Harassment over deluxe should be bannable

[Usernameforforums]

Oh yes, let's equate behavior that causes depression and might lead people to suicide to some random stranger on the Internet typing /spit while having your character selected.
A modicum of thick skin is required to survive within society, but calling /spit "harassment" is downplaying actual harassment that seriously harms the mental health of people.

Maybe there are some people that can handle more problematic harassment better than smaller harassment such as this?

[Redroniksre]

At first we're told it would be only cosmetics and that it won't have any effect in gameplay. Then they slowly brought it up to a boil and now we have boosts and WoW Tokens that are clearly pay to win. Now we're told it was always in the game and we shouldn't be complaining. I say what, I say what in tarnation just happened here?

We should have put a stop to this before it got to this point. We clearly underestimated how many whales have their moms credit cards.

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This right here. If you liked the mount then why do you care what other people think? You did buy it because it looks cool right? Not to impress others with your access to your moms wallet?

Buying a boost is not P2W, and no amounts of bitching about it will make it true. Not on retail and not on classic, not to mention on classic you can only buy one iirc. On retail, the time to level is literally so low that you are probably wasting money instead of levelling normally.

Then the tokens, oh boy. You can tell someone never played back in the day when they seem to conveniently forget that there were a lot of gold sellers. I personally know a few people who all bought gold from them, and the risk to accounts and security in general is just not worth it. Not to mention, what is the difference with someone playing the auction house and buying carries, or just buying the gold? Do you think the auction house player deserves it just because they didn't buy? They still might lack the skill to actually play, similar to a buyer?

[Prag]

If you invest time into getting better at arena you will get gladiator, it's almost inevitable. It would also most likely take the average person less time /played to get glad than it would to get 60. You are paying to skip the time you would have spent grinding; it is not different than paying for a leveling boost.

And yes, that's what I meant. Raiding in vanilla WoW is, for the most part again, a time commitment. Being able to purchase objects that boost your gear up to the minimum required level for a raid is, in my eyes, no different from buying a leveling boost.

I don't see where anyone that defends boosts can draw a line, leveling is an integral part of the game and paying to boost is is the same as paying for gear. Gear is a bi-product of tedious weekly grinds, it does not necessarily require more effort than leveling does, nor does it grant you more power than what leveling does.

Frankly, I'm starting to question why I bother with forums or even this game. Two people have an argument that comes to some sort of a conclusion and 5 posts later there's someone bringing up the same argument again because they didn't read the previous page.

You’ve somehow managed to put leveling and raiding/PvP’ing at a competitive level on the same level and I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why.

Go to the last pages of Raider.io, WCL, wowprogress, or the PvP ladder and explain why people who have put in the same/more time aren’t r1, world first, or competing in MDI.

It also misses the point that people will generally invest way more time in max level content than leveling content. Selling gear on the store won’t happen and I don’t know why it keeps being referenced.

[T-34]

Sure they can reject me for any reason that they see fit. I can also denounce them for any reason that I see fit. This is generally how a paradigm shift is initiated in a community. Point me to the link where the rules say that I cannot complain about arbitrary measures for group invites?

I would never dream of rejecting other people who ask me for an invite as long as they meet the level for the dungeon. Unlike toxic, entitled players who believe they only deserve to play with the best of the best players out there, rejecting beginners from low content.

The difference between the toxic entitlement that you are arguing for and the way Blizzard supports group making is quite simple. Let me repeat it once more:

Your argument: People have the right/should have the right to join another persons group. You are arguing that it is toxic NOT to invite people. You are trying to guilt-shame other players to invite people that they don't want to play with.

Blizzard's policy: A person has the right to invite whomever he wants to his group. That person can invite whomever he wants based on his own personal criteria. It is 100% the prerogative of the group creator to invite, manage and kick people from his group.

I should add that using vile language is against Blizzard's TOS and will result in an infraction. And it doesn't matter if you use such language against people who have bought a boost, people that don't want to play with you or any other reason whatsoever.

So I am 100% against people harassing people who have bought a boost or ride a particular mount.
But I 100% support those that don't want to play with people that have bought a boost.

Personally I don't care either way.

[Drench]

I hate boosts and IAP.

Scum of gaming. But the people who buy this crap are the reason why we have TBC. So don't get mad at them. Thank them and get bad at blizzard for allowing people to buy them.

[GreatNameForSmurfingExTee]

A. Classic has more players than Retail so shut it.
B. I came from private servers and can go right back. Monetization doesn't keep classic alive, but my desire to play the game does.
C. If Blizzard didn't bring back classic then they risk losing their copyright, due to private servers. They had no choice but to bring it back.

A. lulno
B. "your"
C. lulno... What are you talking about? Oh right, nothing more

[Tsarez]

The difference between the toxic entitlement that you are arguing for and the way Blizzard supports group making is quite simple. Let me repeat it once more:

Your argument: People have the right/should have the right to join another persons group. You are arguing that it is toxic NOT to invite people. You are trying to guilt-shame other players to invite people that they don't want to play with.

