Wow refugees, what are you enjoying about the game?

[Katchii]

What level does your job have to be to get into it? Also where ..... Is it? Heh.

Here's the website with all of the questions answered for when, where and how to access it.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...e/deepdungeon/

Quicker, and probably more helpful, than me typing it out.

[Zyrinx]

Here's the website with all of the questions answered for when, where and how to access it.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...e/deepdungeon/

Quicker, and probably more helpful, than me typing it out.

Ty very much!

[Daffan]

...what

Anyone else reading this, please don't listen to this guy. He has made up so much nonsense about crafting that it's clear he's never even actually done it.

you're the infiltrator

what do you make 1-79 that is actually useable that people care that's vastly more diverse than say WoW consumables? nothing, only at 80 like I said do people possibly care FFXIV is no means bad but it's the same fundamental system design that WoW has, nothing like a true economy or sandbox. Most stuff 1-79 is just empty market/2 re-listers and 1-2 HQ items that people use to scam people for quick quest finish. I just recently did it all again on a preferred server.

that's my critique bro, this game has no economy or crafting like albion, eve, uoo etc. It's fine, but not amazing like people keep saying.

in fact, craft so bad pre 80, that people just do restoration LMAO

I legit don't have a clue how crafting is supposed to work, but my LW is only 21 or so

I only ever use the basic button. No clue what the other 8 are for lol.

I am finding even now, that you need gather materials even at this level (need a Mined item to make glamour prisms with LW for example). I'm guessing that this, then, is the money maker.

Glamour prisms sell for 250gil each, it's worthless.

Everyone can gather, so material costs are way down, except for some specifics -- usually in materials that people want to use to power level their crafting or HQ item ppl need for quest.

Running around the world gathering 5-6 unique items for a single craft is super inefficient, just farm out one item and re-craft it 100 times with an automatic macro while you are half-afk watching Netflix (Don't use quick synthesis) u can get 1-60 in a few hours with preferred server and starting on fresh account with zero balance or investment, at 50 or so you can do levequests which are so broken you can get 50-60 in 10 minutes.

[Katchii]

you're the infiltrator

what do you make 1-79 that is actually useable that people care that's vastly more diverse than say WoW consumables? nothing,

Completely false.

Every character being able to be every job means some people are still levelling and want/need low level gear. Stuff that's crafted from 1-79 is still usable and desirable for glamour, needed for other recipes, wanted as housing items, needed for quests, etc... It's hardly worthless.

only at 80 like I said do people possibly care

Unless you're saying people will rush to 80 and only then care about crafting level 1-79 recipes, this statement isn't accurate.

FFXIV is no means bad but it's the same fundamental system design that WoW has, nothing like a true economy or sandbox.

What do you mean by "true" economy or sandbox (sandbox in the context of crafting, anyway)

Most stuff 1-79 is just empty market/2 re-listers and 1-2 HQ items that people use to scam people for quick quest finish. I just recently did it all again on a preferred server.

Then you're not paying attention, or have blinders on.

that's my critique bro, this game has no economy or crafting like albion, eve, uoo etc. It's fine, but not amazing like people keep saying.

The crafting mini game is what I see people praise most of the time, not how crafting fits into the meta of the game.

in fact, craft so bad pre 80, that people just do restoration LMAO

Because it's an easy way to level up. It's not really a huge revelation that people want to spend as little time as possible leveling/ get there with as little effort as possible. Your point was that there's no value in the crafting unless it's max level which is false, that doesn't mean people will purposely stay low level.

Glamour prisms sell for 250gil each, it's worthless.

Hardly. Does it make as much money as other stuff? No, but given how many and how often people use glamour, the sole material used to do is is HARDLY worthless.

Everyone can gather, so material costs are way down, except for some specifics -- usually in materials that people want to use to power level their crafting or HQ item ppl need for quest.

True, but this is the same in any game where you can gather materials. The plentiful ones are cheap, the rarer, more unique ones are more expensive. That's supply and demand, which is a hallmark of an actual economy.

Running around the world gathering 5-6 unique items for a single craft is super inefficient, just farm out one item and re-craft it 100 times with an automatic macro while you are half-afk watching Netflix (Don't use quick synthesis) u can get 1-60 in a few hours with preferred server and starting on fresh account with zero balance or investment, at 50 or so you can do levequests which are so broken you can get 50-60 in 10 minutes.

Yeah, this is true.

