Predictions on a new night elf capital city and zone

[Garretdejiko]

I'd gladly sacrifice a raid tier or four for a world update.

An updated world would be entirely accesible to trial accounts. There's no money there.

[Beloren]

Tavids? Honestly the Exodar Krokul under Nobundo and Velen should've been an allied race (with the LFD bieng customisation options), if they didn't want to add the void Krokul of Argus as an allied race.



Yeah, it's horrible. Hate how the humans are the centerpiece, lead everything, and everyone automaticly bow down to their experience and leadership without questioning it. Might aswell rename the Alliance into the Empire at this point.

Alliance fans don't realise we see this too, just because we get a bit over protective of horde races, doesn't mean we see the rot on the other side.

It's a game that everyone has access to both factions. If the alliance became interesting and cool enough, many would try.. but it's mostly flat out boring.. who wants to play a faction that everything revolves around a human race that is on paper made to be so average, with races like Draenei, and Night elves - you instead spend the vast majority of your time on humans?

If you took us more often to places like WoD Auchindouin, and we saw more places like Zin'Azshari and Suramar for night elves, used the Dwarves and their very LoTR vibe more powerfully, people will pick it up and be interested.


At least on the horde, the orcs are something different to humanity. But on alliance it all goes to humans. Medieval fantasy was nice for a while, but then you go and introduce star elves, and turn them into ordinary forest elves, space goats with an imaginative background and you just make them extra, werewolves are freaking awesome, but no, yes men to medieval castle boys.. this is why it's boring

On the horde, you get a lot from orcs, trolls, goblins, undead, blood elves - look at how very different all of these are and how the spotlight moves between all of them. sometimes it's Trolls leading the charge, other times its Forsaken, then other times Goblins are the game changers...when on the alliance have the dwarves, or Draenei or Night elves every lead the way, or even half human Genn Greymane (okay may be he did a little bit for pvp in Legion) .

Where is the terror and savagery of the worgen? I should be terrified when coming up agianst htem, but they feel like a joke a lot of the time. Where is the starry mystical magical wonder of the very ancient kaldorei? How often do we see involved and utilised the magical technology, crystal buzzing, Draenei? (my fave alliance race btw). Where is the character of the mountain people - I tell you, i fell in love with dwarves from the Hobbit movie - wow dwarves are just invisible behind Stormwind humans.

They are always cut for Stormwind and Varian, Anduin, Khadgar and Jaina, I even heard that the reason Tyrande wasn't in 8.2 was because of her cameo in 8.1 - but Jaina, was in 8.0, 8.1, and 8.2 and so on,

This is the alliance. Why do you think we love the nightborne so much? If they had done that for the night elves don't you think night elves would have been a lot more attractive.. think about it. if Suramar was instead night elf models, but no, because they are not human, they can't be part of the alliance, because it would make them looking better than humans.

Alliance fans like Raven blame horde favouritism, but I say it's human favouritism that is their problem, not the horde.

[geco]

Alliance fans don't realise we see this too, just because we get a bit over protective of horde races, doesn't mean we see the rot on the other side.

It's a game that everyone has access to both factions. If the alliance became interesting and cool enough, many would try.. but it's mostly flat out boring.. who wants to play a faction that everything revolves around a human race that is on paper made to be so average, with races like Draenei, and Night elves - you instead spend the vast majority of your time on humans?

If you took us more often to places like WoD Auchindouin, and we saw more places like Zin'Azshari and Suramar for night elves, used the Dwarves and their very LoTR vibe more powerfully, people will pick it up and be interested.


At least on the horde, the orcs are something different to humanity. But on alliance it all goes to humans. Medieval fantasy was nice for a while, but then you go and introduce star elves, and turn them into ordinary forest elves, space goats with an imaginative background and you just make them extra, werewolves are freaking awesome, but no, yes men to medieval castle boys.. this is why it's boring

On the horde, you get a lot from orcs, trolls, goblins, undead, blood elves - look at how very different all of these are and how the spotlight moves between all of them. sometimes it's Trolls leading the charge, other times its Forsaken, then other times Goblins are the game changers...when on the alliance have the dwarves, or Draenei or Night elves every lead the way, or even half human Genn Greymane (okay may be he did a little bit for pvp in Legion) .

Where is the terror and savagery of the worgen? I should be terrified when coming up agianst htem, but they feel like a joke a lot of the time. Where is the starry mystical magical wonder of the very ancient kaldorei? How often do we see involved and utilised the magical technology, crystal buzzing, Draenei? (my fave alliance race btw). Where is the character of the mountain people - I tell you, i fell in love with dwarves from the Hobbit movie - wow dwarves are just invisible behind Stormwind humans.

They are always cut for Stormwind and Varian, Anduin, Khadgar and Jaina, I even heard that the reason Tyrande wasn't in 8.2 was because of her cameo in 8.1 - but Jaina, was in 8.0, 8.1, and 8.2 and so on,

This is the alliance. Why do you think we love the nightborne so much? If they had done that for the night elves don't you think night elves would have been a lot more attractive.. think about it. if Suramar was instead night elf models, but no, because they are not human, they can't be part of the alliance, because it would make them looking better than humans.

Alliance fans like Raven blame horde favouritism, but I say it's human favouritism that is their problem, not the horde.

Elune bless you and Brwosbandi guide your soul.

