Should raid difficulties and LFR be retuned and consolidated?

[Osmeric]

I thought it worked great. Those Flex raids were a lot of fun,

I meant the before the last tier of MoP, when Flex wasn't in there. There was LFR, Normal (= today's Heroic) and Heroic (= today's mythic). They tried to tune up LFR to be more difficult, approaching today's Normal, and it was a total clusterfuck.

[Soon-TM]

Add a solo mode where you play with NPCs.
No loot drops, just quest completion credit + maybe some transmog, mounts, pets.

Tune it like proving grounds and include all story relevant phases (no mythic only stories)

This is what LFR should be imo, a 'story mode' of sorts. Make Normal queuable, since the difficulty delta between current LFR and Normal is almost nonexistent, keep HC and Mythic as they are.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

Pretty sure that's what Normal reclears/Mythic dungeons are for, why would they settle for lower?

Domination gear (old tiersets) if fact i still have lfr pieces on my 3rd/4th alts that are 3/10M

[Kalocy Jim]

I can tell you that Blizzard has all that data, whether they share it with you or not.

They have said other times that the lower difficulties pay for the higher difficulties to exist.

Source????

[Feral Druid ist Op]

Not really a big difference, if the players quit. Designing the game for the top fringe of players is a ridiculous mistake they've had a hard time moving away from (and no, having lower difficulty levels doesn't mean the game design doesn't revolve around the top players.)

good that ppl like you have noting to say in blizz, destoying your loyal player base taht spends alot of moeney for race changes and server tanses. and your marketing (witch is twich/yourtube nowdays) is -iq move

[Niwes]

No to the LFR removal ! Strong no

LFR is great depending on your real life. I love WoW and I really like raids but I just can't handle to be in guilds anymore and I don't want to ruin random groups by leaving out of nowhere. In LFR I normally stay until the end, even if the group wipes some times but at least I can leave without beeing the exception. I just say why I leave and then leave with best wishes for the rest etc etc. And that is okay!

So killing LFR would kill raiding for such "hardcore casuals" like me

But I can't speak for normal or heroic. Maybe those two could be merged because the difference is not very big? No idea really. On the other hand why does it hurt to have them? I could imagine guilds that love to schedule but are really not at the top of their game and heroic could be too hard for them

it seems you dont often pug nhc and hc

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Domination gear (old tiersets) if fact i still have lfr pieces on my 3rd/4th alts that are 3/10M

you have alts doing 3/10 M and 10/10 HC and they have LFR pieces ? how the heck can this happen ?

[Pheraz]

it seems you dont often pug nhc and hc

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you have alts doing 3/10 M and 10/10 HC and they have LFR pieces ? how the heck can this happen ?

totally! never I think the last time was Bfa heroic warfronts for the awesome sets

apart from this only LFR and I really like it. Also most of the people are actually really nice, only sometimes there are some "i come from heroic and I am pro" people insulting others, really rare. Like... 1 out 20 or rarer.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

it seems you dont often pug nhc and hc

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you have alts doing 3/10 M and 10/10 HC and they have LFR pieces ? how the heck can this happen ?

you may ask blizz why my nerzul hemlet still didnt drop on hc for the 7th week and 3/10 are normal pugs on my server and ez to get into as a 10/10 player nothing special

[Niwes]

totally! never I think the last time was Bfa heroic warfronts for the awesome sets

apart from this only LFR and I really like it. Also most of the people are actually really nice, only sometimes there are some "i come from heroic and I am pro" people insulting others, really rare. Like... 1 out 20 or rarer.

yeah, i just asked that cause of

„and I don't want to ruin random groups by leaving out of nowhere“

thats really not a needed reason to stay in LFR. it happens as often in PUGs as in LFR. zero clue, what the diffrence here should be. but you sounded like it makes a difference in your mind. and therefore i asked, if you often join PUGs (otherwise you would not said that).

[agentsi]

Folks seem to forget why we have so many raid difficulties to begin with.

LFR is there because back when it was normal and heroic only, it was too hard for "A LOT" of the player-base to complete with or without a guild. From there, they made normal really easy, and flexible, and set heroic to 10 players only to try and force some of the player base to the easier content. It didn't work out great, so they found it easier to do the system we have now.

THere is a HUGE variance in the level of skill from players who do LFR to the players who raid Mythic. Then you have to factor into the equation how much time each player has to play the game, and do so while enjoying the raid and seeing all the content the game has to offer.

I think the idea of players playing with NPCs, to carry them through LFR is honestly a fantastic idea, and would fix a lot of the issues that currently plague LFR as a whole. So many folks are 100% worthless in there. Whether it's alts looking for a easy carry so they afk because they feel LFR is beneath them, to players who genuinely have no idea what they're doing, but still want to see the game. This fixes the problem for both groups. Who cares if it gets out gear, the gear is typically worse than World Quest gear, so let it go. Without titanforging being a thing, there is ZERO reason to run LFR ever, unless that is the only way you can see the raid.

