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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    It literally does not, read the spells man. Does SS leave behind pools of toxins?

    Demon Hunters were created from ONE Major lore figure... Nathanos isn't just some world boss either. He's prob the prime example of what a none sylvanas DR would be.
    LOL NO THEY WEREN'T. There was more than just Illidan in TBC. There was the entire Illidari group that was a bunch of demon hunters under Illidan. And Nathanos IS just a world boss because before that, he didn't have ANY of those abilities.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    LOL NO THEY WEREN'T. There was more than just Illidan in TBC. There was the entire Illidari group that was a bunch of demon hunters under Illidan. And Nathanos IS just a world boss because before that, he didn't have ANY of those abilities.
    And who do you think those DH's learned it from before that? There was no Illidary in Warcraft 3, it was just him... You think those Demon Hunters NPC's in SMV had amazing toolkits other than some auto attacks?

    https://www.wowhead.com/npc=21179/de...cant#abilities

    Look at this one, lol only has 1 ability and it's a rogue one.

    No crap Nothanos didn't have them yet since he was yet to be a boss, LOL....

    Like you're making zero sense.

    Look its fine if you don't like DR's and think there would be a better possible 4th spec. But don't say that they're just Purple MM hunters when I'm giving you factual evidence that they're not.

  3. #43
    As a mage who has always joked that I forgot to heal on wipes I absolutely love the idea of a healing spec.

    I'll still absolutely forget to heal but it'll be a serious issue then and not just a joke...

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    And who do you think those DH's learned it from before that? There was no Illidary in Warcraft 3, it was just him... You think those Demon Hunters NPC's in SMV had amazing toolkits other than some auto attacks?

    https://www.wowhead.com/npc=21179/de...cant#abilities

    Look at this one, lol only has 1 ability and it's a rogue one.

    No crap Nothanos didn't have them yet since he was yet to be a boss, LOL....

    Like you're making zero sense.

    Look its fine if you don't like DR's and think there would be a better possible 4th spec. But don't say that they're just Purple MM hunters when I'm giving you factual evidence that they're not.
    You haven't given any factual evidence because using a WORLD BOSS as an example is asinine. All other dark rangers don't have ANY of those abilities. If it was something all of them were capable of, they would have those same spells. But they DON'T. Which further proves dark rangers as a whole are just edgy MM hunters.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Man a lot of you lack imagination don't you? Assassins have always been able to dispatch their foes from a distance with bows, they're not in tune with nature or wild beasts and can have a clear distinction from what hunters are depicted as in warcraft.

    Who's know what kind of uniqueness blizzard can come up with those 2 dh specs and blood warlocks. I'm sure they can come up with unique mechanics, I'm just describing the groundwork of the theme.

    Paladins were meant to be defenders of the weak and powerless. Smiters of undead and demons. You think that screams healer? Yet they have a healing spec. Necromancy has clearly been shown to have the potential to heal. A DK healing spec would be an offensive melee healer, think of a melee disc priest in a sense.

    It's all in the imagination.
    We are talking about YOUR ideas not all the potential in the universe, handwaving off the issues with "Who's know what kind of uniqueness blizzard can come up with" is not a defense its deflection. And yes holy paladin fits the lore because they are priests who wanted to do more to protect people by being on the battlefield instead of trying to pick up the pieces after. DK lore is about pushing forward and overpowering your enemies with unstoppable force healers are about protection and recovery. These themes do not go well together at all.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    You haven't given any factual evidence because using a WORLD BOSS as an example is asinine. All other dark rangers don't have ANY of those abilities. If it was something all of them were capable of, they would have those same spells. But they DON'T. Which further proves dark rangers as a whole are just edgy MM hunters.
    Jesus christ...

    The DH's toolkit is base off of Illidan From warcraft 3.

    All the DH's from TBC have the same amount of uniqueness as the DR NPC's you're describing.

    Nathanos can be used as a model in the same way that Warcraft 3 Illidan is.

    What part of that do you not understand?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Elbob View Post
    We are talking about YOUR ideas not all the potential in the universe, handwaving off the issues with "Who's know what kind of uniqueness blizzard can come up with" is not a defense its deflection. And yes holy paladin fits the lore because they are priests who wanted to do more to protect people by being on the battlefield instead of trying to pick up the pieces after. DK lore is about pushing forward and overpowering your enemies with unstoppable force healers are about protection and recovery. These themes do not go well together at all.
    If I wanted to post mechanics I would have, I'm just posting the general fantasy of them.

    DK healers would still be "pushing forward and overpowering your enemies with unstoppable force", it's just that the final effect would be to heal wounds with special necromancy learned from Maldraxxus.

