Is WoW Pay 2 Win?

[bledgor]

You cant follow threads either. Your questions have already been answered.

I didn't ask if you raided world first, I also raided in top 20 WORLD raid teams, but we fell short so I personally do not have any world firsts. See how I answered that? I DO NOT HAVE WORLD FIRSTS. Thats the answer.

Ah yes, I did answer your question, but you can't read. You base your game on either getting world firsts or not, as time wasted otherwise. I don't agree with that sentiment.

Why dont I enjoy the game? Because I dont play it like you do? Im so confused. But if you go back, I actually tried to help some of you out that WoW being pay 2 win and WHY someone would do that, having nothing to do with this thread. The fact of the matter is who gives a shit why, who gives a shit if some idiot with a ton of cash "DOESN'T ENJOY" the game (in your PoV) what does someone's habits/play style have anything to do with the fact that I essentially paid my way to the top in less than a month?

If you are constantly paying other people do to content for you, thats not playing the game to "me" I guess, though I can't imagine how anyone would consider that playing the game. Might as well just find a video on youtube or a streamer on twitch to go through the game for you and save some money. Bonus points you can watch/listen to them as you do other things.

As for why I care, I genuinely don't want people who don't enjoy the game to play the game, because 1. I'd hope people do things they enjoy, it tends to make them more enjoyable to interact with as they tend to be happier, be it in game or in person 2. People that don't enjoy things tend to be very negative and unenjoyable to be around, this is very much so for people that tend to not enjoy wow in my opinion, and when they do nothing but bitch and moan and complain about everything it brings down my enjoyment (note this isn't a wow thing, this is a life thing to me, I fucking hate overly negative people, though I am not saying you can't be critical).

Going to be honest you come off as a person I don't wish to interact with, in game, in forums, in life. So I'll save us both the headache and add you to the block list.

[Lochton]

I paid for my Maw mount and Twisting Corridor runs. I get to mount up in Maw, others dont.

Well. Some would see that as a lost investment with 9.1 coming, and Worgens and Druids could already.

[Doffen]

In practical terms, that definition is no longer applicable in PC gaming though. Furthermore, you'd be surprised to know that sometimes words change their meaning as time goes by and reality changes. By Lollis' definition, WoW couldn't possibly be P2W even if there were mythic sets on sale in the Blizzard store... because you aren't "winning" anything by buying them.

But sure, you can willfully close your eyes and pretend that all is fine and dandy. You are entitled to it, after all.

And the disingenuousness of some answers ITT is just... baffling.

Who is talking about it being fine and dandy? As if that got anything to do with it.

Yes, thats why you are wrong and Lollis is right, WoW could never be a pay 2 win game by its definition. You say it yourself here. It's not Lollis definition, its THE definition. You are entitled to your opinion of course about whats what, but Lollis is right.

Close my eyes and pretend its fine and dandy. Fuck is it with all the mental gymnastic just to win an argument.

[GUZ]

Nah blizzard it self does not offer anything that is pay to win you do have to pay to play tho

[Rageonit]

Lets see I paid, I got more geared than people still gearing. I paid and got SEVERAL mounts in raids and Mythic+ that people are still trying to earn. It gives my account the same value as someone who spent an entire patch grinding away for the same.

Your account is worth a fistful of peanuts. You achieved nothing of note and you paid for it. Congratulations, I guess?
Meanwhile, people who do it in a legitimate way have fun playing the game. The fact that you call it "grinding" is very telling; if you'd rather do other things than play, why do you even need those mounts?

[TheRevenantHero]

Saying "No I don't" then just responding with the exact same thing restated is not convincing anyone that you know the actual one true definition of Pay 2 Win. I'm loving the process though. Let's keep unpacking.

Also I should point out that one true definition is bolded because nobody actually knows that because it doesn't actually have a definition. Just vague guidelines that armchair heroes punt along and modify as they see fit.

Except I literally explained it to you. I'm not repeating myself a third time. Go back and read instead of skimming.

[Lochton]

Except I literally explained it to you. I'm not repeating myself a third time. Go back and read instead of skimming.

So, what if your advantage is gained by other players?

[Agent Smith]

Ah yes, I did answer your question, but you can't read. You base your game on either getting world firsts or not, as time wasted otherwise. I don't agree with that sentiment.

No, I didn't, i just repeated what someone else said. Again, you cannot read threads properly or you would have put these two things together. And if you dont agree with it, why even bring it up to begin with?

If you are constantly paying other people do to content for you, thats not playing the game to "me" I guess, though I can't imagine how anyone would consider that playing the game.

What does this have to do with the fact that im not the only one doing this? I know you know im not. There's gotta be a reason why there are more people willing to just pay. Essentially what im saying is, there's a crux to this problem and it isn't the way I consume games, if you can believe that.

Might as well just find a video on youtube or a streamer on twitch to go through the game for you and save some money. Bonus points you can watch/listen to them as you do other things.

Why should I based off your very own interpretation on what gaming is? Did you want to just show us all how to live too? Cmon now.

As for why I care, I genuinely don't want people who don't enjoy the game to play the game, because 1. I'd hope people do things they enjoy, it tends to make them more enjoyable to interact with as they tend to be happier, be it in game or in person 2. People that don't enjoy things tend to be very negative and unenjoyable to be around, this is very much so for people that tend to not enjoy wow in my opinion, and when they do nothing but bitch and moan and complain about everything it brings down my enjoyment (note this isn't a wow thing, this is a life thing to me, I fucking hate overly negative people, though I am not saying you can't be critical).