[The Casualty]

Hardly. Does it make as much money as other stuff? No, but given how many and how often people use glamour, the sole material used to do is is HARDLY worthless.

An anecdote, I know, but an FC-mate made absolutely ridiculous amounts of money just by selling glamour prisms.

Personally, I make lower level items at specific brackets when I notice a void in the market. Especially jewelry, because there are so many variations with similar material requirements. Buy the materials for an assortment of 20-30 rings/necklaces/bracelets (or use whatever materials your retainers have been stockpiling for you) and chuck 'em up there. The only thing I don't make is earrings. I don't know if they sell, but I feel like it's so easy to get the expansion earrings that I don't want to risk it when the rest sell so well. The last batch was for 50k a pop and took all of 5 minutes of my time.

That or go the housing route and sell housing items or precursor materials like cut stone and mortar. Housing upgrades require those in spades and are always in demand.

Neither of which require max level.

And you are so right - People do Ishgard foundation stuff because it nets the quickest EXP so you can more easily do the crafts that make money.

[Daffan]

Completely false.

Every character being able to be every job means some people are still levelling and want/need low level gear. Stuff that's crafted from 1-79 is still usable and desirable for glamour, needed for other recipes, wanted as housing items, needed for quests, etc... It's hardly worthless.

A lie. Why would anyone buy gear pre 80? Why? It makes zero sense. 1-50 is easy mode dungeon spam. At 50, 60 and so forth you get full sets of gear for free from your Class quests. Even if you don't even realize this is happening, you get poetics to ease your grind. People who are buying things (sets) are far and few between.

I already mentioned the stuff required for other recipes / quests. The market is barren, except for 1-2 listers who have the HQ items at insane prices because they know people want to skip the quest and want to scam them. I bought every HQ quest item myself because making things is a inefficient waste of time, for every DoH job quest, the amount of listings is like 2. It's pathetic.

Unless you're saying people will rush to 80 and only then care about crafting level 1-79 recipes, this statement isn't accurate.

No. I'm saying that only things at 80 are worth investing time into. 1-79 is useless. People powerlevel past everything, don't care about making anything of use in order to get to 80 ASAP. Nobody is making anything except turn ins and refining 200 xyz with macro on their way to 80, as there is nothing actually 'interesting' to make.

What do you mean by "true" economy or sandbox (sandbox in the context of crafting, anyway)

Uhh this takes time to explain.

Games like EVE and Albion have a fully integrated supply and demand system.

Items are made and they are lost (by pve death, pvp death, degrade, on-use - does not matter method, only result) which in game design term is probably called something like "Item Recycling".

This takes items OUT of the economy. Therefore, everything from tier 1-8, in the case of Albion, is worth-while for a crafter to make and that pushes down so that gatherers are viable. Things don't get 'invalidated' by the progress of time. The item recycling stimulates the demand for crafters and so forth.

For example; Imagine every item in FFXIV was relevant to make, forever. Needed by someone, somewhere. It doesn't matter even if it was level 20 item... it would be equipped and used by someone because of x-y-z reasons. Items aren't invalidated by levels or introduction of 'new' items. Mythrite or Titanium equipment would be sold in just as many quantities as... Exarchic or whatever... if not even more for above x-y-z reasons (x-y-z reasons exist... but irrelevant to this discussion to explain)

Simulating demand in traditional games via transmog, power leveling and special items (Mount? Toy? Pet?) is not enough for a good crafting experience or economy. What ends up happening is 90% of items are fluff.

The idea of power leveling itself is some evidence of a fail really. By implication of its existence it is stating that everything before desired 'level' is much less value and a worthless time investment in the context of crafting and economy. This is a much more interesting discussion though and requires a separate dialogue.

The crafting mini game is what I see people praise most of the time, not how crafting fits into the meta of the game.

Well that's ok, I praise it too. It's quite 'good' even with boring afk-macros. However, this is not part that draws out the shills to my posts, they tell me that every aspect of FFXIV economy and crafting is god like, which is false.

I completely expect these people to also think New World is amazing economy because the trees fall over and it looks pretty.

Because it's an easy way to level up. It's not really a huge revelation that people want to spend as little time as possible leveling/ get there with as little effort as possible. Your point was that there's no value in the crafting unless it's max level which is false, that doesn't mean people will purposely stay low level.

Irrelevant. Don't even know what to reply to this.

Hardly. Does it make as much money as other stuff? No, but given how many and how often people use glamour, the sole material used to do is is HARDLY worthless.

