Israel and Palestine Conflict Heats Up

[Forogil]

An attack on a media building is an attack on journalists.

No, it isn't. I don't understand why you keep insisting on that misinformation.

It was an attack on a building that also houses media. Civilians, including journalists, have special protection during war - but normal civilian building don't have that special protection.

An attack on journalists' capacity to do their jobs and broadcast for distribution is an attack on journalists.

Their job has no special protection during war, as it isn't deemed as essential as a doctor's work.

[Machismo]

First and foremost that wasn't the original claim.

But great that we have moved on from the false claim that it was an attack on journalists (which would have been bad), and now focus on whether it was an attack on media.


Misleading comparison again. Targeting civilian hospitals and some other things is bad - and as far as I can see water treatment plants are among those special targets.

But buildings with media companies aren't among them - they are just normal civilian buildings and targeting them isn't ideal - but certainly not as bad targeting civilians, or specially protected buildings like civilian hospitals and water treatment plants.


You are continuously confusing really shitty action (like attacking a water treatment plant) with an attack on a building that housed media, residentials - and possibly was used by Hamas.

I don't understand why you are that confused and focus all the attention on that.

Targeting the media is bad.

Full fucking stop.

[Endus]

No, it isn't. I don't understand why you keep insisting on that misinformation.

It isn't misinformation.

It's the same rationale that blowing up someone's house is an attack on that person. Or that shooting up a school is an attack on students, even if nobody dies.

You're making a completely ridiculous attempt to separate an attack on the building from an attack on the people within, and argue that it only "counts" as an attack on the people if they are personally injured, ignoring the psychological harm, the damage to equipment, the loss of capacity, and so on.

It's a standard that would not be applied in any other instance, but you want to use it here, because for some reason, you support attacking journalists.

It was an attack on a building that also houses media. Civilians, including journalists, have special protection during war - but normal civilian building don't have that special protection.

So you're okay with the Hamas rocket attacks, then?

Same argument you're making applies there, too, but you won't apply your argument consistently. Hamas has no capacity to attack individuals directly, because their rockets are unguided and they can't target more accurately than aiming in the general direction of a building.

Their job has no special protection during war, as it isn't deemed as essential as a doctor's work.

Nobody was suggesting they had special protection. You're moving goalposts, because you can't deal with what people actually argued.

[Forogil]

Targeting the media is bad.

We don't know that they targeted the media, and as I repeatedly have stated the media doesn't have any special protection during wars.

The simple fact is that: War is bad.

[Shadowferal]

We don't know that they targeted the media,

No. You're the only person that doesn't know.
Everyone else? Yeah we're past that.

[Forogil]

Nobody was suggesting they had special protection.

As many of your other statements this is false, your misinformation, hyperboles, and falsehoods are tiring.

There have been posts comparing media with things that have special protection, like hospitals and water treatment facilities; which exactly suggests that media buildings have special protection. And journalists as persons are seen as civilians during war, and thus have special protection - in contrast to their buildings.

[Machismo]

We don't know that they targeted the media, and as I repeatedly have stated the media doesn't have any special protection during wars.

The simple fact is that: War is bad.

They knew it was a media building, they bombed it into the ground.

They targeted the fucking media.

Stop defending it.

[Endus]

As many of your other statements this is false, your misinformation, hyperboles, and falsehoods are tiring.

Feel free to directly quote where I ever claimed journalists enjoyed special protection under international law.

You're just lying, openly and brazenly.

There have been posts comparing media with things that have special protection, like hospitals and water treatment facilities; which exactly suggests that media buildings have special protection. And journalists as persons are seen as civilians during war, and thus have special protection - in contrast to their buildings.

Were those people making arguments about international law, or were they making comments on the ethics and intent?

You're demanding it must have been the former, but you have no basis for that assumption.

You keep shifting goalposts as needed. Much like how attacking civilian buildings is totally fine when it's Israel, but terrible when it's Hamas, according to you.

[ati87]

We don't know that they targeted the media, and as I repeatedly have stated the media doesn't have any special protection during wars.

The simple fact is that: War is bad.

Attacking civilians is a war crime....so media does have protection.

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As many of your other statements this is false, your misinformation, hyperboles, and falsehoods are tiring.

There have been posts comparing media with things that have special protection, like hospitals and water treatment facilities; which exactly suggests that media buildings have special protection. And journalists as persons are seen as civilians during war, and thus have special protection - in contrast to their buildings.

So what would have happend if they stayed in the building?

[Forogil]

No. You're the only person that doesn't know.
Everyone else? Yeah we're past that.

Not really, as as most who considered it understood that it wouldn't stop the reporting; so it requires that the Israeli did something that they knew would backfire. That doesn't imply that the Israeli necessarily told the truth - just that one would need to dig deeper.

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Attacking civilians is a war crime....so media does have protection.

Attacking civilian persons, including journalists, is a war crime. That's why calling it an attack on journalists is deliberately misleading.

Hospitals and some other things also have that special protection, but not the media.

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Feel free to directly quote where I ever claimed journalists enjoyed special protection under international law.