    Also remember what I said in the OP. These specs are meant to feel new and some may feel outlandish because they are supposed to be new methods of combat for each class. The classes are evolving. The paragon quest would explain it.
    Last edited by Varx; 2021-06-03 at 06:43 PM.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post

    If I wanted to post mechanics I would have, I'm just posting the general fantasy of them.

    DK healers would still be "pushing forward and overpowering your enemies with unstoppable force", it's just that the final effect would be to heal wounds.

    Also remember what I said in the OP. These specs are meant to feel new and some may feel outlandish because they are supposed to be new methods of combat for each class. The classes are evolving. The paragon quest would explain it.
    And the fantasies you listed are high in overlap THATS THE PROBLEM, when i point it out you say o well blizzard will fix that.

    NO healing some one ELSE is not how you overpower your foes yourself, draining your enemies life to prevent them from being able to fight you 1v1 like a blood dk works but when you are using it to help your friends fight its not YOU overpowering your foes, its your allies with your SUPPORT.

    And the ultimate handwave of o the quest will redesign the class fantasy ok I'm probably done with this circle game.

  8. #48
    >Warrior: Gladiator

    >Posts picture of a goddamn Greek Hoplite

  9. #49
    The idea of a 4th spec should be to equalize a spec with something it doesnt have. Or something that that armor proficiency is missing.

    Priests should get a barrier tanking class. Lightsworn DH should be a healer, or a ranged dps. Mages should have a dual wielding melee spec. Something along those lines.

    Dark Ranger shouldnt go to hunters as they are not mail wearers. They are literally rogues brought back as archers to serve Sylvanas, all Dark Rangers now are that. That would be the rogues 4th spec, but to be honest Sub should have just been changed to that when Survival went melee.

    I do agree Combat rogue should have been made a tanking class when they went with the Pirate theme.

    I originally posted about Monks getting a 4th spec built around lightning as ranged. I think it was when Legion launched.
    Last edited by Pandragon; 2021-06-03 at 07:03 PM.
    If what doesn't kill you, makes you stronger. Then I should be a god by now.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Raugnaut View Post
    While I am in favor of 4th specs for everyone but Druids (Who already have all 4 specs), I would prefer if Rogues/Hunters got a tanking spec each.

    Just get rid of Survival and replace it with Unsurvival as the "Dark Ranger" themed spec, nobody likes current survival.
    I don't know about Hunters (because they wield ranged weaponry), but a Rogue could definitely have a tanking spec based on the removed bucklers they had.

    As for Survival, it should be less of a Ranger and more of a Headhunter. Dark Ranger should be its own thing and not part of the Hunter.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    *sigh* No. Just no. Fist of all, it's bull shit that Demon Hunter gets TWO. Second of all, people need to stop trying to make dark ranger a thing when it's clearly never happening.
    Said the Necromancer guy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Now I never see DR's being an actual class, that boat sailed with SL.
    *A spec within a class.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Dark rangers are literally just undead belf hunters in purple and black armor. They don't have any unique powers at all. So bringing dark ranger in as an example was just....a waste. DR are MM hunters. Players will never get to play a class version of Sylvanas because she is a 100% unique example of what she is. She has banshee powers AND hunter abilities. Meanwhile, all demon hunters pretty much have the same powers as Illidan.

    It's not a bias. Dark rangers just have nothing that separates them from hunters.
    You, clearly, don't know much about Dark Rangers.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    No they don't. Sylvanas is literally the only dark ranger with unique abilities. Other dark rangers are nothing but undead hunters. There isn't even enough there to make a SPEC especially since their ONLY unique spell can now be obtained from the new bow in Chains of Domination.
    Sylvanas is the basis for the class, whether you like it or not.
    Your "special case" argument simply ignores other major characters-based classes.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    They are just hunters mechanically and even in lore.
    So, no other ranged weaponry class can exist? We can only have the Hunter (and expand upon it)?
    Not the Dark Ranger? not the Priestess of the Moon? or anything else?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    EVERY SINGLE OTHER DR NPC ACCOMPLISHES WHAT HUNTERS DO.
    Every insignificant NPC does that with their class "equivalent" before they are added. Death Knights and Demon Hunters alike. This is not much of an argument because you don't build a class upon random NPCs in the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    LOL NO THEY WEREN'T. There was more than just Illidan in TBC. There was the entire Illidari group that was a bunch of demon hunters under Illidan.
    And you, really, think Blizzard based the Demon Hunter on them?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    You haven't given any factual evidence because using a WORLD BOSS as an example is asinine. All other dark rangers don't have ANY of those abilities. If it was something all of them were capable of, they would have those same spells. But they DON'T. Which further proves dark rangers as a whole are just edgy MM hunters.
    You, clearly, don't know how NPCs work.

