1. #22641
    Quote Originally Posted by Nellise View Post
    I don't know how they came up with those percentages. China is shown to have given 800+ million doses which would make the Asia number above 10% just from them.

    Edit: I guess that number is unofficial or something and not included in some charts so must not have shown up in whatever they looked at. But seems like a big mistake to count China's population and then ignore all of their vaccinations.
    They didn't look closely enough. China has given 824 million doses according to "Our World In Data" that they use as source, but there's no data on how many have been given one doses vs. being fully vaccinated - so they just skipped that.

    So looking at https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations Asia is sort of leading in terms of doses - 57% of all doses given world-wide were given in Asia, compared to 60% of the worldwide population. Europe has 18% of vaccine doses, and 11% of the population ( https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...ope-population ).

    The real outliers are N. America with 17% of vaccine doses, and 8% of world population, and Africa with 1.7% of vaccine doses and 18% of world population; or as they note when splitting countries according to income - first the high-income countries were vaccinated, but now upper middle-income countries are leading.

  2. #22642
    Interesting graphic I found. Unfortunately without a credited source, so I don't know how reliable this is.

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  3. #22643
    Quote Originally Posted by Forogil View Post
    The real outliers are N. America with 17% of vaccine doses, and 8% of world population, and Africa with 1.7% of vaccine doses and 18% of world population; or as they note when splitting countries according to income - first the high-income countries were vaccinated, but now upper middle-income countries are leading.
    One of the big differences here is the ages of the populations. Over 40% of sub-Saharan Africa (1.1 billion people) is under the age of 14, while in North America it's about 18% which makes the population differences narrow significantly because it's questionable whether kids those ages should even get the vaccine. And on the other end, North America has about 16.5% of its population over 65, while sub-Saharan Africa is about 3%. North America has nearly double the amount of people in the very high risk age range. So those numbers aren't as bad as they look at first glance if the goal is to save lives rather than just vaccinate as many people as possible.

  4. #22644
    Quote Originally Posted by Nellise View Post
    One of the big differences here is the ages of the populations. Over 40% of sub-Saharan Africa (1.1 billion people) is under the age of 14, while in North America it's about 18% which makes the population differences narrow significantly because it's questionable whether kids those ages should even get the vaccine. And on the other end, North America has about 16.5% of its population over 65, while sub-Saharan Africa is about 3%. North America has nearly double the amount of people in the very high risk age range. So those numbers aren't as bad as they look at first glance if the goal is to save lives rather than just vaccinate as many people as possible.
    Good point that I missed.

    Related to that it's not clear that the vaccines are well targeted in poor countries (it isn't clear in all rich countries either); so it's not clear that the 3% in sub-Saharan Africa that are above 65 will be first in line. India as an example has opened up vaccination to all age-groups (afaik - obviously not enough for everyone) as a populist measure.

  5. #22645
    The Insane Acidbaron's Avatar
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    Finally got the invitation, first one is at the end of June second one a few weeks later.

    Getting Pfizer and in my mid thirties in overall good health (Not obese), so not worried at all. Guess i will look up what some side effects might be but won't be scared into not getting like some people are.
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  6. #22646
    Quote Originally Posted by Acidbaron View Post
    Finally got the invitation, first one is at the end of June second one a few weeks later.

    Getting Pfizer and in my mid thirties in overall good health (Not obese), so not worried at all. Guess i will look up what some side effects might be but won't be scared into not getting like some people are.
    thought i was getting that but i got moderna, just felt like id been punched in the arm for 2 days (you know when you go to the gym and cant lift your arm above your head because the muscle soreness, a bit like that)

    Is the chinese version of the vaccine complete dogshit? I keep seeing things like it only has 53% effectiveness in creating antibodies or some shit.

  7. #22647
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnysensible View Post
    thought i was getting that but i got moderna, just felt like id been punched in the arm for 2 days (you know when you go to the gym and cant lift your arm above your head because the muscle soreness, a bit like that)

    Is the chinese version of the vaccine complete dogshit? I keep seeing things like it only has 53% effectiveness in creating antibodies or some shit.
    My main preference was getting a mRNA vaccine, believe it is the carrier of the other version that gives the most side effects.