Folks have to stop being so mean to each other and acting like elitest. Most of the players that play wow and visit these forums aren't top-tier mythic raiders. I bet most of them can't even clear normal, or heroic. My guild raids heroic one night a week, we have AOTC, then we spend the right of our time doing M+ or PvP. The group we run with have IOs of 2100-2400, so again, none of us are those players either, but slightly above average at best.

[Niwes]

you may ask blizz why my nerzul hemlet still didnt drop on hc for the 7th week and 3/10 are normal pugs on my server and ez to get into as a 10/10 player nothing special

i am not sure how your loot distribution looks like or if you ever read a class guide or simmed your character. it sounds like you overestiminate your socket way too much. i cant find any rational reason/situation in my mind, with vault, m+, 230 AH items and Korthia, that would give a reason for wearing an LFR helmet.

i do HC pugs and a lot of M+ on 3 chars every week and i inspect everyone (my small side hobby in wow). means: i saw A LOT of chracters and their items. and tbh: i didnt saw even 1 person wearing even 1 LFR item when in m+ higher 10-11 or in HC raid. cant remember a single one.

what i often see is some rather low trinket (often the PVP one) on specific specs. but i never saw what you mentioned.

i mean, LFR is 213 (and 220 for the last 2 bosses)? just looked at the stat weights of main stat (int, agi, str) and could not find any class this could hold against Korthia gear. even m+6 drops higher. so i dont get it.

so i am not sure what you are doing there. and if a sim, or guide, or maths would advice to do this. very crazy imo.

[MrLachyG]

Oh look, another thread about removing LFR.

there's 2 of them now. I swear they should just close these, they always go around in circles and are ultimately stupid as fuck

[Niwes]

there's 2 of them now. I swear they should just close these, they always go around in circles and are ultimately stupid as fuck

i cant say if i find them stupid as fuck or not. i just dont care. but i am sure as hell you can read EXACTLY the same stuff, in the mentioned 2 and the 16353677336 threads in the past.

but hey, everyday its groundhog day:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GncQtURdcE4

[Feral Druid ist Op]

so i am not sure what you are doing there. and if a sim, or guide, or maths would advice to do this. very crazy imo.

gj casual you baited me into wasting 5 mins of my time as a wr 50 raider i know how to sim unlike you

https://imgur.com/a/jjvRKEx thats the diffrence between a 233 m+ helmet and a lfr helmet

[Niwes]

gj casual you baited me into wasting 5 mins of my time as a wr 50 raider i know how to sim unlike you

https://imgur.com/a/jjvRKEx thats the diffrence between a 233 m+ helmet and a lfr helmet

hey no need to get offensive.

what i exactly see on that picture (since there are just icons) ?

btw: i dont say that this CAN happen. i just said i never saw that. to me its just crazy. but obviously, if you did all right, it CAN happen. just never saw that. i dont say i dont believe you. its just crazy to me, cause i never saw that happen.

whats your overall item level ? so i can rummage a bit around on warcraftlogs if i can find others. just out of pure curiousity. not to proof its wring or false. i believe you.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

hey no need to get offensive.

what i exactly see on that picture (since there are just icons) ?

btw: i dont say that this CAN happen. i just said i never saw that. to me its just crazy. but obviously, if you did all right, it CAN happen. just never saw that.

you see a unhoy bonus that gives almost raw 1k dps with a 213 item

[Niwes]

you see a unhoy bonus that gives almost raw 1k dps with a 213 item

- is the bonus on helmet ?
- or just 1 socket for bonus ?
- and you not have higher item with frost bonus on it (so you need to compare frost+mainstat against it) ?
- and you have no other item with socket for bonus ?
- whats your other items and gems? its hard to say without knowing your loot distribution

just asking…

if you did that with a „best in bags“ mecahnic it should be true. just saying that a sole look at the unholy bonus itself, without combining other things, can lead to wrong assumptions.

but i dont wanna waste your time. i am just curious.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

- is the bonus on helmet ?
- or just 1 socket for bonus ?
- and you not have higher item with frost bonus on it (so you need to compare frost+mainstat against it) ?
- and you have no other item with socket for bonus ?

just asking…

if you did that with a „best in bags“ mecahnic it should be true. just saying that a sole look at the unholy bonus itself, without combining other things, can lead to wrong assumptions.

but i dont wanna waste your time. i am just curious.

ma man i work with custom alps and sims since 2014 dont try that bs on me the diff btwn frost and unhonly is 600 dps on lvl 5, my frost shards are lvl2 so its even more than that, and yes my alt only has the helmet with the bonus on it

[TheRevenantHero]

No. Leave LFR alone.

[EntertainmentNihilist]

I know but some people are so keen on having difficulties removed and whatnot, LFR is - sadly - one of the needed difficulties as 'story mode', and Mythic isn't as needed, and if people wanted a challenge, you could add HMs to HCs to make it tougher if people are so eager to cut anything.

Having a "story mode" is needed. LFR isn't needed. There are multiple better ways to do it.