By Our Hand - Chains of Domination Cinematic

[crakerjack]

I like the way the story is going and ever since the end of legion when blizzard said Sylvanas was morally grey, I’ve been waiting for them to explain it. Curious to see how the story progresses moving forward.

[HateTrain]

*Sigh*.

Nah. Pass. Pass on all of that. It's a good thing I never *really* thought much of WoW writing or this would be hugely disappointing. I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.

I can't wait for it to be explained in detail in a book, possibly even making sense and this cinematic being the only reference to it in game.

[FlubberPuddy]

I don't really get how people are misunderstanding things so much.

Because a lot of people simply just push buttons without thought and click through quests/half pay attention while playing the game and watching netflix etc.

Basically a lot of misunderstanding because the general WoW audience don't pay enough attention for nuance in the first place.

[Eazy]

I'm not a huge fan of the cinematic but how on earth do you people watch that and go OMG ELUNE CAUSE THE TREE TO BURN!!??!?! WORKING WITH SYLVANAS!?!??!! It's such an idiotic leap to make.

Well, she did spare her though.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

How people don't get that if you get to Ardenweald you are reborn is baffling me... This is why she sacrified their living form so they will be reborn in the future. How is this so hard to understand? Man, 6y old gets this...

well you are on MMO Champ, were ppl insist that Incantersflow is as powerfull as rune of power for a fire mage or within 2-3% kekW so im not surprised at all

[Akka]

What is worse, expect a Game of Thrones type of story in a 17y old MMO where the story never got even close to Got and continuous crying over it... or accept it as it is and search something better somewhere else if you don't like it?

Its like expecting an epic story from a Mickey Mouse comic and then complaining why it is not on par with new X-Men...

Yeah because it's either GoT or complete utter shit, there is nothing in-between
Guess the lack of cognitive ability is right on point.

[Lahis]

How people don't get that if you get to Ardenweald you are reborn is baffling me... This is why she sacrified their living form so they will be reborn in the future. How is this so hard to understand? Man, 6y old gets this...

No they don't. Only demigods get to reborn in Ardenweald. Regular souls will be stuck there in the form of squirrels or whatever.

[Tupolew519]

where the herll has she been while Sylvia Butchered her people?

[BrintoSFJ]

No. Elune just allowed the night elves to pass into the Shadowlands to help fuel Ardenweald. She did nothing evil she was just stupid

Yeah, saw the video again several times, the voices in the latest videos are not too good, at least for me. I really feel sad for Elune. She got royally fucked. Everybody expects her to wipe their ass. Mortals, Immortals, Eternals.. wtf??? I think she should just go "Fuck it all! I am done!" and stop caring.

[xuros]

How people don't get that if you get to Ardenweald you are reborn is baffling me... This is why she sacrified their living form so they will be reborn in the future. How is this so hard to understand? Man, 6y old gets this...

With the trailer where Ursoc was in the pod they were harvesting the souls in the groves for their anima, deleting them forver for no? So those souls sent would not have been reborn.

[Eapoe]

Has there been any character that mentioned they were saved by Elune?
Has any character stated that Elune saved some souls?
I'd guess if Elune had saved any, she would let her High Priestess at least know, who clearly wanted to know what Elune did during those moments.

You can be upset for me using the word "semantics", but this isn't semantics, there is no reference or implication that any nightelf on Teldrassil was saved by Elune, it was stated that all she did was to ensure that their death will be painless, which naturally suggests that she didn't save anyone.

Painless death. Believes she sent them to the Weald where they would be happy and have a chance to be reborn into a new life.
To Elune, these are wins. They aren’t something to be mourned, but a chance to save reality and the Shadowlands (afterlife), while giving her followers the ability to live on again if so choosing.
For Elune, she did the right thing. For a society that has no idea what the afterlife is, and the idea that it all stops there, Elune is cold and heartless and doesn’t care about her people. Tyrande is the bridge to a new way of thinking in seeing that death is not the end, and to be feared, but simply a new beginning or continuance of the current existence. Which is what lead her to her current state and letting go of her vengenance.
That does not make what Sylvanas did right or just, but it does take away the significance (which is what I have issue with).
Blizzard writers are attempting deeper meaning with their storytelling, and they do succeed with some cases yet fail with others.

