How to Improve the Gear Rewards Systems of WoW!

[arkanon]

I can't speak for everyone, but the exact point of this thread is to come up with a way to adequately reward players who do more "difficult" content while allowing the same gear progression for players through world content. I believe my latest proposal is a viable solution.

What "problem" does offering those who complete group content an even larger lead over those who dont solve?

I ask because by far the most common complaint around here at least, is players who cant/wont do group content complaining that those who do have vastly better gear, and that is making it "impossible" to find a group if they do decide they want to. This "solution" only seems to exacerbate that "problem".

So I ask again - what problem is this a solution for?

[Zyky]

This is boring, couldn't you think of anything more interesting than 5% stat and stam? -.-

[arkanon]

This is boring, couldn't you think of anything more interesting than 5% stat and stam? -.-

IMO, the whole concept is.....unnecessary. Like a solution in search of a problem - i expect to see many more amendments and iterations of this as each individual says "but that doesnt help ME" and eventually we end up full circle back to where we are now - essentially the same loot and progression system we have had for nearly 2 decades.

Specifically to your point, yes, I personally find mindless 5% increases to be extremely boring - and something that naturally happens by obtaining better loot anyway...

[Zyky]

IMO, the whole concept is.....unnecessary. Like a solution in search of a problem - i expect to see many more amendments and iterations of this as each individual says "but that doesnt help ME" and eventually we end up full circle back to where we are now - essentially the same loot and progression system we have had for nearly 2 decades.

Specifically to your point, yes, I personally find mindless 5% increases to be extremely boring - and something that naturally happens by obtaining better loot anyway...

I do think there is a fundamental problem right now with the gearing system. I've always Mythic, old Heroic, Raided and since Legion it's felt obnoxious that every single tier 50-70% of my BiS is from M+ RNG loot chest. The question is how does the system get fixed so that you can keep both communities happy? Set bonuses is realistically the only thing I can personally think of that can solve the issue without entirely removing a feature of the game. The other option, which is significantly more boring is to just remove garbage versatility and make every piece have all 3 secondary stats.

[arkanon]

I do think there is a fundamental problem right now with the gearing system. I've always Mythic, old Heroic, Raided and since Legion it's felt obnoxious that every single tier 50-70% of my BiS is from M+ RNG loot chest. The question is how does the system get fixed so that you can keep both communities happy? Set bonuses is realistically the only thing I can personally think of that can solve the issue without entirely removing a feature of the game. The other option, which is significantly more boring is to just remove garbage versatility and make every piece have all 3 secondary stats.

I have recommended content specific tier bonuses for a while, but its always rejected. These suggestions usually if not always include set bonuses for world content as well, such as increased rewards, instant mount, increased mount speed, faster hearth cd etc etc etc.

I do agree that the balance between loot from m+, pvp, and raids is worse than it has been for a long time, and all these band-aid fixes Blizzard are trying to implement constantly kind of supports that theory.

Personally, I would like ALL secondary systems removed from the game completely - no grinds, no "XYZ Power", no conduits, or anything of the like, but rather go back to a straight forward gearing system. Instead of all those bonuses, we get pvp sets, open world sets, raid sets, and M+ sets. The problem with this as i see it is they would either be generic across all specs/classes, because i dont see them doing 60+ sets for EACH content type. Not sure if there is a middle ground, but thats the issue as i see it.

[Clash the DK]

This is boring, couldn't you think of anything more interesting than 5% stat and stam? -.-

As I noted in the preview, bonuses and percentages are just an example. What exactly they should be is up for debate. Although it has to be something that works for all classes for the sake of simplicity.

What "problem" does offering those who complete group content an even larger lead over those who dont solve?

I ask because by far the most common complaint around here at least, is players who cant/wont do group content complaining that those who do have vastly better gear, and that is making it "impossible" to find a group if they do decide they want to. This "solution" only seems to exacerbate that "problem".

So I ask again - what problem is this a solution for?

