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  1. #121
    [QUOTE=Egomaniac;53310305]
    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    Disney has not recouped the initial 4 billion dollar investment.

    It's a 4 billion dollar investment. You don't make that back overnight...but still:

    https://www.boxofficemojo.com/release/rl2691925505/
    Force Awakens Box Office: 2 billion

    https://www.boxofficemojo.com/release/rl2708702721/
    Last Jedi Box Office: 1.3 Billion

    https://www.boxofficemojo.com/release/rl2557707777/
    Rogue One Box Office: 1 Billion

    https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/...ref_=bo_se_r_1
    Rise Of Skywalker Box Office: 1 Billion

    https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/...ref_=bo_se_r_2
    Solo Box Office: 400million

    Of all those...Solo is the only one that didn't really make any money for Disney. Plus there's the Mandalorian on D+. And then you gotta consider merchandise, video games, etc. Also, they didn't just get Star Wars. They got Lucasfilm and everything included in that. That means all the IP's. That means Industrial Lights and Magic. You're fucking kidding yourself if you think Disney isn't making bank on Star Wars.




    https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Ca...ab=video-sales
    Captain Marvel Video Sales:

    Domestic: 67 million

    https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/An...ab=video-sales
    Antman and the Wasp Video sales

    Domestic: 50 million

    https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Do...6)#tab=summary
    Doctor Strange Video Sales:

    Domestic 58 Million

    https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Sp...ng#tab=summary
    Spider-Man Homecoming Video Sales

    Domestic: 70 million

    That's Captain Marvel's video sales compared to two other marvel films that it outperformed on video sales and one that it came pretty close to meeting. Not the highest numbers sure...but not "bad" by any means.
    Ah, again someone mistakes the total box office with pure profit for Disney. I do have to correct at least 1 thread per year about that:
    boxofficemojo.com, back on jan 31 2020.
    We discussed the missunderstood GROS and NET numbers back then in the Obi_Wan Kenob thread.
    User PACOX back then gave us the numbers, and we showed him how little was left after you corrected the numbers.
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    Disney SW by the numbers

    TFA - $936,662,225 (domestic), $1,131,561,399 (international), $2,068,223,624 (worldwide)
    TLJ - $620,181,382 + $712,358,507, = $1,332,539,889
    TROS - $503,458,989 + $545,400,163 = $1,048,859,152

    Rogue One - $532,177,324 + $523,879,949 = $1,056,057,273
    Solo - $213,767,512 + $179,157,295 = $392,924,807

    Total gross TD: $5,898,604,745
    Cost of acquisition: $4.05 billion
    Total gross-budget: $4,497,184,891

    All figures from boxofficemojo.com

    Great, now let's take the gross and turn it into the net, the REALLY important part. Disney WAS in the strong position that they got 60% of domestic and 40% of international earnings, the rest went to the cinemas and distributors:

    Total domestic for all movies: 2.806.247.432 *0,6 = 1.683.748.459,20 $
    Total foreign for all movies: 3.092.357.313 *0,4 = 1.236.942.925,20 $
    totals to: 2.920.691.384,40 $

    2. Those numbers are the box office earnings, the cost of production from those movies has yet to be deducted. So it made even less then the 2,9 billion dollars in real profit.
    After calculating all the costs and earnings the IP has not remade the initial investment of 4 billion dollars from the movies. After 9 years, 5 movies, and several TV/streaming shows.

    And the toy sales are still abysmal because they thought it wise to dismiss the old fans who made the IP so profitable. I have yet to find an official report from Disney were they report only the numbers for Star Wars toys, they always mix 'em up with Frozen (II) and other merch.