    NPCs barely have unique abilities. They often take from pre-existing classes and sometimes combine several of them. Blizzard doesn't, really, put much effort into them. Not even significant ones, like named leaders.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    Priests should get a barrier tanking class. Lightsworn DH should be a healer, or a ranged dps. Mages should have a dual wielding melee spec. Something along those lines.

    Dark Ranger shouldnt go to hunters as they are not mail wearers. They are literally rogues brought back as archers to serve Sylvanas, all Dark Rangers now are that. That would be the rogues 4th spec, but to be honest Sub should have just been changed to that when Survival went melee.

    I do agree Combat rogue should have been made a tanking class when they went with the Pirate theme.

    I originally posted about Monks getting a 4th spec built around lightning as ranged. I think it was when Legion launched.
    Dark Rangers are former rangers. Meaning, they use both ranged weaponry and melee ones (as can be seen by Sylvanas both shooting her bow and wielding daggers). They shouldn't have anything to do with either Hunters or Rogues.

    Why not Chi-Ji as a 4th Monk spec?
    Last edited by username993720; 2021-06-03 at 07:36 PM.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Jesus christ...

    The DH's toolkit is base off of Illidan From warcraft 3.

    All the DH's from TBC have the same amount of uniqueness as the DR NPC's you're describing.

    Nathanos can be used as a model in the same way that Warcraft 3 Illidan is.

    What part of that do you not understand?

    - - - Updated - - -



    If I wanted to post mechanics I would have, I'm just posting the general fantasy of them.

    DK healers would still be "pushing forward and overpowering your enemies with unstoppable force", it's just that the final effect would be to heal wounds with special necromancy learned from Maldraxxus.

    Also remember what I said in the OP. These specs are meant to feel new and some may feel outlandish because they are supposed to be new methods of combat for each class. The classes are evolving. The paragon quest would explain it.
    Nathanos is barely a dark ranger as well. Literally every single dark ranger outside of Nathanos is some form of undead elf. And they're called dark rangers because they are raised Farstrider rangers. Guess what those were? That's right, they are hunters. Ranger is nothing but the elven word for hunter. Just like how vindicator is just the draenei word for paladin.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Nathanos is barely a dark ranger as well. Literally every single dark ranger outside of Nathanos is some form of undead elf. And they're called dark rangers because they are raised Farstrider rangers. Guess what those were? That's right, they are hunters. Ranger is nothing but the elven word for hunter. Just like how vindicator is just the draenei word for paladin.

    Okay now I know you're trolling. Calling Nathanos "barely a Dark Ranger" is like saying Thrall is barely a shaman.

    Race has nothing to do with it. Farstrider rangers are just hunters with a different name based on culture. Like how sunwalkers, blood knights, zadalari prelates are all Paladins.

    However, Dark Rangers have developed new abilities previously unavailable to regular hunters/rangers post being risen as shown by Nathanos as a prime example. At the end of the day they're still hunters but with a different tool set, thus a new possible hunter spec.

    And to further iterate on a previous argument. You know how many DK and Paladin NPC's there that are just white hitters without even a special resource bar. Anyone would just call them warriors. So just cus there are dark ranger NPC's with little or no special edgy spells doesn't mean they're just vanilla hunters.

    But regardless, we got nathanos.
    Last edited by Varx; 2021-06-03 at 08:14 PM.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Okay now I know you're trolling. Calling Nathanos "barely a Dark Ranger" is like saying Thrall is barely a shaman.

    Race has nothing to do with it. Farstrider rangers are just hunters with a different name based on culture. Like how sunwalkers, blood knights, zadalari prelates are all Paladins.

    However, Dark Rangers have developed new abilities previously unavailable to regular hunters/rangers post being risen as shown by Nathanos as a prime example. At the end of the day they're still hunters but wit ha different tool set, thus a new possible hunter spec.
    Race has everything to do with it and the fact that you are saying that shows me you really don't know what you're talking about. Nathanos only got new abilities when he became a world boss. Otherwise, dark rangers(including Nathanos) are just hunters.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Race has everything to do with it and the fact that you are saying that shows me you really don't know what you're talking about. Nathanos only got new abilities when he became a world boss. Otherwise, dark rangers(including Nathanos) are just hunters.
    Dude, stop.

    If that was the case Nathanos would have gotten regular vanilla hunter abilities, but he didnt since he's not just a regular vanilla hunter or ranger. He's a dark ranger.

    So you saying Blood Knights and Knights of the silver hand are completely different classes?

    Again, if we're using that rando NPC garbage you keep saying then just look at the DK, Paladin NPC's I mentioned. Or the DH's from SMV.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Dude, stop.