Do u even read context or who I am reply too? Your whole tail-end here is irrelevant.

True, but this is the same in any game where you can gather materials. The plentiful ones are cheap, the rarer, more unique ones are more expensive. That's supply and demand, which is a hallmark of an actual economy.

The S&D system is not fully implemented. The demand in this game is very limited to certain things that are, well, feel artificial. You don't make things to be 'used' in a way a crafter would in a proper universe, only to power level for sake of character sheet or things at 80.

An equivalent example would be Prunescape.

People buy steel bars (the demand you mention) to smith 9000 plate bodies not because the plate body is something interesting or valuable, but because it is artificial to get 99 smithing.

There are plenty of systems in the game that make the economy perfectly fine and I'll posit even better than WoW. Leveling your Desynth that will raise the chance of you getting better mats back from Desynth. Turn ins to your Grand Company which raises your rank which allows you to purchase more different mats that play into other systems AND also needed for purchasing property. For spirit bonding older gear which is needed for obtaining old materia which is a necessity if you're looking to min/max gathers and crafters as well as for a part of the 2.0 relic quest line. Glam for yourself and glams for the weekly Gold Saucer fashion report which can net you a free 10k - 40k MGP every week.

But yeah.. totes useless. Granted I will admit there is some bloat in some regards.

I never said WoW was good either. It is probably the worst of the worst when it comes to professions. Not only is the execution of items terrible (what happens to them, what they used for) but the method of gathering and crafting is boring and lame.

You only need to dye 2 piece of gear and buy a 2gil item (90% of time) for 80 FR pts lmao. ezpz. Pray to gods that if you want 100, the other junk is on a vendor that takes 2 min to farm gil for.

As to the leveling a crafter comment, people are naturally going to go the path of least resistance. Leveling crafter without Ishgard was fine, it took patience sure, but needing patience does not make the content bad.

The implication that people want p level at all for crafting power basically red-letter stamps that everything pre 80 is a much less efficient and wasteful. This is not the case in games with proper economy or crafting system like AB or EVE.

This however, would require more discussion as it is something that goes over people's heads as they don't even know what a decent supply and demand or economy looks like.

Fucking lul. Eleven slots that can be glam'ed (transmog) per character and 10k - 20k per server; if not more, you're looking at 2.5 - 5 million or more gil, but hey it's worthless.

Is it going to make you rich over night, no, but it's a far cry from being worthless.

I only said it was worthless in terms of its time investment for profit. There are things that are much easier and take less time that make more money, this is sign of failure.

Although, to be fair, most games make very similar mistake as balancing 'skill / effort / time' for content profit valuation is very, very hard (e.g bossing makes more profit than gathering, but gathering is no risk). But, at least they don't make their own professions cannibilize each other. (why spend 1 hour hitting x rock when y rock is 10x profit???)

[Katchii]

A lie. Why would anyone buy gear pre 80? Why? It makes zero sense.

Because quests, dungeons, trials, etc... still require you to have a decent set of gear?

You're delusional if you think no one does it. Does everyone? No, but saying that all that gear is completely useless is flatly inaccurate.

1-50 is easy mode dungeon spam.

Uh...no, it's not. This is so wildly off base I can't even believe you're claiming you actually played this game.

At 50, 60 and so forth you get full sets of gear for free from your Class quests.

Yeah AT 50, so what about the gear form 1-50? You seriously saying you wear the starter gear all the way from 1-50? Or that you only use the quest rewards you for questing? What about jobs you level afterwards that you don't have quest rewards for?

Even if you don't even realize this is happening, you get poetics to ease your grind. People who are buying things (sets) are far and few between.

So you admit that people DO buy it? Just that it's few?

I already mentioned the stuff required for other recipes / quests. The market is barren, except for 1-2 listers who have the HQ items at insane prices because they know people want to skip the quest and want to scam them. I bought every HQ quest item myself because making things is a inefficient waste of time, for every DoH job quest, the amount of listings is like 2. It's pathetic.

Which market? Because this is not true for every market, nor is it true all the time. It's also dependent on what server you're on.

No. I'm saying that only things at 80 are worth investing time into. 1-79 is useless. People powerlevel past everything, don't care about making anything of use in order to get to 80 ASAP. Nobody is making anything except turn ins and refining 200 xyz with macro on their way to 80, as there is nothing actually 'interesting' to make.

