Alec Baldwin fires prop gun on movie set, killing cinematographer

[beanman12345]

A blank is only lethal near the opening due to its explosive force, there's no projectile... the accident here involves a projectile going through one person striking another behind. A blank sure as hell can't do that unless there was some obstruction in the gun's barrel to act as a projectile... which was the case with Brandon Lee iirc.

I'll say it again, there is no evidence he was given a gun with a bullet. Whatever narrative you created in your mind is fantasy.

[Mihalik]

A blank is only lethal near the opening due to its explosive force, there's no projectile... the accident here involves a projectile going through one person striking another behind. A blank sure as hell can't do that unless there was some obstruction in the gun's barrel to act as a projectile... which was the case with Brandon Lee iirc.

1. It had to be one helluva obstruction to have the kinetic properties of passing through one person and hitting another.

2. It had to be one helluva explosive charge to propel anything to required speeds.

[Wezmon]

Let's try this one more time.

It.was.a.movie.set.

Actors are not firearm experts nor are they safety inspectors. They are handed a "prepared" firearm. Told to do X with it and pretend they are doing it for real.

The storage, handling, loading, chain of custody around firearms is handled by specialized firms contracted for that specific purpose.

If an actor is handed a loaded gun and he kills someone with it it is literally not his responsibility.

And in fact going one step further, if he tried to verify himself (eg by removing the ammo to check), he would invalidate the experts work and it would have to be redone. The expert is clearly deemed higher authority than an actor.

[Endus]

I will. Anyone that points a weapon at another and pulls the trigger is responsible for all harm caused by that action. Ignorance of safety precautions is not an excuse.

This is just non-legal fantasy you're engaging in because you've got a political agenda against Baldwin.

There is an obvious lack of mens rea here, and Baldwin was following direction when he fired, by all accounts. There is no way under the law he could be deemed responsible, not unless he knew there was a proper round in the chamber and not a blank when he fired.

An actor unloading a prop gun to re-load it manually themselves invalidates all security and safety precautions on-set. There is no way that's the more-reasonable option. The entire reason they have prop handlers to account for these things is because those prop handlers are properly trained in how to ensure the prop weapons are safe for the actors to use as directed. The actors do not have that training, because that is not their role.

Just outright fucking ghoulish on your part.

[uuuhname]

Let's try this one more time.

It.was.a.movie.set.

Actors are not firearm experts nor are they safety inspectors. They are handed a "prepared" firearm. Told to do X with it and pretend they are doing it for real.

The storage, handling, loading, chain of custody around firearms is handled by specialized firms contracted for that specific purpose.

If an actor is handed a loaded gun and he kills someone with it it is literally not his responsibility.

On the other hand if the actor happened to also be the producer, he might be liable for failing to contract the right professionals. But that's an entirely different discussion.

I know ya'll wanna pile on Alec Baldwin cuz he made fun of your Fuhrer, but assuming he is somehow responsible you are all piling on him for the wrong fucking thing.

Literally not seeing the forest.

that's about the only real "negligence" here on Baldwin's part. the rest from what I can tell is just a tragic accident.

[beanman12345]

Something was projected from the weapon into the victim. So it wasn't just a blank. The guy that died from the blank shot himself at point blank range in the head and died (3 days later) from the trauma of the air fracturing his skull. It wasn't over any distance.

This is either brandon lee style thing where there was a something left in the barrel, or it was a situation where live (as in bullets) rounds were used. I cannot fathom why you would have live ammo anywhere near a movie set.

Poor reading comprehension?

[Daedius]

I'll say it again, there is no evidence he was given a gun with a bullet. Whatever narrative you created in your mind is fantasy.

Only fantasy here is you imagining a blank shot can kill one person, penetrating them and injuring another behind.

A projectile was involved.

[beanman12345]

Only fantasy here is you imagining a blank shot can kill one person, penetrating them injuring another behind.

A projectile was involved.

My how you move those goalposts.

[Daedius]

My how you move those goalposts.

What goalpost pray tell? Stop trolling.

[gondrin]

Only fantasy here is you imagining a blank shot can kill one person, penetrating them and injuring another behind.

A projectile was involved.

That is why this has to be an actual bullet round(either dummy that got lodged or actual live round) as it not only went through one person but hurting others in the process. A blank is only deadly to the person that it was pointed at in a very close range(harmful within around 20ft, deadly at point blank).

[Santti]

My how you move those goalposts.

You are being ridiculous.

There are no goalposts being moved, or anything like that.

[beanman12345]

You are being ridiculous.

There are no goalposts being moved, or anything like that.

Bullet =! projectile.

[Hobb]

Only fantasy here is you imagining a blank shot can kill one person, penetrating them and injuring another behind.

A projectile was involved.

But blanks do fire a projectile of some type, some a plastic projectile. And while they do lose momentum rather quickly, depending on the type of blank used one can still be harmed or killed at short and point-blank range.

https://www.zmescience.com/science/b...kill-22102021/

[gondrin]

Bullet =! projectile.

When it comes to firing rounds, the bullet is the projectile. It is the thing that comes out of the end of the gun.

[Daedius]

Bullet =! projectile.

A bullet is a projectile...

[beanman12345]

When it comes to firing rounds, the bullet is the projectile. It is the thing that comes out of the end of the gun.

Yes but a projectile doesn't mean it's a live bullet either. There are several things that might have gone wrong with the gun where the projectile might not have been a metal tipped bullet.

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A bullet is a projectile...

A bullet is a projectile. A projectile isn't always a bullet.

[Daedius]

Yes but a projectile doesn't mean it's a live bullet either. There are several things that might have gone wrong with the gun where the projectile might not have been a metal tipped bullet.

"live bullet"

You do realise a "bullet" is the projectile part of ammo/cartridge, not the entire thing is called a bullet...?

[Endus]

Yes but a projectile doesn't mean it's a live bullet either. There are several things that might have gone wrong with the gun where the projectile might not have been a metal tipped bullet.

People might be acting like this is a silly distinction, but by example, when we were firing the cannons in the job I mentioned earlier, you had to clear the barrels every time. The 12-pounder was fired every single day, and you had to be sure there were nor remnants from prior firings, no pebbles some kid had tossed down the barrel, none of that. That gun was aimed at city buildings; it wasn't firing off into a void. Anything left in the barrel other than the charge you packed in could/would become a projectile, wether it was a cannonball or not.

And it was never a cannonball. Though I definitely did fish out pebbles and such more than a few times.

[gondrin]

Yes but a projectile doesn't mean it's a live bullet either. There are several things that might have gone wrong with the gun where the projectile might not have been a metal tipped bullet.

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A bullet is a projectile. A projectile isn't always a bullet.

While you are right in this, the fact that the gun would have been checked for any errant blockages in the barrel should have excluded this from being an issue. I am just assuming this as there is no info on it. Hence why I will still stand by the fact that it had to be an actual bullet. This will change if there is evidence stating otherwise.

[gondrin]

Seriously? The literal definition of a bullet starts with “a projectile”…

They should have reversed it as it would have made more sense.