    Problem with the Chinese as Russian vaccines is, how reliable is the data their companies and governments release?
    “My philosophy is: It’s none of my business what people say of me and think of me. I am what I am and I do what I do. I expect nothing and accept everything. And it makes life so much easier.
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  8. #22648
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    In my opinion Sinovac/Sputnik and so on do what they need to do, they are still much better than nothing and they seem to prevent severe cases fine. Not everyone can get Phizer/Moderna, much of the world can't get those in next several years. India alone would need like 3 billion shots of those and that's even not knowing how long this will actually hold, might become a years shot like flu, who knows.

  9. #22649
    Quote Originally Posted by jonnysensible View Post
    thought i was getting that but i got moderna, just felt like id been punched in the arm for 2 days (you know when you go to the gym and cant lift your arm above your head because the muscle soreness, a bit like that)

    Is the chinese version of the vaccine complete dogshit? I keep seeing things like it only has 53% effectiveness in creating antibodies or some shit.
    One of them is that bad it seems, specifically CoronaVac used in Chile. Note that Chile is one of the countries with highest percentage vaccinated - and there are still high number of new cases daily.

    There are at least three Chinese inactivated virus-vaccine and one viral vector one.

    Two inactivated are made by Sinopharm (BBIBP-CorV and something), and some claim they are about 72%-78% effective - https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jam...rticle/2780562
    And another by Sinovac (CoronaVac) - which some claim is 51% and others 80%.
    The viral vector (similar as AstraZeneca, Janssen (or J&J), Sputnik V) is similarly as Janssen a single-dose one made by CanSino called AD5-nCOV or Convidecia; and about 66% effective (similarly as Janssen).

    It seems all Chinese pharma-companies must have "sino" in their name.

    Additionally, one major new issue is that they might protect less well against all of the variants - and especially viral vector ones have that problem, whereas mRNA seems handle variants better. We don't know about the inactivated viruses yet, but that may explain some low numbers in practice.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    In my opinion Sinovac/Sputnik and so on do what they need to do, they are still much better than nothing and they seem to prevent severe cases fine. Not everyone can get Phizer/Moderna, much of the world can't get those in next several years. India alone would need like 3 billion shots of those and that's even not knowing how long this will actually hold, might become a years shot like flu, who knows.
    The problem with viral vectors like Sputnik V, AstraZeneca, Janssen is that they are not ideal for a yearly shot - you might get a reaction to the "adeno-vector" instead of the corona-virus - so unfortunately that will not work well. But it's unclear if poorer countries will bother with that.

    Sinovac's Coronavac is inactivated so it doesn't have that issue, which is a major benefit.

  10. #22650
    Herald of the Titans Tuor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnysensible View Post
    thought i was getting that but i got moderna, just felt like id been punched in the arm for 2 days (you know when you go to the gym and cant lift your arm above your head because the muscle soreness, a bit like that)
    Got moderna aswell, not fun awakening in the morning over the arm that got the shot...

    Next 17 i'll take second one... lets hope all goes well.

  11. #22651
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuor View Post
    Got moderna aswell, not fun awakening in the morning over the arm that got the shot...

    Next 17 i'll take second one... lets hope all goes well.
    Use ice and/or exercise your arm it helps spreads the load over your body. Basically what happens is that when you get an injection with mRNA is your body starts building the immune response, but it does so at the injection site unless you spread that through exercise.

    I got Pfizer, first shot I felt like crap and my left arm hurt like hell, on second shot I did the above and it was a lot better.
    "Life is one long series of problems to solve. The more you solve, the better a man you become.... Tribulations spawn in life and over and over again we must stand our ground and face them."

  12. #22652
    Just got my second shot of Moderna. Since I've already had covid, I'm going to be getting quite the reaction from it. Not looking forward to that, but it needed to be done.

  13. #22653
    Quote Originally Posted by Tulune View Post
    Just got my second shot of Moderna. Since I've already had covid, I'm going to be getting quite the reaction from it. Not looking forward to that, but it needed to be done.
    2nd one was much easier than the first on my moderna shot.... i had a very server case of covid too.
    Buh Byeeeeeeeeeeee !!

  14. #22654
    Over 9000! PhaelixWW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tulune View Post
    Just got my second shot of Moderna. Since I've already had covid, I'm going to be getting quite the reaction from it. Not looking forward to that, but it needed to be done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post
    2nd one was much easier than the first on my moderna shot.... i had a very server case of covid too.
    Studies are suggesting that recovery from COVID acts almost like a first vaccine shot. It primes your immune system to do the heavy work of the second dose, which is what is causing the strength of the reaction.