I would agree that this is largely true, depending on the person. If it's easy to get to 80, why would you spend more time than absolutely necessary at anything 1-79? Once there they can craft anything from 1-80 that they want (and that they have the gear/ stats to actually make)

Uhh this takes time to explain.

Games like EVE and Albion have a fully integrated supply and demand system.

Items are made and they are lost (by pve death, pvp death, degrade, on-use - does not matter method, only result) which in game design term is probably called something like "Item Recycling".

This takes items OUT of the economy. Therefore, everything from tier 1-8, in the case of Albion, is worth-while for a crafter to make and that pushes down so that gatherers are viable. Things don't get 'invalidated' by the progress of time. The item recycling stimulates the demand for crafters and so forth.

For example; Imagine every item in FFXIV was relevant to make, forever. Needed by someone, somewhere. It doesn't matter even if it was level 20 item... it would be equipped and used by someone because of x-y-z reasons. Items aren't invalidated by levels or introduction of 'new' items. Mythrite or Titanium equipment would be sold in just as many quantities as... Exarchic or whatever... if not even more for above x-y-z reasons (x-y-z reasons exist... but irrelevant to this discussion to explain)

Simulating demand in traditional games via transmog, power leveling and special items (Mount? Toy? Pet?) is not enough for a good crafting experience or economy. What ends up happening is 90% of items are fluff.

The idea of power leveling itself is some evidence of a fail really. By implication of its existence it is stating that everything before desired 'level' is much less value and a worthless time investment in the context of crafting and economy. This is a much more interesting discussion though and requires a separate dialogue.

OK, now I get where you're coming from. I still disagree that the items are "worthless" but completely understand why you would feel that it's not worth your time in comparison to those other games.

Well that's ok, I praise it too. It's quite 'good' even with boring afk-macros. However, this is not part that draws out the shills to my posts, they tell me that every aspect of FFXIV economy and crafting is god like, which is false.

OK, I can agree with that. I don't think it's copmletely false though, but certainly not some super amazing ground breaking thing either.

I

rrelevant. Don't even know what to reply to this.

Now that I know the context of what you were saying I agree this wouldn't make sense. Disregard.

Do u even read context or who I am reply too? Your whole tail-end here is irrelevant.

You said glamour prisms are worthless. That's all I'm replying to. They're not worthless is my point.

The S&D system is not fully implemented. The demand in this game is very limited to certain things that are, well, feel artificial. You don't make things to be 'used' in a way a crafter would in a proper universe, only to power level for sake of character sheet or things at 80.

An equivalent example would be Prunescape.

People buy steel bars (the demand you mention) to smith 9000 plate bodies not because the plate body is something interesting or valuable, but because it is artificial to get 99 smithing.

How and why an item are in demand is irrelevant to the fact that it IS in demand. Call it artificial if you want, but the fact is that the demand is there.

[The Casualty]

A lie. Why would anyone buy gear pre 80? Why? It makes zero sense. 1-50 is easy mode dungeon spam. At 50, 60 and so forth you get full sets of gear for free from your Class quests. Even if you don't even realize this is happening, you get poetics to ease your grind. People who are buying things (sets) are far and few between.

For anyone coming into FFXIV from WoW or as a fresh player, please, PLEASE, do not actually wear the class gear at this point in the game. They were current at some point, but are now just handed out and really only serve the point of glamour. You will be anywhere from 25-80 ilevels behind equivalent level purchased/crafted gear, and further behind tomestone gear.

If you like how they look, glam them.

[Daffan]

For anyone coming into FFXIV from WoW or as a fresh player, please, PLEASE, do not actually wear the class gear at this point in the game. They were current at some point, but are now just handed out and really only serve the point of glamour. You will be anywhere from 25-80 ilevels behind equivalent level purchased/crafted gear, and further behind tomestone gear.

If you like how they look, glam them.

True, but it's not like the game is hard when leveling. The resources and time spent on these upgrades is a complete waste. You are basically synced the entire time with dooty farming xp anyway, so it basically makes little difference.

The people who farm poetics and stuff at 50, 60 etc... it blows my mind even more than the crafting discussion. Like really? In the time you get your tome junk you could be +10 levels ahead.

It was kind of funny watching Asmongold farm poetics a week ago or so for like 8 hours straight (Odyn) so he can get 130 ilvl gear... that you replace with quest item in like 1 hour.

Because quests, dungeons, trials, etc... still require you to have a decent set of gear?