But besides that Yes. The dwarves in the Hobbyts movies is like the first time they let the dwarves look cool in fantasy.
If they take the Humans away, the Alliance could be a lot more fun.

Without going any further BFA instead of 3 human sounds. You could put on a human sound. One of "Kaldorei refugees" where you told how Tyrande and Maiev made peace that "dark coast" is the "end of the story" and not the beginning.
And a dwarf sound because the Black Irons don't even have a plot. Or maybe mixed with the Wild Iron Ennaos.

Or maybe get the Kaldorei out of there and make azhara 100% elven. Maybe there put a plot where the Elves of the Horde show their apollo to the Kaldorei and grab from there to justify that the Kaldorei do not want to kill the entire Horde.

Lothamer: "give me an option to be able to leave Sylvanas without the Alliance destroying my city and I take her."

It is more so they could mix to make the plot at the end of BFA better for everyone. Instead of being an Anduin Plan that adds nothing. That Tyrande is the one who offers the idea to focus only on ogrimage, Anduin applauds her but the other leaders believe that they only want to avenge Teldrazzil and that this plan puts the Alliance at risk.

In the end it goes well and in this idea the alliance would have a reason to trust at least half of the Horde.

[Lochton]

An updated world would be entirely accesible to trial accounts. There's no money there.

Actually. Content available for trial accounts could mean more money. Sometimes a trail of breadcrumbs can lure people in easily. If a trial logs on in a non-updated world, well, they might not be so keen to stick around.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight]

Tavids? Honestly the Exodar Krokul under Nobundo and Velen should've been an allied race (with the LFD bieng customisation options), if they didn't want to add the void Krokul of Argus as an allied race.



Yeah, it's horrible. Hate how the humans are the centerpiece, lead everything, and everyone automaticly bow down to their experience and leadership without questioning it. Might aswell rename the Alliance into the Empire at this point.



The reason for the draenei absent is even more retarded "we lost so many people on Argus", yeah but you guys were still entirelly militarised and had troops ready, that just returned from freeing another world, a shit ton of experience and armed to the teeth... that's even ignoring the fact that they brought the Lightforged draenei back and Exodar draenei were bieng Lightforged already.

The worgen bieng partially absent makes sense, most of the Gilneans living in/around Darnassus were civilians while their military is mostly seen in the presence of King Genn Greymane... who spends most of his days in Stormwind City or on military campaigns.

The furbolg weren't absent, as Horde you also fight furbolg in Darkshore, using magic which drove them crazy. The lack of Stillpine Furbolg is quiestionable, yes, but they have never shown any naval knowledge so without the night elves or draenei they'd probably be unable to leave the islands.

Since most of Gilneas populace still lived in Night Elves' territory and that the NE are the Worgens' closest allies it was stupid to not have at least a good portion of Gilneas' military and other fighters present in Night Elves' lands during the War of Thorns.

Besides the Furbolgs were only seen in Darkshore even if they are also present in Ashenvale, and it's also stupid that many of the Night Elves' other natural allies such as Wildkins, Treants, Chimaeras, Fey Dragons and Moutain Giants weren't present during the war of thorns either.

[geco]

Since most of Gilneas populace still lived in Night Elves' territory and that the NE are the Worgens' closest allies it was stupid to not have at least a good portion of Gilneas' military and other fighters present in Night Elves' lands during the War of Thorns.

Besides the Furbolgs were only seen in Darkshore even if they are also present in Ashenvale, and it's also stupid that many of the Night Elves' other natural allies such as Wildkins, Treants, Chimaeras, Fey Dragons and Moutain Giants weren't present during the war of thorns either.

It really is a pity that there are no troops. But it is a bigger shame that civilians are not explored.
We are told that the Kaldorei evacuated the civil Warguens first. To have explored that in your culture would be much more magical for the world.

I mean, they can't really be accused of "Greedy" after doing that.

[Beloren]

Elune bless you and Brwosbandi guide your soul.

But besides that Yes. The dwarves in the Hobbyts movies is like the first time they let the dwarves look cool in fantasy.
If they take the Humans away, the Alliance could be a lot more fun.

Without going any further BFA instead of 3 human sounds. You could put on a human sound. One of "Kaldorei refugees" where you told how Tyrande and Maiev made peace that "dark coast" is the "end of the story" and not the beginning.
And a dwarf sound because the Black Irons don't even have a plot. Or maybe mixed with the Wild Iron Ennaos.

Or maybe get the Kaldorei out of there and make azhara 100% elven. Maybe there put a plot where the Elves of the Horde show their apollo to the Kaldorei and grab from there to justify that the Kaldorei do not want to kill the entire Horde.

Lothamer: "give me an option to be able to leave Sylvanas without the Alliance destroying my city and I take her."

It is more so they could mix to make the plot at the end of BFA better for everyone. Instead of being an Anduin Plan that adds nothing. That Tyrande is the one who offers the idea to focus only on ogrimage, Anduin applauds her but the other leaders believe that they only want to avenge Teldrazzil and that this plan puts the Alliance at risk.

In the end it goes well and in this idea the alliance would have a reason to trust at least half of the Horde.

I know right, you see how it irks alliance fans so often, that all the plans that work, and the good strategies are always coming from humans, in the presence of Elves and draenei that blizzards written "lore" class as highly intelligent, written to have developed empires and civilizations of scale and grandeur that makes humans' best efforts so far laughable.

