A decent MMO plagued by some serious problems that make it unplayable in the long run

[zorkuus]

1) Combat:

there has actually been a lot of ability pruning. There's at least 10 abilities I czn name off the top of my head that don't exist anymore.

That didn't solve much though. They remove 2 abilities then add 5 new ones in an expansion.

[Shaetha]

The thing is that in this case their claim isn't even true.

Like I said before, XIV's economy is actually extremely broad. Even max level players will still be looking for glamour items, housing items, crafting items, gear for alt jobs, materials for quests, levequest items they don't want to bother crafting and so on.

Even this late into the expansion I can sell level 70-80 crafting leve items at 500% markups. Housing items for whatever people felt like marking them up for. It's just crazy out there.

I understand, but I was arguing that even if it was true, it's just something to be expected in a video game. Especially an RPG. I think people tend to forget MMORPGs also need to do video game things and RPG things as well the MMO things. (I also think people forget what those things actually are, but that's another topic.)

[Echo of Soul]

It's not bait. The FF XIV community is just extremely defensive.

Every MMORPG community is defensive. Try shitting on WoW in the WoW subforum and people will come after you hard. Nobody likes having people hating on their game.

[zorkuus]

Every MMORPG community is defensive. Try shitting on WoW in the WoW subforum and people will come after you hard. Nobody likes having people hating on their game.

There's a big difference between shitting on a game and just stating an observable fact.

[Saltysquidoon]

Every MMORPG community is defensive. Try shitting on WoW in the WoW subforum and people will come after you hard. Nobody likes having people hating on their game.

There is literally a thread up in the GD forum about an obviously fake LARP shitting on blizzard that people are debating the merits of its points despite the fact is obviously fake. Wow's reddit spent all week dabbing on suevanas.

Neither of these things would ever happen if they were related to FFXIV. I don't even know why it's so controversial to point out FFXIV players are hyper defensive here, every other FFXIV fansite basically admits it.

[Aliven]

There is literally a thread up in the GD forum about an obviously fake LARP shitting on blizzard that people are debating the merits of its points despite the fact is obviously fake. Wow's reddit spent all week dabbing on suevanas.

Neither of these things would ever happen if they were related to FFXIV. I don't even know why it's so controversial to point out FFXIV players are hyper defensive here, every other FFXIV fansite basically admits it.

Can you provide proof and those fansites?

[Saltysquidoon]

Can you provide proof and those fansites?

What would proof be for you a link?, two, three?

How could I even prove *some number* of people in a given community have a trait to a level you personally would find compelling? Hell if you haven't noticed this weird near messianic aura Yoshi has among the fans already, you're probably never going to see it.

[Forteofgray]

Every MMORPG community is defensive. Try shitting on WoW in the WoW subforum and people will come after you hard. Nobody likes having people hating on their game.

every community is full of people who just want to be negative and argue with stuff for the sake of it. every single thread on these forums is proof of that. anything that people enjoy, there is going to be a demographic that comes out of the wild to shit on it even though it's probably just not for them. kinda like the guy who was comparing ESO to XIV adamantly.

[Swnem]

I don't think that FFXIV necessarily needs to prune abilities so much as they should be merged into one another. Much like as in PvP, combo abilities should be tied into one button.

Yup. I agree with that.

The combos can go in one button. Gw2 does that too. I think every class has at least 2 combos. It would imediatly free 4 slots.

[Ethas]

Decent? Have you played it? I had a hard time registering the account. It took me half an hour on their morally dead website. The game itself looks like trash. I couldn’t even get to the first quest how dead boring it is.

[zorkuus]

Decent? Have you played it? I had a hard time registering the account. It took me half an hour on their morally dead website. The game itself looks like trash. I couldn’t even get to the first quest how dead boring it is.

Compared to a lot of MMO's I've played in my years, FFXIV is triple A quality, nevermind some hiccups here and there.
If FFXIV isn't even decent then those other MMO's are straight dumpster material.

And just FYI, I quit the game two times before I really got into it.

[doodle90]

Exactly, those queues maybe for like 12am-11am anything other than that is highly unlikely. Because roulette includes all dungeons and everyone does them for tomes/exp so even if your dungeon is one that isn't common you'll still be paired with people. Trial roulette also includes all primals, and since titan is a lower lvl one it is more likely to get chosen because the pool of people is larger. I have NEVER ever had a 2hour queue outside of like trying to do some random thing at 4am. And that would have to be somethign not included in the MSQ.

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I just wish they would fix the way they do lvl scaling in low lvl dungeons. Scaling is a good idea but taking 90% of your skill bar away and forcing people into the mmo hell of lvl 10 experience press 3 buttons for 30min is insane and makes it painfull. Just scale the damage and let higher players enjoy the whole skill set. Its not like leveling is competitive.

