Fate of Afghanistan, Taliban resurgence

[jonnysensible]

some racist shit

you built a client state and then abandoned it not a democracy, put the fucking calipers away

[uuuhname]

the Ayattolahs in Iran

if you knew anything about what happened in Iran for the past 60 years, or the fact that the CIA CREATED the Taliban to fight socialists and the Russians. you would have typed that post out, realized how ignorant it is, and deleted it post-haste.

[jonnysensible]

the fact that the CIA CREATED the Taliban to fight socialists and the Russians.

This is absolutely not a fact.

[Forogil]

Blaming Afghan corruption on the US is kind of an odd take.

I thought the point is primarily that the US didn't care much about reducing corruption, as there was obviously corruption before as well.
And sending in sacks of dollar bills to a corrupt country seems consistent with not caring about reducing corruption.

There does seem to be a preclusion for whatever reason for countries in that region to drift towards autocratic iron fist rule, whether through a dictator or theocracy.

An autocratic iron fist rule wouldn't prevent corruption.

[uuuhname]

This is absolutely not a fact.

right, just like how the US didn't directly fund death squads in Nicaragua...

[jonnysensible]

I thought the point is primarily that the US didn't care much about reducing corruption, as there was obviously corruption before as well.
And sending in sacks of dollar bills to a corrupt country seems consistent with not caring about reducing corruption.

nothing to do with the US exhibit a : https://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/29/w...rs-office.html

- - - Updated - - -

right, just like how the US didn't directly fund death squads in Nicaragua...

muja doesnt = talib

[uuuhname]

muja doesnt = talib

omg so the nitpicking here is even more pedantic.

[jonnysensible]

omg so the nitpicking here is even more pedantic.

taliban didnt fight the soviets given that they were founded in 1994 and the soviet union collapsed in 1991, pedantic? no you are just fucking wrong

[Draco-Onis]

This is absolutely not a fact.

Well yes and no the US gave billions of dollars to groups that eventually became the Taliban.

[Forogil]

nothing to do with the US exhibit a : https://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/29/w...rs-office.html

Yes, a text-book case of how to not reduce corruption and build states.

However, it isn't just the CIA - but also likely other foreign organizations that were trying to spend money in Afghanistan.

[uuuhname]

taliban didnt fight the soviets given that they were founded in 1994 and the soviet union collapsed in 1991, pedantic? no you are just fucking wrong

the Mujadin BECAME the Taliban and Al-Qaida.. like holy crap dude there is a clear timeline of how these events unfolded. Here's a vid so you can stop being so aggressively wrong about it.

[jonnysensible]

the Mujadin BECAME the Taliban and Al-Qaida.. like holy crap dude there is a clear timeline of how these events unfolded. Here's a vid so you can stop being so aggressively wrong about it.

im not watching a youtube video,

the fact that the CIA CREATED the Taliban to fight socialists and the Russians.

this is stupid and wrong, doubling down wont help you

[Forogil]

the Mujadin BECAME the Taliban and Al-Qaida.. like holy crap dude there is a clear timeline of how these events unfolded. Here's a vid so you can stop being so aggressively wrong about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9j1H330Nmo

The author who wrote the underlying book has recently seen Australia's lockdown as being autocratic, https://twitter.com/johnpilger/statu...80017617068036
and he has also been cozy with actual autocrats like Chavez in "The War on Democracy".

Added: He also posted bail for Julian Assange thinking that Assange would absolutely not skip bail.
Demonstrating that: A fool and his money are soon parted.

That makes him an unreliable source, at best.

[uuuhname]

im not watching a youtube video,



this is stupid and wrong, doubling down wont help you

then I don't give a shit about your opinion... you know at least I went though the effort of trying to back my claims instead of... you who are just saying "nuh uh!" like what the hell, what are you even doing here? saying I'm dumb because you can't be bothered to look at evidence of my claims? yea cool, bye.

- - - Updated - - -

The author who wrote the underlying book has recently seen Australia's lockdown as being autocratic, https://twitter.com/johnpilger/statu...80017617068036
and he has also been cozy with actual autocrats like Chavez in "The War on Democracy".

That makes him an unreliable source, at best.

cool I don't see how that makes what is said in the video any less correct.

[downnola]

the Mujadin BECAME the Taliban and Al-Qaida.. like holy crap dude there is a clear timeline of how these events unfolded. Here's a vid so you can stop being so aggressively wrong about it.

The Afghan mujahideen consisted of groups that eventually went to war with each other after the Soviet withdrawal from the region. The Taliban is a product of that civil war. The U.S. didn't help anyone by getting involved there in the '80s but they didn't literally create the Taliban.

[Forogil]

cool I don't see how that makes what is said in the video any less correct.

I cannot say, since I try to avoid propaganda in the guise of documentary from people with clearly documented poor judgement.

[muto]

I don't think anyone bought the whole we're a whole new Taliban thing however they can't keep the population in lockdown forever. Afghanistan will probably go back to its civil wars.

The Panjshir Valley is already getting prepared.

[uuuhname]

The Afghan mujahideen consisted of groups that eventually went to war with each other after the Soviet withdrawal from the region. The Taliban is a product of that civil war. The U.S. didn't help anyone by getting involved there in the '80s but they didn't literally create the Taliban.

ok, so US's hands are therefore completely clean and their actions in that area had no reverberating consequences. got it.

- - - Updated - - -

I cannot say, since I try to avoid propaganda in the guise of documentary from people with clearly documented poor judgement.

unless you can bother to point out what is wrong then sorry I really don't care about your objections in this particular instance.

[downnola]

ok, so US's hands are therefore completely clean and their actions in that area had no reverberating consequences. got it.

Didn't say that at all. Of course, the United States isn't absolved of any wrongdoing in Afghanistan during that period. I'm just saying that framing their existence solely as a product of American imperialism is an oversimplification of who those people are and how and why they exist. It's also annoying because it's a western-centric way to view Afghanistan and denies them agency.

edit* just want to point out that I'm not trying to dogpile you, just discussing history. I enjoy the vast majority of your posts.

[Forogil]

unless you can bother to point out what is wrong then sorry I really don't care about your objections in this
particular instance.

The errors are:

• Linking to a youtube video instead of presenting any actual statements; thus there are no actual statements to refute.
• That the author of the underlying book thinks that Australia's lockdown is an autocratic move.
• And he was cozy with an actual autocrat like Hugo Chavez.
• And he thought Assange would surely not skip bail. People with poor judgements don't deserve monetized views, and don't deserve to be refuted in each specific instance.