I agree with this bit 110% because it does form a bit of animosity and it can bring down an entire community. But when we get to choose between grinding anima, grinding corridors, doing trivial time sinks, WoW as a game, is just not very enjoyable anymore. The only reason im even still playing is because I have been a Holy Paladin for 15 years strong and I tried to quit and I failed so I came back. I refuse to grind anymore. WoW added a paid option to skip alot of the grinds, why wouldn't anyone take advantage of that?

If WoW isn't pay 2 win(mediocrity or otherwise) then why is the solution to get advertisers off trade, advertisers off LFG, people like me consuming this game the way I do, why is the solution to ALL this, is the permanent stop of token sales? Do you think boosters would be spamming if they knew we all had to grind gold the old fashion way? I would think twice before spending 1.5 million on a raid. I would really think about it then say HELL NO because I cant just wait 7 days to max out tokens again.

The market would collapse over the weekend if we didn't have access to gold on tap.

Im not talking about illegal gold farmers either, thats a punishable offense, im talking about just having gold on tap brought to you by Blizzard

- - - Updated - - -

Your account is worth a fistful of peanuts. You achieved nothing of note and you paid for it. Congratulations, I guess?
Meanwhile, people who do it in a legitimate way have fun playing the game. The fact that you call it "grinding" is very telling; if you'd rather do other things than play, why do you even need those mounts?

What business is it of yours?

[TheRevenantHero]

Who is talking about it being fine and dandy? As if that got anything to do with it.

Yes, thats why you are wrong and Lollis is right, WoW could never be a pay 2 win game by its definition. You say it yourself here. It's not Lollis definition, its THE definition. You are entitled to your opinion of course about whats what, but Lollis is right.

Close my eyes and pretend its fine and dandy. Fuck is it with all the mental gymnastic just to win an argument.

According to Lollis' definition then, there is no such thing as a pay to win game. Because there isn't a single game that lets you pay money to complete it.

But that's not what pay to win is. Pay to win means you are paying real money to get an advantage over other players in the game who aren't paying real money for that thing. WoW has immediate level boosts in the shops, making it a form of pay to win.

[Rageonit]

What business is it of yours?

I research irrational human behaviour for a living.
Or maybe I'm just curious.

[Agent Smith]

I research irrational human behaviour for a living.
Or maybe I'm just curious.

You engaging in a trivial conversation on the topic of a video game then getting worked up over it in a reply, is irrational human behavior.

Start there.

"im not worked up"

[NotTrolling]

You either no life the game, buy tokens to win, or sit as a casual heroic raider.

This is so painfully, depressingly accurate

[Rageonit]

You engaging in a trivial conversation on the topic of a video game then getting worked up over it in a reply, is irrational human behavior.

Start there.

I can't, because I would be biased. Basic science fact.
So your answer is no answer. That's equally telling. As you are a waste of time (in my research, obviously, I'm sure other than that you are a very engaging human being), I will just move on!

[Big Thanks]

"LOL" to the people claiming "Pay to Win" is a simple definition

Is not

Is a very versatile topic and open to debate...and different in every situation
This is not a black & white topic

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Examples:

Just because something is possible to aquire without spending money, it doesnt mean instantly is not pay to win.
"Extreme inconvenience" made on purpose by the gaming company who designed the game in order to promote spending money is one tactic used MANY TIMES

"Bruh, is not pay to win, is possible to get it without spending money"

Couldnt be more wrong.

------

EA (the gaming company) used this exact phrase about FIFA Ultimate Team:

"It's important to note that you can acquire all items in the game without ever spending money, with purchases being entirely optional."

Which is techincally true...but will take YEARS to do so.
Yes years...

[Lolites]

You do of course understand how much gold prices have been fucked for the average player by the absurd amounts of gold that have become available to players through the token right?

tokens DONT GENERATE GOLD, they move gold that was already in economy, that have minimal effect on prices...
prices skyrocketed bcs in wod via garrison people could make thousands golds a day in few minutes on each character...

[Agent Smith]

I can't, because I would be biased. Basic science fact.
So your answer is no answer. That's equally telling. As you are a waste of time (in my research, obviously, I'm sure other than that you are a very engaging human being), I will just move on!

LOL whatever.

Well dont leave mad, no reason to fight here. What the hell else would I do, work? No id rather sit here and make weak arguments.

[rrayy]

Can you do a level 50 dungeon at level 1? no you have to level up or you will die this will require time and effort

Can Jhonny pay X amount of money for a boost to level 50 and do a dungeon with gear immediatly with no time investment or effort put in? Yes!

Pay to Win.

Wrong. IUf he boosts, he will have already outgeared all the dungeons and have no point in doing them. He also cannot clear level 60 content with that boost. You cannot immediately complete the hardest content in the game.,

Basically you are spinning the definition of P2W to suit your narrative.

[Agent Smith]

Basically you are spinning the definition of P2W to suit your narrative.

I think alot of people are doing that. Maybe you too... and me.

Maybe we should properly define what Pay 2 Win would entail.

[rrayy]

Your account is worth a fistful of peanuts. You achieved nothing of note and you paid for it. Congratulations, I guess?
Meanwhile, people who do it in a legitimate way have fun playing the game. The fact that you call it "grinding" is very telling; if you'd rather do other things than play, why do you even need those mounts?

ANd people who pay don't have fun? That is a very ignorant and elitist generalization as I can assure you that there are plenty of people who have bought things enjoy playing the game, starting with me. You are not the sole arbiter of who is having fun in game.

[Lolites]

Yes.

If you can buy power, especially gear, pay to have the content cleared for you to see the end and kill the last boss, or even minor conveniences like leveling which also comes with gear - you will be at an advantage compared to people who don't.

Which is all P2W.

i mean, fine, if you see it that way, okay... but then wow is p2w since its very begining, bcs you could buy gold, gear, leveling or gearing via dungeons in vanila...