Biden / Harris Focused Discussion

[Draco-Onis]

Gerrymandering has nothing to do with the Electoral College.

I disagree because without gerrymandering the GOP would not have the power to enact voter suppression laws that enable them to win the electoral college. For example they wouldn't be able to stop hundreds of thousands of former convicts from voting, mail in voting would be more accessible the list goes on. The local politics have much greater impact than people give them credit for. The GOP foresaw their demise decades ago and have poured a ton of resources in local elections while democrats have been asleep at the wheel, it's clearly paid off.

[Beefhammer]

Ugh. People never seem to understand that the Wyoming rule would change next to nothing.

EDIT: I've expounded at length on the subject before, so let me crosspost this from just over a year ago:

What this does is just show raw data not what all the redistricting would/could be. With that many more districts, it becomes much easier for Dems to have gains and GOP to have losses because gerrymandering becomes more difficult to pull off in the manner the GOP is doing today and well has a more diverse representation of the populace. With a more diverse and truer representation, the willingness to vote from those disenfranchised goes up. Not to mention what the possibilities of better laws being passed.

Of course the raw data won't show that. However history shows that when there is more fairness and diversity, it doesn't play out well for the GOP. Point is, I would bet my life savings that if we followed the Wyoming rule, the GOP would 1, be a minority party in numbers, 2, not be as bat shit crazy, which leads to 3, a functioning congress.

[PhaelixWW]

What this does is just show raw data not what all the redistricting would/could be. With that many more districts, it becomes much easier for Dems to have gains and GOP to have losses because gerrymandering becomes more difficult to pull off in the manner the GOP is doing today

Uh, not really. It just means more redistricting, not that the redistricting itself becomes significantly more difficult.

And it doesn't matter at all how individual districts vote when it comes to the Electoral College.

Point is, I would bet my life savings that if we followed the Wyoming rule, the GOP would 1, be a minority party in numbers, 2, not be as bat shit crazy, which leads to 3, a functioning congress.

Then you'd lose your life savings, sorry to say.

1) The GoP is already a minority party when it comes to voters, but it's not a minority party when it comes to state legislatures. The Wyoming rule wouldn't change that, no matter how much you think it might.

2) Also, I'm not sure very many people are willing to believe that the GoP wouldn't still be batshit crazy even with the Wyoming rule.

3) See #1 and #2.

[Beefhammer]

Uh, not really. It just means more redistricting, not that the redistricting itself becomes significantly more difficult.

And it doesn't matter at all how individual districts vote when it comes to the Electoral College.



Then you'd lose your life savings, sorry to say.

1) The GoP is already a minority party when it comes to voters, but it's not a minority party when it comes to state legislatures. The Wyoming rule wouldn't change that, no matter how much you think it might.

2) Also, I'm not sure very many people are willing to believe that the GoP wouldn't still be batshit crazy even with the Wyoming rule.

3) See #1 and #2.

You keep mentioning the EC as If I don't know what it is. Redistricting would be more difficult with that many more seats, you can have tendrills from districts reaching across multiple counties like that any more. Districts would be more localized and candidates would reflect their communities more so, meaning they would have to actually represent them. Unlike now where you have some where the rich white districts that harbor 40% poor black communities only have to cater to the rich white 60%.

Remember, you are looking at this through today's glasses. HoR continously grew from inception to 1929. If the cap was never put in place, things would be very different. That's my perspective.

Again no shit they are a minority party, yet they still hold the majority of legislatures and governorships in the country despite that. They rely on the 1929 cap, suppression, and disenfranchisement laws to hold any power. My whole point is, if things stayed the way the were supposed to be as designed the GOP wouldn't matter at all. They are only bat shit crazy because of the disproportionate way things are. Enforcing the Wyoming rule and removing the cap would be a way to help reverse that.

[Ripster42]

You keep mentioning the EC as If I don't know what it is.

That's because you said:

If things were fair, like proportional representation according to the Wyoming rule, the GOP would never hold the office of the president.

He's specifically talking to that point. He's not talking about your federal house reps. He's talking about your claim about who is president. The wyoming rule, as he showed, wouldn't have affected who is president.

[Fugus]

Wyoming Rule wouldn't have a huge impact on who becomes president but would be a step in the right direction and have minor impacts on the lower houses.

The problem with the president comes from "Winner Take All" where winning by 51% is no worse than winning by 99% because the rest of the state can screw off so you can end up with situations where the majority overall gets told to screw off due to a few heavily polarized areas which is made even worse by our First Past the Post system that effectively makes it impossible 3rd parties from being viable and any that forms just poaches from the party they are most like making it easier for the least wanted party to win.

And voter disenfranchisement which is driven at the local level and made worse through gerrymandering which allows them to screw the nation from the ground level up.

[Beefhammer]

That's because you said:



He's specifically talking to that point. He's not talking about your federal house reps. He's talking about your claim about who is president. The wyoming rule, as he showed, wouldn't have affected who is president.