    If that was the case Nathanos would have gotten regular vanilla hunter abilities, but he didnt since he's not just a regular vanilla hunter or ranger. Like every other dark ranger that exists.

    So you saying Blood Knights and Knights of the silver hand are completely different classes?

    Again, if we're using that rando NPC garbage you keep saying then just look at the DK, Paladin NPC's I mentioned. Or the DH's from SMV.
    He got unique abilities because he is literally a self-insert of one of the devs, dude.

    Blood knights and knights of the silver hand aren't different because they're both paladins. They just have different names. Just like how hunters and rangers are the exact same class. I'm glad you're finally realizing that.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    He got unique abilities because he is literally a self-insert of one of the devs, dude.

    Blood knights and knights of the silver hand aren't different because they're both paladins. They just have different names. Just like how hunters and rangers are the exact same class. I'm glad you're finally realizing that.
    What???????

    He got Unique dark ranger abilities because he's a dark ranger! Not because you have a hate boner for some dev and sylv.

    You contradicting your self, you specifically made a point to printout rangers as being elves and somehow made it as an argument as to why nathanos somehow isnt a dark ranger because he's not an elf. When he obviously is as he trained as one and has the skill set to show for it.
    Last edited by Varx; 2021-06-03 at 08:31 PM.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    What???????

    He got Unique dark ranger abilities because he's a dark ranger! Not because you have a hate boner for some dev and sylv.

    You contradicting your self, you specifically made a point to printout rangers as being elves and somehow made it as an argument as to why nathanos somehow isnt a dark ranger because he's not an elf.
    No he definitely didn't. He didn't get any special powers until he was made a world boss. He was in the game long before that with no special powers. And it's also public knowledge that he's a self-insert of one of the devs.

    Just because you refuse to admit you're wrong doesn't magically mean you AREN'T wrong. I said there is nothing unique about dark rangers. I said they are all pretty much undead elf hunters outside of Nathanos. I said they don't have any powers that are unique to dark rangers specifically. Maybe actually read my post this time.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    No he definitely didn't. He didn't get any special powers until he was made a world boss. He was in the game long before that with no special powers. And it's also public knowledge that he's a self-insert of one of the devs.

    Just because you refuse to admit you're wrong doesn't magically mean you AREN'T wrong. I said there is nothing unique about dark rangers. I said they are all pretty much undead elf hunters outside of Nathanos. I said they don't have any powers that are unique to dark rangers specifically. Maybe actually read my post this time.
    Who cares if he's really a self insert or not, man? that's besides the point. Why the hell would he have had special abilities in wow's data-base when he was yet to be a boss???? There was no need for it. You think he just randomly got empowered because he's now a boss and boom, here's your set of dark ranger abilities??

    No, he got a set of dark ranger abilities because he was now a boss that we needed to fight and his skill set matches what he is, which is a dark ranger. Not a sylv fanboy dev ranger with special dev edgy spells to go with it.

    How does the moon feel reaching that hard?

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Nathanos is barely a dark ranger as well. Literally every single dark ranger outside of Nathanos is some form of undead elf. And they're called dark rangers because they are raised Farstrider rangers. Guess what those were? That's right, they are hunters. Ranger is nothing but the elven word for hunter. Just like how vindicator is just the draenei word for paladin.
    That's where your confusion comes from. Rangers are, indeed, synonymous with Hunters. The Survival spec, currently, describes it as a ranger. Rangers, much like Hunters, are in-tune with the wilds. Dark Rangers, however, are not. Why separate the two if the only thing that separates them is death, you might ask? Same way you separate a Death Knight from a Knight. Previously, Death Knight were primarily raised Paladins (Knights), which makes them nothing but "Dark/Dead" Knights. But, you wouldn't consider them the same, with just a cosmetic difference, would you? That's because the Death Knight had abilities associated with it that are different from the Paladin. Same as with Dark Ranger. It has abilities that are separate from the Hunter. So, it is not a Farstrider, a Sentinel or an umbral ranger, but something else. Because you can't associate abilities with these archetypes, like you can with the Dark Ranger. Same applies to Vindicators, Sunwalkers and Blood Knights. You can't pinpoint certain abilities unique to them. The same way you associate the Death Knight with Arthas and the Demon Hunter with Illidan, you should be associating the Dark Ranger with Sylvanas and not with some random, no-named NPC.

  20. #60
    This sounds like the killer of the WoW killer to-be-released sometime in Q4 2021 or sometime in 2022.

    Basically legion artifact 2.0 but permanent.

    Very much love the ideas and want them to happen in 10.0 even if stagger-released.

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