No the problem with this is it leads to toxic gameplay of players getting upset when they have new people because they do not have access to later skills. Since FF14 has a lot of direct damage upgrade skills and AoE for some classes is later. It would make the experience for new players horrible.

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Is this bait? I vastly prefer FFXIV but I can't think of a popular mmo with more 'clunky' combat than FFXIV.
From the rigid unbending rotations, to the gcd to the weird animation locks. It's basically the opposite of fluid.

How is a static rotation of 1-2-3 with OGCD skills in anyway "clunky"? Some dps rotations are long yes, but hardly clunky. You can easily focus on the fight instead of your UI unlike many other MMOs. So i think your idea of clunky is off. Do you know what clunky means? Hard to use, weird to understand, gets in the way. A clunky object is awkwardly shaped and heavy. When I think clunky a static rotation is like the last thing that comes to my mind lol

[zorkuus]

When I think clunky a static rotation is like the last thing that comes to my mind lol

A non-clunky static rotation would be something like this: 1,1,1,1,1,1,1,2,3,1,1,1,1,1,1,2,3......... boring yes, clunky no.
This is what FF has: 1,2,3,4,5,x,y,z,1,2,3,q,r,4,5,x,6,y,f,f,z.... etc. for like 2 mins until the rotation is fully complete.

Hard to use, weird to understand, atleast for new players

Besides when people talk about the clunkines in FF, they mean mostly the lack of responsiviness.

[Saltysquidoon]

How is a static rotation of 1-2-3 with OGCD skills in anyway "clunky"? Some dps rotations are long yes, but hardly clunky. You can easily focus on the fight instead of your UI unlike many other MMOs. So i think your idea of clunky is off. Do you know what clunky means? Hard to use, weird to understand, gets in the way. A clunky object is awkwardly shaped and heavy. When I think clunky a static rotation is like the last thing that comes to my mind lol

Shit like slide casting, animation locks, ogcd clipping depending on lag and server ticks, nin playing like basically a separate jo depending on your distance from the server.
The long rotations are fine on bosses but when you get into add switching or downtime between packs or RP intervals you can be left swinging in the breeze, he some classes have buttons specifically for this issue.
Then there are design choices like DWD and assassinate or autocrossbow/scattershot being separate binds.

Further, I was only using clunky because the person you responded to did, hence the inverted commas. I would say janky is more apt.

[Azerate]

Wow, you guys managed to necro the tread from last year.

There's nothing sillier than the idea of "necroing" a thread. The thread is more relevant than ever before, with the increased interest in FF14, and it's perfectly fine that it was revived. A lot of people might be jumping into FF14 because of the hype not realizing that there are majort shortcomings in it. Just because something was posted long ago, doesn't mean it can't be discussed further.

1) Clunky? FF14 combat is some of the most fluid combat of any tab target mmo I have ever played lol...

2) Alt jobs are so easy to lvl in FF14 there are like 15 different methods to do it. Do Fates, Leves, Deep dungeons, squadrons, normal dungeons, roulettes. If you want to quest you can do the side quests, but fates are basically world quests.

3) not even true, during peaks dps queues are like 7mins idk what trial you waited an hour in for the MSQ seems highly unlikely or very very rare.

4) LMAO how you gonna judge something you didnt try. WHY ON EARTH would you need to craft in the middle of monsters?!? That makes zero sense. You can literally teleport to a city next to a market board in 2 seconds why would you craft where you cant even buy/sell or anything??? And gathering has stealth lololol

1. It might be some of the most fluid, but I only have time for only one mmorpg in my life (as do most people) and I will always prefer the most fluid combat, over some of the most fluid, or in other words, second best. Someone who has played hundreds of hours of wow will notice the combat problem immediately.

2. Fates and leves are slow and limited. Deep dungeon is not something everyone will enjoy. Normal dungeons require time investment and are only good for xp once per day really. So you can't spam them.

3. Maybe it sounds unlikely to you but that was my experience with it.

4. So you are fine with it, I'm not. Okay.

What realm and at what time of day are you playing? Because the times you're stating are VERY out of the ordinary, unless you're playing at dead hours of the day for that server.

I think people like you are looking at endgame dungeons and thinking everything else has same queues. That's not the case. Maybe it has changed now, that FF14 supposedly has so many more players, but it was like that at the time of writing the thread.

If you are queuing specifically for old stuff as dps it is gonna take a long time. It's just how it is. No one queues for those things, so you have to wait for the roulettes to circle back to you.
This is not very different from WoW. What happens if you queue for Legion LFR raids when they are level relevant? Pretty sure you don't get a pop. Probably not even available. Blizzard does that. Rather than give you a level relevant experience they removed it so it doesn't make them look bad. Much like the "realm connections" and "shards" which just zone players in to make it look like it's busy when your server is beyond dead.

Except in wow you aren't hard locked in your leveling journey by not being able to do the raid or dungeon, because it's never required for the story to progress. In FF14, you literally have to complete those dungeons because they are part of the dreadful MSQ.

