1. #49461
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkon-III
    Posts
    20,131
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordin Solus View Post
    Honestly id prefer he just enjoyed it off stream by his own so that the people of the server dont have to be flooded by his fans. id only enjoy watching him strugle with the raiding since he is so unprepared XD
    If he raided mythic in WoW, I don't think he would struggle much. The systems are fairly comparable.
    I think, in terms of variety, WoW still presents more situations to the player to adapt to.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ippollite View Post
    Does that make sense?
    I feel the same about my lil' Ifalna, so to me it would make sense.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    Their post states they wants Asmongold (by name) out of the community, and is openly gatekeeping the game and wants anyone to watch him (once again by name) and report anything he does that seems a little out of line... I mean does that seem like fine behaviour to you? It would be like me being sent to watch you day and night while you sleep to when you are a wake to when you work, waiting for you to do something wrong then report you for it all because you are participating in something I like and don't want you to be part of...

    Yes there is something wrong with that. Thats harassment.
    No, if Asmongold and his fans are indeed such nasty players (again: no personal experience here), then I can understand that they do not wish people with that kind of behavior in the community.

    I agree that it's basically Blockleiter behavior but still, as long as SE's staff are the ones actually in power, I don't foresee any problems, except these Blockleiters wasting a ton of their time (and eventually getting punished for harassing support staff), which would be poetic, don't you think?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    How? /10chars
    I think it was that one, not entirely sure however you might have to experiment a bit:


  2. #49462
    Quote Originally Posted by Barzotti View Post
    Maybe, we will see. I just hope for your community he won't stick with FF14 for long on stream, I don't think his community and his persona gives the kind of reaction or attention you want for a game with a positive and chill reputation.
    If I didn't know about him and wasn't visiting these forums. This would have literally 0 effect on my experience playing the game.

  3. #49463
    Granyala dont forget M+ is not just 8 people, there is a better chance to get carried there than in 8 mans where you are so much more accountable for your actions specialy in end turn savages and ultimates.

    Lets not forget light rampant is a thing for a reason XD
    someone else might have gotten it wrong.

  4. #49464
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkon-III
    Posts
    20,131
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordin Solus View Post
    Granyala dont forget M+ is not just 8 people, there is a better chance to get carried there than in 8 mans where you are so much more accountable for your actions specialy in end turn savages and ultimates.
    Depends on the gear level of the group. I have seen quite a bit of carrying in savage. *shrug*

    I honestly do not believe that savage is in any way harder than mythic, they are pretty on par in terms of difficulty, only that I feel that Blizzard is more creative in terms of visuals while mechanics in XIV mostly always look the same (towers for instance). I cannot comment on ultimate, as I never played it.

  5. #49465
    Quote Originally Posted by AryuFate View Post
    Asmongold single-handedly brought FFXIV into the top 5 most viewed games on Twitch during his stream. I don't think he'll stick with it though: who streams hundreds of hours of Old English text? It's hard to focus while keeping up with the stream and most people will not be entertained by it.
    His second FF14 stream if i can read these stats right was the best non launch day/first time stream he's ever had. Seems people are enjoying it more then anything else. Besides he does more then just read quest text, even when reading quest text.

    He's not going to quit playing or streaming wow though as he said himself, he will by his own words bare minimum reach level 80 in FF14 and try do a savage raid which is a hefty time investment. But I don't expect we will be seeing him doing grindy stuff for mounts etc after that though like he does in wow, Prob won't stream it again until end walker is out.

  6. #49466
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkon-III
    Posts
    20,131
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    And with a significantly less competitive playerbase.
    Wouldn't be too sure about that one. At least not from the behavior I've seen ingame.
    maybe on the front of world firsts, no clue. Don't follow such things.

  7. #49467
    Quote Originally Posted by Barzotti View Post
    He probably won't stick with FF14; eventually his horde of rabid fans will get bored and he'll come back to streaming WoW. Probably tomorrow when the new raid launches. Every time he was supposed to quit streaming WoW for good, he came back eventually.



