Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Huehuecoyotl]

So let's talk about Florida. Let's talk about how completely fucked they've chosen to make themselves.

1) DeSantis is considering letting out-of-state nurses come to help Florida because the state is overwhelmed.

Considering that all other states are under pressure (not as bad as Florida, but still bad enough that they don't have nurses to spare) where are these additional nurses going to come from? Are they going to use (gasp) foreign nurses?

The cognitive dissonance could be large enough to be seen from space.

[beanman12345]

4) And before some disingenuous poster comes here to shrill "But Illinois! But Massachusetts!" Florida is the only state that's breaking death records. Vaccines are readily available, masks are everywhere, and Florida's fourth wave is their highest ever ever.

I can actually speak for some of this. Illinois. Southern Illinois, Corn fields, a few college towns, well those college towns are likely where the majority of southern illinois hospitals are located in, are full. Deep red country, low vaccine rate, also low if not 0 ICU beds available. contrast to where almost everyone in Illinois lives, Chicago, we're at 85% ICU capacity. less then 10% of that is covid. Because you know, there is A LOT of medical issues that require an ICU, and people in states where they are FULL of Covid patients, are FUCKED. Don't even drive through any of these states, you get in a car accident, you are FUCKED.

[Omega10]

I can actually speak for some of this. Illinois. Southern Illinois, Corn fields, a few college towns, well those college towns are likely where the majority of southern illinois hospitals are located in, are full. Deep red country, low vaccine rate, also low if not 0 ICU beds available. contrast to where almost everyone in Illinois lives, Chicago, we're at 85% ICU capacity. less then 10% of that is covid. Because you know, there is A LOT of medical issues that require an ICU, and people in states where they are FULL of Covid patients, are FUCKED. Don't even drive through any of these states, you get in a car accident, you are FUCKED.

I never thought of this. But yeah.

[beanman12345]

I never thought of this. But yeah.

I was in one just two days ago, PACU, had to get my gallbladder removed. two other where there, no one with covid. When I was to the ER, nurse said it was one of the quietest she's ever seen it.

[Breccia]

where are these additional nurses going to come from?

There's also "why". Why would anyone come to Florida to work in medicine, now? Honestly, I'm looking for a dollar figure here. Medical professionals are front line workers and Florida is Normandy. What would you need to be paid to move there and work on the front lines? I'm a teacher, basically the second line in this context since Florida is doing in-person without a mask mandate. I can't imagine doing it for a price tag without "million" in it, and my family would question the move without an extra zero in there. Maybe I'm not the standard, but I also don't think Florida can afford seven or even six figures per nurse they want to relocate. I posted earlier they were down fifteen hundred medical personel. $100k each, that's $150 million dollars. To put that in perspective, that's Disneyland for a month.

Or, there could be nurses and such who have a lower price tag. I...hope they don't. The only thing worse than moving a nurse across the country to help people who are desperate to commit suicide, is when those people trying to commit suicide kill the nurse, and their families realize the nurse was killed for the price of a used car.

I suppose religious groups or the Red Cross or something could show up, but uh...they haven't yet. And for Florida to be saved by people used to treating the homeless, the helpless, the bottom of humanity's barrel? Yeah, DeSantis can put that on his 2024 posters.

there is A LOT of medical issues that require an ICU, and people in states where they are FULL of Covid patients, are FUCKED.

I think that's what that one Texas judge fighting Abbott said.

That means if your child's in a car wreck, if your child has a congenital heart defect or something and needs an ICU bed, or more likely if they have COVID and need an ICU bed, we don't have one. Your child will wait for another child to die.

[PhaelixWW]

Yeah...1,000 deaths a day is gruesome. I'd be even more upset if we hadn't just learned Florida is responsible for 900 of them.

Uh, no. That 900 stretches back much longer than a week ago. Florida is "only" about 20-25% of the US death toll.

[beanman12345]

Uh, no. That 900 stretches back much longer than a week ago. Florida is "only" about 20-25% of the US death toll.

900 that they are reporting...

[Breccia]

Uh, no. That 900 stretches back much longer than a week ago.

Oh, right, how did I confuse their death count rising 900 in one day to 900 people dying in one day? It's hard to keep track when they keep hiding their deaths behind time travel, like a kid shoving his vegetables under his napkin so he doesn't have to eat them.

That said, 20-25% of the US death count for a state under 10% of the population isn't a selling point, either.

[PhaelixWW]

That said, 20-25% of the US death count for a state under 10% of the population isn't a selling point, either.

No, it absolutely is not.

You know what is, though?

CNN: President DeSantis? Florida voters say 'no.'

The voters who know Ron DeSantis best don't think he should run for president in 2024.

Six in 10 Florida voters said they would not like to see the state's Republican governor become a presidential candidate...

Oh, wait...