    Edit:
    And to, again, prove Endus wrong:

    Originally Posted by Rennadrel
    This lie is so obvious. You all used it when people shit on Star Wars, Ghostbusters 2016 and Birds of Prey. Can you not just accept that people dislike things in a lot larger numbers than those who like it instead of crying that people are intentionally being negative to artifically reduce audience scores? Just take the L and move on. Because you seem to think that your little echo chamber of people who like the garbage that Hollywood keeps crapping out speaks for the majority all the time, when in reality the people who care the most are the majority. And if you ever try to use critic scores to rationalize your bias, that's just sheer naivety on your part because we know that 90% of reviewers have some sort of bias.

    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    And yet, somehow, those products are financially successful anyway.

    Take the brigading of Captain Marvel, because Brie Larson made a couple comments in interviews that upset the manchildren. It still shows up really low in audience scores on review sites. Despite the quantifiable fact that it's one of the most-successful non-Avengers MCU films; https://www.forbes.com/sites/travisb...g-black-widow/

    It's not even that hard to tell if there's brigading going on; reviews will normally tend to form a bell curve, naturally, if the average is middling, or will be a curve up to a peak at 5 or 1 if it's legitimately great or terrible. When there's brigading, there'll be a huge spike of 1-star reviews, and then a normal bell curve above that in the 3-4-5 region somewhere.

    Imagine trying to deny that brigading occurs in movie audience reviews, in 2021.
    You claimed that here. Both BoP and GB2016 were not.
    Neither were the last Terminator Movie, or the attempt to reboot Charlies Angels.
    Last edited by segara82; 2021-07-30 at 03:49 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I'm fine with a mafia. Of course, the mafia families often worked with independent third parties in order to maintain relations.

  2. #122
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    Edit:
    And to, again, prove Endus wrong:

    You claimed that here. Both BoP and GB2016 were not.
    Neither were the last Terminator Movie, or the attempt to reboot Charlies Angels.
    That's a pretty minor correction to be fluffing up as "proving me wrong".

    Their both made more revenue than they took to make. What cost them both was high marketing costs. This also gets us into Hollywood Accounting nonsense, but fine. My point still remains regarding the other films, including what I had to say there regarding Captain Marvel.


  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post

    Ah, again someone mistakes the total box office with pure profit for Disney. I do have to correct at least 1 thread per year about that:
    boxofficemojo.com, back on jan 31 2020.
    We discussed the missunderstood GROS and NET numbers back then in the Obi_Wan Kenob thread.
    User PACOX back then gave us the numbers, and we showed him how little was left after you corrected the numbers.
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    Disney SW by the numbers
    I actually did not confuse Box Office Numbers. Nor did I suggest they made back the 4 Billion on Ticket Sales.

    I said that Disney made money from the movies. And, aside from Solo, They did. That one was admittedly a flop. It happens.

    And perhaps you missed this, but in a later post I added:

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/30/six-...nvestment.html

    Reportedly, Even Solo flopping didn't stop Disney from making back their investment. Because the thing about Star Wars is that it isn't just the Box Office that they get their money from. It's Merchandise, Video Games, liscensing deals, etc.
    Last edited by Egomaniac; 2021-07-30 at 04:42 PM.

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    Have we failed to move on from our childhood? Why do we connect so much with the media we grew up on and why can we not let it go? For whatever reasons we are upset about our nostalgia being 'ruined' or 'destroyed' why do we really care? I am really not that bothered personally, but it seems us 30+ year olds are really concerned about children's TV shows more than any other generation before us?
    The overwhelming majority of them were shit then and they're shit now, I can't possibly be the only one who recognized shit even as a child.
    Aside from that, what baffles me is seeing adults getting enthralled en masse by shows that are clearly aimed at little children and did not exist when said adults were kids, so nostalgia is out of the equation. Which leaves me slightly concerned and more than a bit disturbed, but to each his own.
    P.s. just to clarify, what I said goes for children's shows alone. Plenty of good animation came out before I was even born and still does to this day. As to other media, yes, I was disappointed by some sequels and remakes. Fantasia is better than Fantasia 2000, 1963's Lord of the Flies is better than the 1990 trainwreck, and 1982's The Thing was better than the 2011 version (which I don't remember being nigh-unwatchable, much unlike 1990's LotF). It goes both ways, some new stuff is better than the old stuff - in both cases though my reactions never went beyond a fleeting feeling of disappointment, even with titles I was looking forwards to. What really irks me is seeing current good stuff ruined midway through (if not downright binned due to Netflix's & co. brilliant renewal policies), though I guess that's another matter entirely.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adolecent View Post
    I'm getting infracted by an American moderator on an American topic promoting/advocating weapons on a childrens forum, what else to expect on an American forum. I'm done here and i'm going to leave you one thing to remember:
    [extremely graphic picture of dead children]
    Hope you sleep well. With the lack of empathy the majority of you show i guess that won't be a problem. BB

