Is D2R the best ARPG in the last 10 years?

[Kalocy Jim]

Yeah i am aware the endgame is to make your character as efficient as possible, that's what i meant by having to create the complexity or more accurately the difficulty yourself. Having to have done that already i'm not finding it that appealing to do again, while modern games usually have some new bosses or dungeons to complete that keep ramping up which i find more appealing.

I see. Yeah I can get behind what you are saying. I think it would be very good of Blizzard to add content to D2R especially since the OG D2 is still functional and works just fine on battle net and single player / modded.

I think the resurrected game can give Blizzard some of the freedom to change / add to / improve the game without having any significant backlash from purists because the original game is still in tact.

It was harder for Blizzard to change or do #somechanges to the classic WoW game because there was no other option to play classic wow other than illegal private servers. Its not like that at all for Diablo 2 because both games exist simultaneously.

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I prefer 3 too, i got a refund for d2r...

waiting for D4..

I have little to no respect for people who play a game, get several hours of entertainment out of it, and then refund it and get their money back after having played the game for several hours. Its just scummy in my opinion.

[Ygg]

No. As much as i loved d2 back in the days, I now find the endgame pretty boring.

[chiddie]

Yeah definitely, build is one thing, but I mostly always just looked at character progression in terms of items. It's like in WoW, if you are a Warlock, you basically have 3 "builds", more or less viable. Then the bulk of your character progression comes from the stuff you wear. In D2R you can have theoretically infinite respecs, you can combine rare drops from Hell bosses to get a respec token.

Yes, but you have to get to hell difficulty before getting respecs. What if in the meantime you messed horribly with your build? I mean, EVERY single website says “whatever you wanna play in the end, roll a Blizz Sorc first, level it to Hell and then start providing stuff for the chars you wanna play”. Never read such a disclaimer for D3.

Gameplay wise as I said I like them both, I just find D3 a little more flexible.

[themortalgod]

I got bored of it after 2 weeks. Sadly the balance is just terrible and there is no real use for the gear you grind.

This pretty much defines D2 for me. I played it when LoD was new for many years and countless hours. It was amazing for its time and forever changed the course of gaming but by today's standards, it is severely primitive. I love it for the experience it was, when it was new(ish) but trying to compare it to more modern titles is silly.

The entire D2 gameplay loop is: "Grind gear to become more powerful to grind gear faster", your gear really has no purpose. Eventually they added uber tristram but (is that a thing in D2R?) even that was less about having a powerful character and more about being able to offset the insane regen the final boss had so most builds just couldn't kill it.

On top of that, combat gameplay was insanely simplistic. I remember most of my gameplay experience was teleport into mob of enemies then spam whatever dps skill my build used (hammers, whirlwind, etc) until the mob was dead. No resource management, no rotations, no cooldowns, etc. Tactics weren't a thing. Just don't get hit by threats and AOE like a champ. Occasionally hit "w" to switch to your CTA and refresh your BA.

I don't mean this as a dig at D2, generally speaking. As aforementioned, it was amazing for the time. I put north of 2000 hours into that game and loved it at the time. It just doesn't hold up to modern ARPGs.

D3 RoS is just wildly superior gameplay loop. Your gear has a purpose (pushing into harder and harder rifts) and combat gameplay is varied and much more tactical. I loved both games for years though so hard to stay X is better than Y so much as both were amazing for their era.

Personally, my favorite ARPG in the last decade has been Darksiders: Genesis. I had so much fun playing that game, though its a very different experience. You play through it once and are pretty much done since it leans into puzzle-solving and exploration more than most ARPGs.

[chiddie]

I realize I ask the impossible; Blizzard shut down the studio that made the game and basically alienated the developers that made them millions; they really had nobody left that could make any significant additions to the game. There's no doubt that continued support would have been profitable for D2, similar to Windows, MMOs, etc. D2 had the popularity and playerbase for longevity, but that opportunity was effectively squandered when suits decided to cut loose everyone that made that success possible.

I'd like to imagine a world where D2 wasn't abandoned like it was, that's a game I would be interested watching evolve and grow with the community.

I'm glad Vicarious Visions was able to accomplish what they have with the game, yet I feel they need more freedom in developing it further into something better.

I agree for the concept, but D2 graphics got old quite fast, support it would have meant do what VV did for the Res version more than 10 years ago. No games get complete overhaul graphic side during post launch, companies prefer just build a new game with a new engine and sell it again full price.