[Ivarr]

This is exactly what they're doing. First she gets the "good" half of her soul back, and now we find out that she was allowed to horribly murder all those poor Night Elves, because Elune was HALPING! her sister by feeding her sweet, sweet souls to help the anima drought, but in reality she was condemning them all to an eternity of suffering and torment. Oh, and she was also visibly having second thoughts when talking to Anduin, and she attacked the Jailer. All of this? It definitely means they're going to redeem her. She will face zero justice for her crimes and get to live and be a popular character that appears regularly.

Thanks Blizzard, I hate it.

Don't forget that you're now supposed to feel remorse for your our own prejudice and your petty thirst for vengeance. I hope we've all learned something here.

[Eapoe]

With the trailer where Ursoc was in the pod they were harvesting the souls in the groves for their anima, deleting them forver for no? So those souls sent would not have been reborn.

Ursoc was harvested because souls were being reborn with no influx of new souls. Basically, there was souls going out but none in, which means they didn’t have a natural supply of incoming anima.
If souls had been sent there then the pods would never have to have been harvested.

[Kralljin]

To Elune, these are wins.

That really brings solace to those who lost their family, especially in the light of the fact that Elune did not deem it necessary to inform *anyone* about this until her sister, whom we have heard nothing about until recently, "met" Elune in the freaking Afterlive.

Tyrande is the bridge to a new way of thinking in seeing that death is not the end, and to be feared, but simply a new beginning or continuance of the current existence. Which is what lead her to her current state and letting go of her vengenance.

Which in return devalues the entire atrocity that is the Burning of Teldrassil.

If death has no meaning, then so does murder.

That does not make what Sylvanas did right or just, but it does take away the significance (which is what I have issue with).
Blizzard writers are attempting deeper meaning with their storytelling, and they do succeed with some cases yet fail with others.

I very much disagree for the point stated above.
The very reason why society treats murder as such a horrible crime because you take something that cannot be given back, when you however create a narrative where death is something that has little meaning in the long run, you are indirectly making people care less about those deaths.

And the concept of choosing renewal over punishment in the current situation of Blizzard as a whole is downright hilarious.

[Accendor]

I watch 30 seconds of this bullshit and all I feel is anger

[Soon-TM]

the concept of choosing contractual renewal over punishment in the current situation of Blizzard as a whole is downright hilarious.

That's all they needed to paint a quite accurate picture of the plight of several ladies at Irvine...

[Eapoe]

That really brings solace to those who lost their family, especially in the light of the fact that Elune did not deem it necessary to inform *anyone* about this until her sister, whom we have heard nothing about until recently, "met" Elune in the freaking Afterlive.

Which in return devalues the entire atrocity that is the Burning of Teldrassil.

If death has no meaning, then so does murder.

I very much disagree for the point stated above.
The very reason why society treats murder as such a horrible crime because you take something that cannot be given back, when you however create a narrative where death is something that has little meaning in the long run, you are indirectly making people care less about those deaths.

And the concept of choosing renewal over punishment in the current situation of Blizzard as a whole is downright hilarious.

Did you not read my entire post before responding?
1). To Elune, she did nothing wrong. It’s a matter of perspective. To her, letting her followers die painlessly, to go on and save reality and Ardenweald, with the ability to rest peacefully or be reborn is not a bad thing.
2). My post later went on to state it takes away the significance of the NEs dying.
3). Again, I posted it takes away significance. However, the flip side to your argument is also the reason things like hell exists in direct opposition to heaven. The way we live our lives determines our fate in death. So, in game, we have Rivendreth, and even for worse rates, the Maw. So it could be argued that how people live in life (in the context of WoW’s now established afterlife) will determine their fate, and it absolutely does matter how they live and put consequence on it without taking away meaning to how they live.

[Kralljin]

1). To Elune, she did nothing wrong. It’s a matter of perspective. To her, letting her followers die painlessly, to go on and save reality and Ardenweald, with the ability to rest peacefully or be reborn is not a bad thing.

Look, if i have to explain to a deity that letting people die (which is in their mind, is the end of their existence) who worship you, will result in them losing faith, then said deity is not worthy of any worship.
Ever.

If basic empathy is that absent within a being, it's not worthy of an inkling of respect, let alone worship.

I reiterate: The Night elves_did_not_know_about this, nor did Elune do *anything* to inform the survivors about the situation, whose faith was certainly shaken in Elune - for very good reasons.