  5. #125
    The Insane Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    Nostalgia.
    usually, when you do something for nostalgia, you still use the old characters and try to resemble the old shows, not shit on it and do something new, that is obviously not going to work.

    It just way easier to try to build something you want/force your vision when the franchise is already established, rather than create your own. But it will confront with the old fans.

    And they were a good TV show back in the days, for the time, obviously, the parameters of quality are higher those days, for everything, food, games, is like wanting to shit on a ps1 game because we have xbox and ps5

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Fencers View Post
    The whole gatekeeping thing is really just a small amount of nerds. To be frank.
    Just like it's a small group of Vocal nerds who sit in here and post about this kind of stuff all day

  7. #127
    My nostalgia is polluted by the fumes of the dying Soviet Union and its socialist satellite countries, since I didn't grow up "in the west". When I go back to good childhood memories of Ninja Turtles, Star Wars, The Pirates of Dark Water or others I also inevitably remember the dark days of socialist regimes suffocating nations for generations.

    So our generation experiences can vary quite a bit and it can't be summed up with one overall description. But I don't get on a hate train by default when the entertainment industry capitalizes on old hits, though I call trash when it's trash or applaud when it's superb.

    I believe that when such old and beloved content is touched for new releases, it should be done with utmost respect and reverence to the original. Often they try to improve it by introducing changes and retcons to staples that made the originals great and often those changes seem to carry socials agendas that only sound good in passive agressive Twitter posts and don't have their own universal value that could stand as a classic through the years.

  8. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post

    Ah, again someone mistakes the total box office with pure profit for Disney. I do have to correct at least 1 thread per year about that:
    boxofficemojo.com, back on jan 31 2020.
    We discussed the missunderstood GROS and NET numbers back then in the Obi_Wan Kenob thread.
    User PACOX back then gave us the numbers, and we showed him how little was left after you corrected the numbers.
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    Disney SW by the numbers

    TFA - $936,662,225 (domestic), $1,131,561,399 (international), $2,068,223,624 (worldwide)
    TLJ - $620,181,382 + $712,358,507, = $1,332,539,889
    TROS - $503,458,989 + $545,400,163 = $1,048,859,152

    Rogue One - $532,177,324 + $523,879,949 = $1,056,057,273
    Solo - $213,767,512 + $179,157,295 = $392,924,807

    Total gross TD: $5,898,604,745
    Cost of acquisition: $4.05 billion
    Total gross-budget: $4,497,184,891

    All figures from boxofficemojo.com

    Great, now let's take the gross and turn it into the net, the REALLY important part. Disney WAS in the strong position that they got 60% of domestic and 40% of international earnings, the rest went to the cinemas and distributors:

    Total domestic for all movies: 2.806.247.432 *0,6 = 1.683.748.459,20 $
    Total foreign for all movies: 3.092.357.313 *0,4 = 1.236.942.925,20 $
    totals to: 2.920.691.384,40 $

    2. Those numbers are the box office earnings, the cost of production from those movies has yet to be deducted. So it made even less then the 2,9 billion dollars in real profit.
    After calculating all the costs and earnings the IP has not remade the initial investment of 4 billion dollars from the movies. After 9 years, 5 movies, and several TV/streaming shows.