Most things we got in GTAIV/V could have been put in Vice City but they didn’t because it was not convenient.

Even the beloved PoE is getting a sequel after 8 years of support. It’s just how games industry works.

[Grax]

I read or watched nothing, outside of a few forum posts, about D2R until I had the game in my hands. I was looking forward to playing D2 without the rubberbanding and maybe some of the general clunkiness smoothed out, with all the gameplay intact. And guess what: VV was so good at their job, it's all still there. Having to drag and drop every inventory item, moronic companion AI, and odd somewhat sticky cursor behavior. I'm at a loss as to why everyone is praising them for "overlaying new graphics on the old engine" or whatever it was they did; what they actually did was the cheapest, easiest way to get it out the door (at ActiBlizz's behest, I know).

I'm surprisingly disappointed, although enjoying playing.

[Vespian]

Yes, but you have to get to hell difficulty before getting respecs. What if in the meantime you messed horribly with your build? I mean, EVERY single website says “whatever you wanna play in the end, roll a Blizz Sorc first, level it to Hell and then start providing stuff for the chars you wanna play”. Never read such a disclaimer for D3.

Gameplay wise as I said I like them both, I just find D3 a little more flexible.

You don't.

Did anyone in this thread actually play D2?

[Triceron]

I read or watched nothing, outside of a few forum posts, about D2R until I had the game in my hands. I was looking forward to playing D2 without the rubberbanding and maybe some of the general clunkiness smoothed out, with all the gameplay intact. And guess what: VV was so good at their job, it's all still there. Having to drag and drop every inventory item, moronic companion AI, and odd somewhat sticky cursor behavior. I'm at a loss as to why everyone is praising them for "overlaying new graphics on the old engine" or whatever it was they did; what they actually did was the cheapest, easiest way to get it out the door (at ActiBlizz's behest, I know).

I'm surprisingly disappointed, although enjoying playing.

Because if you noticed from the shitshow that was Reforged, this is exactly what fans were asking for and not to try and change stuff while fucking up every feature and then some, with no way to ever play the original again (legitimately online, that is)

D2R stays true to D2 while adding some much needed QoL. Whether they choose to splinter off beyond that now that a remake is done is really up to them, and it's better in the form of content updates or additional content rather than something significantly changed up front. And for what it is, the remaster seems pretty good as a remaster, and deserves its praise.

[chiddie]

You don't.

Did anyone in this thread actually play D2?

I only quoted the dude who said that. I’m still level 10 in D2R, last time I played D2 was probably 20 years ago, sorry if I don’t remember well

I didn’t even remember runewords, when I saw them in the guides I thought “wtf is this? Was it there 20 years ago?”.

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Because if you noticed from the shitshow that was Reforged, this is exactly what fans were asking for and not to try and change stuff while fucking up every feature and then some, with no way to ever play the original again (legitimately online, that is)

D2R stays true to D2 while adding some much needed QoL. Whether they choose to splinter off beyond that now that a remake is done is really up to them, and it's better in the form of content updates or additional content rather than something significantly changed up front. And for what it is, the remaster seems pretty good as a remaster, and deserves its praise.

I also think that looking it only “remaster side” it’s nothing less than an excellent remaster.

People who expected something else have their reasons but Blizzard didn’t lie this time: it’s D2 with a new surcoat.

[Triceron]

I only quoted the dude who said that. I’m still level 10 in D2R, last time I played D2 was probably 20 years ago, sorry if I don’t remember well

I didn’t even remember runewords, when I saw them in the guides I thought “wtf is this? Was it there 20 years ago?”.

Runewords were added in Lord of Destruction.

And respecs are granted by Akara after Den of Evil in each difficulty, so it's available since the very first quest, not Hell difficulty.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

lol No are you kidding?

[Gadzooks]

I mean you didn't offer any real criticism of D2 here except that you implied that you like faster paced games and D2 can go at a slower pace depending on your build and skill level.

It's like complaining about the mechanics of Pac-Man in one of the many Pac-Man remasters. Older more limited games are what they are, it doesn't mean older games are bad games and that you should "move on" and never re-play them. It just means games improve over the decades and newer games are better.

I wasn't trying to offer criticism, I don't have a single problem with D2R outside of my own experience. As a game, it's great.

The point was that it's a fine game, and there are other fine games, but there's a group of try hards who fetishize the game to ridiculous degrees.

[Triceron]

I wasn't trying to offer criticism, I don't have a single problem with D2R outside of my own experience. As a game, it's great.