In order to get an actual answer, the high priestess of Elune had to travel to the Afterlive (which only opened up because of the very person that burned Teldrassil), talk to the so far unknown Sister of Elune and only received that revelation once Elune was talking to said sister.
That information was not even targeted at the Night elves, they received that info by sheer circumstance, because Elune had to make amends with her sister and basically said: "Sis, i let my chosen people burn to help you!".

But of course, giving her the power to pursue vengeance - no problemo - until said vengeance is literally within their grasp, then that becomes a big no no.

It is complete lunacy on Elune's part to not share this information_at_any_point directly with the night elves.
The reason why Elune withheld this critical piece of information are completely absent.

2). My post later went on to state it takes away the significance of the NEs dying.

And that in turn means that the genocide a certain someone comitted means less.

So it could be argued that how people live in life (in the context of WoW’s now established afterlife) will determine their fate, and it absolutely does matter how they live and put consequence on it without taking away meaning to how they live.

In other words, we should not seek out justice ourselves, we should let some cosmic being handle it for us.
After all, if someone commits a crime, the Afterlive will punish them for it, no need to even attempt to seek out atonement, Revendreth will do that.

Again, great Meta message, Blizzard.

[Eapoe]

Look, if a have to explain to a deity that letting people die (which is in their mind, is the end of their existence) who worship you, will result in them losing faith, then said deity is not worthy of any worship.
Ever.

If basic empathy is that absent within a being, it's not worthy of an inkling of respect, let alone worship.

I reiterate: The Night elves_did_not_know_about this, nor did Elune do *anything* to inform the survivors about the situation, whose faith was certainly shaken in Elune - for very good reasons.

In order to get an actual answer, the high priestess of Elune had to travel to the Afterlive (which only opened up because of the very person that burned Teldrassil), talk to the so far unknown Sister of Elune and only received that revelation once Elune was talking to said sister.
That information was not even targeted at the Night elves, they received that info by sheer circumstance, because Elune had to make amends with her sister and basically said: "Sis, i let my chosen people burn to help you!".

But of course, giving her the power to pursue vengeance - no problemo - until said vengeance is literally within their grasp, then that becomes a big no no.

It is complete lunacy on Elune's part to not share this information_at_any_point directly with the night elves.
The reason why Elune withheld this critical piece of information are completely absent.

And that in turn means that the genocide a certain someone comitted means less.

In other words, we should not seek out justice ourselves, we should let some cosmic being handle it for us.
After all, if someone commits a crime, the Afterlive will punish them for it, no need to even attempt to seek out atonement, Revendreth will do that.

Again, great Meta message, Blizzard.

1). But it doesn’t result in them losing faith. Hell, in Tyrande’s experience it seems to have strengthened it because she has realized that her people can still go on and what Elune’s plan was. To the survivor’s, they know nothing about what Elune did. So far, only Tyrande, you, and Sandris, along with the denizens of the Shadowlands know about this. The denizens of Azeroth have no idea about Elune’s involvement and still pray and worship her. If you still can’t figure this out, look to any real life religion where atrocities have occurred to the people and they still have faith and worship their respective god(s).
2). At this point you are arguing something while agreeing with me. I’ve stated, twice now, that it takes away the significance of the issue. You then post a reply that comes off as an argument while stating the same thing I already stated but with different words.
3). Do you just argue to argue? I’ve stated the impact of what you do in life determines what happens in death. That is the moral aspect of how you live. Now, you want to argue another topic that we’ve never discussed in some “AHA! GOTCHA!” moment. Of course people would be punished in life for transgressions and deeds, hence why Garrosh was going to be punished for his crimes against multiple races, why we went to war with Deathwing when he challenged the world, and why multiple factions went hunting after Nathanos and Sylvanas to bring them to justice for what they did.
Punishments & rewards exist both in life and death in the game. How you live is going to affect your afterlife, while also affecting how your life goes while live.
Any other asinine point(s) you want to discuss to try and argue?

[Ivarr]

1). To Elune, she did nothing wrong. It’s a matter of perspective. To her, letting her followers die painlessly, to go on and save reality and Ardenweald, with the ability to rest peacefully or be reborn is not a bad thing.

All done without any consent of those affected most. But it's a Blizzard story so at least that part is congruent.