My original point was about fairness including, Wyoming, gerrymandering, and voter suppression. He latched on to the Wyoming rule. This was just a continuation, of that point. I know the EC has nothing to do with proportional representation of house districts.

[fwc577]

Man... Wasn't Newsom supposed to barely win that recall but whalloped the competition by nearly 30 points? That's not good for Republicans that hope for upcoming depressed Democratic turnout.

[Breccia]

Man... Wasn't Newsom supposed to barely win that recall but whalloped the competition by nearly 30 points?

I'd been watching polls off and on, I believe things changed over the last few months. However I don't remember seeing any prediction lower than 58%, at least, not recently.

Each time the Party of Trump tries "we don't like the results of the election so we'll force a change" more and more people are getting tired of it. Claims of fraud aren't coming to pass, to the point that the AZ GOP Senate are turning away from their own recount. The murderous insurrection didn't work, with the upcoming rally being met with low crowds and Trump disdain. The California recall was based on a paper-thin excuse, and Newsom won the recall by more then he won in 2018. And the GOP was claiming the recall was rigged even before votes were cast.

Soon after the recall race was announced in early July, the embers of 2020 election denialism ignited into new false claims on right-wing news sites and social media channels. This vote, too, would supposedly be “stolen,” with malfeasance ranging from deceptively designed ballots to nefariousness by corrupt postal workers.

As a wave of recent polling indicated that Mr. Newsom was likely to brush off his Republican challengers, the baseless allegations accelerated. Larry Elder, a leading Republican candidate, said he was “concerned” about election fraud. The Fox News commentators Tomi Lahren and Tucker Carlson suggested that wrongdoing was the only way Mr. Newsom could win. And Trump predicted that it would be “a rigged election.”

There have been no lawsuits yet attacking California's results, and I think Powell is why not. There's "throwing yourself on the sword" and there's "watching someone else get stabbed to death, wheezing and gasping and coughing up blood as their life spills onto the ground in a spreading red-brown puddle and the light in their eyes fades forever and saying 'I want in on that action, the blade is slightly duller now so it'll hurt more!' "

It turns out, standing in the corner screaming "BUT I WANNA! I WANNA I WANNA I WANNA!" and then sobbing hysterically isn't making any friends. And I hope, in 2022, anyone who backed any of these pathetic and/or fraudulent movements has it thrown back in their face. These actions need to have consequences, and the proven Party of Trump trend of "we only lose if they cheat" when they're a proven minority needs to cost them.

[Shadowferal]

US to buy hundreds of millions more vaccine doses for the world: report

The Biden administration is planning to buy hundreds of millions more Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine doses to share with the world, The Washington Post reported on Friday.

The reported move comes ahead of the U.N. General Assembly next week, where boosting vaccine access in lower-income countries will be a focus. The Post reported that the White House will also be hosting a virtual summit on global vaccinations next week, alongside the meeting.

--------

A good move to help soothe some feelings at the U.N.

[Edge-]

A good move to help soothe some feelings at the U.N.

Also just good overall, including economically. Sure developed nations benefit from hogging the vaccines...to a point, but the interruption in supply chains and markets (both raw material and finished goods) from the pandemic still hurts. Developed nations need to fund vaccination programs for the rest of the world if we want to get through this as quickly as possible while minimizing economic damage.

[Shadowferal]

Also just good overall, including economically.

Yea.. I was looking at a pissed France and the AUKUS deal.

[D Luniz]

Senate Republicans say they will vote to allow a debt default, leaving Democrats scrambling for plan to avert economic crisis

has this EVER worked out for the GOP? I get their base loves it (in theory, till the economic issues bleeds to them)
but everyone else just gets pissed off at them for this shit.

[Benggaul]

Senate Republicans say they will vote to allow a debt default, leaving Democrats scrambling for plan to avert economic crisis

has this EVER worked out for the GOP? I get their base loves it (in theory, till the economic issues bleeds to them)
but everyone else just gets pissed off at them for this shit.

I don't remember it working out so well for Trump when he let it go. It's a bold move, Cotton.

[Draco-Onis]

Senate Republicans say they will vote to allow a debt default, leaving Democrats scrambling for plan to avert economic crisis

has this EVER worked out for the GOP? I get their base loves it (in theory, till the economic issues bleeds to them)
but everyone else just gets pissed off at them for this shit.

Yet another reason to end the filibuster and make this whole thing automatic, the debt ceiling has nothing to do with the budget. This is a silly political football both parties use and it has no logic in even existing.

[CostinR]

Yea.. I was looking at a pissed France and the AUKUS deal.

Yeah who cares? I think these last few months with Biden as president really have shown who around here who actually cares about these kind of issues and who over the last few years have used foreign policy affairs just as a chance to smear Trump at every turn, when of those "disasters" of diplomacy during the Trump era...genuinely didn't matter.