Blizzard's policy: A person has the right to invite whomever he wants to his group. That person can invite whomever he wants based on his own personal criteria. It is 100% the prerogative of the group creator to invite, manage and kick people from his group.

I should add that using vile language is against Blizzard's TOS and will result in an infraction. And it doesn't matter if you use such language against people who have bought a boost, people that don't want to play with you or any other reason whatsoever.

So I am 100% against people harassing people who have bought a boost or ride a particular mount.
But I 100% support those that don't want to play with people that have bought a boost.

Personally I don't care either way.

I'm saying it's toxic to hate and harass people for buying a 58 boost. The reason for most people I've encountered so far to reject them is because they hate them and want to actively harass them by not giving them the opportunity to participate in the game.

Mind you that's an anecdote from personal experience based on roughly 1 hour of LFG chat. Instead of being invited to any group, I've been called names, ignored or asked if I was boosted, and then ignored. Seems like this forum is endorsing such behavior, and I call it toxic.

They can without problem reject me for having a boosted character. I can still continue to denounce them for it, because I think that reasoning is unfair and unjust. It doesn't matter if Blizzard specifically doesn't care about it.

[DechCJC]

You’ve somehow managed to put leveling and raiding/PvP’ing at a competitive level on the same level and I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why.

Go to the last pages of Raider.io, WCL, wowprogress, or the PvP ladder and explain why people who have put in the same/more time aren’t r1, world first, or competing in MDI.

It also misses the point that people will generally invest way more time in max level content than leveling content. Selling gear on the store won’t happen and I don’t know why it keeps being referenced.

I didn't reference R1, world first or MDI; I said gladiator. There's a big difference.

CE, gladiator and KSM is a time commitment and nothing more, you do not need to be some sort of prodigy to reach these levels and nearly anyone can do it in a reasonable time frame. The point that i'm trying to make is that most content, regardless of if it's at max level or not, boils down to time commitment.

Frankly, I'm surprised more people haven't asked for gear boosts. After all, having gear doesn't mean you can clear the content right? Why do you care if someone else has BIS gear, how does it affect you (/s)? Gear is an inevitability in the same way that max level is if you just play the game. The big difference being that having 60 levels on a player has much more impact than having a few item levels does.

I also disagree that many people will spend more time at max level than leveling on vanilla versions of the game, don't the majority of players not even hit level cap?

I just don't see the difference between an item level boost and a leveling boost. I don't see it at all.

[Kralljin]

In case it wasn't clear enough, if you're getting upset irregardless of your position, take a break and go outside. You shouldn't be getting so angry over a game.

Feel free to explain that to the people that equate "X spits on you" to actual harassment on the internet.

Maybe there are some people that can handle more problematic harassment better than smaller harassment such as this?

If you struggle to handle smaller harassment, you still might have certain issues.

Imagine someone cuts in line and the reaction of one person is to call the police, that's not exactly behavior that most people consider reasonable.
Of course, the person that cut the line is extremely rude and inpolite, but the response from the other person should be adequate to the offense, struggling with that implies that is unfortunately not a good sign.

[Delever]

Feel free to explain that to the people that equate "X spits on you" to actual harassment on the internet.

If you struggle to handle smaller harassment, you still might have certain issues.

Imagine someone cuts in line and the reaction of one person is to call the police, that's not exactly behavior that most people consider reasonable.
Of course, the person that cut the line is extremely rude and inpolite, but the response from the other person should be adequate to the offense, struggling with that implies that is unfortunately not a good sign.

Damn a person with a modicum of logic in here. I ll treasure this rare moment

[TrollHunter3000]

If you invest time into getting better at arena you will get gladiator, it's almost inevitable. It would also most likely take the average person less time /played to get glad than it would to get 60.

This is the dumbest shit I've ever heard lmao. The "average" player literally can't get gladiator by definition. The average player would be around the top 50%. Gladiator goes to the top 1%. Literal nonsense.

[DechCJC]

This is the dumbest shit I've ever heard lmao. The "average" player literally can't get gladiator by definition. The average player would be around the top 50%. Gladiator goes to the top 1%. Literal nonsense.

Gladiator is 2400 rating and 50 wins, unless you're talking about TBC, which I'm not. It was never 1% either, it was 0.5%, but it is fun for me to read someone discuss something with such conviction when they have no clue about it.

[TrollHunter3000]

A. Classic has more players than Retail so shut it.
B. I came from private servers and can go right back. Monetization doesn't keep classic alive, but my desire to play the game does.
C. If Blizzard didn't bring back classic then they risk losing their copyright, due to private servers. They had no choice but to bring it back.

Not even close lmao.

Blizzard didn't have to bring back classic to maintain their IP rights. They just had to shut down those using their IP.

[Jotaux]

Do you seriously want to call /spit bullying?
By that logic, Blizzard effectively supports bullying because the existence of the emote.