It creates a power-based reward structure that is not associated with your gear. Did you not say that doing more "difficult" content should have better rewards? Well, this is a way to do just that so that gear acquisition can be normalized across the board.

I don't understand the problem of people not having enough gear to find a group. So your saying they don't want to do group content, but they do want to do group content?

I have recommended content specific tier bonuses for a while, but its always rejected.

You have been railing against the topic of this thread the whole time and now you want to say that you are all for set bonuses? SMH

[arkanon]

It creates a power-based reward structure that is not associated with your gear. Did you not say that doing more "difficult" content should have better rewards? Well, this is a way to do just that so that gear acquisition can be normalized across the board.

I don't understand the problem of people not having enough gear to find a group. So your saying they don't want to do group content, but they do want to do group content?

Since you completely failed to answer the question i asked, i will ask it again: What problem is this change trying to fix?

[Zyky]

As I noted in the preview, bonuses and percentages are just an example. What exactly they should be is up for debate. Although it has to be something that works for all classes for the sake of simplicity.

No it doesn't have to work for all classes. Blizzard supported set bonuses for a decade before deciding to remove them. And every tier had dozens of set bonuses so that it would interact with a specific spec. Saying it has to be a homogenized boring passive for "simplicity" is exactly the problem that Blizzard has with designing content these days and it makes every class feel boring and the same.

[Elias1337]

I can't speak for everyone, but the exact point of this thread is to come up with a way to adequately reward players who do more "difficult" content while allowing the same gear progression for players through world content. I believe my latest proposal is a viable solution.

And this isnt possible to do becouse it goes againts nature od game desing and players behaviour. You will never ever have this in video game unleas you want that video game die.

[Wuusah]

I think its particularly unusual considering how many "casuals" claim gearing was better for them in earlier expansions - expansions that had NONE of these additional systems, I find it especially unusual.

Because those players could just queue up, do a super easy heroic dungeon, get their valor points and buy raid ilvl gear with that. Players had their progression with easy content and they were happy.

Nowadays the progression for the same content ends at almost 30 ilvls below the best ilvl and it ends rather quickly. You get your catch up gear and you’re done.

Blizzard wants to push players into non-queueable content, but somehow it’s such a huge scary wall for these players to even try to group up manually…

[Clash the DK]

Since you completely failed to answer the question i asked, i will ask it again: What problem is this change trying to fix?

I answered the question. You just don't like the answer.

No it doesn't have to work for all classes. Blizzard supported set bonuses for a decade before deciding to remove them. And every tier had dozens of set bonuses so that it would interact with a specific spec. Saying it has to be a homogenized boring passive for "simplicity" is exactly the problem that Blizzard has with designing content these days and it makes every class feel boring and the same.

We have many different areas of the game where you will find "bonuses" that apply specifically to each class. Talents, Conduits, Legendaries, etc... This specific system would play a different role.

And this isnt possible to do becouse it goes againts nature od game desing and players behaviour. You will never ever have this in video game unleas you want that video game die.

GW2 doesn't even have gear progression and yet it has been successful. So I believe that your theory is wrong.

[Zyky]

We have many different areas of the game where you will find "bonuses" that apply specifically to each class. Talents, Conduits, Legendaries, etc... This specific system would play a different role.

And past expansions had that too, you're just making excuses for boring garbage that the game doesn't need to further add to homogenization, this was the exact problem with Essences and why they were complete dogshit.

[arkanon]

Because those players could just queue up, do a super easy heroic dungeon, get their valor points and buy raid ilvl gear with that. Players had their progression with easy content and they were happy.

Nowadays the progression for the same content ends at almost 30 ilvls below the best ilvl and it ends rather quickly. You get your catch up gear and you’re done.

Blizzard wants to push players into non-queueable content, but somehow it’s such a huge scary wall for these players to even try to group up manually…

No, that system has been replaced by the M+ system, where you can earn good gear from easy content.

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I answered the question. You just don't like the answer.

