Some Flirts and Jokes Removed on the PTR, Fathom Dweller Available in NA, DLC #791

[qwerty123456]

The content of the story and the content of the game aren't on the same spectrum. It doesn't have to be all of one or nothing of another. This binary thought process is precisely why these changes are controversial (and also precisely why they shouldn't be).

There is literally a species of Half Ogres born from rape in game. Theres a literal road of the bones of thousands of Draenei in game. If you get offended by a joke then this shit should have offended you waaaaayyyyyy earlier. You don't play a game with a mature storyline and expect only carebear jokes. Those jokes are on a much lighter spectrum than the game and yet your ok with far worse shit. It's like you are watching a torture gore sfm porn set in the Warhammer universe and are bitching because the creator put in a slightly racist Chinese joke.

If this was hello kitty island adventure then I could see your point.

[Menog]

There are plenty of people still subscribed to the game not spending hours of their day trying to prove to the world the importance of their opinion. I'd wager paying customers are probably more valuable than those who are terminally dissatisfied with everything they do or don't do.

"Plenty" hahaha subs are probably on the lowest it has ever been. And sure they are way more valuable. Thats not the point. And if the game is so good why are you wasting your time here white knighting for a bilion dollar company like your chill buddy taliesin? atleast tali is fighting for hes paycheck. What are you fighting for? Want a pat on the back for being woke? hahaha

[Relapses]

"Plenty" hahaha subs are probably on the lowest it has ever been. And sure they are way more valuable. Thats not the point. And if the game is so good why are you wasting your time here white knighting for a bilion dollar company like your chill buddy taliesin? atleast tali is fighting for hes paycheck. What are you fighting for? Want a pat on the back for being woke? hahaha

I'm expressing my opinions and defending them. The fact that I believe the people making the video game deserve to have their wishes respected doesn't mean that I'm trying to cash in a paycheck from Blizzard.

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There is literally a species of Half Ogres born from rape in game. Theres a literal road of the bones of thousands of Draenei in game. If you get offended by a joke then this shit should have offended you waaaaayyyyyy earlier. You don't play a game with a mature storyline and expect only carebear jokes. Those jokes are on a much lighter spectrum than the game and yet your ok with far worse shit. It's like you are watching a torture gore sfm porn set in the Warhammer universe and are bitching because the creator put in a slightly racist Chinese joke.

If this was hello kitty island adventure then I could see your point.

Again, you're comparing two different things and expecting equality at the cost of everything else. It's not a zero sum game. The developers can change aspects of the game which make them uncomfortable without needing to change everything else.

[qwerty123456]

I'm expressing my opinions and defending them. The fact that I believe the people making the video game deserve to have their wishes respected doesn't mean that I'm trying to cash in a paycheck from Blizzard.

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Again, you're comparing two different things and expecting equality at the cost of everything else. It's not a zero sum game. The developers can change aspects of the game which make them uncomfortable without needing to change everything else.

Yes one is vastly more disturbing and offensive and yet you are crying about a joke of something that pretty much everyone does or is capable of doing.

[Dacia Ultan]

Yes one is vastly more disturbing and offensive and yet you are crying about a joke of something that pretty much everyone does or is capable of doing.

Did I miss something? Because as far as I can tell: @Relapses hasn't been "crying," literally (not that you'd know) or figuratively, at all.

Also: there's a difference between a fictional story element—no matter how grim—and something that affects people in real life. I have no idea if the removed lines and emotes have any connection to the latter—and, as things currently stand, consider their removal kind of irrelevant and pointless—but: seriously? The only figurative "crying" I've seen from anyone has been from people yelling about "woke culture" and "puritanism," making snide insinuations about the people responsible, and so on.

[qwerty123456]

Did I miss something? Because as far as I can tell: @Relapses hasn't been "crying," literally (not that you'd know) or figuratively, at all.

Also: there's a difference between a fictional story element—no matter how grim—and something that affects people in real life. I have no idea if the removed lines and emotes have any connection to the latter—and, as things currently stand, consider their removal kind of irrelevant and pointless—but: seriously? The only figurative "crying" I've seen from anyone has been from people yelling about "woke culture" and "puritanism," making snide insinuations about the people responsible, and so on.

The jokes are fictional as well. They apparently said they were removing them to be more inclusive even though one of the jokes removed was the male blood elf saying Don't you wish your girlfriend was hot like me? And the removal of stuff is never makes anything inclusive, you add if you want to be inclusive. If you think black blood elves is something the game needs to be inclusive to the people who role play themselves as black blood elves in real life you don't remove blood elves from the game you make some fucking black blood elf skins. You worried that disabled people don't have any representation in your game you don't remove the models and switch the game from third to first person mode with invisible hands in case people with a missing limb get offended you add some models with disabilities.

When you try and defend the removal of almost completely harmless jokes except to the most fragile of people in a game with very dark topics like rape and mass genocide then yes you are crying.

[DarkAmbient]

You really don't see how you're conflating your singular opinion on the matter with that of the entire development team's whose choice these changes were. Nobody cares if you think it's pointless. That's not the discussion topic here.

Again, you are just making stuff up. The topic is in the thread title and my responses are entirely on topic. You don't get to float around the thread trying to invalidate people's opinions just because you disagree. Claiming that "no-one cares" about my opinion whilst offering your own in multiple posts is comically arrogant to say the least. And neither you nor anyone else has demonstrated how these changes are in any way a solution to anything that's actually occurring.