    I didn't see any big WoW streamer trying out FF14 other than Asmongold and AnnieFuchsia lately. The end game streamers have been streaming TBC for the last month, not FF. You gotta wonder whether people have been watching because it was FF14, or because it was Asmongold streaming FF14. He could watch paint dry on stream and still get an immense viewership count.

    And the latest WoW raid hasn't been released yet, this week was more the prepatch of the 9.1 patch (no raid, no megadungeon, no new M+ season this week). Just wait for the world first race in one week and you'll see.
    Bellular and Preach on youtube have also been trying out FF14. Bellular used to be pretty big WoW content creator before he became clickbait garbage and decided that low effort videos of him just talking to his friend ranting while he checks his email on his phone is good enough. Like.. at least make eye contact with the camera sometimes..

  8. #49468
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordin Solus View Post
    Granyala dont forget M+ is not just 8 people, there is a better chance to get carried there than in 8 mans where you are so much more accountable for your actions specialy in end turn savages and ultimates.
    I'd argue that the opposite is true - Higher level M+ keys have a slim margin for error and one bad player can drag down the rest of the group much easier than in a Savage raid. While you can carry people, the higher you push the harder it becomes if you're aiming to beat the timer. If you're not concerned about the timer then you can brute force your way through almost any M+ eventually, carries in the group or not.

    M+ tends to need a lot more coordination for interrupts and some of the affixes than anything I've seen in FF14.

    FF14 is a lot more forgiving in terms of it punishments for failure. You can be ressed and carry on with a damage penalty and still contribute something to a group. In WoW you're either taking up a combat res (which can be a valuable resource) or are sitting the fight out. You take an additional 5 second timer penalty in either case.

  9. #49469
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    Preach on youtube have also been trying out FF14.
    As far as I know, Preach didn't even touch the game, he only tried to guess Ultimate mechanics from kill videos.
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Looking for Raid.
    They never found one though

  10. #49470
    Quote Originally Posted by StrawberryZebra View Post
    I'd argue that the opposite is true - Higher level M+ keys have a slim margin for error and one bad player can drag down the rest of the group much easier than in a Savage raid. While you can carry people, the higher you push the harder it becomes if you're aiming to beat the timer. If you're not concerned about the timer then you can brute force your way through almost any M+ eventually, carries in the group or not.

    M+ tends to need a lot more coordination for interrupts and some of the affixes than anything I've seen in FF14.

    FF14 is a lot more forgiving in terms of it punishments for failure. You can be ressed and carry on with a damage penalty and still contribute something to a group. In WoW you're either taking up a combat res (which can be a valuable resource) or are sitting the fight out. You take an additional 5 second timer penalty in either case.
    M+ past a certain point is completely irrelevant, and the more gear you obtain the less relevant pushing a key becomes. Doing a +20 or more in a mode that scales infinitely doesn't make it infinitely more difficult. Yes, it's certainly massively punishing and key obliterating if even one person dies, or people aren't playing 100% optimally.. in content that's completely irrelevant outside of a mostly meaningless challenge. A +15 doesn't really require much from anyone, outside of the odd stun, or pretty basic affixes that equate to "Kill at the same time. Kite. Don't stand here. Don't cast. Get everything low then kill it. Burst x enemy." You bring damage, you'll probably win.

    Besides, if you're familiar with on release Savage content you would know that even with 8 people playing optimally, one death or two can still result in you not making the enrage and just dying. Just because you can res as many times as you want in a fight doesn't mean that the res sickness and downtime won't result in failure. I mean you don't get any stat deficit if you die and get res'd in WoW, either. Maybe that isn't completely true with the best of the best, but those groups that were going for "day 1" kills on the 4/4 Savage boss? One death? You wipe.

    Fights in FF14 are, however, 100% scripted with very little RNG. It makes for very easy fights because the more you wipe, the more you perfect your CDs, the more you perfect maximum damage and uptime as a healer, and it gets easier with gear. Again, not all so different than WoW, I suppose.
    Last edited by La; 2021-07-05 at 04:38 PM.
    *Insert every single ridiculous PC parts detail here that no one cares about*

  11. #49471
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogalicus View Post
    As far as I know, Preach didn't even touch the game, he only tried to guess Ultimate mechanics from kill videos.
    Oh yeh. That's what I saw. But still, giving it exposure.