    So people who haven't had COVID (or had only a light case) should have a worse reaction to the second dose, while those who have had COVID already should have a worse reaction to the first dose.

    I'm curious to see if your experience lines up with this, @Tulune.


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  15. #22655
    Quote Originally Posted by Forogil View Post
    One of them is that bad it seems, specifically CoronaVac used in Chile. Note that Chile is one of the countries with highest percentage vaccinated - and there are still high number of new cases daily.

    There are at least three Chinese inactivated virus-vaccine and one viral vector one.

    Two inactivated are made by Sinopharm (BBIBP-CorV and something), and some claim they are about 72%-78% effective - https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jam...rticle/2780562
    And another by Sinovac (CoronaVac) - which some claim is 51% and others 80%.
    The viral vector (similar as AstraZeneca, Janssen (or J&J), Sputnik V) is similarly as Janssen a single-dose one made by CanSino called AD5-nCOV or Convidecia; and about 66% effective (similarly as Janssen).

    It seems all Chinese pharma-companies must have "sino" in their name.

    Additionally, one major new issue is that they might protect less well against all of the variants - and especially viral vector ones have that problem, whereas mRNA seems handle variants better. We don't know about the inactivated viruses yet, but that may explain some low numbers in practice.

    - - - Updated - - -


    The problem with viral vectors like Sputnik V, AstraZeneca, Janssen is that they are not ideal for a yearly shot - you might get a reaction to the "adeno-vector" instead of the corona-virus - so unfortunately that will not work well. But it's unclear if poorer countries will bother with that.

    Sinovac's Coronavac is inactivated so it doesn't have that issue, which is a major benefit.
    I read that the b-cells and t-cells activated by the mRNA vaccines recognize all the different variants of Covid so far.

  16. #22656
    Quote Originally Posted by PhaelixWW View Post
    Studies are suggesting that recovery from COVID acts almost like a first vaccine shot. It primes your immune system to do the heavy work of the second dose, which is what is causing the strength of the reaction.

    So people who haven't had COVID (or had only a light case) should have a worse reaction to the second dose, while those who have had COVID already should have a worse reaction to the first dose.

    I'm curious to see if your experience lines up with this, @Tulune.
    so I guess that means that I did have covid after all? I mean tests were negative, but there is also a chance to get a false negative as far as i know, and my first shot was far FAR worse then my second. with second, arm pain went away fairly quickly, wasn't nearly as bad and I only had extremely mild under the weather symptoms otherwise. no fever or anything.

    either that, or I'm just a weirdo O_O

    P.S. and I'm now glad that I ended up getting Moderna rather then J&J..

  17. #22657
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    I read that the b-cells and t-cells activated by the mRNA vaccines recognize all the different variants of Covid so far.
    They recognize it remarkably well - but the question is whether that is enough.

    Some studies indicate that two doses of Pfizer/BioNTech was 81% or 88% effective against Delta (from India), whereas AstraZeneca was only 60% effective; https://abcnews.go.com/Health/covid-...ry?id=77878990 https://news.yahoo.com/delta-variant...143928155.html

    But Delta is also more transmissible and some put the R0 as high as 8 https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57431420
    If R0 is 8 you need 87.5% protection (the product of vaccination-coverage and effectiveness) to reach herd immunity from vaccines, and if the effectiveness is in the range above reaching that is between impossible and very difficult requiring >99% vaccinated.
    However, there are lots of uncertainties: it's not clear that R0 really is 8 (especially not everywhere), and even if the vaccine protects 88% against symptomatic spread that doesn't say the spread is reduced exactly 88% (could be more, could be less).

    The only conclusion I see is that it is even more important to get vaccinated yourself, including possible booster-shots, and keep some precautions (R0 depends on what we do normally, the virus, the season, etc).

  18. #22658
    Its called the Wuhan Fauci Plandemic. Get with the times.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Get your slave mark of the beast quick and while you can lol. You people are so souless.

  19. #22659
    I am Murloc! KOUNTERPARTS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madhorde View Post
    Its called the Wuhan Fauci Plandemic. Get with the times.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Get your slave mark of the beast quick and while you can lol. You people are so souless.

    That's right, you tell 'em. Also say it on your main account to really get them good.

  20. #22660
    Quote Originally Posted by KOUNTERPARTS View Post
    That's right, you tell 'em. Also say it on your main account to really get them good.
    I like triggering soft snowflakes .

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