That you get from quest rewards. The only item level requirement breakpoints are for hard mode trials for some MSQs, which you get from tomes and quests without ANY grind. I believe at 50 the breakpoint for some MSQ is 90 and at 60 it is 210 or so. Extremely easy, especially with the earing that auto scales far above those breakpoints.

Uh...no, it's not. This is so wildly off base I can't even believe you're claiming you actually played this game.

How do you think people level alts in this game?

Yeah AT 50, so what about the gear form 1-50? You seriously saying you wear the starter gear all the way from 1-50? Or that you only use the quest rewards you for questing? What about jobs you level afterwards that you don't have quest rewards for?

Quest rewards. Dungeon spam greens. Literally all my alt jobs use the exact same gear from 1-40.

How I know this for certain? I recently made a new characater (227cm femroe btw) on Hyperion-Primal 20th July with preferred bonus (RIP) and have 1x 70 so far and all other jobs at 25-40, doh/dol all at 60.

1-15 is random quest gear from armory.
15-40 is Plundered / Doctore / Cavalry / Infantry (This is the junk you redeem at GC for seals normally). Aetherial ring/neck/bracelet is same for every single job both DoW/DoM + brilliant new ring + menph earing.

Little gearing is required! 50% of slots (Right hand side) are auto filled by universal jeweler and left side is from dungeon drops that are DoW/DoM universal.

I'm pretty sure even the content instant queue spam is extremely simple as well.

tam tam > hala > haukke > brayflox etc

https://i.imgur.com/Rsyp4Vn.png

So you admit that people DO buy it? Just that it's few?

Like 5 pages ago I said this

Which market? Because this is not true for every market, nor is it true all the time. It's also dependent on what server you're on.

Hyperion-Primal. And yes, like I said once before, the only things that sell are consumes and stuff ppl use for p-level. So technically your statement is correct, even if irrelevant.

I would agree that this is largely true, depending on the person. If it's easy to get to 80, why would you spend more time than absolutely necessary at anything 1-79? Once there they can craft anything from 1-80 that they want (and that they have the gear/ stats to actually make)

Well the whole point of my argument is that, having everything 1-79 be invalid is kind of stupid. That's all, nothing more, nothing less.

OK, now I get where you're coming from. I still disagree that the items are "worthless" but completely understand why you would feel that it's not worth your time in comparison to those other games.

Yes, the system described is not for everyone!

Many people hate the idea of item recycling (any version) and would rather have the WoW/FFXIV style where you just gain item, it advance in power and so forth (at the expense of eco/craft). That is a perfectly acceptable opinion to have.

My point was while that is a subjective acceptable opinion, it is "imo" (lol) objectively bad for eco/craft. You cannot have a top tier eco/craft without it.

How and why an item are in demand is irrelevant to the fact that it IS in demand. Call it artificial if you want, but the fact is that the demand is there.

And it would be more ideal if both parts, input and output were in demand

[Doomchicken]

I enjoy likeable good guys and fun bad guys like emet-selch and easy to follow stories that make sense in their own universe. Something I've clearly forgotten when playing world of warcraft. Game isn't perfect by any means, but I've had more fun playing final fantasy in the roughly 280 hours I've played it over the last few months than I've enjoyed world of warcraft in YEARS.

[Lane]

I enjoy likeable good guys and fun bad guys like emet-selch and easy to follow stories that make sense in their own universe. Something I've clearly forgotten when playing world of warcraft.

It's been so nice to have villains whose motivation isn't just that they were corrupted like in WoW. Emet's probably my second all time favorite behind Ardyn from FFXV.

I hadn't thought about likeable good guys, but now that you mention it I like a lot more in FFXIV than I do in WoW.

[Doomchicken]

It's been so nice to have villains whose motivation isn't just that they were corrupted like in WoW. Emet's probably my second all time favorite behind Ardyn from FFXV.

I hadn't thought about likeable good guys, but now that you mention it I like a lot more in FFXIV than I do in WoW.

I like almost everyone in the main good guy cast. Y'shtola, Thancred, Alisaie, Gra'ha tia, Krile is the only lalafel I like, even Alphinaud has grown on me. The supplimental cast is excellent like motherfucking estinien is the man, Aymeric, Raubahn, Ardbert. So much greatness and I'm sure I've forgotten to list a few as well.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

For the Scions, I quite like Alisae. I also like Alphinaud and Urianger. Estinien and Thancred are fine. Y'shtola and Krile are meh. G'raha Tia... erm, well I liked him in 5.0. I dislike him after. Ardbert was pretty good.

