Unpopular opinion: Cataclysm was one of the best expansions and I'll explain why.

[epigramx]

Many people created the meme that it was the worst expansion back then (or at least the worst expansion by a very easy margin and a very clear way) but for me it was very clear that they were biased by the mere fact that back then the overwhelming majority of players that were playing and they were still in the game were players that were there from the start or even the very start and I mean players that were there since Vanilla or at least late Vanilla or at most early BTC and it was the first time that most of them hit an age or a stage in their life that they really wanted an exit from MMO-long hours gaming and they wanted an excuse.
You see: in this game when you reach a certain age/point in your life you often feel the urge to exit it because you want to do something else because it took so many hours/per day in your life and some people are psychologically so attached that they really want a good excuse to do it and they don't have the capacity to realize and understand that they they do it because their own life had a turn and not necessarily the game itself and I've seen that fact clearly in many cycles of the game (vanilla/btc(most players first enter)->wotk(they're still in(nobody wants yet to live))->cata(they get old and leave)->mop(new players)->etc.).

[Azadina]

I read this rambling 3 times and I've yet to spot even a single reason why cataclysm was the best, or hell, even good expansion. Not one. Work on your script.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Did you forget to include the reason why OP? I'm seriously confused.

[froschhure]

Cata was bad because of death wing
Destroying azeroth. After ICC, cata felt like crap. Why? Because wotlk quality and quantity is superior to the "polished textures" cata delivered. In BFA I enjoyed the aspect to go back an do some stuff there. Literally no one was in uldum before BFA anyways.

[epigramx]

I read this rambling 3 times and I've yet to spot even a single reason why cataclysm was the best, or hell, even good expansion. Not one. Work on your script.

Did you forget to include the reason why OP? I'm seriously confused.

Cata was bad because of death wing
Destroying azeroth. After ICC, cata felt like crap. Why? Because wotlk quality and quantity is superior to the "polished textures" cata delivered. In BFA I enjoyed the aspect to go back an do some stuff there. Literally no one was in uldum before BFA anyways.

The point is most players back then were already in the game for years (almost all of them since late-Vanilla/early-TBC) and wanted an excuse to exit (WotLK was early for anyone to exit) and they didn't want to admit their real life changed so they had to blame the game itself.

The proof they are delusional is found in the obvious contractions they had: e.g.:
"WOTLK WAS PERFECT!!!!1!11" (Trial of the Crusader was the most ugly-ass looking raiding in the history of the Game itself and the grinding in the ICC dailies area was boring as fuck).
"Cata did nothing well!!1111!!11" (The art work on the goblin areas were the first time the game looked fresh again and raids like Firelands were some of the best ever.

At the end of the day the same brilliant people that designed Ulduar: designed some of the best fights in Cata too and while they did mistakes (like the ugly-ass looking Trial of the Crusader): they still kept improving the game and most people that exit the game do it because their own life changes and not the game but they don't want to admit it because they are conditioned to blame others for everything that happens to them.

[Runicblood]

Sentences, use them.
If i understand correctly, your reasoning for Cata being the best is that it is when "veterans" started to quit playing mmo's?

edit; oh, so actually cata was great because you thought ToC was trash. I also assume you're playing some wolk private server atm?

[epigramx]

Sentences, use them.
If i understand correctly, your reasoning for Cata being the best is that it is when "veterans" started to quit playing mmo's?

edit; oh, so actually cata was great because you thought ToC was trash. I also assume you're playing some wolk private server atm?

But you forgot to include why Cata was the best. It doesn't matter if people wanted to exit - Why was Cata better? What features or lack thereof made Cata better?

Why people dragged the expansion doesn't explain why it was a better expansion.

Learn reading: nobody told you it's the best: the title itself says it's *one of the best*. The point is its mistakes are overinflated by people that fail to see the game has a natural progression from the same devs or almost the same devs so when people segregate the expansions to their own little boxes only prove they are foolish and biased and only want an excuse to exit.

For example: compare the disgusting experience of Trial of the Crusader (in aesthetics at least) in the "perfect" expansion of WotLK with Firelands that most people liked: if you stop being foolish by putting expansions into little boxes you see that within months the game has ups and downs that make some expansions still some of the best ever and a lot of people that become haters of specific expansions and glorify others are foolish and mainly want an excuse to say why they cancelled their subscription or they have the traditional teenage mentality to always pick a fight by always picking a "team" when the funny thing is it's the SAME devs that created most of the mechanics and bosses and art of WotLK and Cata and others back then.

[Runicblood]

yeah idk who kicked you out of a toc pug on your private server, but you are clearly frustrated about something that isn't directly related to cataclysm being one of the best expansions

[Alahondor]

Learn reading:

You do not need to tell anyone to "learn reading" when your original post was two run on sentences that actually took my breath away to read in my head.