The point was that it's a fine game, and there are other fine games, but there's a group of try hards who fetishize the game to ridiculous degrees.

To be fair, does it really matter if a group of try hards who fetishize the game exists?

Just as you wish to move on, what if you also chose not to, and put the game on a pedestal? Would it be a wrong choice to have? I don't think you'd consider that either, and you seem fairly sensible about having that freedom of choice and expression. You can be a casual fan or a die-hard fan, and either way whoever considers D2(R) the best ARPG ever made is purely up to subjective opinion.

[Cracked]

Runewords were added in Lord of Destruction.

And respecs are granted by Akara after Den of Evil in each difficulty, so it's available since the very first quest, not Hell difficulty.

Yeah my comment was specifically about the "inifnite" part. Akara will only give max of 3 respecs to any character.

[PC2]

I wasn't trying to offer criticism, I don't have a single problem with D2R outside of my own experience. As a game, it's great.

The point was that it's a fine game, and there are other fine games, but there's a group of try hards who fetishize the game to ridiculous degrees.

Nah nobody here is fetishizing the game. Normal people who like playing games and Diablo are just trying to enjoy an old game without a bunch of crazy angry people constantly harping about it being an outdated flawed game.

If Vicarious Vision actually did make a huge mistake then constant criticism would be valid but their mistakes were just small things that aren't even set in stone.

[Th3Scourge]

D2R is shit.

It's a significantly less polished version of D2, just with QoL features that mods like Plugy already do.

You can tell it's not a blizzard product, the animations feel janky, some of the sounds don't fit, the models are garbage. And I'm not even getting into the fact that somehow the world of 2000/2001 was a less censorious time than now. THAT is saying something.

Seeing all the content and hype around D2R made me go back and play D2 again, and it is the FAR superior game. Some things are just best left alone.

[Wigermo]

I mean it got a palace with a harem, how is it not the best

[Th3Scourge]

I mean it got a palace with a harem, how is it not the best

Except the harem is empty now. They removed any and all dead harem girls from said harem in D2R.

So now when Jaren says

"Screams echoed up the stairwells from the harem. My guards arrived to find the poor girls being slaughtered by a merciless band of hell-spawned demons. My brave guardsmen tried to push the demons back into the mysterious rift from which they came"

, you go into the palace harem to investigate, lo and behold.. no slaughtered harem girls

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

To be fair, does it really matter if a group of try hards who fetishize the game exists?

Just as you wish to move on, what if you also chose not to, and put the game on a pedestal? Would it be a wrong choice to have? I don't think you'd consider that either, and you seem fairly sensible about having that freedom of choice and expression. You can be a casual fan or a die-hard fan, and either way whoever considers D2(R) the best ARPG ever made is purely up to subjective opinion.

"Its just an opinion, man!" is kind of a cop out post in a thread titled 'Is X the best Y in the last 10 years?"

I mean, technically, you are right, everyone has their opinion, I just find it funny that the people repeating that are also arguing with others while repeating that.

No one is arguing against your right to have an opinion, but people can still point out the bad things about D2, and debate the topic. I don't see the point in saying anything about opinions in a debate. Another poster was saying the same thing while essentially implying anyone who who had anything bad to say about D2 is either an idiot or didn't play it, thats what this person meant by "fetishizing" the game.

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Nah nobody here is fetishizing the game. Normal people who like playing games and Diablo are just trying to enjoy an old game without a bunch of crazy angry people constantly harping about it being an outdated flawed game.

If Vicarious Vision actually did make a huge mistake then constant criticism would be valid but their mistakes were just small things that aren't even set in stone.

No, I mean this is a thread asking whether or not this is the best ARPG in the last ten years, I am not sure why you think people are coming after you, or that D2 wouldn't get any criticisms in this thread. What did you expect, 100% of posts to just say "yes." and call it a day?

[PC2]

You can tell it's not a blizzard product, the animations feel janky, some of the sounds don't fit, the models are garbage.

If you press 'G' in D2R you can see the mechanics, animations, and models map onto the original reasonably well. Maybe things aren't perfect but perfection isn't something that can be achieved anyways.

Except the harem is empty now. They removed any and all dead harem girls from said harem in D2R.

So now when Jaren says , you go into the palace harem to investigate, lo and behold.. no slaughtered harem girls

I'm anti-censorship but to be fair they were hanging, nude, and bloody. If they did it to be prudes then I'm against it but if they did it for money/sales reasons then you can't really blame them because they're just doing their job by making it appropriate for younger players.