the entitled players that think that they have a right to be carried by you.

previously basic discussion aspects and arguments aside: especially in your last sentance is a lot of truth.

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Fortunately, it’s very easy to spot boosted players.

good question if this still is true, for Blizzards m+ scoring. i doubt that, cause blizz wanna feed their smart cash grab system (token). but at least the high rated players will, exactly for that reason, still using r.io.

[craigw]

man this thread still going? people are still butthurt they wont get picked for a M+ key? has the answer "get good" been used yet? or the classic i got a 1300 io but cant get into 10 keys (the score equals all 13s)? Or the one such as i dont have the proper utility to get into anything higher than a 9, so i dont get invited excuse. please inform me.

[kaminaris]

Well, it's not a rat race now either then as we had a soft nerf by more/higher lvl conduits plus a ton of blizzard nerfs. There is no single reason to be "rat racing" on normal level as you can wait few months for way easier game.

That is some next level mental gymnastics here. Getting better gear was never a part of any race, its just standard mechanic of RPGs. And going with that logic you can wait till expansion is over to get even easier content, except by then, nobody will care about that content.

The thing is nerfs are not done in faith to help players clear content but because something was clearly overtuned compared to others (ex bosses). Rolling nerfs are literally done to help players clear the raid. Not because it was overtuned. Plus they were expected.

Rat race:
a way of life in which people are caught up in a fiercely competitive struggle for wealth or power.

Do you struggle for power now? Yes you do, otherwise you won't be invited to higher keys (or fail them). And mechanics like [irrelevant score] encourages that because
Between two people with [5x Mists done on +15] the one with better class/spec and higher score will win. To push that score you gotta do other dungeons as well even if you don't like some of them. This is just dumb pressure.

SO: aside from ilvl/gearscore you have additional barrier.
Add to that much more complex specs, much more complex bosses, timers and you should be able to understand how environment has changed.

[Minikin]

The addon (and the website) show your best for each specific dungeon so I don't even understand what we're even bickering about.

This is our safe space tziva!

[erifwodahs]

power.

Do you struggle for power now? Yes you do, otherwise you won't be invited to higher keys (or fail them). And mechanics like [irrelevant score] encourages that because
Between two people with [5x Mists done on +15] the one with better class/spec and higher score will win. To push that score you gotta do other dungeons as well even if you don't like some of them. This is just dumb pressure.

Actually looked at some 8 year old Preach video, it was Late Cata/Early mists? So yeah, he talked about how ridiculous it was that people in WotLK were required to have better gear than the content dropped and how you had to get achievements to get into pugs.

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man this thread still going? people are still butthurt they wont get picked for a M+ key? has the answer "get good" been used yet? or the classic i got a 1300 io but cant get into 10 keys (the score equals all 13s)? Or the one such as i dont have the proper utility to get into anything higher than a 9, so i dont get invited excuse. please inform me.

Yep. Apparently some people get more leavers/toxic people in a week than had in the last 3 years.

Also
Get into guild - they have closed groups
Community - can't because of scheduling
Do your own keys - it always fail [insert someone else to blame here]
Add people after good runs - social anxiety

Rio=toxic
Leaving=toxic
Not randomly inviting people=toxic
Playing meta class = meta slave and makes you bad at the game
Most of players buy boosts=fact

[Kaver]

good question if this still is true, for Blizzards m+ scoring. i doubt that, cause blizz wanna feed their smart cash grab system (token). but at least the high rated players will, exactly for that reason, still using r.io.

If they show 'number of dungeons completed' in different brackets then it will be easy to avoid 99.9% of the boosted players.

[Niwes]

If they show 'number of dungeons completed' in different brackets then it will be easy to avoid 99.9% of the boosted players.

yep, thats right. if they do. but i assume Blizz will hide a lot and just going to show a single number, to attract boostsers more, for token selling.

but as long as they not prevent r.io its not problematic. but imo in 3 years r.io no longer exists. when i look to what (ATVI Blizz) Blizzard became, i assume that will happen:

- they first introduce their score system
- after a while they come up with some technical/security blah blah why they have to change their API
- so r.io no longer can get all the needed data
- at this time anyway only the +15 ppl use r.io
- r.io close
- Now you have Blizz and their solely control about what you see and how much Token they can sell with

i assume, thats what happens in the next 3 years.

[Temp name]

yep, thats right. if they do. but i assume Blizz will hide a lot and just going to show a single number, to attract boostsers more, for token selling.

but as long as they not prevent r.io its not problematic. but imo in 3 years r.io no longer exists. when i look to what (ATVI Blizz) Blizzard became, i assume that will happen:

- they first introduce their score system
- after a while they come up with some technical/security blah blah why they have to change their API
- so r.io no longer can get all the needed data
- at this time anyway only the +15 ppl use r.io
- r.io close
- Now you have Blizz and their solely control about what you see and how much Token they can sell with

i assume, thats what happens in the next 3 years.

I mean, the people who only do 15s already only look at the score, so they won't need r.io anymore, which means in your pessimistic world view, Blizz would have no reason to break r.io.