  12. #49472
    Quote Originally Posted by StrawberryZebra View Post
    FF14 is a lot more forgiving in terms of it punishments for failure. You can be ressed and carry on with a damage penalty and still contribute something to a group. In WoW you're either taking up a combat res (which can be a valuable resource) or are sitting the fight out. You take an additional 5 second timer penalty in either case.
    It greatly depends on the content. During Savage (Mythic) Raid prog, a few deaths and you're very likely not killing the boss in your gear. You also don't double your damage with BiS from the start of the tier, like taking 10m fights down to 5m. General mechanics are also a lot tougher in FFXIV, though they have to be because the game is a lot slower at a base 2.5s GCD as opposed to WoW's 1.5/1.0 (for AGI). On top of that, 24% of a healer's MP bar (unless they're WHM and use Thin Air on it) per rez is nothing to just ignore, especially if they give a crap about their stats and don't go nuts on Piety, even moreso if you have multiple deaths.

    Also while I haven't played Shadowlands, in BfA you could definitely carry a player at +15 (the highest level that mattered) and still make the timer. I'm a pretty meh player and my group did that aplenty. In FFXIV, if one player dies in Savage or even Extreme Trials, you're very likely losing at least 1-2 more people to a mechanic that is intended to hit 8 players (which is now hitting 7 so someone's gonna be hit twice). There is no zero-penalty BRezzing (which is also 2-5x faster to do in WoW than it is in FFXIV) unless you want to waste LB3 on that.

    But yeah, definitely depends on the content you're talking about. I wish we had some form of M+ in FFXIV because it would make the dungeons less boring and more than just Tomestone (Justice/Valor Points) farming (a la BC/LK dungeons which also got very repetitive). I just wanted to point out that having "unlimited battle rezzes", while it sounds great on paper, runs into many downsides. We don't have an M+ system so it's hard to fairly compare.


    That said, I will say that WoW definitely demands more CC from you. You never use Sleep outside of Baldesion Arsenal, and Interrupts are extremely uncommon (also only available to Tanks and Physical Ranged players) while it feels like a quarter of every WoW tier has something that demands interrupts, potentially another few of them that need some other form of CC. Where FFXIV makes up for that though is planning mitigation cooldowns (as virtually every class has at least 1 "raid-benefitting mitigation tool) and DPS-increasing cooldowns that you want to line up and stack as many as you can (vast majority of which are on a 2m cooldown).
    Last edited by Polarthief; 2021-07-05 at 04:53 PM.
    Still wondering why I play this game.
    I'm a Rogue and I also made a spreadsheet for the Order Hall that is updated for BfA.

  13. #49473
    Quote Originally Posted by zorkuus View Post
    How do you know some of his fans don't play FF?
    I know for a fact that some do, but his that doesn't make my statement incorrect. They're still a part of the community.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wangming View Post
    You think there is no overlap?

    Saying: This was the FFXIV community is just as hypocritical, my dude. Especially cause this happens every time Asmon plays any MMO from WoW, to ESO, to FFXIV. And it somehow didn't happen to Pyromancer, Jesse, Taliesin, Evitel or Bellular. Makes you think, huh?

    Personally I think the crowd was a mix of regular dumb Asmon fans, and FFXIV fans who think this is somehow making the game less toxic (jokes on them, Asmon had fun and he was less toxic than the so called defenders), with neither of these groups representing the whole. Anyone who says otherwise is just pushing an agenda.
    Your post was my entire point . That's always been my point to every single one of these discussions. This community is a hypocritical mess filled with the same people that play a bunch of other games that people regularly talk trash about. This is generally true of any gaming community IMO.

  14. #49474
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Arkon-III
    Posts
    20,131
    Quote Originally Posted by StrawberryZebra View Post
    I'd argue that the opposite is true - Higher level M+ keys have a slim margin for error and one bad player can drag down the rest of the group much easier than in a Savage raid.
    Are there M+ keys for the big raids now? Oo
    I was only aware of the dungeon zergfest M+ mode.