The French recalling their ambassador is a fairly enormous deal and shows just how furious they are. They did just lose a lot of money and a strategic partnership with Australia and the way they lost these things also pisses them off greatly. If this had happened under Trump we'd have gotten a 50+ page thread already discussing how Trump is bringing an end to America...since it happened under Biden...well who gives a shit he's the democrat president.

As for the issue at hand: It's a pretty big deal to have Australia gaining nuclear powered submarines build by the US and UK and shows where the situation is heading in Asia. The French getting angry at that? Well they've lost what they assumed would be a gateway into Asia and will play a diminished role.

Yet another reason to end the filibuster and make this whole thing automatic, the debt ceiling has nothing to do with the budget. This is a silly political football both parties use and it has no logic in even existing.

If the democrats want to end the debt celling they can do so with reconciliation without even touching the filibuster.

[Breccia]

Well it's bad news for Donald Trump and his Justice for J6 rally friends, such as Davy Cockup pictured earlier.

About four hundred people showed. They arrived to find the police and National Guard there nearly equal to their own numbers. The crowd was so small, people thought it was Trump's inauguration. Which is how we got to this point in the first place, actually.

Also, one dumb fuck showed up with a gun and got arrested. A second dumb fuck showed up with a knife and got arrested. And two more showed up with warrants out for their arrest for something we've been saying for weeks would have unusually high police turnout. Seriously, one of the warrants was for illegally owning a gun, in Texas. How dumb to you have to be, not only to be an illegal gun owner in Texas, but then travel across the country to where the most vigilant cops on the planet were spending their weekend? Even by Trump supporters, this is bottom of the barrel stuff.

Just so we're clear, we don't have any information yet about the people that were arrested and what their political affiliations are. So it would be completely unfair for me to simply assume they were Trump supporters, based on their substandard intelligence level, coming from Texas, and owning guns.

(or would it...)

Also also:

On Saturday, that’s a setup. If people don’t show up they’ll say, ‘Oh, it’s a lack of spirit.’ And if people do show up they’ll be harassed.

-- Donald Trump, as some of you quoted, a few days ago after praising the rally in all caps

People didn't show up. It was a lack of spirit.

-- Breccia

[D Luniz]

Yeah who cares? I think these last few months with Biden as president really have shown who around here who actually cares about these kind of issues and who over the last few years have used foreign policy affairs just as a chance to smear Trump at every turn, when of those "disasters" of diplomacy during the Trump era...genuinely didn't matter.

The French recalling their ambassador is a fairly enormous deal and shows just how furious they are. They did just lose a lot of money and a strategic partnership with Australia and the way they lost these things also pisses them off greatly. If this had happened under Trump we'd have gotten a 50+ page thread already discussing how Trump is bringing an end to America...since it happened under Biden...well who gives a shit he's the democrat president.

As for the issue at hand: It's a pretty big deal to have Australia gaining nuclear powered submarines build by the US and UK and shows where the situation is heading in Asia. The French getting angry at that? Well they've lost what they assumed would be a gateway into Asia and will play a diminished role.

a lot of the silence is we don't know exactly whats going on. Biden isn't on Twitter bragging about how France was screwing us, and so we need to screw them. Plus, this is as much Aus pissing them off as well.

Id like to know how much more than "the US stole my sale" this is before going on it. But if you want to try and defend Trump's admin with this, you do you.

If the democrats want to end the debt celling they can do so with reconciliation without even touching the filibuster.

you're forgetting Manchin and Sinama(sp?) would happily vote no.

- - - Updated - - -

*snip*

So guess theyll need ANOTHER rally to support the "political prisoners" of this rally?

[Kaleredar]

Well it's bad news for Donald Trump and his Justice for J6 rally friends, such as Davy Cockup pictured earlier.

About four hundred people showed. They arrived to find the police and National Guard there nearly equal to their own numbers. The crowd was so small, people thought it was Trump's inauguration. Which is how we got to this point in the first place, actually.

Also, one dumb fuck showed up with a gun and got arrested. A second dumb fuck showed up with a knife and got arrested. And two more showed up with warrants out for their arrest for something we've been saying for weeks would have unusually high police turnout. Seriously, one of the warrants was for illegally owning a gun, in Texas. How dumb to you have to be, not only to be an illegal gun owner in Texas, but then travel across the country to where the most vigilant cops on the planet were spending their weekend? Even by Trump supporters, this is bottom of the barrel stuff.

Just so we're clear, we don't have any information yet about the people that were arrested and what their political affiliations are. So it would be completely unfair for me to simply assume they were Trump supporters, based on their substandard intelligence level, coming from Texas, and owning guns.

(or would it...)

Also also:


-- Donald Trump, as some of you quoted, a few days ago after praising the rally in all caps


-- Breccia

Hey, if the whole idiotic "rally" resulted in getting four dangerous people arrested before they could harm anyone, then... I guess it was "worthwhile?"

[Calfredd]

That's a whole lot of crazy.

With a name like "LiberalDemon" he's not being very subtle.