It's not to say humans can't come up with great ideas, but seriously, if you are going to have Tyrande and Velen there, at least show the players why they and their race are worthy of such descriptions, but no, always a human.. I see that, and i think this is ridiculous , even on its bad day, I prefer the horde.. except the horde has had many bad days too.


Too often in this game, what you see doesn't match what they write. Is it that the writers don't understand what some of the adjectives and descriptions they use actually mean? Or is something else going on?

[geco]

I know right, you see how it irks alliance fans so often, that all the plans that work, and the good strategies are always coming from humans, in the presence of Elves and draenei that blizzards written "lore" class as highly intelligent, written to have developed empires and civilizations of scale and grandeur that makes humans' best efforts so far laughable.

It's not to say humans can't come up with great ideas, but seriously, if you are going to have Tyrande and Velen there, at least show the players why they and their race are worthy of such descriptions, but no, always a human.. I see that, and i think this is ridiculous , even on its bad day, I prefer the horde.. except the horde has had many bad days too.


Too often in this game, what you see doesn't match what they write. Is it that the writers don't understand what some of the adjectives and descriptions they use actually mean? Or is something else going on?

In the Horde you have a group of troll spies. Orc Army. Renegade Technology, Elf Mages, and Tauren Spirit Guides.

In the Alliance you have human spies, armies, human technology (but supposedly genomics), human wizards, and human spirit guides.

The alliance for me would have to be Kaldorei spies (Wardens), Human Armies, Genomic technology (and that has personality), spiritual guides and Human Magicians.
(Well I wrote it quickly in another I think well where the dwarfs would go and that).

PS: I agree that I always chose La Horad. But BFA breaks that of the Horde and their spirit of "honor" to the point that I have a hard time choosing the Horde now.
Although not even crazy I choose the XD Alliance.

PS2: Speaking of the difference of the council and the warchief.
Well, not the "war chief" has more variety in the plot than the council as shown by Blizzard.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight]

It really is a pity that there are no troops. But it is a bigger shame that civilians are not explored.
We are told that the Kaldorei evacuated the civil Warguens first. To have explored that in your culture would be much more magical for the world.

I mean, they can't really be accused of "Greedy" after doing that.

And yet Tyrande was supposed to be "wrong" and "unreasonnable" for wanting more retribution than the little Anduin gave her.

- - - Updated - - -

The Alliance of Loardaeron at least made extensive use of High Elven rangers and Wildhammer Dwarves gryfon riders as scouts, Bronzebeard Dwarves provided the heavy artillery and the Gnomes lots of their inventions and weapons.

We could see more of the dwarven's artillery, explosive experts and snipers, of Gnomes' rogues and inventions such as robots, world enlargers or shrink rays or force fields, of the Draenei's mages, mechas, elleks cavalry and technology; Night Elves' sentinels as scouts, rogues and wardens as spies and assassins, druids and their natural allies such as Furbolgs, Treants, Chimaeras and possibly Bog Beasts (since one of them joined the Alliance) to help the Alliance armies in major battles.

The Highborne and the Draenei are some of the most powerful and knowlegeable mages in existence and yet this is almost never shown onscreen. Same for the Gnomes who are super intelligent and whose creativity and quick-thinking should make them amongst the most dangerous and unpredictable magic users but this is never exploited.

- - - Updated - - -

A new Night Elf capital in Mount Hyjal should keep the nature theme unique to the Night Elves but also regain a bit of the architecture that they had before the War of the Ancients to signify that while they will always be close to nature and prefer druidism and Elune to arcane NE have began to come to terms with their past and to reaccept magic in their society, with arcane being used in combination with their connection to nature and used to protect it instead of dominating it like the Night Elf Empire did under Azshara.

[ravenmoon]

And yet Tyrande was supposed to be "wrong" and "unreasonnable" for wanting more retribution than the little Anduin gave her.

- - - Updated - - -

The Alliance of Loardaeron at least made extensive use of High Elven rangers and Wildhammer Dwarves gryfon riders as scouts, Bronzebeard Dwarves provided the heavy artillery and the Gnomes lots of their inventions and weapons.

We could see more of the dwarven's artillery, explosive experts and snipers, of Gnomes' rogues and inventions such as robots, world enlargers or shrink rays or force fields, of the Draenei's mages, mechas, elleks cavalry and technology; Night Elves' sentinels as scouts, rogues and wardens as spies and assassins, druids and their natural allies such as Furbolgs, Treants, Chimaeras and possibly Bog Beasts (since one of them joined the Alliance) to help the Alliance armies in major battles.

The Highborne and the Draenei are some of the most powerful and knowlegeable mages in existence and yet this is almost never shown onscreen. Same for the Gnomes who are super intelligent and whose creativity and quick-thinking should make them amongst the most dangerous and unpredictable magic users but this is never exploited.

Very well said.

They also use the faction so much and standardise it into human uniformity seldom using the other races.

I like how BFA had the alliance forces show up in their racial outfits and set up. This is how it should be rather than humanising them.

...
A new Night Elf capital in Mount Hyjal should keep the nature theme unique to the Night Elves but also regain a bit of the architecture that they had before the War of the Ancients to signify that while they will always be close to nature and prefer druidism and Elune to arcane NE have began to come to terms with their past and to reaccept magic in their society, with arcane being used in combination with their connection to nature and used to protect it instead of dominating it like the Night Elf Empire did under Azshara.