[Omega10]

There's also "why". Why would anyone come to Florida to work in medicine, now? Honestly, I'm looking for a dollar figure here. Medical professionals are front line workers and Florida is Normandy. What would you need to be paid to move there and work on the front lines? I'm a teacher, basically the second line in this context since Florida is doing in-person without a mask mandate. I can't imagine doing it for a price tag without "million" in it, and my family would question the move without an extra zero in there. Maybe I'm not the standard, but I also don't think Florida can afford seven or even six figures per nurse they want to relocate. I posted earlier they were down fifteen hundred medical personel. $100k each, that's $150 million dollars. To put that in perspective, that's Disneyland for a month.

Or, there could be nurses and such who have a lower price tag. I...hope they don't. The only thing worse than moving a nurse across the country to help people who are desperate to commit suicide, is when those people trying to commit suicide kill the nurse, and their families realize the nurse was killed for the price of a used car.

I suppose religious groups or the Red Cross or something could show up, but uh...they haven't yet. And for Florida to be saved by people used to treating the homeless, the helpless, the bottom of humanity's barrel? Yeah, DeSantis can put that on his 2024 posters.

You have about the right amount that would be needed. This is from Kansas, one of those "out-of-state" places that might have nurses willing to move to sunny Florida.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/covid-19-...122324046.html

Title: COVID-19 news: Hospitals in ‘bidding war’ over nurses, Kansas death may be 1st in U.S.

Relevant Excerpt:

Demand for travel nurses has skyrocketed as the COVID-19 case surge spawned by the delta variant is crushing hospitals across the U.S. And hospitals in Missouri and Kansas are angling to hire them as the number of nurses may determine how many patients can be treated at a given time.

The demand has driven the cost of hiring way up. Some jobs advertise pay of $5,600 per week; some nurses have heard they can make $10,000 or more.

$5.6k a week is... 5.6k x 52 = around $290k a year. Ok only a quarter million, but still in the right ball park. $10k a week is over a half a million a year.

The downside? Maintaining this level of intensity over 6 months or a year is very non-trivial.

[Poopymonster]

Considering that all other states are under pressure (not as bad as Florida, but still bad enough that they don't have nurses to spare) where are these additional nurses going to come from? Are they going to use (gasp) foreign nurses?

The cognitive dissonance could be large enough to be seen from space.

They'll ask those brave heroes to come together and do what is needed to help their fellow Americans.
I hope one gets asked and says "Oh, so we're going to administer the vaccine there? That's the best fucking thing we can do to help."
Then gets interviewed by the news.

[Breccia]

The downside? Maintaining this level of intensity over 6 months or a year is very non-trivial.

I've personally cited at least three articles about nurses and other staff quitting from sheer exhaustion. I've seen it with teachers -- the extra rules/changes/safeguards was a lot of work, more importantly a lot of new different work, and a fair number of teachers just decided they'd rather retire. And of course, it's not just me.

Nearly 30% of National Education Association members say the pandemic has led them to plan on leaving teaching earlier than expected. Almost all 50 states reported shortages for the 2020-2021 school year, according to the U.S. Department of Education.

[Dontrike]

I've personally cited at least three articles about nurses and other staff quitting from sheer exhaustion. I've seen it with teachers -- the extra rules/changes/safeguards was a lot of work, more importantly a lot of new different work, and a fair number of teachers just decided they'd rather retire. And of course, it's not just me.

My friend has his teaching license is glad he isn't working for any schools right now, though he has experience seeing other family deal with teaching elementary school. Don't blame him.

[Breccia]

Well, Abbott somehow found 2,500 medical personel willing to help Texas.

"You already posted that."

This is in addition to the 2800 from last week. He says the whole should arrive by Sept 30.

Abbott is also trying to open more monoclonal sites, get more equipment, and asked Texas to get the vaccine.

"Well, surely he asked for a mask mand--"

No. He's still fighting those.

"Why would he spend what must be hundreds of millions of taxpayer money to fight the pandemic, but oppose a mask mandate which is basically free?"

I still don't know. Generally speaking, people who are anti-mask would be anti-vaxxers and he's clearly pro-vaccine.

"Are Texas' actions going to yoink possible help from going to Florida?"

Almost certainly. There's only so many spare nurses (etc) to go around right now, and anyone willing to risk Florida's numbers will find Texas' numbers not as bad.

[swiftowner]

@Breccia nurses are in high demand everywhere. My wife recently got a raise, no need to argue for it, just hospitals throwing money out to help retain nurses. All the hospitals around here need nurses. They even bumped up her pay an additional $20/hr for when her contract renews (yes, in addition to the original raise she just got). She could still make more going out of state to the south where things are a lot worse… but she hasn’t decided to do that yet. Though if they are paying half a mil, I don’t think I could convince my wife not to go.