The difference is that those people quite often go out of their way to bully others, those people spam social media account(s), dox them, etc..
Putting aside "bullying on the internet" is a general term, someone taking / uploading a very questionable video / picture of yours, which then goes viral is not the same as /spit in WoW, not even fucking close.
And frankly, those people most of time attack you over personal matters, not over some actions within a virtual world.

Seriously, if you cannot see the difference, you need to damn chill, because then playing a game about killing others should be an absolute no go for you.

Thats a lot of text to justify bullying, even adding in an attack at the victims at the end to complete the bullying.

[TrollHunter3000]

Gladiator is 2400 rating and 50 wins, unless you're talking about TBC, which I'm not.

This is literally a thread about TBC so why the fuck would I not be talking about TBC. It's factually the top 1% right now in classic TBC, again, the subject of this thread. Pretty sure it's also always been 1% with top .1% being rank 1 titles since they removed battlegroups.

Regardless, 2400 rating in arena is still no where close to the 50% mark. The average player does not make it to 2400 and will not make it. Saying if they put enough time into it they will make it would mean they are not an "average" player.

You fundamentally do not understand what the word "average" means.

[Delever]

Thats a lot of text to justify bullying, even adding in an attack at the victims at the end to complete the bullying.

Imagine having to explain to a psychologist how you got traumatized by people (that you can block) using an emote on you in a video game. Humanity has been progressing in interesting ways.

[tikcol]

If you can't handle mobbing, leave your job
If you can't handle bullying, quit your school
If you can't handle sexual harassment, don't leave your house

oh wait...

Calm your tits there mate, it's a video game.

Are you going to equate PvP in WoW to murder in real life next?

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Imagine having to explain to a psychologist how you got traumatized by people (that you can block) using an emote on you in a video game. Humanity has been progressing in interesting ways.

We've had people in this thread equate it to bullying, mobbing, murder, humiliation, and even bloody rape. Believe it or not

"She was asking for it the way she was dressed"
That right there is what you are doing the equivalent of.
"They knew people hated the mount, so its their fault people are harassing them over it"
Instead of blaming the victim for "Being a target" why not idk... punish the actual person doing the bad thing?
also how the fuck does it look out of place, its LITERALLY a model from TBC.

[DechCJC]

This is literally a thread about TBC so why the fuck would I not be talking about TBC. It's factually the top 1% right now in classic TBC, again, the subject of this thread. Pretty sure it's also always been 1% with top .1% being rank 1 titles since they removed battlegroups.

Regardless, 2400 rating in arena is still no where close to the 50% mark. The average player does not make it to 2400 and will not make it. Saying if they put enough time into it they will make it would mean they are not an "average" player.

You fundamentally do not understand what the word "average" means.

The 'average' player doesn't even reach level cap in the first place, so how is that relevant? I'm saying that the nearly anyone is capable of it with time, in the same way that if you decided to go running every other day you would naturally get better at it without much of a thought.

I also thought that in my previous posts I've made it pretty clear that I was talking about TBC and retail in parallel since I also quoted KSM and CE, but I guess not.

[Prag]

I didn't reference R1, world first or MDI; I said gladiator. There's a big difference.

CE, gladiator and KSM is a time commitment and nothing more, you do not need to be some sort of prodigy to reach these levels and nearly anyone can do it in a reasonable time frame. The point that i'm trying to make is that most content, regardless of if it's at max level or not, boils down to time commitment.

Frankly, I'm surprised more people haven't asked for gear boosts. After all, having gear doesn't mean you can clear the content right? Why do you care if someone else has BIS gear, how does it affect you (/s)? Gear is an inevitability in the same way that max level is if you just play the game. The big difference being that having 60 levels on a player has much more impact than having a few item levels does.

I also disagree that many people will spend more time at max level than leveling on vanilla versions of the game, don't the majority of players not even hit level cap?

I just don't see the difference between an item level boost and a leveling boost. I don't see it at all.

It took a few months at most for casual people to hit 60. It will take more than a few months to compete for the top 0.5% for glad (LK) - or whatever competitive segment you’re interested in, and you’ll be competing against people who’ve invested thousands of hours pvping to get there.

I think what you’re missing is that it’s actively against Blizzard’s interests to sell max level gear. It leaves you less inclined to play, and disrupts the economy. If you’ve never bothered to run a GDKP, it’s actually pretty chill and a great way to earn gold.

People seem to be eager to assume Blizzard is full of idiots, despite the fact they’ve kept a 15+ year old MMORPG insanely popular. I don’t agree with a lot of the shit that’s been done, but I feel safe assuming they have the data to validate the impact of the cash shop. A great example is the number of people in these threads that were making the same claims in WotLK about the shop killing WoW, but here they are, still playing.

[Kralljin]

Thats a lot of text to justify bullying, even adding in an attack at the victims at the end to complete the bullying.

There is a difference between getting bullied and just being thinskinned.

Seriously, try that in real life, call the police whenever someone even slightly offends you and watch the reaction from the police and even surrounding people.
There's even an emote in WoW that will convey their reactions: /faceplam