It really is important to show nature in a night elf capital. But I’m convinced this is done through incredibly rich gardens and parks for a city.

They must not use rural architecture for cities. That isn’t the place for it and it undermines what is supposed to be Azeroths oldest and highest achieving race. They won’t mix things up, and are not disordered or forgotten how to do cities because of the long vigil. They know forestry very well and they also no urban cities very well.

They love nature and they love beauty in all they do.

Tree homes and wood homes don’t fit the Druid philosophy in a city scape, the sheer number of trees you will twist or cut down or distort shape just for houses when you have the magic to do marble instead with vines interwoven doesn’t make sense. It will horrify them. Tree homes work as home’s for a large family in the forest or a very small village, nature is disturbed least as the quantity is very small. It is why most druids actually dwell in Bareow Debs and not in trees if you paid attention to night elf lore.

So in their city, gardens all over. Roof top gardens and parks, lots of green spaces. Like the image of Zin’Azshari where you saw some buildings had gardens on top. This is how you show the nature love. We know what night elf city buildings look like. We have seen them in Darnassus in the old architectural style, and we have seen them in Suramar, Die Maul, Nar’thalas and Zin’Azshari Warbringers. Those are how night elf do city buildings. Elune is shown in specific super beautiful buildings. The nicest structures night elves build have always been their temples to Elune. Nature love, this is shown in cities through beautiful gardens and parks.

Blizzard must show city gardens of the most beautiful kind and parks with nature wonder. Night elf nature side is instead shown fully in the forest, not in tree homes in a city

So This how you show nature in city. The thing with night elves is that nature will be present around the city too with a massive forest all over the mountain outside, not inside.

For Night elves it’s not just the city portion that is the city. It’s the forest too because the Druid people live in the forest. It is the priests, warriors, Highborne Mage types, traders, craftsmen, diplomats, Academies that require cities.

Druids are not going to live there. Their business doesn’t involve trading and commerce nor diplomacy with humans and allies. They don’t use academies and fortresses to train their troops and fellows like the sentinels posted to the city would do or the mages and schools of learning there would do. For Druid night elves - the forest provides their needs. In a city, you will find Druid folk in the parks and gardens they tend and in very limited quantities.

If you want to see Druid folk amongst the night elves, the city is not the place, but the forest outside.

I know some people expect night elves to live in a pure forest, but they completely forget that is just a part of them, they are a full race not a one thing race and they have wings and institutions that have no place in a forest.

They are not in isolation in the long vigil any more. WC3 shows them finishing the long vigil, sadly most don’t pay attention to the story which is why they expect things that don’t make sense for night elves. As a full and very detailed race, they will have cities with all the things a city needs. They’ve done this better than any other group. Now they need a city again they will do one, and they will have forests to show that Druid side.

but cities isn’t their whole life or centre like it is for races like humans. Night elves also greatly value forests which is why they have living forests. And temples which is why they have massive temples in their city or community

[geco]

And yet Tyrande was supposed to be "wrong" and "unreasonnable" for wanting more retribution than the little Anduin gave her.

From what we see Anduin was literally not going to give them anything or even get their lands back.

Back to the topic.

Imagine the houses "highborne" But instead of being in the form of "city" that are scattered throughout a forest. For me something like that should be the capital.

[ravenmoon]

Imagine the houses "highborne" But instead of being in the form of "city" that are scattered throughout a forest. For me something like that should be the capital.

Then that's not really a city.. that's just homes scattered throughout the forest. night elves have that, but they also have a city.

Darnassus when done was a city, on top of a tree, with a forest outside.

People don't get night elves or sometimes too often try to separate them from their pre-sundering past thinking that's just Highborne and night elves don't do that any more. Darnassus surely proved otherwise, and Highborne were never the only arcane users in the pre-sundering era nor the only ones to live in a city. As WotA clearly shows. I think there has been a misconception on the forums concerning night elves that often isn't corrected because dedicated night elf fans were few and far between.. most probably hoped to blood elves in TBc and never looked back. Viewed night elves as the inferior elves, that were stand ins for the high elves they always wanted.. and firmly still believe said high elves should always be better than night elves, whiles failing to understand night elves properly, because most of these guys never read Wota trilogy and still don't. They never read the WC3 manual, they ignore texts, because they don't like reading and you don't have to read in a video game. Except most of the night elf lore is in text, and only part of it shown, gradually more has been shown over time with the largest collection done in Legion expansion. Which they sadly can't even relate to the night elves, because they never knew this is what night elves did. This is why they love to separate them as if night elves were not kaldorei in the per-sundering era, and are a different night elf race post sundering - yet that's clearly not the case. The druidism in the long vigil was present throughout the pre-sundering era, just to a lesser extent and pushed to far out reaches around the time of the legion invasion, but it was there, and it was the same night elves that were in cities, doing arcane magic, worshipping Elune and loving nature. Just the ratios and extents were different. There were always lots more forests than cities , even in the pre-sundering era.

That's wrong on so many levels, the pre-sundering wasn't just Highborne, civilizations weren't just Highborne, Highborne was the ruling class.
night elves did not leave civilization and arcane magic forever, they were put aside for the long vigil,- the long vigil is over.