[Lane]

G'raha. <3 He replaced Thancred as my favorite character. I'm struggling to think of anyone in the main cast I didn't like in ShB except for Ran'jit.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I thought Ran'jit was pretty cool. He only had three problems:

• He could have used a few flashback CGs to get us to empathize with him a bit more. Maybe as he was talking about how he raised the other Minfillias, we get CGs showing him raising her when she was a little girl, playing with her, teaching her how to fight when she was older, going around the country keeping the people safe and doing quests, fighting Sin Eaters, and then cradling her dying/dead body in his arms. That way his grief would be more visceral to the player, rather than something you just hear but don't really think about.

• Unwinnable boss fights in FFXIV aren't designed well. They don't threaten you at all and they are a slog. You're doing well dodging the boss' every move and slowly whittling down for 5 minutes, and then you whittle his HP down to an arbitrary number and he just one shots you. A better designed fight would be like 1-2 minutes long, where you're burning him down quickly, but he's burning your HP down faster (high damaging auto attacks), so it doesn't matter how good you are. Even if you pop all of your CDs, you WILL die before you kill him, but at least you got him down to like 30% or something. Perhaps the boss' attacks could scale so the lower his HP you get him down to, the harder hitting his attacks become. That way, the fight doesn't feel like a cheat. It feels like a close race, and when you come back a little bit stronger (and also have foreknowledge of his moves), you can reasonably win.

• The Thancred vs Ran'jit fight should have lasted 3 minutes, not 10. And probably should have ended with Thancred killing Ran'jit.

[Doomchicken]

G'raha. <3 He replaced Thancred as my favorite character. I'm struggling to think of anyone in the main cast I didn't like in ShB except for Ran'jit.

I think the only person I didn't like in Shadowbringers was Gaia. Plus, someone pointed out to me she has duck lips and I can't unsee it. Ran'jit could of been better and I completely agree with Val's post above.

[Lane]

I didn't like that he was inexplicably OP, selfish, abusive, and there was nothing noble or remotely sympathetic about his goals. He was just going to continue imprisoning every reincarnation of the oracle while serving Vauthry until the end of the world. He rejected that there was any other way or that there was anything wrong with what he was doing. It might've been fine if it was a one-off encounter, but he hounds you throughout 5.0 in a string of unwinnable fights - when you're going around killing Lightwardens. So, yeah, not a fan.

[ippollite]

Ive just hit 4.3. And on balance, i genuinely think stormblood is better than heavensward. I mean, i have terrible takes, so this is probably another one. But aside the build up to the final steps of faith, heavensward was a bit of a slog. Stormblood started off on a terrible foot (rhalgars reach and the underwater turtle bit), but ever since i hit the steppes (some of the best story in game thusfar), its been super fun.

[Seiklis]

Did my first day today finally, seems pretty standard thus far though I only got to 10 as Marauder. Thinking about switching to rogue till 50 after it though, idk still deciding

Biggest complaint so far is tab targeting seems really dumb. The GCD differences I'll get used to but the lack of accuracy on tab is gonna get irritating

That said, my favorite thing so far is one of the most simple. The fact I can get into my inn bed and it asks to log me out.....like it's one of the most obvious things I've ever seen and it felt good.

I know not to judge anything until I'm into the xpacs but so far I could see myself getting immersed in this.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Did my first day today finally, seems pretty standard thus far though I only got to 10 as Marauder. Thinking about switching to rogue till 50 after it though, idk still deciding

For what it's worth, Rogue/Ninja unlocks its fun class mechanics (the Naruto style hand signs where you combo different hand signs together to cast a spell) sooner than any ARR job you can start as. Ninja unlocks those mechanics at level 35-40ish, whereas the starting ARR job take until around the mid 70s to 80s to start unlocking their really interesting mechanics. So you really won't see the fun, interesting mechanical stuff until you hit Stormblood, which is at least 200 hours into the game.

The expansion jobs (namely Samurai, Red Mage, Dancer, and Gunbreaker) have their fun class mechanics available as soon as you unlock them (at level 50 and 60). Though I guess it's important to not to oversell these class mechanics. IMO it's not a huge change that makes everything different and awesomer; it's just that IMO I think that those jobs are just more fun to play right away than the starter ARR and HW jobs.