Do you like Cataclysm? Then state the reasons why you like it. This topic (read: what expansions are good or bad) is entirely *subjective.* Just like everyone else in this thread that will give their opinion on the expansion, you can simply give yours too. I challenge you to list 5 separate things about Cata that you actually enjoyed and that make it one of the best expansions to you. I enjoyed Cata, it's probably my favorite expansion, but I can actually list out the reasons why that is, rather than saying "its because it actually just had a bad rap" which is what your post is all about.

So again, lets actually see your reasons, and please do not tell anyone to learn to read.

[epigramx]

yeah idk who kicked you out of a toc pug on your private server, but you are clearly frustrated about something that isn't directly related to cataclysm being one of the best expansions

I haven't played in an illegal server since I was a kid in vanilla. This has nothing to do with those servers. I've been playing with subscriptions and raiding since TBC.

[Runicblood]

I honestly enjoyed ToC. /unpopular opinion

[epigramx]

So "Cataclysm was one of the better expansions because people were old and grody."

That's a shitty explanation, then. No, I don't agree. I do agree that Cataclysm was given a lot more shit than it deserved, but no, it was not "one of the best expansions" just because people disagreed with the design direction.

Cataclysm rightfully gets shit for all the focus put on revamping the old world. Even the devs agreed that their vision suffered due to it.
Cataclysm rightfully gets shit for putting it's entire focus on raiding and the gear treadmill, which they directly sought to address in MoP. (To great success.)

Yes, Wrath had it's problems too. No, that doesn't elevate Cataclysm in any way, shape, or form.

You contradict yourself: you first say "yes I agree it took more shit" and then say "but yeah" but the fact is you can't quantify HOW MUCH worse or better it was so we're clearly talking about personal opinions here that are very subjective.

My opinion is that very clearly the Vanilla players (the original ones) were some of the most hateful people that ever existed in the game because I remember VERY WELL those people hated EVEN TBC (anyone that was an adult back then can vouch I'm telling the truth) so when they started getting old for MMOs (most people do after 2 or 3 expansions max) they started spitting hate like never before and Cata took the worst hit of that hate of that first predictable wave of exodus.

A further proof of all that is the treatment gamers gave to MoP: very clearly that expansion was lucky to get a wave of new players that had not played Vanilla and there was almost zero criticism compared to Cata while very clearly MoP had some bad designs in it: and similarly WoD got the most hate ever since it was another time for an Exodus (when the main "sin" WoD commit was to overdo it with the spam of Followers (they should have had only 10-20 of them max)).

[Mendzia]

It had a few really good things but still one of the top 3 worst xpacks (next to BFA and WoD).

[epigramx]

You do not need to tell anyone to "learn reading" when your original post was two run on sentences that actually took my breath away to read in my head.

Do you like Cataclysm? Then state the reasons why you like it. This topic (read: what expansions are good or bad) is entirely *subjective.* Just like everyone else in this thread that will give their opinion on the expansion, you can simply give yours too. I challenge you to list 5 separate things about Cata that you actually enjoyed and that make it one of the best expansions to you. I enjoyed Cata, it's probably my favorite expansion, but I can actually list out the reasons why that is, rather than saying "its because it actually just had a bad rap" which is what your post is all about.

So again, lets actually see your reasons, and please do not tell anyone to learn to read.

The point was to say how biased people are at the moment they want to quit MMO gaming in general: this game gets cycles of exoduses: during an exodus the meme is to hate the current expansion: the fact vanilla players (the actual ones) hated TBC and WotLK (anyone that was an adult back then knows it) proves it.

As far as your insistence to list good things of Cata (which is a slightly different subject) it's very easy.
E.g. The new art work for the goblin areas and other refurbished areas is beautiful (I love the blending of technology and fantasy they did because I love scifi and fantasy), or Firelands was one of the best raids ever designed, or the Mechanics of classes were the most polished as they had ever been.

At the end of the day the devs were almost the same from the start back then so in terms of mechanics of fights and classes (actual gaming):
Vanilla originally was a turd at an alpha stage -> TBC was almost a complete game (almost balanced) - > WotLK was a polished TBC (and clearly the best until that time) -> Cata polished the mechanics of WotLK even further and refurbished the art a little -> MoP refreshed the aesthetics a lot and while the actual fighting didn't improve they kept adding mechanics (most later expansions kept trying to add that way because the game stopped having broken mechanics since at most WotLK).

- - - Updated - - -

It had a few really good things but still one of the top 3 worst xpacks (next to BFA and WoD).