There are reasons any race needs a city, has been said a few times here already, and a city does not contradict night elf theme nor go against what the race stands for.. people just need to accept the night elves pre-sundering and long vigil era are part of the same race, not some different race. And a city can demonstrate it's nature love of it's race in ways that match what a city is - gardens say hello, parks say hello. You see people are in error to think that only a Highborne quarter would have beautiful marble buildings - and the rest of the night elves don't want that - with Darnassus and the history of their lore saying otherwise. nah, a Highborne quarter would likely be marked with a lot less gardens and parks, but it would have some too, because Highborne people never hated nature, the arrogant ones in the palace just stopped caring much for it in their arcane obsession. They still loved gardens and parks, but you would notice considerably less flowers, plants and green spaces in their lawns or roofs or hanging out of their windows. Where are standard Darnassian would have his beautiful marble building with grass floor, and flowers within and without, a Highborne would likely only have the garden outside. Where one would have a measure of wildness and randomness, the Highborne one would probably have all the flowers the same height, the same kind, order to colour and type, with no mixing. As an example.

what people wrongly assume is that the night elf would live in the sort of buildings blizzard uses for night elf small villages, loan lodges or forest homes, while the Highborne kind will live in actual houses - no, just no. There are buildings and styles for villages and remote locations or forest dwellings , as there are for mobile camps, there is a different sort for proper towns and proper cities. I say this based on what the game shows us. it uses those wood buildings in small villages , for lodges and forest dwellings, while it switches it up in the city, Darnassus was the only exception that had wood buildings, but none of the other night elven cities they have shown since do, nor should any, because of what that means - wood buildings in a city at that quantity means killing trees, or distorting trees for homes which is unnecessary when you can now use arcane magic (which they couldn't during Darnassus' building) and is definitely not druidic in style. IF you couldn't magic the marble and stone you needed like during the long vigil then you may have used wood, which they did, but only in small quantities, no big sprawling wood cities or towns.. because it's not the wow druid philosophy or view of the trees.

A pure forest race is worgen night elves, dryads/keepers, night fae, furbolgs - they will have a pure forest home. of night elves that sort of thing was only part.

Druidic culture never had large gatherings of people and homes because they spread through the wilds, but mostly slept in cave homes called barrow dens as part of what they do.

night elves are not just druids, but priests, mages - don't forget the returning Highborne, also diplomats, tradesmen, craftsmen etc

These things were not needed for their race during the long vigil because of what the long vigil was about - just because civilization, trade, craft, arcane magic, temple life was relegated because of the task does not mean that t isn't a part of the race and they still do them.

Night elves are no longer immune to elements and disease.. they can't just go lying around in the forest and fall asleep on the grass or tree top - if you want that, it's either a druid because of his nature magic or a dryad/keeper, a night fae, a worgen night elf or furbolg, they do that.



Also I don't get where people thinking all night elves must live in a forest and live in a tree. This clearly isn't demanded by the lore which has demonstrated a different state of affairs... They wrote the lore of the night elves to be an incredible elven race that loved both arcane magical and the forest, and had a civilization that showed or an perfected these to an incredible level. they didn't make them exclusive forest dwellers, even the Long vigil group, we meet them coming out of the long vigil in WC3, they are not created to stay in that place, or just be about the things there. This is evidenced by their lore, when they were designing Wc3, they were writing the War of the Ancients, showing the night elf civilization. Wc3 ends the long vigil, so when we start with them in wow, they are in a new era, both long vigil and pre-sundering era have passed. So why you thinking night elves most only live in a forest? and the capital must be a forest? I think most (not all) of these people aren't night elf fans, they're either horde fans, or alliance human or worgen fans.. some night elf fans think so to, but i can assure you most of these were lovers only of the side of the night elves shown in Wc3, when they were in the long vigil.

I don't get why people think somehow the forest aspect disappears , or will vanish because of a city or because night elves are using arcane.. they think that having more prominent mages or night elf civilization will somehow make them blood elves or Nightborne and not night elves.. WTF? Firstly they don't understand knight elves, 2, they don't know what they're talking bout. Nightborne are a night elf culture centred ONLY about a city, while the night elves have all of it, city parts, forest parts, priest parts, demon hunter parts. Night elves are a full race, not a one thing only small race, they are not an allied race. Wanna make one thing only about the forest? introduce night elf worgen,

Night elves because of their history, their current lo re, the alliance, their various orders and factions, need a city , as well as a forest and a massive temple of Elune to properly represent who they are and present them as a full race.

They have their uniqueness, no one does cities like Suramar and Zin'Azshari, or Nar'thalas and Darnassus - that's unique enough, to say night elves can only be unique without having a city is nonsense.. so all the other races in the game that have cities are therefore not unique ? I tell you some blood elf fans hate the idea of night elves getting their pre-sundering level of beauty for cities, because they feel threatened, but this has always been how night elves do cities.. they lore wrote them to come out of isolation too join an alliance.. funny how they don't have a problem with the alliance, or mixing with other race, nor with a beautiful temple, but when it is a city or arcane magic, guess who are their fiercest opposers/ Blood elf fans. The same who love to tell you night elves are not associated with the Nightborne - I mean it doesn't get more ridiculous than that

[Itori]

Mount hyjal has been sitting vacant for a while now, and it has the perfect defensive location for the Night elves, i'd think they would go there and live inside the old tree if anything.