    And the toy sales are still abysmal because they thought it wise to dismiss the old fans who made the IP so profitable. I have yet to find an official report from Disney were they report only the numbers for Star Wars toys, they always mix 'em up with Frozen (II) and other merch.

    Edit:
    And to, again, prove Endus wrong:

    Originally Posted by Rennadrel
    This lie is so obvious. You all used it when people shit on Star Wars, Ghostbusters 2016 and Birds of Prey. Can you not just accept that people dislike things in a lot larger numbers than those who like it instead of crying that people are intentionally being negative to artifically reduce audience scores? Just take the L and move on. Because you seem to think that your little echo chamber of people who like the garbage that Hollywood keeps crapping out speaks for the majority all the time, when in reality the people who care the most are the majority. And if you ever try to use critic scores to rationalize your bias, that's just sheer naivety on your part because we know that 90% of reviewers have some sort of bias.



    You claimed that here. Both BoP and GB2016 were not.
    Neither were the last Terminator Movie, or the attempt to reboot Charlies Angels.
    I have to wonder what exactly Star Wars is making most of its money from. It certainly isn't movies or toys, that's for sure. Is it from mobile games? And how many years of microtransactions will it take for Disney to recoup their investment?

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    I actually did not confuse Box Office Numbers. Nor did I suggest they made back the 4 Billion on Ticket Sales.

    I said that Disney made money from the movies. And, aside from Solo, They did. That one was admittedly a flop. It happens.

    And perhaps you missed this, but in a later post I added:

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/30/six-...nvestment.html

    Reportedly, Even Solo flopping didn't stop Disney from making back their investment. Because the thing about Star Wars is that it isn't just the Box Office that they get their money from. It's Merchandise, Video Games, liscensing deals, etc.
    Yes, and the writer of that article made the usual mistake of taking the gross box office revenue and writing as if it was pure profit for Disney. Which, as the numbers i showed you, it is not. But who needs math and facts when good-sounding PR is needed?

    The numbers for Star Wars toys are so bad, that their revenue is added together with the Frozen merch, so to make the numbers look better. But i have not yet found a report from Disney in the last years showing the pure SW toys numbers. They claim that the numbers went up from last year, but still add them in with Frozen (II) merch. And since the Frozen IP manages to makes up to 25% of all merch sales ... it is IMO a very convenient spot to hide bad numbers.

    As for the merch and the other things: Disney gets 10%, 15% or, in some cases, even 30% of the profit- numbers vary by contract. I have not found reliable info on how big their cut is for Star Wars.
    The numbers from the Q1 FY 2021 however do not paint a rosy picture.
    https://www.investopedia.com/how-dis...-money-4799164

    @Endus: YOU claimed 'they were financially successful anyway'.
    only one of them was. The rest barely broke even , or were flops. If you want to set the bar of success so low as 'barely breaks even' than you and i have very different understandings of 'financially successful'.
    Or, you could admit that you were wrong, and that only 1 was a success.

    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    I have to wonder what exactly Star Wars is making most of its money from. It certainly isn't movies or toys, that's for sure. Is it from mobile games? And how many years of microtransactions will it take for Disney to recoup their investment?
    Currently not much. While they do make some money with merch (Lego sets and relaunches of the original triology stuff) and the few games out there, it is pittance to the old numbers George got. Disney+ so far is still in the red, and if they really make all 11 shows the oversaturation will do more harm than good to the IP IMO.
    Last edited by segara82; 2021-07-31 at 09:51 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I'm fine with a mafia. Of course, the mafia families often worked with independent third parties in order to maintain relations.

  10. #130
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    @Endus: YOU claimed 'they were financially successful anyway'.
    only one of them was. The rest barely broke even , or were flops. If you want to set the bar of success so low as 'barely breaks even' than you and i have very different understandings of 'financially successful'.
    Or, you could admit that you were wrong, and that only 1 was a success.
    Of the 5 Star Wars films released, only one didn't make back it's costs; Solo. The rest were wildly successful and there really isn't any debate about that; even Rise of Skywalker pulled in North of a billion dollars at the box office.

    If you're expecting me to lie about that, you'll be a long time waiting. I already admitted to overstating regarding the other films, so I don't see where you think you're going with this.


  11. #131
    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    Yes, and the writer of that article made the usual mistake of taking the gross box office revenue and writing as if it was pure profit for Disney. Which, as the numbers i showed you, it is not. But who needs math and facts when good-sounding PR is needed?
    No, he did not. The article specifically states that the calculation includes, but is not limited to, the Box Office Revenue. It also accounts for the hundreds of millions of dollars that is spent for marketing and production.

    Again, what you are missing is Merchandise.

    https://www.pymnts.com/news/retail/2...ndise-revenue/

    According to analyst estimates, a Star Wars movie year is worth $5-$7 billion in merchandising revenue for Disney—and that estimate was made with the 2015 release of the first of the Disney Star Wars films, The Force Awakens.
    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    I have to wonder what exactly Star Wars is making most of its money from. It certainly isn't movies or toys, that's for sure. Is it from mobile games? And how many years of microtransactions will it take for Disney to recoup their investment?
    What makes you think Movies and Toys aren't making a ton of money for Star Wars?

  12. #132
    Legendary! Lord Pebbleton's Avatar
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    Absolutely yes.

    I think it's a normal defense mechanism that humans have - depreciating the new stuff is a way to keep the old stuff relevant, at least in one's mind. Couple that with the fact that older folk are not exactly willing to learn new stuff, and you get a slew of adult people that absolutely refuse to listen to people under a certain age threshold, and that refuse to learn something new ("I am not good with computers" -> "I never even tried and I won't even if you advise me to").

    I believe that older folk start feeling insecure when their beliefs are questioned. For example, 40 years ago it was perfectly normal to have children all the time, while now more and more people opt out of it. The people that didn't really know you could choose between having or not having kids, and that had them, are the ones that tell you "You will change your mind in the future", because you agreeing with their decisions makes those decisions more valid.

    I have had so many first-hand experiences with this that it has become a problem. I live in a country where, in the past years, it was insane to think you wanted to move abroad. Every time I mention the possibility of moving away (for better opportunities or to make new experiences), I need to select my talkers carefully, because I have had people outright insult me because I wasn't 100% faithful to my country, whatever that means. Those were people that went abroad maybe twice in their life, just for a vacation.

    Another time an old lady told me she wanted to visit a psychologist that would agree with whatever she said. I told her that's not psychology, that's manipulation. She told me she doesn't have to listen to someone this young (I am not a teen...).

    Society is changing rapidly, extremely so, and this kind of behavior, I fear, will become more and more common. For my part, I hope I never become a gatekeeper, I would love to keep an open mind about new stuff until the day I die, and I want to make my decisions because I want to make them, not because "it's always been done this way".

  13. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    No, he did not. The article specifically states that the calculation includes, but is not limited to, the Box Office Revenue. It also accounts for the hundreds of millions of dollars that is spent for marketing and production.

    Again, what you are missing is Merchandise.

    https://www.pymnts.com/news/retail/2...ndise-revenue/



    - - - Updated - - -



    What makes you think Movies and Toys aren't making a ton of money for Star Wars?
    Yes, she did. From the article you linked:
    'Disney’s purchase of “Star Wars” production company Lucasfilm is proving to be one of the smartest acquisitions ever made in corporate America.

    The deal, worth $4.05 billion in cash and stock, was announced Oct. 30, 2012 and marked the start of a new era in the Star Wars franchise. Disney would make back that investment and more in just a few short years. The four Star Wars feature films Disney has produced have grossed more than $4.8 billion at the box office, according to comScore.'

    She is, once again, mistaking box office numbers with net earnings for Disney. We have already analyzed and dismissed this badly researched article in 2 other threads.
    And while Disney made money with merch and games, TLJ killed the demand for it. It had gotten so bad that for years now the numbers for SW merch are added together with the Frozen merch to give the impression of good sales.

    Here is a more in-depth report about Hasbro's SW toy numbers up until 2018:
    https://www.jeditemplearchives.com/2...ith-star-wars/

    If you want to know how badly the House of Mouse is hurting:
    https://www.investopedia.com/how-dis...-money-4799164
    Just to highlight: The company's net income fell 99.2% to $18 million in Q1 of its 2021 fiscal year (FY), which ended January 2, 2021. Revenue for the quarter fell 22.2% to $16.2 billion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I'm fine with a mafia. Of course, the mafia families often worked with independent third parties in order to maintain relations.

  14. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    Yes, she did. From the article you linked:
    'Disney’s purchase of “Star Wars” production company Lucasfilm is proving to be one of the smartest acquisitions ever made in corporate America.

    The deal, worth $4.05 billion in cash and stock, was announced Oct. 30, 2012 and marked the start of a new era in the Star Wars franchise. Disney would make back that investment and more in just a few short years. The four Star Wars feature films Disney has produced have grossed more than $4.8 billion at the box office, according to comScore.'
    She specifically used the word "grossed" and you're trying to say she was talking about "net".

    She goes on to talk about the costs:

    While box office grosses are a solid measure of a film’s success, they still don’t tell the whole story. There are hundreds of millions of dollars of costs that come into play, along with dozens of other “Star Wars” revenue streams.

    The receipts don’t account for the estimated $200 million to $300 million Disney shelled out per film in production costs or the money spent on its robust marketing campaigns to promote each release.
    And again the article isn't just about Box Office Perfomance:

    Then there’s also the money Disney makes on DVD, BluRay and digital sales, not to mention licensing agreements for the brand and sales of its own Star Wars apparel, toys and novelizations. Ahead of the release of “The Force Awakens” in 2015, Disney’s earnings got a boost from sales of Star Wars merchandise on Force Friday, a September event designed to excite fans of the franchise to purchase newly released goods.
    Merchandise. Lots of money in Merchandise.

    If you want to know how badly the House of Mouse is hurting:
    https://www.investopedia.com/how-dis...-money-4799164
    Just to highlight: The company's net income fell 99.2% to $18 million in Q1 of its 2021 fiscal year (FY), which ended January 2, 2021. Revenue for the quarter fell 22.2% to $16.2 billion.
    Yeah, you may have heard about this little thing called "COVID-19"...it kinda savaged the movie and theme park industries last year. Also, has nothing to do with Disney's aquisition of Star Wars.
    Last edited by Egomaniac; 2021-07-31 at 08:48 PM.

  15. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by Ladey Gags View Post
    This rampant nostalgia consumer machine is nothing more than the infantilization of adults to further the degradation of society and culture. People who buy into this rubbish are literally manchildren. Yea, it’s time to grow up and move on. But the idea of growing up bothers a frighteningly large amount of people, that I’m not surprised so many adults today unironically watch cartoons
    Those same people also often flock to other fandoms and push for the same childish tropes to be present in every story. A lot of good video games and TV shows are having lasting consequences stripped from their stories due to a growing amount of people being unable to handle anything bad happening.

  16. #136
    The Unstoppable Force Super Kami Dende's Avatar
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    There isn't a gatekeeping problem.

    There is a recycling old franchises into utter fucking trash problems though.

  17. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Of the 5 Star Wars films released, only one didn't make back it's costs; Solo. The rest were wildly successful and there really isn't any debate about that; even Rise of Skywalker pulled in North of a billion dollars at the box office.

    If you're expecting me to lie about that, you'll be a long time waiting. I already admitted to overstating regarding the other films, so I don't see where you think you're going with this.
    Oh, so now you limit yourself to only the Star Wars movies as financially successful?
    Shall i take it that even you don't consider BoP successful?
    You already admitted that GB2016 is not, so only 1 franchise of the 3 you claimed 'were financially successful anyway' was.
    How about you just admit that you were wrong, and only 1 was successful?

    @Egomaniac:
    Then why is the headline in her article:
    Disney bought Lucasfilm six years ago today and has already recouped its $4 billion investment

    Which is plain wrong from the numbers i can see.
    The movies, while themselves bringing in a profit, have killed off the demand for merch. In begining, with TFA, numbers went up and all looked well.
    Then came TLJ and shat all over the fans and the old stuff. The toys and merch that sells best is OG stuff, and from those earnings George Lucas still gets his cut (one of the reasons Disney wanted the old characters gone).
    For 2018 Mattel made less then 200 millions in sales, from which only a fraction (usually 10-15%) goes to Disney.

    And yes, Covid has hurt lots of industries, bringing down the amount of money Disney makes with SW even further.

    So, unless you can show concrete numbers that prove me, and the articles i linked, wrong i'll stick to my theory that Disney has not remade their initial investment.

    btt:
    If you do it right than you can attract new fans and please old fans.
    He-Man 2002 being a good example, or Extreme Ghostbusters.
    TMNT had several shows since 1987, and always managed to mix things up without shitting on the old.

    It is not easy, and we, like every generation, have a few that are against any change.
    But it is do-able. You just have to be careful and plan things out accordingly.
    Last edited by segara82; 2021-08-01 at 05:43 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I'm fine with a mafia. Of course, the mafia families often worked with independent third parties in order to maintain relations.

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Ladey Gags View Post
    This rampant nostalgia consumer machine is nothing more than the infantilization of adults to further the degradation of society and culture. People who buy into this rubbish are literally manchildren. Yea, it’s time to grow up and move on. But the idea of growing up bothers a frighteningly large amount of people, that I’m not surprised so many adults today unironically watch cartoons
    While I can agree it's a huge consumer machine that has way too many people feeding it, The fact that you're posting on a video games general discussion forum with that Profile pic and username that you have is extremely ironic. You're just shifting what is allowed to be enjoy to fit yourself and everything beyond it is childish. You're playing a game where cartoon garden gnomes and cows defeat cosmic gods with the help of their fish and space goat friends, how is that any better then shit like Adventure Time?

  19. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Fencers View Post
    Entertainment companies keep repackaging this stuff more so than there is an active desire for it. Mostly because this stuff never goes away anymore.

    If I wanted to watch All in the Family or Ed Sullivan back in the day, I had to catch a rerun on some affiliate channel or buy a VHS collection for $29.99 on a late-night infomercial.

    But I can bring up like any episode of the Pirates of Dark Water or Bravestar if I wanted in a few seconds. I mean, I don't. A retelling of the classic tale of Silverhawks is what I am clamoring for necessarily. Probably not a lot of other people are either- they just recall it and say, "Oh yea."

    But that's enough for an entertainment company because they just need eyeballs on the product on content. Voluminous, unending content.

    The whole gatekeeping thing is really just a small amount of nerds. To be frank.
    The answer you're looking for would be "yes"

  20. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by Graeham View Post
    Those same people also often flock to other fandoms and push for the same childish tropes to be present in every story. A lot of good video games and TV shows are having lasting consequences stripped from their stories due to a growing amount of people being unable to handle anything bad happening.
    The fact that shit like Game of Thrones, American Horror stories, The Boys etc exist is counter to your point. You're blaming people who are playing a game for the "No bad things allowed" when it's just a corporate attempt at mass appeal.

    I mean, It's just beyond reason to think games like God of War, Ghosts of Tsushima, Sekiro are stripped of their uncomfortable visuals or story turns because people can't handle it, I just think people love blaming the SJW boogeyman for a lot of things.

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