[Relapses]

Again, you are just making stuff up. The topic is in the thread title and my responses are entirely on topic. You don't get to float around the thread trying to invalidate people's opinions just because you disagree. Claiming that "no-one cares" about my opinion whilst offering your own in multiple posts is comically arrogant to say the least. And neither you nor anyone else has demonstrated how these changes are in any way a solution to anything that's actually occurring.

You know, deliberately refusing to read the words I'm writing so you can go off on some weird ass tangent about opinions is getting kind of old. Take care, friend.

[DarkAmbient]

Yet again you resort to dishonesty as a method of evasion. I guess you really had nothing substantive to offer after all.

Did I miss something? Because as far as I can tell: @Relapses hasn't been "crying," literally (not that you'd know) or figuratively, at all.

Also: there's a difference between a fictional story element—no matter how grim—and something that affects people in real life. I have no idea if the removed lines and emotes have any connection to the latter—and, as things currently stand, consider their removal kind of irrelevant and pointless—but: seriously? The only figurative "crying" I've seen from anyone has been from people yelling about "woke culture" and "puritanism," making snide insinuations about the people responsible, and so on.

'Crying' and 'yelling' are both terms people use to mischaracterise views they disagree with...

[DingDongKing]

It's comical that you're talking about dishonesty, evasion and nothing really substantive.

All the while talking about 'emergerd woke' 'mrrngh inclusivity bad'.

[DarkAmbient]

It's comical that you're talking about dishonesty, evasion and nothing really substantive.

All the while talking about 'emergerd woke' 'mrrngh inclusivity bad'.

What's funny is that you had to lie and misrepresent me in order to criticise me for accusing someone else of being dishonest.

[DingDongKing]

What's funny is that you had to lie and misrepresent me in order to criticise me for accusing someone else of being dishonest.

The notion that 'inclusivity' is a reasonable alternative to anything doesn't really hold water.

Okay, mate. You keep at it.

[DarkAmbient]

Okay, mate. You keep at it.

Seems like you didn't follow the conversation, or your reading comprehension failed you. I was replying to Relapse's notion that inclusivity was a reasonable justification for making changes to things that weren't actually excluding anyone, not stating 'mrrngh inclusivity bad' as you put it.

These conversations would be better for everyone if people responded to things that have actually been said...

[Delever]

People like relapses and dacia make me thank the universe ever day for not being born in America. Imagine having such a puritan view of the world.

[DingDongKing]

Seems like you didn't follow the conversation, or your reading comprehension failed you. I was replying to Relapse's notion that inclusivity was a reasonable justification for making changes that weren't actually excluding anyone, not stating 'mrrngh inclusivity bad' as you put it.

These conversations would be better for everyone if people responded to things that have actually been said...

- If the goal of removing this content is to make players less toxic, it will not work.
- If the goal of removing the content is to make people uncomfortable with the content more comfortable, then it will work.

So...the inclusivity element does work. You were saying?

[Mormonius]

- If the goal of removing this content is to make players less toxic, it will not work.
- If the goal of removing the content is to make people uncomfortable with the content more comfortable, then it will work.

So...the inclusivity element does work. You were saying?

They probably exclude some category of people with the change. Can you then say it is for inclusion when you exchange one group for another?

[DarkAmbient]

- If the goal of removing this content is to make players less toxic, it will not work.
- If the goal of removing the content is to make people uncomfortable with the content more comfortable, then it will work.

So...the inclusivity element does work. You were saying?

Who are these people who are supposedly uncomfortable with the content to the point that quest/item names made them feel excluded? I certainly have never encountered them in game, nor have I seen much if any evidence of such people on any WoW-related media. Honestly, have you? It was a problem that didn't exist, except in the minds of a group of developers who seem detached from reality as far as this particular issue goes, going by what they've said on Twitter.

[DingDongKing]

Who are these people who are supposedly uncomfortable with the content to the point that quest/item names made them feel excluded? I certainly have never encountered them in game, nor have I seen much if any evidence of such people on any WoW-related media. Honestly, have you? It was a problem that didn't exist, except in the minds of a group of developers who seem detached from reality as far as this particular issue goes, going by what they've said on Twitter.

I've spoken to a few people who found the jokes off-colour and not representative of the game. So fair enough. Removing these games is not an indictment of other players in the game, nor does it drastically alter the experience of the game, so why does it bother you so much?

You're more intent on going on about how people are 'detached from reality' or 'excluding people'. You do you. My original point stands.

[DarkAmbient]

Your original response to me was a misrepresentation, so that stands for nothing. But when it comes to the actual topic, I simply disagree that the stated reasons given for these changes make any sense. And although it obviously doesn't affect the game mechanically, the sanitisation of the game by a small bunch of puritans doesn't actually improve it, and in fact removes part of what gave the game its character.

[DingDongKing]

Your original response to me was a misrepresentation, so that stands for nothing. But when it comes to the actual topic, I simply disagree that the stated reasons given for these changes make any sense. And although it obviously doesn't affect the game mechanically, the sanitisation of the game by a small bunch of puritans doesn't actually improve it, and in fact removes part of what gave the game its character.

If removing bad taste content - I don't care, but enough people want it gone - affects your gameplay experience, maybe you should develop some empathy. You're being selfish at that point. Because like you said, it's not essential component of the game, it's just 'I want it this way'.

So it still stands.