[Tanaria]

The city has got to be of practical use and I think, they should make the Night Elf city the Kalimdor equivalent to Stormwind.

So, you've got a huge portal room (Highborne sections) with Mage trainers, you've got tradesmen and craftsmen quarters, you've got class trainers, you've got the sections of Alliance night elf society like the Sentinels, Wardens, Druids and the Sisterhood, but also - I think a barber's shop and transmog vendors should also go into both the new Night Elf city and the updated Silvermoon.

But again, the city must be practical. I know @ravenmoon, wanted Suramar - but even as a Horde player, Suramar - the city, is not practical for the functions that players need from a racial capital like Stormwind or Orgrimmar. The Nighthold is practical, for what it gives and it could give more, but as far as the in-game city of Suramar...it's too messy to try and navigate around to find your class trainers, profession trainers, portal room, barbers etc. Could work in the Nighthold for Horde players, but not the outer city. That will likely forever remain as part of the Legion outdoor content.

The new night elf city and updated Silvermoon should look like polar opposites, but have very similar functions in terms of how players use them.
I also think Silvermoon should serve like the Horde Eastern Kingdoms' Capital. The assets that Orgrimmar has, should also be given to Silvermoon, so then players can choose where they'd like to spend their time.

[geco]

Text. XD

Most of the Kaldorei tradition is in separate texts, not precisely in Wota.
The tradition is from Wota to W3 and shows many more things that we have to imagine because Blizzard never really tells us anything about that time.

Maybe you are not understanding me and you are thinking a lot like a human. How many times do you leave your house? how many times do you go with your neighbor.
Now think about that time and multiply it by 100. The Kaldorei do not need to live all crowded one above the other (What a city is) Because they live much longer and have another view of time. They also don't need quantity because they go for quality.
If in a human city you have one blacksmith for every 100 people in a Kaldorei you have one for every 1000 people.

I am not saying that the city does not exist but I am saying that we fuse the city and the forest. By the way, we have a city that is really different from the others.
To give you an idea the first level of Maiev from W3. That you go through a kind of 3 burned villages and forest in the middle and back to town and back to forest. Something like that I say (Of course without Illidian breaking everything with his nagas)

I mean instead of doing the elven version of this:


Make the elven version of this:

The city has got to be of practical use and I think, they should make the Night Elf city the Kalimdor equivalent to Stormwind.

So, you've got a huge portal room (Highborne sections) with Mage trainers, you've got tradesmen and craftsmen quarters, you've got class trainers, you've got the sections of Alliance night elf society like the Sentinels, Wardens, Druids and the Sisterhood, but also - I think a barber's shop and transmog vendors should also go into both the new Night Elf city and the updated Silvermoon.

But again, the city must be practical. I know @ravenmoon, wanted Suramar - but even as a Horde player, Suramar - the city, is not practical for the functions that players need from a racial capital like Stormwind or Orgrimmar. The Nighthold is practical, for what it gives and it could give more, but as far as the in-game city of Suramar...it's too messy to try and navigate around to find your class trainers, profession trainers, portal room, barbers etc. Could work in the Nighthold for Horde players, but not the outer city. That will likely forever remain as part of the Legion outdoor content.

The new night elf city and updated Silvermoon should look like polar opposites, but have very similar functions in terms of how players use them.
I also think Silvermoon should serve like the Horde Eastern Kingdoms' Capital. The assets that Orgrimmar has, should also be given to Silvermoon, so then players can choose where they'd like to spend their time.

Does it really have to be "practical"? That really is its value.
If we change our practice in exchange for them having more lore, wouldn't it be better?
I mean, the cities nowadays are simply there for the players to get together but they don't tell you a story. If we look for a city that tells you a story, wouldn't it be something much richer?

I say then they will make us go to Ogrimar and Stormwind again and the new cities will be forgotten by the developers.

[Moozart]

So:

1. Do you think this will actually happen? When? how?

2. What do you think it will look like?

3. Where do you think it will happen?

4. Why should it really happen?


My Answers:
1. Yes it will happen - because you've moaned too much about it:
a) It will happen when they do a world revamp
b) It will happen using existing assets polished and repurposed


2. It will look like a cross between Suramar and Zin'Azshari in warbringers, and Nar'thalas in Azsuna. It will have Zin'Azshari colours and not Suramar colours. It would be surrounded by nature and have lots of gardens.

3. It will happen on Hyjal, the broken isles is gone to the horde - hyjal has both Nordrassil and the Well of Eternity, and the night elves are now sufficeintly weak and battered enough for these racial assets previously nuorishing the world to also now work to their restoration.

4. It should happen because people care about races, and because night elves are very popular, if one of your most popular races is decimated by you in your story, and you receive a lot of fan hate for it, you'd be stupid to leave it just like that.

I don't think senior devs particularly care for night elves, and of those that still work at blizzard now, it's hard to say, but a lot of love was put into Suramar, night elf lore, so there must be junior designers that love the essence.

The new night elf home will be incredible: It will boast of the best of all areas of the kaldorei.