[Benggaul]

Thursday's report:

169,953 new cases; about 2k fewer than last week. Once all of the corrections roll in it will probably end up being more again, but the increases this week have been lower overall than last week, so that's at least a little encouraging.

Top 10:

Fuck Florida (over 21k according to worldometers).
Texas: 18,112 new cases; 275 deaths
California: 12,622 new cases; 110 deaths
Georgia: 10,823 new cases; 92 deaths
North Carolina: 8,620 new cases; 60 deaths
Tennessee: 6,673 new cases; 48 deaths
New York: 5,658 new cases; 34 deaths
Ohio: 5,395 new cases; no deaths reported
Kentucky: 5,334 new cases; 27 deaths
Louisiana: 5,131 new cases; 72 deaths

Nationally cases may appear down this time around, but you'll note the lowest on the top 10 is still over 5k and considering which states are hitting those marks that's a lot. The 7-day average in Florida makes it appear as though their cases have plateaued, but considering they hit a new record Wednesday I'd take that with a handful of skepticism. California, on the other hand, does actually appear to have things under control for the time being. We'll see if it stays that way. Fridays typically have higher totals in general. Meanwhile, positivity has jumped up to 23% in South Dakota. Gee, I wonder why. Florida is still above 20%.

1,215 deaths is about 50 more than last Thursday and brings the total to 651,956. This does not include the huge dump from Florida--their total for yesterday is listed as "8". Ahem. So let's put them in the number one spot anyway. Texas is catching up, closing in on 300 and California had just over 100. The 7-day average is just shy of 1k at 995 and it's expected to pass 1k with Friday's numbers.

Related news:

DeSantis' Anti-Mask Expert Was Asked in Court, 'What's an Acceptable Death Rate for Children?'--He responded with "What are the trade-offs?", so he automatically loses that argument in the minds of anyone with a heart or brain.

68 Florida Hospitals Could Run Out of Oxygen in Two Days Amid COVID Surge--As others have mentioned, ICUs are meant for a whole host of issues apart from COVID, so if they're full of COVID patients, anyone else with other serious problems is SOL. The same also goes for Oxygen.

Covid data disappearing in some states even amid delta surge--Not just a Florida thing. Georgia is also playing coy with their numbers.

Stay safe, folks.

[Breccia]

Though if they are paying half a mil, I don’t think I could convince my wife not to go.

First of all, glad your wife is getting the pay she deserves for putting up with this shit.

Half a million is life-changing money. That's "pay cash for house" money. Everyone has their own limit to how much they'd need to be paid to, let's face it, help the sick and dying -- it's not like she's stealing govt secrets or killing someone.

Whatever happens, I hope you two stay safe.

It doesn't surprise me at all that nurses and such are short everywhere. When states like Florida and Texas say things like "everything is under control, by the way we need several thousand nurses" it's not just the money and danger that's involved. It's that, well, where would you find several thousand available nurses? As you've said, the hazard pay is there and most people generally prefer to stay local.

It's not that I want the entire state of Florida to die, or even just the Trump supporters. But they've neglected the problem so long, that even if ten thousand nurses were to show up today, I don't know how much that'd affect the death count.

[Machismo]

First of all, glad your wife is getting the pay she deserves for putting up with this shit.

Half a million is life-changing money. That's "pay cash for house" money. Everyone has their own limit to how much they'd need to be paid to, let's face it, help the sick and dying -- it's not like she's stealing govt secrets or killing someone.

Whatever happens, I hope you two stay safe.

It doesn't surprise me at all that nurses and such are short everywhere. When states like Florida and Texas say things like "everything is under control, by the way we need several thousand nurses" it's not just the money and danger that's involved. It's that, well, where would you find several thousand available nurses? As you've said, the hazard pay is there and most people generally prefer to stay local.

It's not that I want the entire state of Florida to die, or even just the Trump supporters. But they've neglected the problem so long, that even if ten thousand nurses were to show up today, I don't know how much that'd affect the death count.

I think people are going to be very surprised at the Medicare costs that come out of all of this. Considering Florida is the Medicare fraud king, then I expect to see them try and push all these costs on the federal taxpayers. Or, if things get ultra dumb... the "state of emergency" plea for money.

[Breccia]

68 Florida Hospitals Could Run Out of Oxygen in Two Days Amid COVID Surge--As others have mentioned

And this is after some Florida cities have cut back on water treatment oxygen. Even that isn't enough. Why are their deaths so low, again? Oh, right, the blatant lying.

[Machismo]

And this is after some Florida cities have cut back on water treatment oxygen. Even that isn't enough. Why are their deaths so low, again? Oh, right, the blatant lying.

The most ridiculous thing is, that everyone knows they are lying, and just moves past it... and just compiles the data that Florida refuses to do. Sure, it takes about a week to fill in the blanks, but at least we have some idea as to exactly how badly they are lying.