You claimed that journalists were attacked, when they weren't.

And I'm a bit unsure what you are arguing for: I'm stating that civilians persons, including journalists, do have special protection under international law.

Nobody was suggesting they had special protection.

Were those people making arguments about international law, or were they making comments on the ethics and intent?

They were clearly suggesting that media buildings had special protection by comparing them to hospitals and water treatment that does have special protection.

[Shadowferal]

Not really, as as most who considered it understood that it wouldn't stop the reporting; so it requires that the Israeli did something that ...

Who is this "most" posting here?

[deenman]

Yeah, no. Considering Arabs are ~20% of population, have almost zero presence in armed forces, against Jews of whom majority have served (remember, mandatory draft, including women) + high level of patriotism it would make for a very onesided war. At most, West Bank might try to do something, but I can't see it mattering.

Plenty of non arabs in israel are against him,the guy is as bad as they come in our modern days,he is a few steps away from bring like kim jong,hes been facing corruption charges for years now,the only reason he is able to get away with it is because he knows he has usa in his back pocket

[downnola]

Benjamin Netanyahu is a literal holocaust revisionist. he and his government are no better than apartheid South Africa but even more brazen with their fascist beliefs.

This is the same guy that refused to be in the same building as Edward Said during a TV interview when he was Israel's ambassador to the UN in the 80s. His reasoning was he was afraid that Said, a professor of literature at Columbia University, wanted to kill him. The dude has always been unhinged and bigoted.

[Easo]

Plenty of non arabs in israel are against him,the guy is as bad as they come in our modern days,he is a few steps away from bring like kim jong,hes been facing corruption charges for years now,the only reason he is able to get away with it is because he knows he has usa in his back pocket

And those plenty of non-Arabs are unlikely to ever join hands with Arabs to overthrow Bibi.
This talk of civil war between various Jew factions seems really far fetched to me.

Look into it if you have time. The situation is really tense.

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/...-now-1.9500059

"For 40 years, Israel has allowed a radical separatism, fed by political extortion and impunity, to flourish. That Haredi sedition, empowered by its blatant defiance of COVID rules, is now a danger to the Jewish state"

Those are the same people who do not even serve the armed forces. It is a big minority, but it still is a minority. Pretty sure hammer would come down hard if they actually tried to do something. As for the far right groups - going to assume you won't get more than few thousand people actually capable of stirring shit up.

I really am not seeing it.

[Cringefest]

And those plenty of non-Arabs are unlikely to ever join hands with Arabs to overthrow Bibi.
This talk of civil war between various Jew factions seems really far fetched to me.



Those are the same people who do not even serve the armed forces. It is a big minority, but it still is a minority. Pretty sure hammer would come down hard if they actually tried to do something. As for the far right groups - going to assume you won't get more than few thousand people actually capable of stirring shit up.

I really am not seeing it.

The article actually describes well what happens when the government tries to control them. It's not a numbers game. It's not a matter of believing it. The problem is already there and is already out of hand.

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And those plenty of non-Arabs are unlikely to ever join hands with Arabs to overthrow Bibi.
This talk of civil war between various Jew factions seems really far fetched to me.



Those are the same people who do not even serve the armed forces. It is a big minority, but it still is a minority. Pretty sure hammer would come down hard if they actually tried to do something. As for the far right groups - going to assume you won't get more than few thousand people actually capable of stirring shit up.

I really am not seeing it.

Just checking the news now and stumbled upon this.

https://www.euronews.com/2021/05/16/...ynagogue-colla

[tehdang]

Absolutely. The damage Netanyahu has done to his own country is beyond appalling. I'm not sure many people understand that Israel is running head straight into civil war.

There won't be an intra-Israeli civil war as long as hearing sirens in major metros from Hamas rockets is a recent memory for most Israelis.

The worst civil war they'll get is another election without a ruling majority. Ironically, Netanyahu could've already been out and Arabs been established in a ruling majority, had Hamas not gone on a rocket spree during coalition formation talks.

[Belize]

Yo, so is targeting Médecins Sans Frontières hospitals war-crimey enough yet, or is that also justified?

In case you know, targeting civilians and and journalists wasn't already crossing the line?

[PC2]

Yo, so is targeting Médecins Sans Frontières hospitals war-crimey enough yet, or is that also justified?

In case you know, targeting civilians and and journalists wasn't already crossing the line?

When Palestinian militants stop using hospitals and news buildings for military and terrorist purposes then that won't happen anymore.

[downnola]

When Palestinian militants stop using hospitals and news buildings for military and terrorist purposes then that won't happen anymore.

Which of course is what Israel is telling everyone to justify their actions. Too bad nobody can confirm and verify because they level entire buildings so it's impossible to know for sure. But hey, they have such a great track record I suppose we can just trust them right?

[uuuhname]

When Palestinian militants stop using hospitals and news buildings for military and terrorist purposes then that won't happen anymore.

there is no evidence of this being the case, really anywhere, other than the cavernous ass the IDF pulls this "intelligence" from.