Link the answer again - All i see is you trying to explain your "solution" yet again, without identifying the "problem" it is supposed to be solving. Its a simple question, why wont you answer it?

[Clash the DK]

And past expansions had that too, you're just making excuses for boring garbage that the game doesn't need to further add to homogenization, this was the exact problem with Essences and why they were complete dogshit.

Essences didn't offer very much of a power upgrade. Just one reason they were annoying.

Even using my earlier example, gaining 15% extra stats for all Raid and Dungeon content by completing a Heroic Raid or Mythic +15 would be a decent upgrade to power.

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Link the answer again - All i see is you trying to explain your "solution" yet again, without identifying the "problem" it is supposed to be solving. Its a simple question, why wont you answer it?

Once again, just for you. Because you can't be bothered to scroll up.

This creates a bonus reward system for players who participate in more "difficult" content that translates into other similar areas of the game. By adding power through accomplishments, it reduces the need for the actual gear to be the main focal point of the rewards structure. This in turn, creates an avenue for world content gear to scale to maximum ilvl just like all other gear within each patch cycle. Gear progression is the rock that WoW was founded upon. And with this new proposed system, all content would provide a long rewarding path that puts all players on equal footing within the outside World...of Warcraft.

[arkanon]

Once again, just for you. Because you can't be bothered to scroll up.

Once again - this is just outlining your "Solution" - you have not once actually outlined what the PROBLEM is as you see it.

[Amarys]

Nah warforged should be brought back.. what was wrong with it anyway?

So world content, normal and heroic dungeon, casual PvP and LFG has a very low chance of getting you BiS items but its there. Why would anyone mind if casuals get a few really good items that way? It's not a viable way to gear if you want to be competitive.

Normal raids and other that level activities have a moderate chance of giving you BiS stuff so if you don't skip anything, you are likely to get decked out by the end of the patch.

Heroic raids have a good chance of getting you these items. Youll likely gear pretty fast and get the best gear item level wise in a few months, especially when combined with side activites.

And finally mythic raids and high mythic keys would gear you pretty fast if you manage to clear them with almost guaranteed chance of a piece of BiS gear with every run. Also rewards prestige items and mounts.

[Wuusah]

No, that system has been replaced by the M+ system, where you can earn good gear from easy content

Yes but you don’t get to do M+ by just pressing a button and getting ported into the dungeon a few minutes later. You have to leave your comfort zone to progress beyond ilvl 200.
This kind of players that get left behind nowadays, they don’t want to progress through more and more difficult content. They want to play cookie clicker in WoW.

[Zyky]

Essences didn't offer very much of a power upgrade. Just one reason they were annoying.

See now I know you're just trolling. Passive Essences offered upwards of 20-30% damage increases if not more depending on certain classes.

[Clash the DK]

See now I know you're just trolling. Passive Essences offered upwards of 20-30% damage increases if not more depending on certain classes.

So you're comparing 20-30% damage increase to a single ability versus 5-20% stat increase across the board?
That affects Str/Agi/Int + Mastery/Haste/Crit + Stam.
And I'm the one trolling here?

[ASecretOne]

Resilience with extra steps. Blizzard have tried this and it was deemed an epic failure. What's the point in having bonus damage on your gear when gear will do the same thing. The solo players should not get any gear at all. Right now they should all be ilvl 175, because that's all they have earned. You are ilvl 200 because of the good grace of actual casual players. The pretend casuals should stop coming up with convoluted systems that reward them with gear they don't deserve.

The main playerbase is getting older and has less time to dedicate to things like raiding and constant pvp. Telling a major part of the playerbase "oh you don't deserve gear because you don't want to do the content I want to" is entirely elitest (not to mention cringey) and just serves to have the playerbase dwindle away even faster than it already is and has. There's nothing wrong with making world content the way for solo players to gear up at a reasonable pace so they can still play and have a sense of progression in a game that needs all the players it can get to maintain some sort of positive trajectory