I would normally agree: but: I really think MoP is overrated to an extend. It is not a bad Expansion per se (the game always got progressive improvements to everything anyway and segregating expansions too much is a stupid meme anyway) but it's overrated because the mechanics of fights and classes themselves weren't improved that much and people mainly based their hype for it on the refurbished art aesthetics alone (new panda aesthetics that wore off anyway). Also since the game gets those cycles of exoduses of players that have been around too much to play at all after a point they often find an excuse to overrate their hate for an expansion (e.g. Cata and WoD) and the new players that get in (or stay in) overrate the ones after the exodus (e.g. MoP and Legion).

[McNeil]

Cataclysm is looked back on a lot more fondly since WoD and most of its following expansions. I still don't like it due to various reasons:

- I don't like the way they revamped the old world by demolishing a lot of what made the world look beautiful, its one of the main reasons why I wanted Classic
- The questing started to go on rails and the game felt a lot closer to a singleplayer RPG rather than a huge open world MMORPG
- Also the atmosphere changed drastically, mainly because they did a lot of joke quests like the ones in Westfall and Redridge (I prefer the more mystic vibe from the old world)
- They didn't add a new continent and I don't like how spread out all the new zones were. We even needed a portal for each zone just to reach them
- Dungeons were stupidly overtuned, something that apparently the vast majority of the playerbase didn't want after all after the outcry that WotLK dungeons were too easy
- The lore was just a Thrall wankfest with very little of Deathwing actually doing anything after he caused the Cataclysm
- Patch 4.3 in general.....

It does have some bright spots:

- PvP was very solid
- Worgen and goblin are very fun new races and their starting zones are some of the best
- Vashj'ir is a fun and unique zone that sadly didn't get enough love, they would need to improve the underwater physics and combat by a lot
- Firelands is a really good raid, with Rag being one of the better fights in the game
- Flying in Azeroth gave the world a whole new dynamic

[muto]

It had a few really good things but still one of the top 3 worst xpacks (next to BFA and WoD).

And Shadowlands.

I’d honestly rather play through Cataclysm again than WoD, BFA, or Shadowlands, at least until Dragon Soul, then I’m out like swimwear.

[epigramx]

- The questing started to go on rails and the game felt a lot closer to a singleplayer

That's the most unfair criticism an expansion can get; though I understand the delusion that causes it; people want to blame anything in their path.
First of all it's the exact same designers that worked back then from the start and Vanilla has an unfinished mess in terms of questing.
Secondly: the EXACT SAME mechanics of questing continued in "perfect" expansions like MoP and Legion and people don't bother.
In fact: the game is progressively improving (or call it changing) in those things since the very start: TBC was very streamlined.

- - - Updated - - -

That's the most unfair criticism an expansion can get; though I understand the delusion that causes it; people want to blame anything in their path.
First of all it's the exact same designers that worked back then from the start and Vanilla has an unfinished mess in terms of questing.
Secondly: the EXACT SAME mechanics of questing continued in "perfect" expansions like MoP and Legion and people don't bother.
In fact: the game is progressively improving (or call it changing) in those things since the very start: TBC was very streamlined.

To add on that: I can't believe people even forget TBC itself which just got a "classic" version: it had EXTREMELY streamlined questing mechanics.
RIGHT OFF THE BAT you enter a zone that you have to kill some boars and you reach the FINAL ZONE with an unbreakable chain of questing.
Besides: it's not even that bad: Vanilla was a fucking mess and not a "pleasant chaos" (to anyone without rose-tinted glasses).

[Osmeric]

Cataclysm was one of the worst expansions, in my opinion. Before SL I rated it as the worst. It showed enormous misjudgment on the part of the devs as to what their customers actually wanted. On the positive side, at least they seemed to care that they had screwed up, unlike in SL.

[Cosmic Janitor]

You'd be just wrong, there was plenty wrong with cata and the reasons for that have been explored to death as well.

[Skayth]

I will actually state that cataclysm was a good expansion (until dragon soul). Buttttt that's only for fresh people.

All the content was in leveling. And it was actually really good. I liked it. Problem was, it was for leveling. Alot of people were max lvl already. And all they had to do was the few endgame leveling zones. They were good, but it didnt last to long.

Theeeeeennnnn, the raid were good as well, but that's not a big thing, since that's normal. Raids, art, and music always tends to be the plus to even the worst expansions. (Cough wod and bfa)

Here though, it became very casual friendly, after the original dungeons got nerfed to the ground. They were working under the assumption they would grow more subs. Wotlk spiked pretty hard, so in cata development it became more casual friendly.

And firelands is one of the best raids ever. Transmog came into existence. Soooo yes. Cata had quite a few good things. It is not the best, but it's not the worst.

What should have happened was to have all the content scale with ur character in most zones. That way, no content went to waste. But they havent even done that to this day, cause blizzard are stubborn.