• City structures and wonders would be attributed to the shen'dralar's great skill as the kaldorei empires main magic wonder workers and engineers /architects
• Hyjal's natural beauty and deep forest lore of the wild gods will inform the state of nature as it is rebuilt. The city would likely be in the charred vale from the firelands incursions, but the rest of Hyjal would be beautiful forests, gardens leading up to the Well of Eternity and the World tree.
• A new Cathedral of Elune would be the centre piece of the new city and likely be clean version of the ToS in the broken isles, with bourrowed assets
• One day the barrowdnes and under mountain regions of Hyjal will open up, it is likely here the demon hunters will work together

We are likely never really going to go back to the Broken Isles for anything, it failed as a viable option when blizzard changed the Nightborne to horde. Allied races are very unlikely to get any real focus , Nightbonre are at a disadvantage uncoupled from the night elves - beacuse of their identity, it works better to be Silvermoon focused. But the future of the nightborne and blood elves depends on how heavy a role the alliance elves will have to play with Quel'thalas.

We know that Elune is going to be a bigger part of this expansion at some point. There is a possibility Tyrande ends up getting something from her to help restore Teldrassil.

[Shadowtwili]

We know that Elune is going to be a bigger part of this expansion at some point. There is a possibility Tyrande ends up getting something from her to help restore Teldrassil.

Hope they restore the Elven immortality and lack of diseases then too.

[ravenmoon]

Kaldorei homes:

Here is a picture of what a Darnassian kaldorei home in the city might look like in a proper night elf city


Art by Anndr (deviant Art)

and a highborne one in the highborne sector




Another example of how it would be in the section most Darnassians would live:




or



And in Suramar colours:



Note they both have beautiful buildings equally, same style, difference is, one is over flowing with nature interspersed and overflowing. It has flowers and gardens, while the other is mostly stark, if he had a garden, it would be super strict.. blizzard displays this perfectly in Suramar, the commons area, where the lowborne night elves/borne live doesn't have uglier buildings, the buildings are beautiful, but they have a lot more nature in them. compared to the noble/elite Highborne section of the city, where the buildings are more jewelled, and have a lot less media.

Blizzard already has defined what the difference is.

Switch tot he Temple and blizzard has differnet styles for a proper niight elf city temple;

Cathedral of Etenral Night the HQ of the TEmple of Elune:


Art by Hipnosworld from Deviantart
Just think of it as Suramar colours in a city, because lore wise this temple stood in the city, it's just that most of hte nighte lf buildigns have been destroyed by the new letgion ones.

Here is the Temple of Elune in a rural/town/village setting: The temples in FAlanaar (suramar) in the town of Meeredil and the one in Azsuna at the top of the cliff look exactly teh same.. notice they aredifferent from the capital city temple. Yet more evdienec that the style switches from Urban metropolis to town/rural area.. and also evidence that the Elune temples are the night elves' most outstanding structures, same during the pre-sundeirng era as it is now.

Old version of temple of elune in Darnasus



Here is a picture of rural home



Note: Lor'danel, Astrannar, Val'sharah - homes are all like this. Note how few homes they are - so as to use as litlte wood as possible, here is a nicer fan image by Peter Lee






Druids actually would live in barrow dens. here is a picture:




Mobile homes:


These were used for war, they are the games best mobile defence/offense structures, no one should be able to beat night elves for mobility in large campaigns, the long vigil thrived on that, as they constantly patrolled, the ancients will serve as bases, take root, and when they have to move get up and lvea

Wc3 version




one of several types of buildings which included. Altar of Elders, Ancient of Lore, Ancient of Wind, Ancient of Wonder, Ancient Protector, [these are all mobile] Night elves lived in these during the long vigil and travelled with them to fulfil the Long Vigil. they also had Bear dens





Chimera Roost, Entangled Goldmine, Hunters' Hall, Moon Well, Night elf birth, Night elf SHipyard

Updated wow cataclysm version: Wc3 versions are simplifeid models, they'd look more like this.
A Forest Stronghold from Feathermoon Stronghold in cata



These are NOT permanent homes, they military structures for sentinel type campaigns. A forest stronghold, during the long vigil, not to be confused, by a proper night elf stronghold when they did civilization prior to the long vigil:

Black rook Hold Military Stronghold



Moonguard Stronghold: Mage army stronghold




This is what they started building after the long vigil ended in WC3, to trap the demons that got loose in that battle: Notice how this is also very differnet from what the sentinesl whipped up in Feathermoon stronghold:





When they form a nation after WC3, they need more than mobile homes. T hey need a standing army, this is where night elf warriors become a thing, soldiers, this is where Moonguard will fit in too when and if they join as a magical wing, it becomes different.. armies existed from the mage and priest sides for the kaldorei during the war of the ancients and the conquest of Kalimdor.. night elves are not going to change how they do armies, they are a race that did armies well enough to conquer Kalimdor and defeat the Legion.

they are not going to change cities either, they know how to build them, and their standard trumps everyone else in terms of grace , majesty and style.. look at Suramar.. only blood elves have been able to achieve something nearing that level of spectacular, but even theirs didn't match.

Why would night elves use rural buildings in cities? They won't, they have rural buildings, they'll use them in rural areas for rural villages..

When they do cities: This is what they look like:

Ruined Town:

Image of Tel'anor - now this is full night elf town, not a small village or rural outpost like Astrannar and Lor'danel





Do note: towns are different from villages, especially forest villages. Astranar is a forest village, made out of wood, small, handful of buildings, Tel'anor and Meredil are towns, they instead are of stone and marble:



ruins of Meredil:




Ruins of Nar'thalas:



Nar'thalas before it was ruined:





Nar'thalas in full grandeur:



Ruins of Dire Maul (old model ruins - not updated)



An artistic impresson:







Artists impression of non-ruined city:



Old model Darnassus: this is before the Legion update, A rebuilt Darnssus would not look like this, notr should it, as Nelves have come far since then.