Besides, even if they do break r.io, they won't sell more boosts. People don't avoid buying boosts because they think they won't be able to join dungeons anymore, they avoid buying boosts because they think it's either a waste of gold, or ruins the fun

[Niwes]

I mean, the people who only do 15s already only look at the score, so they won't need r.io anymore, which means in your pessimistic world view, Blizz would have no reason to break r.io.

Besides, even if they do break r.io, they won't sell more boosts. People don't avoid buying boosts because they think they won't be able to join dungeons anymore, they avoid buying boosts because they think it's either a waste of gold, or ruins the fun

you CLEARLY not read my text.

i said: „IF“ Blizzard will show (in example) the amount of runs (to clearly differ boosters with high score from real +15 players), then there is no problem at all. but „IF“ they do „NOT“ and just solely show a number, high rated players will need to go to r.io, to check how many runs that player did, to differ that highscored player from a booster. and ONLY in this case, blizz dont wanna r.io because it means boosting is still the same business it is today and they not selling even more tokens and therefore try to prevent r.io.

or in short: Blizz sells less Tokens when ppl can differ high rated players from boosters. if ppl can not differ them, they sell more tokens. this means, „IF“ Blizzard is that greedy, they will try to prevent that differing. and one way to do this, is to implement your own score (just a single number, no extra informations) and after a while shutdown r.io (and the extra informations). so ppl solely rely on Blizzards one and only number without the possibility to differ boosters and real high rated players. this would support sellling of tokens. „IF“ they are that greedy and do that.

hopefully you now

a) read the „UPPERCASE“ words
b) got even at all what i am talking

then you can stop giving totally clueless „i did not even read your posts“ answers...

[klaps_05]

Blizzard system SO FAR just looks pretty barebones, off the top of my head:

1. Huge numbers for score instead of smaller amounts similar to PVP.
2. No website to filter runs by affixes/region/faction/etc.
3. Runs actual completion timer dont seem to matter for ranking (only complete/deplete, perhaps only 2/3 chest will give more points?).
4. No link between mains/alts.
5. No number of completed runs / per bracket runs.
6. No number in tooltips.
7. Rio also provides Raid progress, which Blizzards system doesnt.

Now of course some of the things above may be added, but usually when something hits the PTR, especially systems wise, it means they are showing 99% of the final product and you wont see any changes for at least 1-2 major patches (e.g. practically every system that has been on PTR since legion).

[Wuusah]

To reach KSM in 9.1 players will have to get a score that you reach when you beat all dungeons on +15 in both fortified and tyrannical. Doing higher keys gives you leeway because you only need the cumulative score.

Honestly, I like it. It gives players more reasons to play in tyrannical weeks as well as reasons to go into higher keys and makes buying boosts more annoying because you need double the amount of boosts to get the mount.

The only bad thing about this is that the mount is just a recolor of the S1 mount…

[Coldkil]

To reach KSM in 9.1 players will have to get a score that you reach when you beat all dungeons on +15 in both fortified and tyrannical. Doing higher keys gives you leeway because you only need the cumulative score.

Honestly, I like it. It gives players more reasons to play in tyrannical weeks as well as reasons to go into higher keys and makes buying boosts more annoying because you need double the amount of boosts to get the mount.

The only bad thing about this is that the mount is just a recolor of the S1 mount…

It's not more reasons. It's literally "having to" (or do all fortified at 24 in comparison). I don't see how making people do twice the stuff for the same rewards is good. It tackles some issues as you pointed out but i don't think the balance is overall positive.

[Twdft]

It's not more reasons. It's literally "having to" (or do all fortified at 24 in comparison). I don't see how making people do twice the stuff for the same rewards is good. It tackles some issues as you pointed out but i don't think the balance is overall positive.

Are there really people who only play every other week and completely disregard tyrannical?

Just do 16s on fortified and 14s on tyrannical weeks.

[erifwodahs]

Are there really people who only play every other week and completely disregard tyrannical?

Just do 16s on fortified and 14s on tyrannical weeks.

There would be more people who play both weeks if they made the balance better. We still do keys on tyrannical weeks but with way less enthusiasm as it just sucks.

[Coldkil]

Are there really people who only play every other week and completely disregard tyrannical?

Just do 16s on fortified and 14s on tyrannical weeks.

A lot of them. Preach did a video in conjunction with raider.io and the data doesn't lie (as the fact 99% of players chose their covenant based on the performance and nothing else, while Blizzard thinks people will go based on looks, story or whatever else).

[Twdft]

A lot of them. Preach did a video in conjunction with raider.io and the data doesn't lie (as the fact 99% of players chose their covenant based on the performance and nothing else, while Blizzard thinks people will go based on looks, story or whatever else).

There is a difference but it is a lot closer than you perhaps think:
18.7 million fortified runs
14.5 million tyrannical runs

That's probably more like "fuck it I only do 1 instead of the usual 4" than players ignoring tyrannical completely.