Decent? Have you played it? I had a hard time registering the account. It took me half an hour on their morally dead website. The game itself looks like trash. I couldn’t even get to the first quest how dead boring it is.

That is a good point about it being confusing to buy the game and make an account. The game itself has a nice theme and I just like FF as a franchise, that's probably why I enjoyed it to an extent. I've played every single player FF game from 1 to 10 and seeing all those things in an mmorpg was a great feeling. Quests and core gameplay is kinda like typical mmorpg gameplay, so that's serviceable as well. And yeah, as zorkuus points out below your post, compared to every other mmorpg out there it's pretty high up there. But it's definitely not beating WoW in my book.

How is a static rotation of 1-2-3 with OGCD skills in anyway "clunky"? Some dps rotations are long yes, but hardly clunky. You can easily focus on the fight instead of your UI unlike many other MMOs. So i think your idea of clunky is off. Do you know what clunky means? Hard to use, weird to understand, gets in the way. A clunky object is awkwardly shaped and heavy. When I think clunky a static rotation is like the last thing that comes to my mind lol

Rotation being bloated, which is also a problem, is a completely different thing from the combat feeling clunky and not fluid. It's much more about how it feels, than how many skills there are, and it's certainly not about the difficulty. So many people who haven't played a lot of WoW just don't understand this concept and I don't blame them. If you don't get used to the flowing combat we have in WoW, which basically feels as if your character in the game is a literal part of your real life body, you won't notice how awkward it feels to play many of those other games.

[Vasilisa]

There's nothing sillier than the idea of "necroing" a thread. The thread is more relevant than ever before, with the increased interest in FF14, and it's perfectly fine that it was revived. A lot of people might be jumping into FF14 because of the hype not realizing that there are majort shortcomings in it. Just because something was posted long ago, doesn't mean it can't be discussed further.

True, I just found it a bit funny. If this was a revived post in Wow section it would be closed within hours. Yet you're right, many points in this topic still stand.

[Azerate]

True, I just found it a bit funny. If this was a revived post in Wow section it would be closed within hours. Yet you're right, many points in this topic still stand.

I may not know the rules of the forum inside out, but from what I understand only old threads that get closed after being bumped up from "death" are the ones where nothing new is being added, or which are completely irrelevant anymore, or which are bumped up by bots.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Ehhhh

The mechanics of doing the professions are very good. Much better than standard 'click once' of most MMO.

The output however is trash. The game has no supply and demand system, no item loss and no item degradation of value. The items therefore are almost worthless because you only need to make/buy once and never again, or they were never 'meta' in the first place so essentially useless. Except for certain glory patches or days that are limited when they have actual power/value, very similar to WoW patches when certain crafted items are very good. Crafters are third rate citizens.

The upside? You can be all crafters on one character so that means even though 90% of profs are garbage you still can play 'the one' at any moment.

As someone who's over gil cap with over half of that money coming from crafting and MB shenanigans, I can say with 100% certainty that everything in your post is 110% false, and judging by your previous posts sounds more like someone who played the game for a week and then quit.

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It's not bait. The FF XIV community is just extremely defensive. They can't allow any criticisms, even founded ones like the obvious combat clunkiness.

Yes it's totally the FFXIV community that can't handle criticism.

It has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that 95% of the criticism levied at FFXIV sounds like the poster in question didn't even play the game, or they played it for 2 hours and quit the game.

There's also the fact that 90% of "Criticism" from WoW andys is "LOL WEEB GAME" "COMBAT TOO CLUNKY (I played to level 7)" "ECONOMY SUCKS (I farmed some level 3 logs and they didn't sell for anything)" and whatnot. It's like, long time players can spot in an instant the disingenuous "Criticisms" of the game coming from players who barely even gave it a chance. I never see any criticism of late game, overall game design, overall story, journey, etc. There's no criticisms of the mid or late game.

When I first played WoW, we ran around with 2 abilities, trying to kill murlocs that would swarm us then spawn camp us. We mined copper only for it to sell for 10c. Vanilla WoW was awkward as fuck, and by today's standards was complete garbage. I've definitely heard some criticism of FFXIV that is genuine, valid, and sounds like the person played for more than 10 hours, but it's rare.

[Swnem]

Except in wow you aren't hard locked in your leveling journey by not being able to do the raid or dungeon, because it's never required for the story to progress. In FF14, you literally have to complete those dungeons because they are part of the dreadful MSQ.

Aren't they? The story of the expansions passes through the raids. They basically make you skip the story like it doesn't exist. FF is giving you a complete experience. Yeah, it might take a bit with the queue at times but you are getting it. It's not like there is nothing to do while you are queued.

[Aydinx2]

These are all opinions.

For the game to be "plagued by some serious problems that make it unplayable in the long run" you need to actually show that the way things are designed will stop the game from being enjoyable or accessible over a longer period of time for the vast majority of players.