New models from Legion:
Suramar: Pre-sundering city not ruined: yes the nightborne live there now, but they are kaldorei civilziation culture, this is a night elf built city, all the famous night elves come fro this city, the prettiest in the night elf empire from 10,000 years ago, preserved and kept going prisitnely for 10,000 years. People who say this is nightborne not night elf, as if to say it isn't night elf architecture or a city is rubbish. It's like saying a high elf city isn't blood elf, it is, but it isn't. It's nosw a city of the nightborne, but htey are living in a kaldorei city.



Actual Zin'Azshari:






Artistic impression of Zin'Azsahri at night:


Zin'Azshari is not a Highborne city, it's a night elf city, where all castes had representation. Another misconception is all the cities were highborne. This again comes form blood elf centric fans who assume that any night elf civilization or arcane magic is actually blood elf, because they can't bare the thought that night leves had this. it's so silly.


Another fan impresion: of night elf city


Priestess Layilea on twitter




Why is wood used in the long vigil so much?:
Is it because they hate beautiful marble buildings? Is it because night elves are incapable and have forgotten how to build anything? or it that they can't build them? or won't? The games and the lore have all these answers.

Lore doesn't tell us they hated the beauty of their architecture or civilization, but that they hated the arrogance and of the Highborne, their decadent behaviour and addiction, and they hated that in themselves, the Highborne were the worse offenders, not the only offenders.

But they didn't hate beauty.. so why wood during the long vigil?

Think! the lore gives us all the clues.
1. Long vigil = military time, watch, fight, guard =/= build families, build homes and cities for normal life, trade etc, interaction with others, grow your civilization - for starters. it's isolation - mix with no one, fuck everyone up who tries to use magic, kill anyone who has intelligence that even gets a whiff of half the distance to the well of eternity. Hunt, hunt hunt, stragglers, invaders, demon mischief making satyrs, constant patrol, with forest folk like dryads, and furbolg. This is the long vigil. druids had important nature work, the priests, did the guarding, fighting and community - it wasn't build family time - most your men are asleep for 1000s of years, life is over for you, it's now duty duty duty, Legion was your responsibility you must bear this burden. And they'd id.
2. Philosophy of digging u the earth and disrupting nature just to build is not their style, maybe it never was.. old cities were built using nature and arcane magic. Arcane magic can extract and conjure material without harming the earth. which leads us to
3. The means to build them, or a vital means, i.e. arcane magic not allowed.

so a) no desire to build them during the long vigil - it's penance times
2. significant reduced means to do so

This is why they use wood, but very sparingly, they don't disturb nature.


When the long vigil ends, guess what, Darnasuss springs up, marble is back, city is back, there is a need, it's no longer long vigil any more, life has to go on, they're not immortal either, more protection is needed.


2 Important Points

1. There is night elf art for every situation: For a proper city, for town, for rural village, for a forest home - and there are ruins version of all of these. It is really extensive. They won't do more. What we want is a stunning night elf city, done well

2. Long Vigil and Pre-sundering are both OVER - but night elves will STILL buildings after BOTH styles. For the forest and mobile campaigns - the long vigil buildings do it best.. they'll use that.. for stationary cities for the full night elf civilization, they will use and build what they built in the pre-sundering era. Different groups like wardens, sentinels, Moonguard, will have their stuff in the areas they do.

All the night elf art is there and it is very very extensive. Night elves are a full race, and despite being ignored for most wow, they



More nice images:
Nar'thlas in Azsuna not in ruins




A night elf town's marble buildings



Notice it's pretty much a marble version of someo f the wood ones, but they arne't eh only type of buildigns, you have the gazeebos,



Nice, but notice the jump in eleveation from, Darnassu, first built just coming out of the long vigil, to Suramar or zin'Azshari, built with the night elves haivng learnt allt hat knoweldge and power - well, the same ngiht elven mages and ancietn tree drudis are still around, they've got the power of hte well of eternity - 2 of these 3 were absent when Darnassus was built, it's hight time they ahd somthing nice.

[Theangryone]

The only way you are going to get a new Nelf capitol with the current devs is if it is a new raid or m+ dungeon.

[geco]

At first I like each image less than the previous one for a "Kaldorei" city they look like a "High elf" city.

But the first one (and the one that you have ojas narnjas) I like a lot.

Then this makes me realize the great problem with Lore Kaldorei. The Horde get tired of finding so many Kaldorei things (that half are elven things so they are valid for both). But at the same time None (or almost none) of those things are really for the Kaldorei.

It's like there is the "Cake of the Kaldorei" But nobody can eat them.
In my case and the one that touches me the most. You have all these Wardens structures and a Wardens Dungon you even have two sonas if you count Cata. But you have 0 Wardens lore in all of WoW.
You don't have a history of helping a Wardens or something like that develop pj.
(Unlike for example the quest to help the Gobling Leader in Drenor for the spores that return to all monsters).
Either the Kaldorei don't need you or they are damsels who have to be saved.


PS: Unfortunate. How are you going to call an Ancioano a "mobile home"? He is a brother. It's like a Gobling saying that a Tauren is a "moving house".