  15. #49475
    Calling Savage on par with Mythic raiding feels a bit disingenuous. Maybe like the first 1-2 bosses of a mythic tier, but nowhere near the latter half of a tier. I can't speak on Ultimates as I've never participated but as someone alluded to above, there is 3 of them in a 7 year old game so it's somewhat moot.

  16. #49476
    Quote Originally Posted by Dakhath View Post
    Calling Savage on par with Mythic raiding feels a bit disingenuous. Maybe like the first 1-2 bosses of a mythic tier, but nowhere near the latter half of a tier. I can't speak on Ultimates as I've never participated but as someone alluded to above, there is 3 of them in a 7 year old game so it's somewhat moot.
    yeah in my opinion clearing both, id say savage is like the first 75% of a raid in mythic (the last 2/3 bosses usually being much harder compared to final ffxiv bosses), ultimate being final boss difficulty. wow raids on average are much harder compared to ffxiv.
    Last edited by The Oblivion; 2021-07-05 at 06:35 PM.

  17. #49477
    Herald of the Titans Marxman's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    2,540
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    Bellular and Preach on youtube have also been trying out FF14. Bellular used to be pretty big WoW content creator before he became clickbait garbage and decided that low effort videos of him just talking to his friend ranting while he checks his email on his phone is good enough. Like.. at least make eye contact with the camera sometimes..
    He still makes the videos you're talking about. You're complaining about his stream vods being less professional... no shit they're less professional. It's a stream vod.

    Bell is no more clickbaity than the rest of youtube. The algorithm is dumb, you gotta do what you gotta do. As long as the videos are still good (and they are), who cares about clickbait titles or thumbnails?

  18. #49478
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    He still makes the videos you're talking about. You're complaining about his stream vods being less professional... no shit they're less professional. It's a stream vod.

    Bell is no more clickbaity than the rest of youtube. The algorithm is dumb, you gotta do what you gotta do. As long as the videos are still good (and they are), who cares about clickbait titles or thumbnails?
    It seems asmongold only reacts to the stream vods then and most often they are completely void of any substance and are just Bellular's irish friend ranting while Bellular sits there looking at his phone.

  19. #49479
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    Bell is no more clickbaity than the rest of youtube. The algorithm is dumb, you gotta do what you gotta do. As long as the videos are still good (and they are), who cares about clickbait titles or thumbnails?
    Loving every laugh shillfriend.

    Bellular
    How To WIN! The Patch 9.1 Torghast Revamp Guide: Earn 5* Score, Rewards & MORE
    CONFUSED? Patch 9.1 Korthia & Maw Guide: Fast Rep, Gear Mounts & MORE!
    Should YOU Resub For 9.1? The Pros, Cons & Honest Opinions

    Preach
    Drama Time - Furry Daddy Milkers
    Drama Time - My Character Quit Before I Did
    Preach's Most Corrupt Guild - ConFused

    You can pretend there's no difference there but anyone with eyes can see someone's click baiting just a smidge harder (hint it's not Preach)
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  20. #49480
    Herald of the Titans Marxman's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    2,540
    Quote Originally Posted by Saltysquidoon View Post
    Loving every laugh shillfriend.

    Bellular
    How To WIN! The Patch 9.1 Torghast Revamp Guide: Earn 5* Score, Rewards & MORE
    CONFUSED? Patch 9.1 Korthia & Maw Guide: Fast Rep, Gear Mounts & MORE!
    Should YOU Resub For 9.1? The Pros, Cons & Honest Opinions

    Preach
    Drama Time - Furry Daddy Milkers
    Drama Time - My Character Quit Before I Did
    Preach's Most Corrupt Guild - ConFused

    You can pretend there's no difference there but anyone with eyes can see someone's click baiting just a smidge harder (hint it's not Preach)
    Preach doesn't monetize his videos. You don't need clickbait if you aren't trying to run a business on YT.

    Also notice that Preach's drama time series are his least watched videos, easily. A quick glance at Preach's "Most Popular" videos... "TOP 5 (X) IN WOW!". Wow! Almost like the algorithm is in play for Preach as well. Who would have thought?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •