Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Machismo]

Who did you vote for in 2016? 2020?

Edit: be aware, a big part of getting Trump elected was convincing people to vote third party because “morals”.

I did not vote for Trump, and I'm saying right now I do not support him.

That was easy to refute your nonsense.

[PhaelixWW]

So, we've talked recently about Fuck Florida's numbers.

The numbers for the last few days are still missing on worldometers... and literally as I was typing this, they popped up. It appears that worldometers has picked up the CDC website's data and is now reporting the same, including postings for yesterday and today of 15,322 and 24,753 new cases.

And yet they're only posting death totals of 16 and 4 for those two days. That's... not right.

Fuck Florida.

...

That is all.

[Milchshake]

IkEA, reminds everyone that Mike Lindell is a "former" crack head.



I put "former" in parenthesis, because when is the last time this guy presented a clean piss?

[Breccia]

That's... not right.

I think at this point, DeSantis has proven so willing to murder his own voters that any numbers he gives are the accounting variation of hiding the bodies.

And we're past "the cases/hospitalizations are hitting records" by, what, a week now? I'm not buying their low death count. The CDC is saying their deaths have been going down. That bucks most forms of logic and a few forms of fantasy.

[Masark]

IkEA, reminds everyone that Mike Lindell is a "former" crack head.

I put "former" in parenthesis, because when is the last time this guy presented a clean piss?

He probably doesn't actually use crack anymore.

He has enough money to have switched to powder.

[Endus]

Just saw the news about why Rand and his libertarians are pushing vaccine hesitancy, it’s so he can profit from his wife’s investment in covid treatments(not vaccines).

If that's the case, they should be heavily prosecuted for corruption. That's an aim to wield his political position to A> get Americans killed, and B> profit off their suffering, by way of his immediate family, which has to be a conflict of interest. It would be in literally any other professional position.

There's no world where that should be "okay". It's the kind of thing that should get Rand sent to prison for 20+ years.

[Hollycakes]

Well Boda,

1. I generally think "most*" of you are somewhat "reasonable*" and more openminded to new information than said poster, so no I don't think it's the same.
but
2. is a fair point and like Ivan says I see the amusing side of it.
but

this is why:

I guess since I asked you a question that you didn't;t answer but instead answered one I didn't;t ask, then when I restated it you ignored it, its safe to say I either blew your argument out of the water or exposed you as a bad faith poster......which is it?

His tactics are always the same, you end up going in a circle and he never responds to any of the actual bs he posts with anything remotely backing it up. Then he just makes another post spouting something else entirely insane and moves on to the next.

So your quote here sums up what I meant.
That kid has 99 problems

Edit: If that pillow is real I fucking love Sweden.

*fractionally insignificant

[PhaelixWW]

I think at this point, DeSantis has proven so willing to murder his own voters that any numbers he gives are the accounting variation of hiding the bodies.

And we're past "the cases/hospitalizations are hitting records" by, what, a week now? I'm not buying their low death count. The CDC is saying their deaths have been going down. That bucks most forms of logic and a few forms of fantasy.

Yeah, when the new case count graph looks like this:



...but then the death count graph looks like this:



...then you know someone is blowing smoke up your ass.

[PhaelixWW]

Just pneumonia, nothing to see… moving along… move along.

So what you're saying is...

[Wezmon]

Just pneumonia, nothing to see… moving along… move along.

That's the power of Ivermectin

[PhaelixWW]

That's the power of Ivermectin

LATimes: Major study of Ivermectin, the anti-vaccine crowd’s latest COVID drug, finds ‘no effect whatsoever’

Ivermectin, the latest supposed treatment for COVID-19 being touted by anti-vaccination groups, had “no effect whatsoever” on the disease, according to a large patient study.

That’s the conclusion of the Together Trial, which has subjected several purported nonvaccine treatments for COVID-19 to carefully designed clinical testing. The trial is supervised by McMaster University in Hamilton, Canada, and conducted in Brazil.

One of the trial’s principal investigators, Edward Mills of McMaster, presented the results from the Ivermectin arms of the study at an Aug. 6 symposium sponsored by the National Institutes of Health.

Among the 1,500 patients in the study, he said, Ivermectin showed “no effect whatsoever” on the trial’s outcome goals — whether patients required extended observation in the emergency room or hospitalization.

“In our specific trial,” he said, “we do not see the treatment benefit that a lot of the advocates believe should have been” seen.

The study’s results on Ivermectin haven’t been formally published or peer-reviewed. Earlier peer-reviewed results from the Together Trial related to the antimalarial drug hydroxychloroquine, which had been touted as a miracle treatment for COVID by then-President Trump, were published in April; they showed no significant therapeutic effect on the virus.

The findings on Ivermectin are yet another blow for advocates promoting the drug as a magic bullet against COVID-19. Ivermectin was developed as a treatment for parasitical diseases, mostly for veterinarians, though it’s also used against some human parasites.

Its repurposing as a COVID treatment began with a 2020 paper by Australian researchers who determined that at extremely high concentrations it showed some efficacy against the SARS-CoV-2 virus, which causes COVID, in the lab. But their research involved concentrations of the drug far beyond what could be achieved, much less tolerated, in the human body.

The Ivermectin camp, as I reported earlier, is heavily peopled by anti-vaccination advocates and conspiracy mongers. They maintain that the truth about the drug has been suppressed by agents of the pharmaceutical industry, which ostensibly prefers to collect the more generous profits that will flow from COVID vaccines.

The problem, however, is that the scientific trials cited by Ivermectin advocates have been too small or poorly documented to prove their case. One large trial from Egypt that showed the most significant therapeutic effect was withdrawn from its publishers due to accusations of plagiarism and bogus data.

Nevertheless, the advocates have continued to press their case — without necessarily observing accepted standards of scientific discourse. During the symposium, Mills complained that serious researchers looking into claims for COVID treatments have faced unprecedented abuse from advocates.

“I’ve had enough abuse and so have the other clinical trialists doing Ivermectin,” he said. “Others working in this area have been threatened, their families have been threatened, they’ve been defamed,” he said.

“I can think of no circumstances in the past where this kind of abuse has occurred to clinical trialists,” he added. “We need to figure out a system where we have each others’ backs on these issues, because the abuse that certain individuals have received is shocking.” He referred to “accusations” and “swearing,” though he gave no specific examples.

Mills said that his team’s Ivermectin trial was altered after advocacy groups complained that it was too modest to achieve the results they expected. The trial originally tested the results from a single Ivermectin dose in January this year, but was later changed to involve one daily dose for three days of 400 micrograms of the drug for every kilogram (about 2.2 pounds) of the patients’ weight, up to 90 kilograms.

Half the subjects received a placebo tablet. No clinical results were detected at either dosage, Mills said.

Asked whether he expected further criticism from Ivermectin advocates, he said it was all but inevitable. “The advocacy groups have set themselves up to be able to critique any clinical trial. They’ve already determined that any valid, well-designed critical trial was set up to fail.”

You know what works? Vaccination.

[Bodakane]

LATimes: Major study of Ivermectin, the anti-vaccine crowd’s latest COVID drug, finds ‘no effect whatsoever’


You know what works? Vaccination.

Ivermectin = bad.
Ivaccinated = good.

[Breccia]

The NYTimes reports that, in a closed-door session, the SJC was told at-the-time US AG Pak resigned because he refused to sell Trump's election "fraud" claims, and was told Trump was going to fire him for refusing to sell Trump's election "fraud" claims.

This sounds like threats were used to change the course of political events, also known as "terrorism".

- - - Updated - - -

I love the WH response to DeSantis...well, hold on.

Florida asked the WH for ventilators for very obvious reasons. Within hours, DeSantis denied he made the request and said he had plenty.

Makes sense? Yeah, nobody else thought it did either. @PhaelixWW is doing a double-take right now, I can tell.

So the WH response was

As a policy, we don’t send ventilators to states without their interest in receiving the ventilators. I think the most important question here is why would you oppose receiving the ventilators when clearly you need those in your state given the percentage of hospitalizations that are occurring?

Also known as

You both made and denied the problem. Good luck, Fuck Florida

[s_bushido]

Yeah, when the new case count graph looks like this:



...but then the death count graph looks like this:



...then you know someone is blowing smoke up your ass.

Not necessarily. It could mean that treatments have become more effective or that new cases are simply less severe. Obviously there's no reason to give them the benefit of the doubt in this situation, but there are possible/plausible explanations for those results that don't involve malfeasance.

[Benggaul]

I see y'all just couldn't resist. "OMG we must save random passerby to a subforum on a gaming website from misinformation! Ignoring it is how we got Trump!" Riiiight.

It appears that worldometers has picked up the CDC website's data and is now reporting the same, including postings for yesterday and today of 15,322 and 24,753 new cases.

I'll arbitrarily give them 25k because fuck Florida, which would mean about 15k more than last Tuesday. We'll see how close I am if those numbers ever come in

Damn, one day off. Though I call bullshit on only 15k for Tuesday. Thanks for keeping us posted, Phaelix. As for the death totals, I'll give them one day to correct that, otherwise, yeah...

I do recall that the "pneumonia" story was debunked by quite a few sources, though, so I wouldn't hop on that train just yet. Just got back from work and I'm in no hurry to look it up, but I think Politifact and Factcheck.org both had stories about it last year.

- - - Updated - - -

Not necessarily. It could mean that treatments have become more effective or that new cases are simply less severe malfeasance.

Since last year, absolutely. Not in the course of past 4 days, is what they're saying. Look at the graphs. Cases are skyrocketing and continue to go up, but the deaths for the past few days dropped dramatically. That's just not how things work.

[PhaelixWW]

Not necessarily. It could mean that treatments have become more effective...

I guarantee we would have heard about it already if this were the case.

...or that new cases are simply less severe.

Not when hospitalizations look like this:

[postman1782]

Mike Lindell's own "Cyber Security Expert" said there was no evidence that China hacked the election.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...they-cant-pro/

This is even one of the worst sources you can use, as they are ardently pro-Trump. Mike Lindell says he has 37 terabytes of evidence, but there is nothing in it that shows that China hacked the election.

What is also funny, is that the $5 million that Lindell offered to disprove the data, is now off the table.

Even Steve Bannon, who was broadcasting from this bullshit symposium, even said there was no evidence presented to show that China hacked the election.

https://www.newsweek.com/this-mistak...-fraud-1618546

[Breccia]

Not necessarily. It could mean that treatments have become more effective or that new cases are simply less severe.

And I'm going to call bullshit on that.

Pick any other state, such as South Dakota. (15 seconds later) Not South Dakota, they stopped reporting cases. They claimed 0 cases/day for the last few days. So they're lying too.

Fine, pick...Ohio. Pick Mississippi. Pick Idaho. Pick Georgia. Pick California. Pick NYC. Pick NYState. Pick the total USA.

Compare cases vs. deaths, right now.

Florida is showing a massive record-breaking (for them) number of new daily cases. They are claiming they have a downwards death track. Something that, somehow, they are doing but nobody else is.

So either
(a) Florida and Florida alone has magic medicine that makes their COVID cases less severe than any other state in the country, nobody else knows about it, nobody else is asking for it, nobody else is claiming to have this magic medicine to sell to other states in bad shape like Louisiana or Alabama (oh, right, pick Louisiana or Alabama) and there are no whistleblowers pointing out that Florida is hoarding this magic medicine -- while the Florida health dept still begging for ventilators behind DeSantis' back and their ICU rooms are filled to the brim

or

(b) Florida's death count is wrong.

Your claim might be well-intentioned or called upon in a vacuum, but it fails in even the slightest glance of context.

If the state of Kansas (oh, right, pick Kansas) announced they had the most shootings/capita of any state, 50% more than their next closest and nearly triple the national average, then also said they had half or quarter the shooting deaths/capita of the national average, I would not leap to the conclusion that Kansas' bullets were magically nonlethal bullets. I would not leap to the conclusion that Kansas hospitals were just that good. And I would not say it was Glinda, Witch of the North, using magic bullet-repelling bubbles. I would say the data was wrong. There is nothing in Kansas that makes the inhabitants magically bulletproof. And there is nothing in Florida that allows an increase in COVID I've spent several long-ass posts describing, somehow have a decrease in COVID deaths that no other state is managing.

No. That's not what's happening. I reject that theory out of hand.

[Benggaul]

Pick any other state, such as South Dakota. (15 seconds later) Not South Dakota, they stopped reporting cases. They claimed 0 cases/day for the last few days. So they're lying too.

Just so people know, South Dakota doesn't report daily, but they report something like every other day or every three days. Worldometers divides those up equally among the days they're for, which is why their graph has a lot of "doubles"; two days in a row with the same number. They do have 124 cases for Wednesday listed on worldometers. They've been going up like the rest of the nation has, but with their low population they shouldn't be seeing enormous numbers--but I'm keeping an eye on them because of Sturgis and the Pillow Talk.

Also, I believe that bushido thought we were talking about the year-to-year amount of deaths rather than the last week's worth out of there. Taken year-to-year, yes, deaths are down and that could be chalked up to improvements in treatment.

[PhaelixWW]

Pick any other state, such as South Dakota. (15 seconds later) Not South Dakota, they stopped reporting cases. They claimed 0 cases/day for the last few days. So they're lying too.

FYI, it just looks like they do one data dump each week on Thursdays (for data through Wednesday). So tomorrow we should see those 0s fill up, divided evenly through all 7 days, with any remainder added to Wednesday.



Because, you know, who wants accurate daily trends of a deadly pandemic, right?

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Just so people know, South Dakota doesn't report daily, but they report something like every other day or every three days.

Bah. Ninja'd by @Benggaul.

- - - Updated - - -

They do have 124 cases for Wednesday listed on worldometers.

Yeah, looking at worldometers, they have 123 each day from 8/5 to 8/10 and then 124 for 8/11. So that was a dump of 862 new cases for the week, which is yuuuuuuge increase over the 376 new cases from the previous week. That's a +129% week-to-week increase.

Good thing they're not having some large, mostly unmasked event there to really push those... wait, they what?... Oh boy.